sglosbcfc Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Mandela striding out into a crowd of tens of thousands of Afrikaans wearing a Springbok shirt, an iconic image and surely one of the political master strokes of the last century. His achievements cannot be underestimated, the word great man is bandied about too readily but Mandela is most deserving of the title. How many of us would be prepared to die for our beliefs? How many of us would be willing to spend years in prison? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 With all our souls, i think you meant I mean in our mundane,day to day existance, our "tiny" lives.We must adhere to the virtues he lived and died for. Notably tolerance,compassion and understanding. In fact as Jesus and later on the Beatles put it , "All you need is love" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avalonred Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Mandela was a wise and well educated man who deserves praise for sticking to his principles and fighting for the freedom of his people.... and stopping the infighting once they had managed to topple the government at the time. He was however a 'figurehead', there were tens, hundreds or maybe thousands of others risking their lives for the cause on a daily basis, both in the SA Government and the ANC, they did the work behind closed doors, in secret, they deserve massive praise for their achievement and the groundwork for Maldela to become who he was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eco Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 A highly emotive topic and feelings will be no doubt alligned to ideology and political ideology. Mandela no doubt saw disgraceful, unjustifiable treatment during his reign... But from where I'm at during my time in life I don't condone a lot of his actions. Feelings run high on either side and I think for right now a lot are best left unsaid. Those detractors have their reasonable issues and those supporters their reasonable condolences. A man has lost his life and that alone is a tragedy. What actions exactly are you referring to ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveybadger Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 If you want an idea of how he almost single handidly stopped South Africa falling into civil war post apartheid, read 'Invictus' by John Carlin (turned into a Matt Damon film whose name I can't remember). That is real leadership combined with an ability to forgive and move on I'll never posses. RIP. ps Using Winnie Mandela's actions to criticise him is frankly outrageous and really does show the crass stupidity of the poster. pps Mugabe and Mandela may have had similarities to begin with (both used violence to fight racist dictatorships), but one has ended up a despot and brought his country to its knees, while the other has just died. On a lighter note, can't get Harry Enfield's Nelson Mandela's fighting beer sketch out of my head! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 What actions exactly are you referring to ? There are lots of things he did leading up to imprisonment, and a few things he did when in power which cannot really be described as great. I am not going to dig them out but you can do the research for yourself. As a figurehead once Apartheid was banished he has done undoubted good, But there was a lot of muddy waters rippling around NM's feet. So I can see exactly why some people will not always take the great and the goods view. Probably not best discussing it the day he dies though. Best left for another time. The man was as flawed as much as anyone else, I believe he acknowledged this and said himself he should not have been put on such a high pedestal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippy273 Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 What actions exactly are you referring to ? He almost tried to wage war against white South African's, some regarding him as a terrorist for encouraging rallies that caused violence. It was all for a very very valid purpose was it not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Its a real shame this. I thought he was really good in The Shawshank Redemption. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecko Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 So why did you "like" his original post then? Perhaps you should "unlike" it!!!!! Do you know how to use quotation marks? And yes, thanks for pointing out that I did indeed like it, it was a mistake of mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eco Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 He almost tried to wage war against white South African's, some regarding him as a terrorist for encouraging rallies that caused violence. It was all for a very very valid purpose was it not? Well I think the subjugation of the majority population is quite a valid cause ! Pre-trial I believe he renounced peaceful actions once all other avenues were closed, but any specific targets were either industrial or military which could be regarded as legitimate. Once inside prison I don't see how he could have been involved with any bombings which the military wing of the ANC committed, anyway these bombings were mainly retaliatory and pale into insignificance compared to what the SA state was up to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 The quote is in this tribute from Obama, "As he once said, 'I am not a saint, unless you think of a saint as a sinner who keeps on trying.'" http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-25250278 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdliketoRogerMoore Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Free Nelson Mandela! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cider_dog Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Myself, personally, "I've never met a nice South Afrikaan." Winne Mandela? She even had her own football team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezgimed Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 What actions exactly are you referring to ? Is that a joke? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezgimed Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 http://americanfreepress.net/?p=11873 Any thoughts on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avalonred Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 What actions exactly are you referring to ? This isn't really the time or place to get into any sort of discussion but maybe a few minutes on Google would enlighten you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eco Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 http://americanfreepress.net/?p=11873 Any thoughts on this? Yes, it's a right wing american website which has an agenda and hence has no value whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezgimed Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Yes, it's a right wing american website which has an agenda and hence has no value whatsoever. http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/africa/item/15888-saint-mandela-not-so-fast http://thebackbencher.co.uk/3-things-you-didnt-want-to-know-about-nelson-mandela/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umkhonto_we_Sizwe http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_National_Congress http://ajmacdonaldjr.wordpress.com/2013/06/22/nelson-mandela-the-man-and-the-myth/ Etc etc. Are you really that naive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 I wonder if George Osborne still wears his Hang Mandela t-shirt which he got when he was in the Federation of Conservative Students? My POV on NM is he was one of the few people who enters politics for the right reason. Prevented a civil war, it has to be said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Right Honourable Les Q Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Winne Mandela? She even had her own football team... I understand they didn't devote much time to talking up the opposition, or worrying about performances, or people "only seeing the negatives." Some lessons for us there, perhaps ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eco Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/africa/item/15888-saint-mandela-not-so-fast http://thebackbencher.co.uk/3-things-you-didnt-want-to-know-about-nelson-mandela/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umkhonto_we_Sizwe http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_National_Congress http://ajmacdonaldjr.wordpress.com/2013/06/22/nelson-mandela-the-man-and-the-myth/ Etc etc. Are you really that naive? Des,you can throw as many right wing conservative opinions at me as you like, the fact is they're tainted by the political slant of the authors. Feel free to believe them. Please see post # 70 for my thoughts on NM and terrorism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezgimed Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Des,you can throw as many right wing conservative opinions at me as you like, the fact is they're tainted by the political slant of the authors. Feel free to believe them. Please see post # 70 for my thoughts on NM and terrorism. I respect your opinion but imprisoned or not, I don't think an individual can be associated (founding) with such a group, with his wife etc and then completely condemn all their actions. Bit too idealistic for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Free Nelson Mandela! ..... with every 20 litres of super unleaded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aizoon Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/africa/item/15888-saint-mandela-not-so-fast http://thebackbencher.co.uk/3-things-you-didnt-want-to-know-about-nelson-mandela/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umkhonto_we_Sizwe http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_National_Congress http://ajmacdonaldjr.wordpress.com/2013/06/22/nelson-mandela-the-man-and-the-myth/ Etc etc. Are you really that naive? No, but apparently you are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezgimed Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 No, but apparently you are Ok you win, he DIDN'T co-found that group and they DIDN'T commit terrorist acts (sorry, didn't fight for freedom). Congratulations, you just changed history! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Free Nelson Mandela! So there is yet another season ticket offer I missed out on. Not only did I not get my free food vouchers, I also never received my free Nelson Mandela. My personal account manager should be locked up for this. Never in the history of the world has someone been discriminated more than me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City Rocker Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Ok you win, he DIDN'T co-found that group and they DIDN'T commit terrorist acts (sorry, didn't fight for freedom). Congratulations, you just changed history! Wow, disappointing that people are bringing this stuff up in a discussion honouring the man's death. Of course Mandela co-founded the ANC's military wing, and its fight against the evil regime sometimes resorted to violence. You see this as a bad thing? As someone else alluded to, for Mandela to renounce the violence of the ANC would be akin to the French Resistance rolling over for Hitler. It is no different. In both cases sadly, blood was shed, but good triumphed over bad. And Jerry Dammers got to write one of his catchiest tunes! RIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezgimed Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Wow, disappointing that people are bringing this stuff up in a discussion honouring the man's death. Of course Mandela co-founded the ANC's military wing, and its fight against the evil regime sometimes resorted to violence. You see this as a bad thing? As someone else alluded to, for Mandela to renounce the violence of the ANC would be akin to the French Resistance rolling over for Hitler. It is no different. In both cases sadly, blood was shed, but good triumphed over bad. And Jerry Dammers got to write one of his catchiest tunes! RIP Of course the greater outcome was positive but you cannot praise somebody who shed the blood of innocents in the process, without being called up on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i hate you butler Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 just heard on the news crowds are gathering at nelson mandela housebut delboy and Rodney have told em to f''k off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BristolCity1992 Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Of course the greater outcome was positive but you cannot praise somebody who shed the blood of innocents in the process, without being called up on it. Again easy to say when you're not seeing your fellow innocent people being slaughtered and there seems like no other way out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.