Second Half – That’s the City I want to see

[Fat Cigar]

We only started playing once we went 2-0 down, which, given the timing of their second goal, gave us the whole of the 2^nd half to attack. I recognise that at 2-0 down, in a cup match, you really haven’t got much to lose (apart from the match…) by going all out attack, but that’s the kind of football I want to see from us from the start. Passing at pace and with purpose. Actually making inroads into the opposition’s half, rather than going forwards, then back, then forwards.

Some of our movement off the ball was great. Reid was full of lots of good nifty turns. Pack was immense second half. I was really impressed with Engvall. He has a lovely first touch. More than once he received the ball and turned away from his marker in one movement. How often do you see that? Didn’t really see what he can do shooting wise, but a very decent home debut.

I thought Moore was a lot better first half. That excellent last ditch intervention the highlight. He has a good reading of the game. I thought he was a little sloppy in the second half and gave the ball away too many times for my liking. I know in the separate thread on him he’s being praised to the hilt, but I think he lost his way a bit in the second half. Still, an encouraging performance.

There really was plenty to admire in the second half: high intensity, high octane, slick passing, nice one touch football. We just need more composure in front of goal. Too often the final ball came too late. So many times Little burst down the right, only to wait far too long before releasing it. That’s been a pattern of our play all season. We dally. We’re wanting to walk the ball in the net. Sometimes two or three passes needs to be followed by a shot. Amazing how our players still shirk from shooting near the box. Yes, I know, when they do it’s usually awful, so something to work on. But, holding on to it too long just gives the opposition time to regroup.  

Hull counterattacked at pace and were a strong physical side. I think Brighton will be a very similar prospect. To be honest, I doubt there’s much in it with regards to who’s better: Brighton or Hull.

I know some have complained that we didn’t start with Tomlin and Tammy, but I think Johnson made the right call. Tammy has to be given a breather and yesterday was the ideal time. And what a difference they made.

Watching Lee Tomlin dance his way round their defenders was wonderful. It’s a privilege to watch him. We are witnessing an artist at work. He is worth the price of my season ticket alone. We just need everyone else on his wavelength. That first mazy run he went on when he shot it straight at the keeper…I was imagining his thought process being something along the lines of: “Right, I’ve had enough of this nonsense. Out the way, give me the ball. I’m going right through them.” 

And then he scored doing something almost identical. Was his shot deflected? Have seen the replay a few times and it doesn’t look like it.

Overall, a terrific and thoroughly enjoyable second half. Let’s be honest, we’re 6^th but we haven’t been that good. It’s been our never say die attitude and the super-subs that have propelled us there. One advantage having so many young players. They come on with 25-30 mins to go and terrorise lethargic and tiring players.

I would love us to start Engval up front with Tammy on Saturday, but I very much doubt Johnson will. Hopefully he’ll play some part though Think it’s going to be a cracking match. Expect lots of goals.

[...]

22 minutes ago, Fat Cigar said:

We only started playing once we went 2-0 down, which, given the timing of their second goal, gave us the whole of the 2^nd half to attack. I recognise that at 2-0 down, in a cup match, you really haven’t got much to lose (apart from the match…) by going all out attack, but that’s the kind of football I want to see from us from the start. Passing at pace and with purpose. Actually making inroads into the opposition’s half, rather than going forwards, then back, then forwards.

Some of our movement off the ball was great. Reid was full of lots of good nifty turns. Pack was immense second half. I was really impressed with Engvall. He has a lovely first touch. More than once he received the ball and turned away from his marker in one movement. How often do you see that? Didn’t really see what he can do shooting wise, but a very decent home debut.

I thought Moore was a lot better first half. That excellent last ditch intervention the highlight. He has a good reading of the game. I thought he was a little sloppy in the second half and gave the ball away too many times for my liking. I know in the separate thread on him he’s being praised to the hilt, but I think he lost his way a bit in the second half. Still, an encouraging performance.

There really was plenty to admire in the second half: high intensity, high octane, slick passing, nice one touch football. We just need more composure in front of goal. Too often the final ball came too late. So many times Little burst down the right, only to wait far too long before releasing it. That’s been a pattern of our play all season. We dally. We’re wanting to walk the ball in the net. Sometimes two or three passes needs to be followed by a shot. Amazing how our players still shirk from shooting near the box. Yes, I know, when they do it’s usually awful, so something to work on. But, holding on to it too long just gives the opposition time to regroup.  

Hull counterattacked at pace and were a strong physical side. I think Brighton will be a very similar prospect. To be honest, I doubt there’s much in it with regards to who’s better: Brighton or Hull.

I know some have complained that we didn’t start with Tomlin and Tammy, but I think Johnson made the right call. Tammy has to be given a breather and yesterday was the ideal time. And what a difference they made.

Watching Lee Tomlin dance his way round their defenders was wonderful. It’s a privilege to watch him. We are witnessing an artist at work. He is worth the price of my season ticket alone. We just need everyone else on his wavelength. That first mazy run he went on when he shot it straight at the keeper…I was imagining his thought process being something along the lines of: “Right, I’ve had enough of this nonsense. Out the way, give me the ball. I’m going right through them.” 

And then he scored doing something almost identical. Was his shot deflected? Have seen the replay a few times and it doesn’t look like it.

Overall, a terrific and thoroughly enjoyable second half. Let’s be honest, we’re 6^th but we haven’t been that good. It’s been our never say die attitude and the super-subs that have propelled us there. One advantage having so many young players. They come on with 25-30 mins to go and terrorise lethargic and tiring players.

I would love us to start Engval up front with Tammy on Saturday, but I very much doubt Johnson will. Hopefully he’ll play some part though Think it’s going to be a cracking match. Expect lots of goals.

Is this not like saying you want to be like you were on your best ever night in a night-club??

- Looking amazing; pulling five times; keeping down eight pints without vomiting on the bouncer; funny as hell; and still got into work the next day - when the boss (female, about 30-32, 5'11; white blouse .....) tells you she has always loved and admired you, but only wants sex with no strings ......

WELL TOUGH - LIFE IS NOT LIKE THAT.

Uncle TFR

[AshtonGreat]

41 minutes ago, Fat Cigar said:

We only started playing once we went 2-0 down, which, given the timing of their second goal, gave us the whole of the 2^nd half to attack. I recognise that at 2-0 down, in a cup match, you really haven’t got much to lose (apart from the match…) by going all out attack, but that’s the kind of football I want to see from us from the start. Passing at pace and with purpose. Actually making inroads into the opposition’s half, rather than going forwards, then back, then forwards.

Some of our movement off the ball was great. Reid was full of lots of good nifty turns. Pack was immense second half. I was really impressed with Engvall. He has a lovely first touch. More than once he received the ball and turned away from his marker in one movement. How often do you see that? Didn’t really see what he can do shooting wise, but a very decent home debut.

I thought Moore was a lot better first half. That excellent last ditch intervention the highlight. He has a good reading of the game. I thought he was a little sloppy in the second half and gave the ball away too many times for my liking. I know in the separate thread on him he’s being praised to the hilt, but I think he lost his way a bit in the second half. Still, an encouraging performance.

There really was plenty to admire in the second half: high intensity, high octane, slick passing, nice one touch football. We just need more composure in front of goal. Too often the final ball came too late. So many times Little burst down the right, only to wait far too long before releasing it. That’s been a pattern of our play all season. We dally. We’re wanting to walk the ball in the net. Sometimes two or three passes needs to be followed by a shot. Amazing how our players still shirk from shooting near the box. Yes, I know, when they do it’s usually awful, so something to work on. But, holding on to it too long just gives the opposition time to regroup.  

Hull counterattacked at pace and were a strong physical side. I think Brighton will be a very similar prospect. To be honest, I doubt there’s much in it with regards to who’s better: Brighton or Hull.

I know some have complained that we didn’t start with Tomlin and Tammy, but I think Johnson made the right call. Tammy has to be given a breather and yesterday was the ideal time. And what a difference they made.

Watching Lee Tomlin dance his way round their defenders was wonderful. It’s a privilege to watch him. We are witnessing an artist at work. He is worth the price of my season ticket alone. We just need everyone else on his wavelength. That first mazy run he went on when he shot it straight at the keeper…I was imagining his thought process being something along the lines of: “Right, I’ve had enough of this nonsense. Out the way, give me the ball. I’m going right through them.” 

And then he scored doing something almost identical. Was his shot deflected? Have seen the replay a few times and it doesn’t look like it.

Overall, a terrific and thoroughly enjoyable second half. Let’s be honest, we’re 6^th but we haven’t been that good. It’s been our never say die attitude and the super-subs that have propelled us there. One advantage having so many young players. They come on with 25-30 mins to go and terrorise lethargic and tiring players.

I would love us to start Engval up front with Tammy on Saturday, but I very much doubt Johnson will. Hopefully he’ll play some part though Think it’s going to be a cracking match. Expect lots of goals.

Tomlin is fantastic when he's on his game but with talent like that you expect him to be hugely influential in every game. We haven't seen that yet this season

[LeeCity]

 

Our first half performance was our best home first half showing all season and I doubt anyone gave the ball away more than Pack.

 

Magnusson against Blackburn and Moore last night (both times with Flint) were MOM performances.

 

I wish we'd play 2 up front (at home anyway), for me it's the reason why our first half showings this season have been so poor.

 

[spudski]

35 minutes ago, Fat Cigar said:

We only started playing once we went 2-0 down, which, given the timing of their second goal, gave us the whole of the 2^nd half to attack. I recognise that at 2-0 down, in a cup match, you really haven’t got much to lose (apart from the match…) by going all out attack, but that’s the kind of football I want to see from us from the start. Passing at pace and with purpose. Actually making inroads into the opposition’s half, rather than going forwards, then back, then forwards.

Some of our movement off the ball was great. Reid was full of lots of good nifty turns. Pack was immense second half. I was really impressed with Engvall. He has a lovely first touch. More than once he received the ball and turned away from his marker in one movement. How often do you see that? Didn’t really see what he can do shooting wise, but a very decent home debut.

I thought Moore was a lot better first half. That excellent last ditch intervention the highlight. He has a good reading of the game. I thought he was a little sloppy in the second half and gave the ball away too many times for my liking. I know in the separate thread on him he’s being praised to the hilt, but I think he lost his way a bit in the second half. Still, an encouraging performance.

There really was plenty to admire in the second half: high intensity, high octane, slick passing, nice one touch football. We just need more composure in front of goal. Too often the final ball came too late. So many times Little burst down the right, only to wait far too long before releasing it. That’s been a pattern of our play all season. We dally. We’re wanting to walk the ball in the net. Sometimes two or three passes needs to be followed by a shot. Amazing how our players still shirk from shooting near the box. Yes, I know, when they do it’s usually awful, so something to work on. But, holding on to it too long just gives the opposition time to regroup.  

Hull counterattacked at pace and were a strong physical side. I think Brighton will be a very similar prospect. To be honest, I doubt there’s much in it with regards to who’s better: Brighton or Hull.

I know some have complained that we didn’t start with Tomlin and Tammy, but I think Johnson made the right call. Tammy has to be given a breather and yesterday was the ideal time. And what a difference they made.

Watching Lee Tomlin dance his way round their defenders was wonderful. It’s a privilege to watch him. We are witnessing an artist at work. He is worth the price of my season ticket alone. We just need everyone else on his wavelength. That first mazy run he went on when he shot it straight at the keeper…I was imagining his thought process being something along the lines of: “Right, I’ve had enough of this nonsense. Out the way, give me the ball. I’m going right through them.” 

And then he scored doing something almost identical. Was his shot deflected? Have seen the replay a few times and it doesn’t look like it.

Overall, a terrific and thoroughly enjoyable second half. Let’s be honest, we’re 6^th but we haven’t been that good. It’s been our never say die attitude and the super-subs that have propelled us there. One advantage having so many young players. They come on with 25-30 mins to go and terrorise lethargic and tiring players.

I would love us to start Engval up front with Tammy on Saturday, but I very much doubt Johnson will. Hopefully he’ll play some part though Think it’s going to be a cracking match. Expect lots of goals.

Nice post mate...some good points about certain players.

However...as much as the second half was enjoyable and very entertaining, the only reason we could play that openly was because we were two down and chasing the game.

If it was 0-0 and a league game, no way would you risk playing that way.

All very well playing that way, because it's exciting and open...but it would lead to losing most games.

I've a good friend who works for the first team at Burnley...he's been around the Championship a fair bit. He's always said to me something that you've quoted...we're 6th and haven't been that good'...he'd say similar, but...'We're 1st and haven't been that good'. The championship is that type of league...more nitty gritty games than actually entertaining and 'looking good'

As for last night...I was really happy to see the team put out...what other match would be suitable to try out Engval and McCoulsky....

Had it not been for better Goalkeeping, we matched Hull all over the pitch.

Was really impressed by Engval and Moore. Thought Odowda had his best game for us too. Flint was also immense. Pack showed why he needs to play regularly, with his vision and passing.

Where we can work on....

Thought ROD was poor all night...and I'm not a fan of FF either. Could have done better for both goals imo.

For all his endeavour and bulldozing himself into position...what's the point, when Little can't strike a clean ball into the box? Scuffed 90% of every ball it seemed...so frustrating after all that hard work.

Still think we need better movement off the ball in the final third. Too many players standing still or in the shadow of an opponent, preventing a pass. The amount of times Goldbourne had  the ball in the final third, with no option but to go backwards, to keep possession, because our forward players weren't coming or moving for the ball into space. Again so frustrating.

As you say...really enjoyable game, and the players deserved their standing ovation at the end. If it weren't for two lapses in concentration, we slightly edged that game imo.

We've come a long way in a short time.

[Red Exile]

How great to read some considered reactions to the match! And some thought provoking observations.

I'd only add that it was great opportunity to see the depth of the squad...which was encouraging.

And to get 16k to a League Cup match was some feat...lots of new faces sat around us, and they'll hopefully back after what must have been an exciting end to the game.

 

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Still no goal at home scored in the 1st half this season which is incredible and needs rectifying quickly if we are to maintain our strong home record. Seems we only really play in 2nd half at home this season.

[cidered abroad]

Fat Cigar. Tomlin's original shot was on target towards middle (ish) of the goal but had a deflection which made the ball curve in to the net just inside the post.

A very good post. I've said similar things in a new thread and only noticed your thread after I'd created a new one. Enjoyable match and there is a definite buzz about City at present. 

[Gert Mare]

2 hours ago, Fat Cigar said:

We only started playing once we went 2-0 down, which, given the timing of their second goal, gave us the whole of the 2^nd half to attack. I recognise that at 2-0 down, in a cup match, you really haven’t got much to lose (apart from the match…) by going all out attack, but that’s the kind of football I want to see from us from the start. Passing at pace and with purpose. Actually making inroads into the opposition’s half, rather than going forwards, then back, then forwards.

Some of our movement off the ball was great. Reid was full of lots of good nifty turns. Pack was immense second half. I was really impressed with Engvall. He has a lovely first touch. More than once he received the ball and turned away from his marker in one movement. How often do you see that? Didn’t really see what he can do shooting wise, but a very decent home debut.

I thought Moore was a lot better first half. That excellent last ditch intervention the highlight. He has a good reading of the game. I thought he was a little sloppy in the second half and gave the ball away too many times for my liking. I know in the separate thread on him he’s being praised to the hilt, but I think he lost his way a bit in the second half. Still, an encouraging performance.

There really was plenty to admire in the second half: high intensity, high octane, slick passing, nice one touch football. We just need more composure in front of goal. Too often the final ball came too late. So many times Little burst down the right, only to wait far too long before releasing it. That’s been a pattern of our play all season. We dally. We’re wanting to walk the ball in the net. Sometimes two or three passes needs to be followed by a shot. Amazing how our players still shirk from shooting near the box. Yes, I know, when they do it’s usually awful, so something to work on. But, holding on to it too long just gives the opposition time to regroup.  

Hull counterattacked at pace and were a strong physical side. I think Brighton will be a very similar prospect. To be honest, I doubt there’s much in it with regards to who’s better: Brighton or Hull.

I know some have complained that we didn’t start with Tomlin and Tammy, but I think Johnson made the right call. Tammy has to be given a breather and yesterday was the ideal time. And what a difference they made.

Watching Lee Tomlin dance his way round their defenders was wonderful. It’s a privilege to watch him. We are witnessing an artist at work. He is worth the price of my season ticket alone. We just need everyone else on his wavelength. That first mazy run he went on when he shot it straight at the keeper…I was imagining his thought process being something along the lines of: “Right, I’ve had enough of this nonsense. Out the way, give me the ball. I’m going right through them.” 

And then he scored doing something almost identical. Was his shot deflected? Have seen the replay a few times and it doesn’t look like it.

Overall, a terrific and thoroughly enjoyable second half. Let’s be honest, we’re 6^th but we haven’t been that good. It’s been our never say die attitude and the super-subs that have propelled us there. One advantage having so many young players. They come on with 25-30 mins to go and terrorise lethargic and tiring players.

I would love us to start Engval up front with Tammy on Saturday, but I very much doubt Johnson will. Hopefully he’ll play some part though Think it’s going to be a cracking match. Expect lots of goals.

because we brought on our two best players Abraham and Tomlin who should have started the game.

[Fat Cigar]

4 hours ago, spudski said:

Nice post mate...some good points about certain players.

However...as much as the second half was enjoyable and very entertaining, the only reason we could play that openly was because we were two down and chasing the game.

If it was 0-0 and a league game, no way would you risk playing that way.

All very well playing that way, because it's exciting and open...but it would lead to losing most games.

I've a good friend who works for the first team at Burnley...he's been around the Championship a fair bit. He's always said to me something that you've quoted...we're 6th and haven't been that good'...he'd say similar, but...'We're 1st and haven't been that good'. The championship is that type of league...more nitty gritty games than actually entertaining and 'looking good'

As for last night...I was really happy to see the team put out...what other match would be suitable to try out Engval and McCoulsky....

Had it not been for better Goalkeeping, we matched Hull all over the pitch.

Was really impressed by Engval and Moore. Thought Odowda had his best game for us too. Flint was also immense. Pack showed why he needs to play regularly, with his vision and passing.

Where we can work on....

Thought ROD was poor all night...and I'm not a fan of FF either. Could have done better for both goals imo.

For all his endeavour and bulldozing himself into position...what's the point, when Little can't strike a clean ball into the box? Scuffed 90% of every ball it seemed...so frustrating after all that hard work.

Still think we need better movement off the ball in the final third. Too many players standing still or in the shadow of an opponent, preventing a pass. The amount of times Goldbourne had  the ball in the final third, with no option but to go backwards, to keep possession, because our forward players weren't coming or moving for the ball into space. Again so frustrating.

As you say...really enjoyable game, and the players deserved their standing ovation at the end. If it weren't for two lapses in concentration, we slightly edged that game imo.

We've come a long way in a short time.

Fair points.

Little is doing his best, but he's not really good enough is he.

The thing that drives me mad (and so many of our players are guilty of it) is when they receive a pass deep inside our own half, but rather than getting it forward quickly, or passing it back first time, they hang on to it. A few seconds elapse and they still haven't passed it. They put themselves under unnecessary pressure, they then feel rushed and their pass back is hesitant and often falls short. We haven't been punished as much this season as last, but it's suicidal play.

Agree with you 100% over the GKs. Have felt for a while that neither is good enough. People get sucked in by the good reflex saves (which are good, but every keeper pulls these off. That's their job), but neither commands his box, or is confident from set pieces, or back passes. Do we blame O'Donnell for the first goal? My initial reaction was yes. How did he not catch that? 

I think a top class keeper is as much a priority in Jan or the summer as two new strikers. Stockdale of Brighton is my favourite. A superb keeper. Obviously not going to join us, but worth watching.

Very interesting what your Burnley mate says. And reassuring. I mean, we really haven't played that well yet have we?? Had good halves, but there's got to be more to come, surely. 

[mozo]

This topic could apply to 90% of our games this season!

[spudski]

15 minutes ago, Fat Cigar said:

Fair points.

Little is doing his best, but he's not really good enough is he.

The thing that drives me mad (and so many of our players are guilty of it) is when they receive a pass deep inside our own half, but rather than getting it forward quickly, or passing it back first time, they hang on to it. A few seconds elapse and they still haven't passed it. They put themselves under unnecessary pressure, they then feel rushed and their pass back is hesitant and often falls short. We haven't been punished as much this season as last, but it's suicidal play.

Agree with you 100% over the GKs. Have felt for a while that neither is good enough. People get sucked in by the good reflex saves (which are good, but every keeper pulls these off. That's their job), but neither commands his box, or is confident from set pieces, or back passes. Do we blame O'Donnell for the first goal? My initial reaction was yes. How did he not catch that? 

I think a top class keeper is as much a priority in Jan or the summer as two new strikers. Stockdale of Brighton is my favourite. A superb keeper. Obviously not going to join us, but worth watching.

Very interesting what your Burnley mate says. And reassuring. I mean, we really haven't played that well yet have we?? Had good halves, but there's got to be more to come, surely. 

Agreed...Little imo, is a great trier and 100% effort. He tries his best...but at this level you need that little bit more finesse. How many times has he got into the final third and good positions, only to rush a scuffed ball across. A little more composure and quality is needed in that final third. So frustrating after all the hard work is done.

As for your second point...again frustrating...but often down to the lack of options in front of them. a couple fans next to me last night were having a go at Goldbourne for going backwards instead of getting the ball forward. But what they failed to notice was that every player in front of him was tightly marked or pass blocked. He had no options but to go back and retain possession. That happens frequently...our players hang on to the ball looking for a pass...but no opportunity arises without a good chance they will lose possession and put themselves under danger....hence the back pass and 'start again' approach.

As for our GK's....agreed...at this level they should be consistently better in their all round game. Both don't give me confidence, which is what you need from your goalkeeper.

As for your last sentence...I think what we have seen so far this season, as in 'standard' of football...I think it's a fair reflection of what we will witness in this league...much of a muchness. There isn't much difference between a great majority of the teams, and they often nullify one another.

This league is so much harder than League 1...every game is a battle.

[Fat Cigar]

7 minutes ago, spudski said:

Agreed...Little imo, is a great trier and 100% effort. He tries his best...but at this level you need that little bit more finesse. How many times has he got into the final third and good positions, only to rush a scuffed ball across. A little more composure and quality is needed in that final third. So frustrating after all the hard work is done.

As for your second point...again frustrating...but often down to the lack of options in front of them. a couple fans next to me last night were having a go at Goldbourne for going backwards instead of getting the ball forward. But what they failed to notice was that every player in front of him was tightly marked or pass blocked. He had no options but to go back and retain possession. That happens frequently...our players hang on to the ball looking for a pass...but no opportunity arises without a good chance they will lose possession and put themselves under danger....hence the back pass and 'start again' approach.

As for our GK's....agreed...at this level they should be consistently better in their all round game. Both don't give me confidence, which is what you need from your goalkeeper.

As for your last sentence...I think what we have seen so far this season, as in 'standard' of football...I think it's a fair reflection of what we will witness in this league...much of a muchness. There isn't much difference between a great majority of the teams, and they often nullify one another.

This league is so much harder than League 1...every game is a battle.

When we got promoted, I said that we had no reason to fear most clubs, in particular the fallen giants, living off past glories. Now, two-thirds of last season was awful, but when we got up and running, you soon realise just how ordinary most teams are.

There's your top two - Norwich and Newcastle, then Sheff Wed and Brighton, then a scramble. Once they start scoring, you'd expect Villa to rise up the table. Derby are in a bad rut and in McClaren have made a really poor choice. Again. There's no reason we can't challenge for the play-offs, but think we lack the canniness and maturity at the moment. Hence why I think top 10 more likely. 

[spudski]

If we make top 10 in only our second season up again, then I'd be very delighted. Play offs are a dream...but lets keep dreaming ;-)

[Rudolf Hucker]

I hate to say it but I thought that Joe had a poor game by his standards. He did brilliantly in the first half to bring a high ball under control and turn in a single movement but otherwise he seemed a little jaded and almost pleased to be taken off.

[Fat Cigar]

15 minutes ago, Rudolf Hucker said:

I hate to say it but I thought that Joe had a poor game by his standards. He did brilliantly in the first half to bring a high ball under control and turn in a single movement but otherwise he seemed a little jaded and almost pleased to be taken off.

Agree. He's had better days.

[TheCulturalBomb]

It makes me wonder what on EARTH we were doing at Cardiff. That game was polar opposite of how we played yesterday, ball on the ground lovely passing and runs in midfield.

[cityexile]

46 minutes ago, Rudolf Hucker said:

I hate to say it but I thought that Joe had a poor game by his standards. He did brilliantly in the first half to bring a high ball under control and turn in a single movement but otherwise he seemed a little jaded and almost pleased to be taken off.

First goal cannot really work out what he is doing. Seems to get pushed along by their player who heads it in. If he just stand his ground, it is no goal. Equally, really bad goalkeeping it seemed to let it in.

Not questioning commitment, but felt for a while we have two very good back up keepers, not a strong number one at this level. Both are good in parts.

Agree re need to keep in tight, eight games in our league finished 1-0 this weekend, but it is a balance. Would really love to see a good first half!

[cidercity]

I dont get people still getting their little digs in about Pack, gave the ball away the most, i dont think so.

It could be that he is on the ball a lot more than any other player and is always available to receive it.

I thought last night we were excellent in both halves, outplayed a prem team just caught out at 2 set pieces, their keeper made 3 good saves and we had a ball kicked off of the line, not 2 shabby.

Personally i would much prefer our starting midfield from last night and obviously Tomlin than last Saturdays, Korey and GO are to negative and we have no creativity with 2 defensive midfielders in there.

[spudski]

38 minutes ago, TheCulturalBomb said:

It makes me wonder what on EARTH we were doing at Cardiff. That game was polar opposite of how we played yesterday, ball on the ground lovely passing and runs in midfield.

Hull played a totally different game last night compared to Cardiff...much more open and didn't press and pack the midfield so tightly. It gave us room to play more....especially on the floor. Warnock set them up to play a 'disruptive game'. At Cardiff we had way more possession...but just couldn't break them down and create shooting chances that day...it happens and will continue to do so in this league.

[BobBobSuperBob]

4 hours ago, spudski said:

 

As for your second point...again frustrating...but often down to the lack of options in front of them. a couple fans next to me last night were having a go at Goldbourne for going backwards instead of getting the ball forward. But what they failed to notice was that every player in front of him was tightly marked or pass blocked. He had no options but to go back and retain possession. That happens frequently...our players hang on to the ball looking for a pass...but no opportunity arises without a good chance they will lose possession and put themselves under danger....hence the back pass and 'start again' approach.

 

There's a reason for that Spud - our movement (or I should say complete lack of it ) off the ball, to give the player in possession an option(s) is ridiculously absent most of the time - Spent a fair part of last night watching players off the ball and it was statues - no hint of anyone inviting a pass or even making a movement to make the opposition think - most of the time the man on the ball had to find / make / force a pass

As you know the run should invite the pass not the other way round.

players sometimes only need to move a few yards to create space / change angles etc

if we want to be really good keeping possession we need to improve this significantly and frustratingly it should come second nature to pros and if not , should be one of the easier things to rectify

 

 

 

[spudski]

12 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

There's a reason for that Spud - our movement (or I should say complete lack of it ) off the ball, to give the player in possession an option(s) is ridiculously absent most of the time - Spent a fair part of last night watching players off the ball and it was statues - no hint of anyone inviting a pass or even making a movement to make the opposition think - most of the time the man on the ball had to find / make / force a pass

As you know the run should invite the pass not the other way round.

players sometimes only need to move a few yards to create space / change angles etc

if we want to be really good keeping possession we need to improve this significantly and frustratingly it should come second nature to pros and if not , should be one of the easier things to rectify

 

 

 

Indeed....I totally agree mate, and it's something I've said like you in numerous posts recently. Our lack of movement off the ball is shocking...especially in the final third.

What frustrates me even more, and I don't know whether you've noticed this also, but some players are actively positioning themselves behind an opponent, instead of creating an angle, it seems so that they wont get a pass given to them....almost wanting a breather. Tomlin does this a lot....then gets a second wind and makes himself available.

Hardly anyone comes for the ball...Wilbs does though. Most just sit on the shoulder of a defender. No movement to take a player away from a danger area...not even a simple scissor movement.

[TheCulturalBomb]

5 hours ago, spudski said:

Hull played a totally different game last night compared to Cardiff...much more open and didn't press and pack the midfield so tightly. It gave us room to play more....especially on the floor. Warnock set them up to play a 'disruptive game'. At Cardiff we had way more possession...but just couldn't break them down and create shooting chances that day...it happens and will continue to do so in this league.

You saw the way we played though? We were hoofing it up the pitch and losing it everytime, far more logical to keep it on the ground and see if we can find a weakness. Even if it takes time.

[Marlborough Red]

In my business life we had a mantra- "Get it right first time".

Playing devils advocate , may I suggest that at Ashton Gate LJ has never achieved this objective. It is very concerning that we have failed to score in any game in the first half at home, often failing to get any shots on target and certainly not presenting any serious threat. Tammy is isolated and we seem to play the ball to him too much in the air which, as we all know, does not play to his strengths. The obvious conclusion is that he has not selected the right team for Home games and we only come alive after half time, often when we go  a goal behind and he then makes changes and brings on  the substitutes needed and ends up more often then not playing 2 up front.

It would be a pleasant change at the Brighton match to get the team selection right first time , play 2 up front at home  (Engval and Tammy perhaps)  score a goal  in the first half and take the lead , forcing the opposition to change their tactics and push forward more giving us the chance to score on the break !

Getting the team selection right first time would also mean he  can start with this team for the next home match without the need for constant changes particularly in midfield.

 

• Quote

[spudski]

13 minutes ago, TheCulturalBomb said:

You saw the way we played though? We were hoofing it up the pitch and losing it everytime, far more logical to keep it on the ground and see if we can find a weakness. Even if it takes time.

I watched the game...yes. We did play the long ball on occasion when space ran out in midfield. However...Stats show we had 59% possession, so I'd suggest we weren't losing it every time. Plus we made more chances. Warnocks teams are renowned for being spoilers. We were never going to win that game, for a multitude of reasons.