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'sleeping Giants'?


Lew-T

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I've heard many people say in the past, that we are a sleeping giant club. I've spoken to a few away fans over the years along with general football fans and they have said with the city of our size and the big catchment area, we should be in the top division with decent past history. However, we are not a big club and only had a good spell in the 70s. Just curious to know if any of you had ideas to why we haven't been more successful? Look at cities like Sheffield, Manchester, Birmingham, Leeds, Liverpool, Norwich, Coventry and Leicester. All of which are roughly the same size as this city and just as passionate, but they have all been in the premier league and have a greater history than us.

Maybe this is a question for the old ones, as they have seen it all. Why are we not up there with the rest of them with past glories and decent level of football?

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Sleeping??? more like comatosed. Bristol is a city with a village mentality, always has been. Support for sports both physically and financially has been lacking. Until this changes we will never achieve anything.

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Not really, football is a very simple game. The team with the better players and better teams always go the furthest. We haven't had good enough players or teams to get to the premier league.

I personally do not think its just down to poor quality of players. The council have held us back in a lot of aspects, and I think sport is one of them. Another thing could be that Bristol is a nice place with a lot of other things to do than watch football. If you go to places like blackburn, there isn't a lot there but football on a Saturday. This encourages more people to watch a game

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Not enough bums on seats I'm afraid. For a city of half a million and catchment area of double that our average crowd puts us right up there with the other sleeping giants Bradford, Huddersfield, and Preston North End!

To be fair, Preston and Bradford have a good history with more top flight football and cup glories. It's only recent that they have struggled. I'll give you Huddersfield though

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To be fair, Preston and Bradford have a good history with more top flight football and cup glories. It's only recent that they have struggled. I'll give you Huddersfield though

What , the same Huddersfield who were the first team to win 3 consecutive league titles and have appeared in 5 FA cup finals , that Huddersfield??

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I would be happy with Huddersfield history, not sure they would be happy with ours though! We are going to be the team of the future, more people and more money coming into the south west, and an increasingly wealthy backer in Mr Lansdown. Stay up this season and then build for the future. There is nothing to stop Bristol City being a Premier League club, although the new stadium is vital to us holding that status for any period of time.

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Nothing to do with passion or bums on seats .

If we had a successful team people will come but when you have spent most of your history in the lower leauge you support will reflect that.

Its more to do with poor Managers ,players and Chairman making bad mistakes.

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We aren't as passionate. Look at average gates over the last ten years. 40k turn up for Play off finals but 12k watch us play every week.

not sure if I agree with that, put any club of size in the 3rd tier for many moons and see the attendances, check Newcastles before Keegan arrived...

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not sure if I agree with that, put any club of size in the 3rd tier for many moons and see the attendances, check Newcastles before Keegan arrived...

Just checked out Newcastles attendances before Keegan and every one of their average was over 21,000 except 1991 when they averaged 16,834

That's pretty good figures in my eyes.

Source: http://www.european-football-statistics.co.uk/attn.htm

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Simon Kuper is good on this, on how industrial working class towns became the football powerhouses in their respective countries. When football started to boom during the Industrial Revolution many factory towns had significant migrant populations. The football club gave the rootless diaspora something to identify with - it is these clubs that have survived and prospered, whilst locations with a stable population are seen as not traditional football hotbeds.

Size isn't everything, for example not one of the 7 biggest cities in europe has produced a European Cup winner (Istanbul, Paris, Moscow, London, St Petersburg, Berlin and Athens), and in honesty it's a lazy argument for suggesting a region should be successful at football.

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I saw us at Newcastle in the early 90's, the crowd was about 11,000. We drew 0-0.

11,000 !!

I was at that match and at the time we was getting a lot more than that . So much for Geordie passion.

Newcastle was lucky . A chairman came in with a bit of money, an inspired choice of manager in Keegan, the premier leauge starting and sky sports deciding to adopt Newcastle has their very own team

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Just checked out Newcastles attendances before Keegan and every one of their average was over 21,000 except 1991 when they averaged 16,834

That's pretty good figures in my eyes.

Source: http://www.european-....co.uk/attn.htm

presumably when they were putting seating in to comply with the taylor report.

we didn't average over 16,000 once between 1981-2007

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Newcastle have brilliant support given the size of the town.

That particular season was just about the worst average attendance in their history (16,800) other than in the 19th century. Probably due to ground improvements. We averaged 13,500 - we weren't getting anywhere near their attendances.

They had 43,000 average in the championship a couple of seasons ago and only dipped under 30,000 once since 1992 and that was 29,000.

47,000 average last season and pushing 50,000 this season.

As I say, brilliant support up there and something that we will never see in Bristol.

I was at that game as well. There may well have been ground improvements taking place but there was a huge amount of empty space in the Gallowgate End and empty seats in the stands. Not sure why the gates then were so low but I don't think it was down to ground improvements.

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What , the same Huddersfield who were the first team to win 3 consecutive league titles and have appeared in 5 FA cup finals , that Huddersfield??

Got me there! Wasn't it in the 20s where they won 3 consecutive titles? Didn't know they appeared in 5 FA cup finals though.

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2 football clubs.

Rugby.

Bad luck.

Bad decisions.

Its certainly not all about passion or apathy.

A bit of luck and investment all at the same time and things can turn for any club.

Even Wigan can do it and they have very few fans and not a great deal of vociferous support.

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You need a consistent period of top flight success to build up a decent fanbase. Maybe if we'd spent 8 years in the old first division rather than 4 - and had actually been in a cup final since 1908 - then the little kiddies of Bristol would all be wearing City replica kits rather than Man Ure etc etc.

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2 football clubs.

Rugby.

Bad luck.

Bad decisions.

Its certainly not all about passion or apathy.

A bit of luck and investment all at the same time and things can turn for any club.

Even Wigan can do it and they have very few fans and not a great deal of vociferous support.

^This

Plus Bristol is an afluent city and it's demographic was completely different to the industrial working class areas where football really took off and cemented a place in the heart of communities years ago. In more recent times, Bristol has become a place full of 'non-bristolians' a huge student population where many stay on after as well as lots of people moving here for jobs... I've always said there are a lot more Scousers in Liverpool than there are Bristolians in Bristol.

Regarding attendances it's always amazed me that there is so much amatuer football on Saturday afternoons in Bristol. I lived until I was 11 and no one played on Saturday afternoons except semi-pros... it was all Sat and Sun mornings.

Schools don't help either - up until a couple of years ago I could probably name more fee-paying independent schools than I could state secondary - all of which play rubgy and cricket far more than football. Even some of the state schools were historically more rugby orientated e.g. St Bernadettes and Wellsway.

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I don't think there is one reason, rather a number of contributing factors:

1 - Two league teams, who for much of their history (it pains me to say) have been relatively closely matched, have split the fan base.

2 - The Downs league means may would-be regulars can't make it to games on a Saturday afternoon.

3 - Our region is traditionally more interested in Rugby, and our clubs have had success over the years (I include Bath and Gloucester in this).

4 - Our performances are not exactly headline grabbing (with the exception of the play off final season).

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^This

Plus Bristol is an afluent city and it's demographic was completely different to the industrial working class areas where football really took off and cemented a place in the heart of communities years ago. In more recent times, Bristol has become a place full of 'non-bristolians' a huge student population where many stay on after as well as lots of people moving here for jobs... I've always said there are a lot more Scousers in Liverpool than there are Bristolians in Bristol.

Regarding attendances it's always amazed me that there is so much amatuer football on Saturday afternoons in Bristol. I lived until I was 11 and no one played on Saturday afternoons except semi-pros... it was all Sat and Sun mornings.

Schools don't help either - up until a couple of years ago I could probably name more fee-paying independent schools than I could state secondary - all of which play rubgy and cricket far more than football. Even some of the state schools were historically more rugby orientated e.g. St Bernadettes and Wellsway.

Oh dear, what happened when you were 11? Are you making contact from the other side?

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Whilst I do agree with most of the points above - it does go to show just how vital it is for us to retain out NPC status. That way, we are only ever one good season away from the PL, with all the exposure, excitement and money that comes with it, in order to become a regular fixture in the PL/Top NPC places.

Let's not forget that we were recently just one goal/90 mins/one wonder strike (however you want to look at it) away from this elusive place in the PL, with the rewards that come with it and a sell out crowd every week!

There is a fine line between glory and mediocrity - our problem is we always seem to fall just the wrong side of it!

One day, our time must come. Surely!!

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This isn't a Rugby city, it's a Football City. But Up North they don't have much to do, Bristol however is an affluent City, people have character and ambition...whereas up there they don't.

I see us as a similar size to Stoke. Stoke averaged 12000 a few years ago when struggling in the Championship, now they must be aroud 25000 and I think that's what we should expect if we were ever to get to those dizzy heights. Personally, I love the Championship, good players, well backed clubs (in the main) the leigh-weigh to play youngsters and find some gems. Attacking football, it's a good league and personally I think where we belong. Competing (like we did under GJ) to 4th, 10th and 10th is a great acheivement and again where we should be.

Would it be great to see City in the Premier League? Yeah, why not, but for me the Championship is excellent and we should enjoy competing in it...as long as we stay up.

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