Gut feeling...

[spudski]

...how I see it panning out so far.

Ashton and Burt being used to Indentify and recruit players over Transfer and loan window period.

Pembo and Wade to coach first team.

Club will consider a new coach over the coming weeks and decide who to bring in eventually...or give Pembo the job if he does well.

Close?

[brizzlelou]

Is that not pretty much what Ashton said on the twentyman show???

[spudski]

4 hours ago, brizzlelou said:

Is that not pretty much what Ashton said on the twentyman show???

I don't know fella...Sorry...I've not listened to it. So that's what he implied?

[SuperFly2002]

4 minutes ago, spudski said:

I don't know fella...Sorry...I've not listened to it. So that's what he implied?

Yep.......in essence. 

[havanatopia]

34 minutes ago, God almighty from BS3 said:

Yep.......in essence. 

Except he did not say 'weeks' for a new manager which essentially means he told us nothing and that is what I would have expected. The only nuance I think we all can say, for those who listened as I did, was that absolute immediate priority is players but finding a new manager is also on-going. That is how he came across to me at least so a new manager could be hours, days or weeks away from those remarks.

[Snufflelufagus]

One thing Ashton also said on 'Subs bench extra' with Latham and Nigel that i found intresting was how well pembo and wade have done since late last week. He went on to special single out and praise wade.

[citywest30]

My gut is that it could still be Pearson. Don't think the title is important, it is what is agreed as to his remit. Anyway now his odds have lengthened to 10/1, thought it'd be worth a fiver!

[SnozRobin]

10 minutes ago, citywest30 said:

My gut is that it could still be Pearson. Don't think the title is important, it is what is agreed as to his remit. Anyway now his odds have lengthened to 10/1, thought it'd be worth a fiver!

I think you're right - I don't think the title is important, so long as we get promoted. 

[havanatopia]

5 minutes ago, SnozRobin said:

I think you're right - I don't think the title is important, so long as we get promoted. 

Although the trophy is the oldest in the world and would be very nice in the West Stand trophy cabinet in 2017.

[LoyalRed]

6 hours ago, spudski said:

...how I see it panning out so far.

Ashton and Burt being used to Indentify and recruit players over Transfer and loan window period.

Pembo and Wade to coach first team.

Club will consider a new coach over the coming weeks and decide who to bring in eventually...or give Pembo the job if he does well.

Close?

Yep, but we can all forget any "big name" manager such as Moyes, Pearson etc as they wont come in a role as a "yes man", they would have their own experience and ideas.  You can also strike out the likes of Warnock as they are not looking for a quick fix.  I would say the next manager at this moment of time is likely to be Pemberton.  Ashton went on about the likes of Rodgers, Dyche etc as he has appointed and worked with good managers but these were "yes men" under his control when they started out.  The club are looking for a head team coach / yes man who has to go through Ashton for everything.  

Ashton struck me as a very good front man / communicater but I can see a lot of fans dissapointed with who comes in as head team coach as it won't be an inspired lifting choice - it will be someone that fits into his control.

[AshtonGreat]

6 hours ago, spudski said:

...how I see it panning out so far.

Ashton and Burt being used to Indentify and recruit players over Transfer and loan window period.

Pembo and Wade to coach first team.

Club will consider a new coach over the coming weeks and decide who to bring in eventually...or give Pembo the job if he does well.

Close?

That's such a Bristol City thing to do. Hence why we're usually to be found languishing in the lower leagues

[Kid in the Riot]

22 minutes ago, LoyalRed said:

Yep, but we can all forget any "big name" manager such as Moyes, Pearson etc as they wont come in a role as a "yes man", they would have their own experience and ideas.  You can also strike out the likes of Warnock as they are not looking for a quick fix.  I would say the next manager at this moment of time is likely to be Pemberton.  Ashton went on about the likes of Rodgers, Dyche etc as he has appointed and worked with good managers but these were "yes men" under his control when they started out.  The club are looking for a head team coach / yes man who has to go through Ashton for everything.  

Ashton struck me as a very good front man / communicater but I can see a lot of fans dissapointed with who comes in as head team coach as it won't be an inspired lifting choice - it will be someone that fits into his control.

With respect I think that's nonsense. He was in fact asked whether the manager/head coach would have to share his ideas on systems/formations/players etc and he said 'no'. The manager/head coach simply fits into a team (committee if you like) that makes decisions on all footballing matters.

People say that precludes Moyes/Pearson joining - I think that's nonsense too. You can't tell me that similar arrangements don't exist at Leicester, Man U and indeed most other Premier League/Championship clubs. Moyes did not have 'complete control' at Man U and I bet it was the same for Pearson at Leicester.

Ashton is not reinventing the wheel, he's simply coming in and implementing what most other successful clubs have ben doing for years. Hopefully for us that means dragging us up from a L1/L2 club off the field to a Championship and beyond one.

[Phileas Fogg]

3 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

With respect I think that's nonsense. He was in fact asked whether the manager/head coach would have to share his ideas on systems/formations/players etc and he said 'no'. The manager/head coach simply fits into a team (committee if you like) that makes decisions on all footballing matters.

People say that precludes Moyes/Pearson joining - I think that's nonsense too. You can't tell me that similar arrangements don't exist at Leicester, Man U and indeed most other Premier League/Championship clubs. Moyes did not have 'complete control' at Man U and I bet it was the same for Pearson at Leicester.

Ashton is not reinventing the wheel, he's simply coming in and implementing what most other successful clubs have ben doing for years. Hopefully for us that means dragging us up from a L1/L2 club off the field to a Championship and beyond one.

Exactly, people seem to have this idea that all bigger name managers we've been 'linked' with are autocratic philistines. Pearson, at Leicester, was working under a pretty modern setup.

[exAtyeoMax]

2 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

With respect I think that's nonsense. He was in fact asked whether the manager/head coach would have to share his ideas on systems/formations/players etc and he said 'no'. The manager/head coach simply fits into a team (committee if you like) that makes decisions on all footballing matters.

People say that precludes Moyes/Pearson joining - I think that's nonsense too. You can't tell me that similar arrangements don't exist at Leicester, Man U and indeed most other Premier League/Championship clubs. Moyes did not have 'complete control' at Man U and I bet it was the same for Pearson at Leicester.

Ashton is not reinventing the wheel, he's simply coming in and implementing what most other successful clubs have ben doing for years. Hopefully for us that means dragging us up from a L1/L2 club off the field to a Championship and beyond one.

Yes, he did mention that The Alex Ferguson type of manager - those who have complete control over the whole club - are very rare, and that isn't the norm in most circumstances nowadays. So I wouldn't rule anyone out

[GrahamC]

Still think the chances of the current two being in post for the season are very slim.

There are two reasons for that:

Firstly because Ashton's current focus is unsurprisingly on recruitment, as we are so short numerically that this has to take priority.

Secondly because much as I like Pemberton and hope that he stays on at the club, as soon as we lose a few (which is inevitable) the call to bring in an established manager will be impossible to ignore.

If he can get us a few results while we sort things out and then stay on as an assistant I think that would be best all round.

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Still think the chances of the current two being in post for the season are very slim.

There are two reasons for that:

Firstly because Ashton's current focus is unsurprisingly on recruitment, as we are so short numerically that this has to take priority.

Secondly because much as I like Pemberton and hope that he stays on at the club, as soon as we lose a few (which is inevitable) the call to bring in an established manager will be impossible to ignore.

If he can get us a few results while we sort things out and then stay on as an assistant I think that would be best all round.

Indeed, we always hear how we should look towards Swansea, now may be a time when we can see if that's something the board actually do. Take them in recent weeks, Curtis caretaker; loses to Man Utd [write that off anyway] and then wins one and draws 2 of the next 3 with clean sheets in each, gets told he'll be guardian for the season and three or so games later he's been quite publicly demoted.

No time for knee jerk decisions. It won't please the fans but I'd prefer no dialogue to be honest until a man is in place: no 'JP and WE till end of the season statement', no comments upon when a likely successor is in, just carry on business as usual (w/ JP and WE) until something otherwise has been agreed. Internal communication is different but this is one time when actually I would support a news blackout even though it may feel frustrating.

[Chappers]

So what is this "call to bring in an experienced manager"? Just a few fans with fixed ideas who think they know what the "magic bullet" is. I think Ashton is sensible enough to ignore that and appoint whoever he and the board feel is the right person for the job. JP and WE might just be the right fit for the club, and continuity might just be the right option at present. I know as little as everybody else on here, and prefer to keep an open mind, back whatever decision is made, and judge it on results.

 

[BCFC_Dan]

Seems plausible and it's something I'm feeling increasingly comfortable with.

I'd still love Pearson to come in and for the board to back him heavily in the transfer market but that's simply not realistic and it's a big gamble if it goes wrong.

Although we're in the relegation zone and have just sacked the manager, things are not as bad as they have been on previous occasions. The players never seemed to lose their motivation and genuinely seem to get along with one another. They need help from some new signings and would benefit from a fresh tactical approach but it's not like last time when they were broken men in desperate need of a lift. League position and squad size aside, they're not in a bad place really.

Signings can be made (in theory) as well by a committee as an individual: I think even we on OTIB have done a reasonable job of identifying the needs and the available options, and negotiation was always Burt's remit anyway, whilst there is no reason to suppose that Pemberton and Elliot can't pick a sensible team and tactics.

The positive attitude and good feeling in the squad is part of Steve Cotterill's legacy and the work he did instilling that must never be forgotten but equally it's done now. All the new guys need to do is maintain it and not let it slip. Hopefully this is something they can do.

[Turbored]

1 hour ago, AshtonGreat said:

That's such a Bristol City thing to do. Hence why we're usually to be found languishing in the lower leagues

Sounds like the Millen appointment over again...If they win a couple of games they would have done well and we will give them a go at the job but that's what happened with Millen and then the wheels fell off.

Its a really tough one this as perhaps the club should show some loyalty but then again where did that loyalty take us with Cotteril we probably should of sacked him a couple of months ago with hindsight.

[Taz]

Gary Neville wants to come back to England before he gets sacked in Spain 

[LoyalRed]

1 hour ago, Kid in the Riot said:

With respect I think that's nonsense. He was in fact asked whether the manager/head coach would have to share his ideas on systems/formations/players etc and he said 'no'. The manager/head coach simply fits into a team (committee if you like) that makes decisions on all footballing matters.

People say that precludes Moyes/Pearson joining - I think that's nonsense too. You can't tell me that similar arrangements don't exist at Leicester, Man U and indeed most other Premier League/Championship clubs. Moyes did not have 'complete control' at Man U and I bet it was the same for Pearson at Leicester.

Ashton is not reinventing the wheel, he's simply coming in and implementing what most other successful clubs have ben doing for years. Hopefully for us that means dragging us up from a L1/L2 club off the field to a Championship and beyond one.

We shall see, not sure Fellani was a group decision - definitely a player Moyes wanted and got so no group decision there.

[LoyalRed]

Personally I can't see Moyes or Pearson playing second fiddle and having to answer to a guy who's previous was at Oxford Utd which is why our next manager won't be a big name. 

[ten minutes of rough]

27 minutes ago, Turbored said:

Sounds like the Millen appointment over again...If they win a couple of games they would have done well and we will give them a go at the job but that's what happened with Millen and then the wheels fell off.

Its a really tough one this as perhaps the club should show some loyalty but then again where did that loyalty take us with Cotteril we probably should of sacked him a couple of months ago with hindsight.

That's the rub, if we had sacked him earlier we would have some wriggle room, now we don't. Is there a manager , coach out there that could take over and ensure our safety? I don't think there is, but the reaction got on Saturday might gloss over the real problems, which will be more so if we beat WBA  and Leeds, Ha!

 

 

 

[RedM]

1 hour ago, LoyalRed said:

Yep, but we can all forget any "big name" manager such as Moyes, Pearson etc as they wont come in a role as a "yes man", they would have their own experience and ideas.  You can also strike out the likes of Warnock as they are not looking for a quick fix.  I would say the next manager at this moment of time is likely to be Pemberton.  Ashton went on about the likes of Rodgers, Dyche etc as he has appointed and worked with good managers but these were "yes men" under his control when they started out.  The club are looking for a head team coach / yes man who has to go through Ashton for everything.  

Ashton struck me as a very good front man / communicater but I can see a lot of fans dissapointed with who comes in as head team coach as it won't be an inspired lifting choice - it will be someone that fits into his control.

That's my feelings too. My thoughts are that maybe Pemberton isn't enough of a 'personality' for them.  Don't want to sound too harsh but with Cotterill being such a dominant, strong personality wasn't Pemberton a yes man to him?

I think they want the positive side of Cotterill, the long term vision of SoD, the young up and coming-ness of McInness, the contacts and experience of Coppell...not sure if that is Pemberton personally. But then I guess that's where Mr Ashton pulls the strings.

[Robin1988]

1 hour ago, Kid in the Riot said:

With respect I think that's nonsense. He was in fact asked whether the manager/head coach would have to share his ideas on systems/formations/players etc and he said 'no'. The manager/head coach simply fits into a team (committee if you like) that makes decisions on all footballing matters.

Wasn't exactly likely to say 'yes'...

You mention dragging us to being a Championship club off the field, and maybe he will. But let's hope it doesn't end up like this: http://www.watfordobserver.co.uk/sport/3995357.print/

[downendcity]

I've had a gut feeling - normally when we get into the last 5 minutes of games, and it's a gut wrenching feeling!

[chipdawg]

A few things to note here. No one will be playing 'second fiddle' to Ashton when they come in. He will presumably be the bridge between board/chairman and management/coaching staff. In the 'good old days' a manager would report directly to the club chairman, probably in a smoke-filled office whilst sharing a brandy and a Cuban cigar while Tina the tea lady fixes some egg sandwiches. Football is a business these days and professional people are required to run a football club. If Mark Ashton wanted to be a manager, I presume he would have done his coaching badges and applied for some coaching positions

Secondly, the idea that Pearson wouldn't work under such a person is ridiculous. At Leicester he worked under both a Chief Operating Officer and a Director of Football (Terry Robertson and then John Rudkin). I have no idea exactly where the boundaries of those roles intersected with the manager, but a lot of assumptions are being made about what the new 'head coach' will be able to do. I'm 100% certain that any new man will be heavily involved in the 'recruitment panel' Ashton talked about in his interview

Finally, I'm not sure where the assumption that the board want a 'yes man' comes from. They certainly want someone who will work within the structure which has been decided is best for the long-term future of the club, but at the end of the day who are we to say whether Pearson, Moyes or the Queen of Sheba wouldn't go "that looks like a sensible way to run a football organisation" and jump on board

At the end of the day, I think everyone involved in the club is pragmatic enough to realise that if a 'name' manager is keen to come here and they can work within the business and football structures we have in place, the they should be backed to do the job. If that means they have more say in transfers than say Cotts did or a Pemberton would have, then I'm pretty sure that can be accommodated. If said manager demands complete control, I'd personally argue they'd be a poor appointment anyway

[Robin1988]

21 minutes ago, chipdawg said:

Finally, I'm not sure where the assumption that the board want a 'yes man' comes from. They certainly want someone who will work within the structure which has been decided is best for the long-term future of the club, but at the end of the day who are we to say whether Pearson, Moyes or the Queen of Sheba wouldn't go "that looks like a sensible way to run a football organisation" and jump on board

It's not so much of an assumption as one of the main reasons Cotterill was given the chop.

[chipdawg]

7 minutes ago, Robin1988 said:

It's not so much of an assumption as one of the main reasons Cotterill was given the chop.

I'd say 4 wins in 24 games or whatever it was, was the major factor in Cotterill being given the chop. Can you provide evidence to back up your claim that Cotts non-compliance was the major reason he was sacked? And if so, why did he last 2 years? Has he only recently become a 'no man'? And is so, why?

[Robin1988]

1 minute ago, chipdawg said:

I'd say 4 wins in 24 games or whatever it was, was the major factor in Cotterill being given the chop. Can you provide evidence to back up your claim that Cotts non-compliance was the major reason he was sacked? And if so, why did he last 2 years? Has he only recently become a 'no man'? And is so, why?

Not without defaming other people within the club, but names have been mentioned elsewhere. When everything was going well last year and the transfer system was working, he was a 'yes man' as such, because why wouldn't he be? Even then, he's always been rather abrasive and that put certain people's backs up. But it shouldn't have been a factor in his dismissal.

The issues really started this summer, he delivered a clearly prepared statement after the Yeovil friendly (didn't exactly need to be pushed to come out with it) and went from there. I wouldn't say he was at war with the board, but he didn't exactly paint them in a good light.