Joe Allen to Stoke for 13 million quid.

[reddogkev]

For me, this indicates the craziness in the game, and the distorted value of a million quid.  Don't get me wrong, like most who watch the game I like Allen - not a lot, but I can see his qualities.

Are they worth 13 million quid?  You've got to be aving a laugh!

He moves the ball well, is good lying deep and also providing a platform in a more advanced position, and does, occasionally have a goal threat, but I don't feel he does this well enough to be worth such a figure.

Why is a million pound in the real world such a life-changing balance of money (just think of all you could buy if you scooped a meagre million on the lottery), yet in the footie world, a million seems to be thrown around without a passing thought.

Do you feel this is a fair figure for Joe, or has every Welsh player just appreciated in value by several million?

(BTW - I see this thread appeared twice in the forum - I think I threw a spanner in the works by adding the pound sign to the original title!)

[Eddie Hitler]

TV money has hugely distorted the market for transfer fees and wages.

Can't see it changing though.

[MichaelRobartes]

I think Allen is a pretty good player. In the context of today's market that's not a bad price at all in my opinion.

[reddogkev]

5 minutes ago, MichaelRobartes said:

I think Allen is a pretty good player. In the context of today's market that's not a bad price at all in my opinion.

I hear what you're saying, but I just can't accept it, I know Prem clubs can afford that sort of fee without a second thought, but if I was going to value him, I'd say about 7 or 8 mill.

 

12 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

TV money has hugely distorted the market for transfer fees and wages.

Can't see it changing though.

The TV money must be a bottomless pit, but where does the money originate?  Just incredible to consider how far-removed these figures are from the real world.

Is it all advertising income?  It can't be the subscription rates, take myself as an example, my main sports channels are the beeb and BT sports - which don't cost me a penny.

Or does it just come from the sales of the differing products around the globe?  Surely this will change in the imminent future with the widespread availability of internet streaming...

[BRISTOL86]

Given our fans are talking about 8m for Flint and 10m for Kodjia i'd say that's a steal! 

[Eddie Hitler]

14 minutes ago, reddogkev said:

I hear what you're saying, but I just can't accept it, I know Prem clubs can afford that sort of fee without a second thought, but if I was going to value him, I'd say about 7 or 8 mill.

 

The TV money must be a bottomless pit, but where does the money originate?  Just incredible to consider how far-removed these figures are from the real world.

Is it all advertising income?  It can't be the subscription rates, take myself as an example, my main sports channels are the beeb and BT sports - which don't cost me a penny.

Or does it just come from the sales of the differing products around the globe?  Surely this will change in the imminent future with the widespread availability of internet streaming...

I've just looked and Sky Sports bundle is just under £50 a month so £600 a year.

Guessing that four million have this that's £2.4 billion. This will keep flowing IMO as it gives HD on big screens that you don't get from streaming.

A friend's dad in his late 70s, since getting a back injury, does little else but watch sport all day. £50 a month is great value for him.

[reddogkev]

4 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

I've just looked and Sky Sports bundle is just under £50 a month so £600 a year.

Guessing that four million have this that's £2.4 billion. This will keep flowing IMO as it gives HD on big screens that you don't get from streaming.

A friend's dad in his late 70s, since getting a back injury, does little else but watch sport all day. £50 a month is great value for him.

Good point, I guess that does represent a decent sized wedge of money!

[Eddie Hitler]

3 minutes ago, reddogkev said:

Good point, I guess that does represent a decent sized wedge of money!

Yes, which is why I can't see it changing. I don't subscribe to it but I can see why people do.  I don't even have a telly as it happens!

[redfred]

£13m is bizarrely now a relatively small sum for an established Premier League player.

I've never known a player give the ball away as much as Allen, though. A ridiculous amount given his otherwise talent,so maybe why he's only £13m? 

[EmersonsRed]

Given the current market I think it's an absolute steal. Joe Allen has unfortunately become one of the professional players who aren't rated due to social media. He's got some genuine quality with the football at his feet and that's a lot more than most players. Good technically too. I like him. Good buy for Stoke.

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, EmersonsRed said:

Given the current market I think it's an absolute steal. Joe Allen has unfortunately become one of the professional players who aren't rated due to social media. He's got some genuine quality with the football at his feet and that's a lot more than most players. Good technically too. I like him. Good buy for Stoke.

I thought he was one of Wales best players alongside Ramsey at the Euros. £13m by todays standards is nothing.  Hughes is building a decent sqaud at Stoke.

[EmersonsRed]

3 minutes ago, Tomarse said:

I thought he was one of Wales best players alongside Ramsey at the Euros. £13m by todays standards is nothing.  Hughes is building a decent sqaud at Stoke.

He was brilliant Tom, yes he's got a good squad there. Imbula, Bojan, Shaqiri, Allen... Would fancy them to push for top half, this years surprise team perhaps. Maybe it wouldn't even be a surprise!

[Super]

44 minutes ago, reddogkev said:

I hear what you're saying, but I just can't accept it, I know Prem clubs can afford that sort of fee without a second thought, but if I was going to value him, I'd say about 7 or 8 mill.

 

The TV money must be a bottomless pit, but where does the money originate?  Just incredible to consider how far-removed these figures are from the real world.

Is it all advertising income?  It can't be the subscription rates, take myself as an example, my main sports channels are the beeb and BT sports - which don't cost me a penny.

Or does it just come from the sales of the differing products around the globe?  Surely this will change in the imminent future with the widespread availability of internet streaming...

Is Pogba worth 100m?

[reformed_red]

When Jordan Ibe is worth £15m, Joe Allen at £13m is quite a decent price I'd say. Either which way.....

Football + Money = Crazy

[Super]

45 minutes ago, reddogkev said:

I hear what you're saying, but I just can't accept it, I know Prem clubs can afford that sort of fee without a second thought, but if I was going to value him, I'd say about 7 or 8 mill.

 

The TV money must be a bottomless pit, but where does the money originate?  Just incredible to consider how far-removed these figures are from the real world.

Is it all advertising income?  It can't be the subscription rates, take myself as an example, my main sports channels are the beeb and BT sports - which don't cost me a penny.

Or does it just come from the sales of the differing products around the globe?  Surely this will change in the imminent future with the widespread availability of internet streaming...

Hang on some value Kodjia and Flint at that price!

[ChippenhamRed]

If someone is willing to pay £13m for a player, then they are worth £13m.

With the new TV deal, I think we all have to readjust what we consider to be "value" both in this division and above. Football is now a billion dollar industry and footballers are priced accordingly. The economics make sense even if the morals don't.

[Scott mcgarveys fanclub]

6 minutes ago, Super said:

Is Pogba worth 100m?

No one is don't care who they are

[samo II]

Of course the money is crazy, but it's just how the market is.

£13 million for Joe Allen is excellent business for Stoke; when you think Liverpool just paid £25 million for that Dutch lad who is wildly inconsistent for me, I'd personally stick with Allen instead.

As others have said; Stoke are building themselves a formidable squad - at times last season they were unplayable, and think they'll do better again this time out,

[ChippenhamRed]

4 minutes ago, Scott mcgarveys fanclub said:

No one is don't care who they are

If United win the title, qualify for the Champions League, sell more merchandise, increase their global profile and grow their fan base as a result of having Pogba in the side, then the fee is justified. He could be the difference.

Those are the economics of the situation. It's far too simplistic to say "no one is". Doesn't make it morally acceptable however.

[Eddie Hitler]

4 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said:

If United win the title, qualify for the Champions League, sell more merchandise, increase their global profile and grow their fan base as a result of having Pogba in the side, then the fee is justified. He could be the difference.

Those are the economics of the situation. It's far too simplistic to say "no one is". Doesn't make it morally acceptable however.

Which is why I would like to see this particular one fail badly and it then looks to be a stupid amount to pay and will throw a bucket of cold water over these mental top end deals.

Pogba IIRC was £100m to buy him and £25m for his agent.  Now that is truly mental whereas the £13m for Allen is not unreasonable in the market.

[ChippenhamRed]

10 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Which is why I would like to see this particular one fail badly and it then looks to be a stupid amount to pay and will throw a bucket of cold water over these mental top end deals.

Pogba IIRC was £100m to buy him and £25m for his agent.  Now that is truly mental whereas the £13m for Allen is not unreasonable in the market.

Certainly a gamble, and the stakes are particularly high, but that is always the case for the mega-clubs. Just look at the value of Utd as a global brand v Stoke and you can see why one is spending £100m and the other £13m. Not defending it - it's just the economic reality. If United didn't think Pogba could add more than £100m to their bottom line, they wouldn't pay it.

[redfred]

15 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Which is why I would like to see this particular one fail badly and it then looks to be a stupid amount to pay and will throw a bucket of cold water over these mental top end deals.

Pogba IIRC was £100m to buy him and £25m for his agent.  Now that is truly mental whereas the £13m for Allen is not unreasonable in the market.

There's no way his agent is a £25m player - I've never even heard of him.

In all seriousness, that money for his agent takes the piss, irrespective of whether a club is prepared to pay it or not.

[Lanterne Rouge]

Am I being dim or does the 25mil come out of the 100mil or is it in addition to it?

[Fordy62]

1 hour ago, reddogkev said:

For me, this indicates the craziness in the game, and the distorted value of a million quid.  Don't get me wrong, like most who watch the game I like Allen - not a lot, but I can see his qualities.

Are they worth 13 million quid?  You've got to be aving a laugh!

He moves the ball well, is good lying deep and also providing a platform in a more advanced position, and does, occasionally have a goal threat, but I don't feel he does this well enough to be worth such a figure.

Why is a million pound in the real world such a life-changing balance of money (just think of all you could buy if you scooped a meagre million on the lottery), yet in the footie world, a million seems to be thrown around without a passing thought.

Do you feel this is a fair figure for Joe, or has every Welsh player just appreciated in value by several million?

(BTW - I see this thread appeared twice in the forum - I think I threw a spanner in the works by adding the pound sign to the original title!)

Hi Kev,

Don't think I can add much that hasn't already been covered by others, but I'd like to comment on your monetary value as a poster... Specifically as a thread starter. 

So many threads just contain the title and a four or five word sentence. Or even just a link to a newspaper article. That pisses me right off.

That's not your style. Your opening posts are often well considered and, dare I say, thought provoking. 

You've done enough to make it into my OTIB starting XI. 

Keep up the good work.

I'd rate you at the £10m+ mark as a poster. 

[cidered abroad]

Transfer fees have rarely, if ever, had any relationship with average earnings or what a house costs. When I was 8 years old in 1951, my Dad earned around £6 / £7pw at the BAC in Filton.

In 1951, Notts County of the Second Division, sold Jackie Sewell to Sheff Wed in the First for £34,500 which became the new UK transfer record. He played 6 times for England, later transferred to Villa for £20,000 and then Hull.

He emigrated to what is now Zambia and played 10 games for their national team. I doubt if many under the age of 60 will ever have heard of him.

£34,500 was a ridiculous sum then so where will £13 million for Joe Allen sit now? Or around £3 million for Lee Tomlin. It's not the real world, it's fantasy land but the only difference between now and then, the past, is that while Jackie Sewell was probably well off compared with the average working person, the average player at Championship and above is looking at earnings that will make them millionaires within a very few years. 

[reddogkev]

1 hour ago, Fordy62 said:

Hi Kev,

Don't think I can add much that hasn't already been covered by others, but I'd like to comment on your monetary value as a poster... Specifically as a thread starter. 

So many threads just contain the title and a four or five word sentence. Or even just a link to a newspaper article. That pisses me right off.

That's not your style. Your opening posts are often well considered and, dare I say, thought provoking. 

You've done enough to make it into my OTIB starting XI. 

Keep up the good work.

I'd rate you at the £10m+ mark as a poster. 

Cheers, Fordy, much appreciated.  It's an honour to earn a spot in your team!

[reddogkev]

2 hours ago, Super said:

Is Pogba worth 100m?

I've never seen enough in Paul Pogba's game to suggest his value should be £50mill, let alone double that figure.  Utter madness.

For sure, the money for a player like Pogba is purely for the brand of the man, as opposed to his talents as a midfielder.

 

[AshtonGreat]

3 hours ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Given our fans are talking about 8m for Flint and 10m for Kodjia i'd say that's a steal! 

8M for Flint :laugh:

[1960maaan]

56 minutes ago, AshtonGreat said:

8M for Flint

WBA bid £7m for Dunk, so not so crazy then.

[Eddie Hitler]

3 hours ago, Red Right Hand said:

Am I being dim or does the 25mil come out of the 100mil or is it in addition to it?

In addition to it.  Amazingly.

And it is not you that is being dim; it is the football clubs for paying the agent when in any other business the person he represents would be paying him.