does anyone actually want LJ to stay?

[BobBobSuperBob]

5 minutes ago, Bs4Red said:

I am very much 50/50, I must admit up until the Fulham game I was fully backing him. 

In my honest opinion I believe LJ will become a great manager in the future, he's passionate, willing to learn and still very young. He also believes and cares about the future of this club. 

Man United very nearly sacked SAF at the start of his career and look what they were rewarded with for not doing so (slightly different but best I could think off top of my head)

I am also baffled throughout this run and season just how lightly the players have got off, some of them have been an absolute disgrace. The blatant lack of effort and passion is there to see. You can tell me "the manager doesn't get the best out of them" I personally believe that if this is the case for some of our players it shows why they're where they are. Top players perform no matter who the manager, and they at least put the effort required.

My reasoning mainly for wanting him to stay is 3 reasons.

1. He has proven already that when he gets it right, we look a great team (First 15 games or so)

2. He's young and still learning, yes he does make mistakes but that's going to happen. 

3. I don't think we will go down and I also believe he will get it right eventually 

Surely we are all bored of the same old cycle of managers at this club. 

Sorry but here we go again with one of the most ridiculous arguments ever - and keeps getting thrown in

Start of his career ??

Had succeeded at St Mirren

Won Scottish League and cups with Aberdeen

Oh yes , and the European Cup,Winners Cup

Oh yes , had also managed his country at the 86 World Cup

 

And Lee - a pretty suspect CV and very worrying testimonials from two L1 clubs 

hmmmmmmmm

I despair

 

[milo1111]

I honestly thought he was a dead man walking after losing to brentford and preston at home in a week pre xmas but knew lansdown would give him every chance to turn it around. Ive gone past being angry about it. Just want the season to end asap either way tbh. Watch a bit of cricket instead or something. This whole fiasco is just really sad now. He is clearly still here because of cronyism and because he is a yes man.

The idea that he is the only manager out there who would buy into our set up (project) is simply absurd. I thought the whole point of our set up was to provide continuity should a change in head coach be deemed necessary. How do clubs like swansea and soton keep going with changes in head coach. For starters most continental head coaches work this way and im sure there are plenty of guys who could do better than LJ in this country, who would jump at the chance and who would accept the structure. Some dinasours wouldnt but plenty would.

[BobBobSuperBob]

11 minutes ago, Bob Thompson said:

I use my own name. I have never spoken to LJ or his father or any of the present players. I be!ieve he has the making of a good manager. I don't know who is fit or who finds the players. I believe that LJ has the making of a good football coach.Whether he can be a good manager is another question. The abuse that all coaches get is intolerable and this certainly effects their judgement. We all the increases at city with the various departments a review of the running of the club should certainly be appraised. In the meantime we stick with the coaches and players until the end of the season.  33 is a young age to manage footballers, perhaps the job came too soon and an older head  to assist might help. Just stating he is useless without clarification does not help any. LJ stays at least to the end of the season and even longer in some capacity.

Oh blimey the irony

Nor does stating he has the making of a good manager or 'good football coach' , you seem unsure

without 'clarification'

[LC_]

on the wall opposite the desk where LJ conducts his press conferences at Failand is a mural composed of inspirational quotes. On the day when LJ is finally put out of his misery, he's going to leave the training ground and it's going to become apparent he's been making all this shit up as he's gone along, plucking verbatims from the wall. He's just a gimpy limp away from Keyser Soze

[Olé]

19 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Yep, I am usually still backing the manager when they are fired.  I didn't want Cotts fired.  (NB - that's not to say I don't agree with it in hindsight - I do).

I don't actually want LJ fired as it happens, I think he should step down and so retain some self-respect and the chance of another managerial job.

This is exactly me too. I have a recent history of defending managers when they leave. With Johnson I haven't felt the same but I also haven't been necessarily goading for a firing, I'd be very happy and frankly less surprised to see him actually accept the inevitable and step down to make it easier for a chairman who has backed him to the hilt (pay offs make that less likely, but he could at least offer a mutual agreement conversation - his position is utterly untenable).

Full credit to @ooRya for the explanation, it has plenty of logic and I know for a fact talking to people off OTIB, that this view has some sympathy. I am certainly not going to pull it to pieces - I don't agree with it, but I can't argue with the thought process. What I would say is that SL has been burned by some managers he could not control and I think it goes to the other extreme to believe that LJ is the only one who could fit into the progressive structure the club has. It just isn't true, but I think SL is terrified of trying to find out.

The one bit I would pick up from @ooRya's well reasoned post, only in the interest of debate, is the tactical bit.

This just confuses me. It's become a bit of a cliché that LJ may be implementing tactics that are well beyond the capacity of his players. Certainly that was my (only logical) assumption for 3 months up to Christmas, when I couldn't understand how else some of our football had become so laboured and confused if not due to clearly good players struggling to adapt. However since Christmas we've seen a succession of amateurish tactical mistakes and no shortage of evidence that the manager isn't certain of his best team, formation, or playing style.

Perhaps the latter IS him desperately dialling down his tactical expertise searching for a solution, but the former is exactly what it had looked like: tactical weakness. I'm afraid at that point I just can't reconcile this "step ahead" tactician idea with the things he is doing. I fear he just talks a good tactical story that he has learned or studied but actually has zero experience of applying to good effect.

He (and football as a vocation) would not be alone in having people who are well studied and have ideas but are utterly unable to turn that into a coherent management style or progress, because they lack that critical experience which turns knowledge and ideas (unapplied) into actual expertise (applied) of what works and what doesn't. LJ is blundering through because he has yet to accept failure, stop, take a step back, and take life's lessons into how he applies his knowledge successfully in future.

Someone put it so well in another thread a few weeks ago (was it @BCFC_Dan?) that he'll go on to be a great manager but this was too soon for him as he was always going to need to learn the hard way by failing somewhere first, ideally not with us. The crying shame of this is not for LJ, who will learn from this all in the end, but for the club, given that both SL and LJ seem unprepared to accept that we're in the failure phase any apprentice goes through when they have knowledge but not the experience, and that isn't ever going to change "on the job".

[BobBobSuperBob]

30 minutes ago, spudski said:

That's exactly the same way as I feel...however, I still think it's 50-50 as to whether we will go down.

I think the biggest difference for me these days...is if we go down...do I care?...not really. I've become apathetic. Was quiet good fun in League 1. I also enjoy watching footy at FGR's...it's about the day out for me, not so much the result or where we are in the league.

Football is my hobby...something that's meant to be fun and relaxing. When it's starts effecting how you feel every day, then you know, imo, it's time to reflect a little.

You've only got to read this forum to see how many people are frustrated, angry, unhappy...they post every day. The same things...frustration jumping at you from the screens. I know some spend a lot of time on here, because of 'situations' in their day to day lives, and they have this as an outlet. It becomes all consuming in their lives...it takes over. The Club and the results have a massive effect on some peoples lives it seems.

Of course like anyone I want the Club to do it's best and be successful...however...City and following them, and watching other football Clubs, and taking an interest in coaching and all parts of the game...it's purely a past time, an interest....I'm not going to allow it to get to me.

I see fans with very little money and some who can't afford to go to games, get so involved in following the Club and letting it effect them. What's the point if it makes you angry and frustrated so much? So what if we were to ever win the Championship...what do 'bragging rights' give you in the big picture of your life? Is a Man Utd or Chelsea fans life any better than someone who follows Tranmere for example...or any other Club?

I sat at the Bristol v Bath game on Sunday and just let it wash over me...I do the same when I go to watch GCCC play....chill out with mates, have a few beers, bit of banter, maybe an Indian....and just watch the game.

I thought on Sunday...I should be more like this when watching City. What's the point in getting frustrated.

SL's a multi millionaire...the players get paid thousands, it's a job to them. Do they sit at home or work going mental? I doubt it. I'm a normal bloke paying to watch people at work...it's no longer a Club, it's a business. The results on the field shouldn't really effect how I feel. Granted it's great when you win...but I'm not gonna let it spoil my days anymore.

I'm embracing apathy...haha ;-)

 

Spud

Youve only become apathetic in the last couple of weeks 

Prior to that you were anything but apathetic and posting very vociferously and critical of most football fans, in your unwavering support of LJ and what the club were doing

So to dig at people who are still passionate but vociferous in their concerns / frustrations / anger is a bit strange if I'm honest

Look back at your posts

 

[Kid in the Riot]

26 minutes ago, spudski said:

That's exactly the same way as I feel...however, I still think it's 50-50 as to whether we will go down.

I think the biggest difference for me these days...is if we go down...do I care?...not really. I've become apathetic. Was quiet good fun in League 1. I also enjoy watching footy at FGR's...it's about the day out for me, not so much the result or where we are in the league.

Football is my hobby...something that's meant to be fun and relaxing. When it's starts effecting how you feel every day, then you know, imo, it's time to reflect a little.

You've only got to read this forum to see how many people are frustrated, angry, unhappy...they post every day. The same things...frustration jumping at you from the screens. I know some spend a lot of time on here, because of 'situations' in their day to day lives, and they have this as an outlet. It becomes all consuming in their lives...it takes over. The Club and the results have a massive effect on some peoples lives it seems.

Of course like anyone I want the Club to do it's best and be successful...however...City and following them, and watching other football Clubs, and taking an interest in coaching and all parts of the game...it's purely a past time, an interest....I'm not going to allow it to get to me.

I see fans with very little money and some who can't afford to go to games, get so involved in following the Club and letting it effect them. What's the point if it makes you angry and frustrated so much? So what if we were to ever win the Championship...what do 'bragging rights' give you in the big picture of your life? Is a Man Utd or Chelsea fans life any better than someone who follows Tranmere for example...or any other Club?

I sat at the Bristol v Bath game on Sunday and just let it wash over me...I do the same when I go to watch GCCC play....chill out with mates, have a few beers, bit of banter, maybe an Indian....and just watch the game.

I thought on Sunday...I should be more like this when watching City. What's the point in getting frustrated.

SL's a multi millionaire...the players get paid thousands, it's a job to them. Do they sit at home or work going mental? I doubt it. I'm a normal bloke paying to watch people at work...it's no longer a Club, it's a business. The results on the field shouldn't really effect how I feel. Granted it's great when you win...but I'm not gonna let it spoil my days anymore.

I'm embracing apathy...haha ;-)

Apathy is a dangerous place for us City fans to be...especially with an autocratic owner. Look what happened to Cardiff fans when they were apathetic about the changes Tan made to the club; they lost the identity of the football club.

As another example, what does an apathetic electorate get? A shit government that can do what they want without fear of repercussion.

Whatever you do, don't become apathetic mate; it's what separates us from shit clubs like Cardiff and the bin-dippers from N Bristol!

[Bs4Red]

12 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Sorry but here we go again with one of the most ridiculous arguments ever - and keeps getting thrown in

Start of his career ??

Had succeeded at St Mirren

Won Scottish League and cups with Aberdeen

Oh yes , and the European Cup,Winners Cup

Oh yes , had also managed his country at the 86 World Cup

 

And Lee - a pretty suspect CV and very worrying testimonials from two L1 clubs 

hmmmmmmmm

I despair

 

I meant the start of his United career and also did (slightly different but best I could think off too of my head)

 

[42nite]

1 hour ago, Rascal said:

You need to find a club with more money than sense and sell him to them 

Cheap shot!

Off you go now.

[RedLionLad]

I believe the contract extension is the stumbling block. SL has to stick by that decision no matter what happens on the pitch.

Money men don't like to be seen as foolish or stupid.

 

[BCFC_Dan]

26 minutes ago, Olé said:

Someone put it so well in another thread a few weeks ago (was it @BCFC_Dan?) that he'll go on to be a great manager but this was too soon for him as he was always going to need to learn the hard way by failing somewhere first, ideally not with us. The crying shame of this is not for LJ, who will learn from this all in the end, but for the club, given that both SL and LJ seem unprepared to accept that we're in the failure phase any apprentice goes through when they have knowledge but not the experience, and that isn't ever going to change "on the job".

Yes that was me. I also said that if he fails, leaves, and recovers suitably elsewhere then I would have no problem at all with him returning in the future if the circumstances are right.

He's not a Tony Pulis, who is clearly capable but whose methods were anathema to the club and its supporters. He's also not a Tinnion or a Millen, as he's shown some aptitude for the job at a lower level. There is no reason to dislike a man who is simply failing at a job he desperately wants to succeed in.

The more he fails at City, the harder it will be for him to recover. If he scrapes through this season he might yet come good next year but the problems aren't going to go away. Relationships with the players and fans won't be reset over the summer. He'll have to start with wins in August, whichever division we're in, or his position will be absolutely untenable.

This can all be managed in a good way if the people involved choose to do so. He can leave honourably and on good terms, even attending the press conference as his father did. He could accept a lesser coaching role under someone else, or he could look elsewhere for a managerial job. He doesn't have to burn any bridges at City.

I think SL feels he will be successful one day and didn't want to miss out on him. If he'd taken Barnsley up and they'd done OK in the Championship (as they have) then Lee would be a target for bigger Championship clubs and smaller Premiership clubs. We're a big draw but we're not that big. He needs to accept that it's not happening right here right now and consider letting him move on, which is the probably the best outcome for all parties.

[RedM]

1 hour ago, Shtanley said:

If we beat burton then yeah. I know it's stupid but I'm bored of the idea of changing managers. I appreciate that my viewpoint borders on ridiculous. Even with this abysmal run it would frustrate me immensely for him to be sacked, simply because he promised so much. 

Got to admit that I feel the same, if he goes it would be another failure for us and we've had too many. I pretty much never want our managers sacked, SoD was the only recent exception (when I was dancing in the street) and Pulis before that.

Saying that it now feels like we are in quicksand since trudging away from Villa Park last night. I've written on another thread that I can only see him staying, but I can only see us relegated too. So it will be project #Stick&Rebuild, but we should never have had to.

I certainly do not want League One again so soon, and I think many feel the same. I like Lee Johnson, but he should never have been given our club to use as a Guinea Pig to practice his management career with, as someone else says it was at least a club too soon for him.

[Vincent Vega]

16 minutes ago, RedLionLad said:

I believe the contract extension is the stumbling block. SL has to stick by that decision no matter what happens on the pitch.

Money men don't like to be seen as foolish or stupid.

 

But in this case he is. What does he think the rest of us will just forget what he did  the man's delusional .

[Olé]

42 minutes ago, Bs4Red said:

1. He has proven already that when he gets it right, we look a great team (First 15 games or so)

37 minutes ago, miketh2nd said:

The main problem with his game plans appear we either go all guns blazing for a win which worked at the start of the season

I am full of respect for those of you who have posted well reasoned and eloquent explanations for why you still hope that Johnson can turn this round. I can see some logic in your thinking and more power to you for your optimism.

With that said, on a point of order, I don't think we were ever getting it right or it was "working" earlier in the season. For me, based on the quality of performances, things must have changed in the summer. LJ's influence and how we setup, was very different right from the start of the season. It didn't work for long periods. At Burton we were anything but "all guns blazing", they were all over us for long periods.

In that first 11 games (which is all it was) that people think LJ can or will reproduce again in future, Tammy was on an unprecedented hot scoring streak that is almost impossible to achieve over the course of a season - this masked some weakness. We also only looked like a great attacking team at Fulham, for a half at Rotherham (obviously) a half at home to Villa, and just bursts of the Forest, Leeds and Wednesday games. Some of the problems that have become endemic now, were visible at times then. Results were good but in my view the football really wasn't besides those periods, so probably no more than 1 game, 2 halves, and some bits and pieces in 11 matches, Tammy scoring or featuring heavily in all of that. Otherwise we already exhibited the lack of pace, the compactness, the lack of variety in our attacking, and the standing off and lack of press. The problems have been around for a long time - teams didn't do a lot to figure out how to contain and beat us.

I am yet to be clear what the reproducible working football philosophy is that LJ is supposed to have produced already and be able to get us using again in future, that makes him worth persisting with, but I respect your loyalty nonetheless.

[Monkeh]

1 hour ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Ok 

Serious q then finker as this is something that personally I find bizarre in all this (And you aren't  only one who's said this)

What bloody difference does it make if we are above the relegation zone (On GD and for now) or in it ? Or even if we are 3 places above it but sinking like a stone ?

Games are running out for this crazy (IMHO) argument

For example if we hover above it until the final game (And I'm sure we will be in it before than) and then drop in and get relegated on the final day , would you say 'Oh shucks'

Its about where we are heading surely ?

Id also like to know why you still support LJ (Not the team on match day) and on what basis do you think he's going to turn this around ? ((Maybe you are quite happy , as it appears , to be relegated if as long as people back LJ ?)

I shall be genuinely interested in your reasons 

 

 

rovers were only in the relegation zone for the last 15 minutes of the season, it didn't stop them going out of the football league, Lansdown and some have the same mentality as the blue few

[1bristolcity]

1 hour ago, spudski said:

That's exactly the same way as I feel...however, I still think it's 50-50 as to whether we will go down.

I think the biggest difference for me these days...is if we go down...do I care?...not really. I've become apathetic. Was quiet good fun in League 1. I also enjoy watching footy at FGR's...it's about the day out for me, not so much the result or where we are in the league.

Football is my hobby...something that's meant to be fun and relaxing. When it's starts effecting how you feel every day, then you know, imo, it's time to reflect a little.

You've only got to read this forum to see how many people are frustrated, angry, unhappy...they post every day. The same things...frustration jumping at you from the screens. I know some spend a lot of time on here, because of 'situations' in their day to day lives, and they have this as an outlet. It becomes all consuming in their lives...it takes over. The Club and the results have a massive effect on some peoples lives it seems.

Of course like anyone I want the Club to do it's best and be successful...however...City and following them, and watching other football Clubs, and taking an interest in coaching and all parts of the game...it's purely a past time, an interest....I'm not going to allow it to get to me.

I see fans with very little money and some who can't afford to go to games, get so involved in following the Club and letting it effect them. What's the point if it makes you angry and frustrated so much? So what if we were to ever win the Championship...what do 'bragging rights' give you in the big picture of your life? Is a Man Utd or Chelsea fans life any better than someone who follows Tranmere for example...or any other Club?

I sat at the Bristol v Bath game on Sunday and just let it wash over me...I do the same when I go to watch GCCC play....chill out with mates, have a few beers, bit of banter, maybe an Indian....and just watch the game.

I thought on Sunday...I should be more like this when watching City. What's the point in getting frustrated.

SL's a multi millionaire...the players get paid thousands, it's a job to them. Do they sit at home or work going mental? I doubt it. I'm a normal bloke paying to watch people at work...it's no longer a Club, it's a business. The results on the field shouldn't really effect how I feel. Granted it's great when you win...but I'm not gonna let it spoil my days anymore.

I'm embracing apathy...haha ;-)

 

Sensible post...

And I imagine it is Lee's sentiments too.

[The goal is that way]

The form of the team is surely going to be affected by the training/coaching the players get. The motivation of the players and belief in what they are being told. The ability of the players and luck. Based on the second half of last season and the very beginning of this, the players are clearly good enough. So something else is wrong. Are the team just going through a very unlucky time or is the loss of belief in the coaching etc?                                                                JOHNSON OUT. I want success now not another 30 years of watching lower league football. Time waits for nobody Mr Lansdown  

[RedLionLad]

56 minutes ago, Doozerchris said:

But in this case he is. What does he think the rest of us will just forget what he did  the man's delusional .

They don't like to proved wrong. SL will be praying long and hard over the next few weeks.

If we survive, just wait and see the smug look on his face.

[RedLionLad]

54 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

rovers were only in the relegation zone for the last 15 minutes of the season, it didn't stop them going out of the football league, Lansdown and some have the same mentality as the blue few

Nick Higgs came out back then and said that the buck stopped with the Chairman.

I wonder (if we go down) Lansdown will say anything similar.

[RedKatieScarlett]

I'm still a yes. But haven't been posting due to the knowledge that I will be shot down in flames, I don't really need that in my life!!! I may disagree with others ( yep, I accept the majority on here!), but I don't feel the urge to question their intelligence, sentiment or thinking! I imagine there are others like me who both avoid the forum at meltdown moments and don't necessarily post what they think either!

[Bris Red]

Just after christmas (the same time as we sacked cotts the previous year) would have been when i would have given the boot.

I never wanted him here from the beginning, and it still shocks me to this day that we went for him. The cheap option but this is BCFC so I shouldn't have been to suprised.

Dont for the life of me understand the love in from some too, 'i really wanted him to suceed, more than most ex city managers' cant buy into this im sorry. Little Lee is no City man, all this spin and crap about him loving the club can **** off IMO. He only got a game here because of his old man, and played for countless other clubs aswell. Just some shite he has spun hoping to win the fans over. He will go down as the worst city manager in history and i and many fans will never forget this, i cant even say i will welcome him back either. Genuinely cannot stand the bloke and hope he stays as far away from this club as possible for good!

[Jack Dawe]

2 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

He was even being talked of as a future England manager on here when he was appointed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That was me! 

But it was in Sept/October, not when he was appointed. My point being that there was an ever dwindling number of English coaches above him in the pyramid, as we sat somewhere around 5th or 6th in the table, and that if the FA kept to their latest belief in growing-their-own, they would soon have to look to the top of the Championship for home-grown coaching candidates, and by a process of elimination, LJ might be in the future running.

He still might. He's still coaching.

It wasn't an entirely serious thread. Honest.

[Alessandro]

I supported the boards decision to give time to LJ in the hope the continuity would help. I especially felt that he deserved the January window as so many of the summer signings have either underperformed or are for the future. 

That was despite the performances and results. My head wasn't in the sand, I saw the results and performances. It's just my opinion that a manager should have 'sufficient' time to arrest a bad run, if the team is not cut adrift off the bottom of the table. It's not because I saw signs to show me things would improve that everyone else didn't, it's just a case of remaining patient to see if those signs would come. I think we are stuck in a huge mental rut as a team, and hoped that something would change to get us out of that, be it a big decision or stroke of luck or big win that would build some momentum. 

It's been enough games now since January to see a change. Games are unfortunately running out and the horrific run of form extends. What has concerned me the most is that of the Januaury signings only really two have been convincing and LJ has turned back to some L1 promotion favourites the last few games. 

I thought SL would pull the trigger after Fulham. 

I think we will avoid relegation if we don't lose to any of our relegation rivals. Burton is a must win and the fact that Lee has said as much means that for his professional reputation he has to go if we don't win. 

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

I want Lee to remain in his post until we are either mathematically safe or relegated.

The reason being is that if he goes and we're relegated then there will always be the doubt among some, including me, that he might just possibly have kept us up what with us never having been in the relegation zone so far this season.

If a "knee jerk" new man  (possibly Pembo) comes in and keeps us up then then they get hero status and maybe the job full time and I really don't want to see a another new Manager appointed by default without a comprehensive ( for once) selection process. I doubt very much there's any decent Manager out there who wants only 12 games  and no new players and their first milestone being relegation.

The time for change was months ago and I sincerely believe that moment has gone. Mr Lansdown has rolled his dice and has to take the consequences personally, professionally and financially.

We, the fans, have to decide whether another season in L1 is something we'd pay our money to watch. I will but if that's where we are - it'll take me years to understand how this season went so terribly wrong on so many levels. I'll never understand why we can manage to get to the Championship  but slowly disintegrate as soon as we do. In almost 40 years we've managed one really good season out of Div 3.

[spudski]

1 hour ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Spud

Youve only become apathetic in the last couple of weeks 

Prior to that you were anything but apathetic and posting very vociferously and critical of most football fans, in your unwavering support of LJ and what the club were doing

So to dig at people who are still passionate but vociferous in their concerns / frustrations / anger is a bit strange if I'm honest

Look back at your posts

 

Indeed I was mate...and it wasn't a 'Dig' as you put it, about other fans...that's how you've read it I'm afraid. :-)

I have however, read this forum and participated in it for a long time...I have enjoyed the debate.

It has however, become increasingly hostile, toxic, vitriolic and a very negative place.

I understand 'passion' and 'concerns'...but I've seen some very placid and reasoned posters become very angry on here, and very quick to temper and jump down others throats, when they don't agree with what the other person is saying....I've been guilty of it myself.

Hence the step back...and having a rethink as to why I bother, and why let it get to me.

How can I put it in layman's terms...it's a bit like going into your favourite local every evening, and sharing a couple pints with like minded friends. We have debate and it's fun and relaxing. Then the Landlord changes, and he starts to alter things in the pub. What was once a friendly boozer for locals, now has music blaring, fruit machines, sky sports on every wall, and all of a sudden a bunch of noisy delinquents start frequenting the place, and abusing everyone within earshot. Some of your friends start having a go back, and it all gets rather silly. What was once your favourite place to hangout...has now become a place you've got accustomed to frequenting everyday, but you no longer enjoy it. Your friends start to drift off...other friends say to you 'why do you bother with that place...it's full of mental people'...and then you start to question everything.

Of course I want City to do well...but do I care as much anymore...no. And tbh, it's probably hanging out on here that's made me feel that way. When at the ground and with mates actually watching the game, it's a different scenario.

I've stopped posting so much...not because of the situation with results etc, but because it has become a pack mentality and so very negative on here. It's not fun anymore...I like the reasoned debates, but they are few and far between these days. Or get's infiltrated by some knob who just wants to vent his spleen.

When I go to the pub, do I want to argue, feel depressed, want to knock the block off the annoying teenager getting pissy and loud in the corner?...no. Do I sit back to myself and just chuckle at it all?...definitely. Do I spend less time worrying and caring about it all?...right now... Yes.

You'll relate to this...having a father that has supported the Club since the late 40's...and seeing him frail and with various health issues...and seeing how much the City results play a part to his day to day wellbeing and frame of mind, and his mood...it got me thinking...'Do I want to be like that?'

The answer I came to is no.

Apathy for the Club, as a supporter, might be something it doesn't want. But tbh, the 'Club' are only interested in me or any supporter come to that, for our money. Everything else is by the by. We may have it in our blood and feel passionate...but I've decided not to let it get me down anymore. There are far more enjoyable things in the world to get involved with.

Do I ever want to be in my old age saying...'I wish I'd spent less time worrying about the City and their results?'

I remember reading a post a while back...I think it was from 'Marinas Rolls Royce'...where he said he'd gone to watch Wales v England in the Rugby, and spent the entire game looking at his phone to see what our score was...so much so, that his battery died. I thought to myself...Jeeeeez...I'm like that. Nuts when you think about it. Can't enjoy a day out at a great occasion, because you're worried about the City scores...it takes over your life and stops you enjoying other things.

So it made me think...a bit of balance is needed.

Round of golf on the weekend...and a trip to Italy the next...where I'll catch a Serie B game for my football fix... and I'm sure I'll catch up with our results along the way. But am I going to let it bother me any more...most definitely not  ;-)

[Alessandro]

3 minutes ago, spudski said:

Indeed I was mate...and it wasn't a 'Dig' as you put it, about other fans...that's how you've read it I'm afraid. :-)

I have however, read this forum and participated in it for a long time...I have enjoyed the debate.

It has however, become increasingly hostile, toxic, vitriolic and a very negative place.

I understand 'passion' and 'concerns'...but I've seen some very placid and reasoned posters become very angry on here, and very quick to temper and jump down others throats, when they don't agree with what the other person is saying....I've been guilty of it myself.

Hence the step back...and having a rethink as to why I bother, and why let it get to me.

How can I put it in layman's terms...it's a bit like going into your favourite local every evening, and sharing a couple pints with like minded friends. We have debate and it's fun and relaxing. Then the Landlord changes, and he starts to alter things in the pub. What was once a friendly boozer for locals, now has music blaring, fruit machines, sky sports on every wall, and all of a sudden a bunch of noisy delinquents start frequenting the place, and abusing everyone within earshot. Some of your friends start having a go back, and it all gets rather silly. What was once your favourite place to hangout...has now become a place you've got accustomed to frequenting everyday, but you no longer enjoy it. Your friends start to drift off...other friends say to you 'why do you bother with that place...it's full of mental people'...and then you start to question everything.

Of course I want City to do well...but do I care as much anymore...no. And tbh, it's probably hanging out on here that's made me feel that way. When at the ground and with mates actually watching the game, it's a different scenario.

I've stopped posting so much...not because of the situation with results etc, but because it has become a pack mentality and so very negative on here. It's not fun anymore...I like the reasoned debates, but they are few and far between these days. Or get's infiltrated by some knob who just wants to vent his spleen.

When I go to the pub, do I want to argue, feel depressed, want to knock the block off the annoying teenager getting pissy and loud in the corner?...no. Do I sit back to myself and just chuckle at it all?...definitely. Do I spend less time worrying and caring about it all?...right now... Yes.

You'll relate to this...having a father that has supported the Club since the late 40's...and seeing him frail and with various health issues...and seeing how much the City results play a part to his day to day wellbeing and frame of mind, and his mood...it got me thinking...'Do I want to be like that?'

The answer I came to is no.

Apathy for the Club, as a supporter, might be something it doesn't want. But tbh, the 'Club' are only interested in me or any supporter come to that, for our money. Everything else is by the by. We may have it in our blood and feel passionate...but I've decided not to let it get me down anymore. There are far more enjoyable things in the world to get involved with.

Do I ever want to be in my old age saying...'I wish I'd spent less time worrying about the City and their results?'

I remember reading a post a while back...I think it was from 'Marinas Rolls Royce'...where he said he'd gone to watch Wales v England in the Rugby, and spent the entire game looking at his phone to see what our score was...so much so, that his battery died. I thought to myself...Jeeeeez...I'm like that. Nuts when you think about it. Can't enjoy a day out at a great occasion, because you're worried about the City scores...it takes over your life and stops you enjoying other things.

So it made me think...a bit of balance is needed.

Round of golf on the weekend...and a trip to Italy the next...where I'll catch a Serie B game for my football fix... and I'm sure I'll catch up with our results along the way. But am I going to let it bother me any more...most definitely not  ;-)

Double like Spud.

I couldn't agree more. As the rot set in the league OTIB is overrun with behaviour that I can only liken to Hyenas. 

I've watched as pretty much one by one, people posting for patience or calm or positivity have been ripped to shreds by the pack.

It's understandable, but a bit of a shame. Does it really matter that much?

For me, I like the debate, but ultimately it's football. My life will go on without it and if we got relegated, I'd probably be upset for a day and then I'd be over it. Maybe that's why I'm more patient, my expectations are low. 

Maybe if I worked in Bristol and had an ear full from a gashead colleague everyday i'd change my mind though!

 

 

[Nogbad the Bad]

2 hours ago, Bob Thompson said:

I use my own name. I have never spoken to LJ or his father or any of the present players. I be!ieve he has the making of a good manager. I don't know who is fit or who finds the players. I believe that LJ has the making of a good football coach.Whether he can be a good manager is another question. The abuse that all coaches get is intolerable and this certainly effects their judgement. We all the increases at city with the various departments a review of the running of the club should certainly be appraised. In the meantime we stick with the coaches and players until the end of the season.  33 is a young age to manage footballers, perhaps the job came too soon and an older head  to assist might help. Just stating he is useless without clarification does not help any. LJ stays at least to the end of the season and even longer in some capacity.

A few points.

1)I've seen nothing to suggest LJ will ever be a good manager/coach. He's not improving in any way, he's floundering horrifically while just repeating the stubbornness and constant mistakes he made at Barnsley.

2)LJ does have the final say on signings, so we have been told.

3)The idea we should stick with LJ and the coaches until the end of the season strikes me as absurd and near suicidal. Collectively they have failed about as miserably as anyone could and the season will almost certainly end in ignominious relegation if they remain. Particularly LJ.

4)Why bring in an older head to assist him? What other club would do that at this stage? If he's not capable enough he should be replaced, not molly coddled. We need someone in charge of this club who can manage competently at this level, not someone who constantly needs excessive assistance from the owner both in terms of finances and personal reassurance.  

5)Did the job come too soon? Very obviously so, and there's no absolutely reason to think it should ever have come at all.

6)What reason could there be for advocating LJ should stay until the end of the season? We might as well accept relegation right now if that's to be the case.

7)Why on earth should he stay at the club longer in some other capacity if a new man takes over? Ridiculous notion which can only be based on sentimentality for the individual and nothing else. Must there, for some unfathomable reason, be a job for Lee Johnson somewhere at BCFC? Why?

He needs to go elsewhere, down the leagues, and attempt to gradually build a suitably impressive coaching career such that another club apart from Bristol City might some day be interested in employing him at this level.

From his career so far, and what we've witnessed with our own eyes, I don't see that ever happening btw.

[Guest]

Don't go with the sit down shut up brigade, the worst performing City manager in a long while........without a doubt; and he`s still here.

Should have gone mths ago but now it seems SL is going to go with him whatever and where-ever that takes us.

Going down for sure in my opinion, for those who think not please tell me where our points are going to come from to avoid that. Because we are going to have to probably win at least 5 games apparently to stand a chance.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Ok 

Serious q then finker as this is something that personally I find bizarre in all this (And you aren't  only one who's said this)

What bloody difference does it make if we are above the relegation zone (On GD and for now) or in it ? Or even if we are 3 places above it but sinking like a stone ?

Games are running out for this crazy (IMHO) argument

For example if we hover above it until the final game (And I'm sure we will be in it before than) and then drop in and get relegated on the final day , would you say 'Oh shucks'

Its about where we are heading surely ?

Id also like to know why you still support LJ (Not the team on match day) and on what basis do you think he's going to turn this around ? ((Maybe you are quite happy , as it appears , to be relegated if as long as people back LJ ?)

I shall be genuinely interested in your reasons 

 

 

Why the start with 'finker'? Does it make you feel better? Do you want a pat on the head by your mates for such a 'cutting start to your post'? If there was a pat on the head emoji, I'd have put it here.

That you find my views bizarre and expect me to have to explain myself, is in itself bizarre. People think differently than you, get over yourself.

You are not interested in any of my reasons (or anyone else who thinks differently to yourself), you just expect everyone to hop on board the 'LJ out' bus with no thoughts of their own. This is pure stupidity and I'll not indulge you.

It appears that you look to blame City's current run of poor results, laying the blame solely at the feet of one person only - LJ. I do not. Football is a team game - the manager, the players and the backroom staff. If the results are poor, blame has to be shared.

My view:
OTIB is an open forum, and as such, posters should expect people to hold different views to themselves, otherwise this board might as well be based in North Korea (a dig at the idiots who try to draw comparisons between the City board and NK), all religiously saying the same thing.
We are on a poor run and LJ has to take a higher proportion of the blame - he chooses the players on the day, decides the tactics etc.
The players get off very lightly when it comes to blame. Alas, they can't be sacked.
The back room staff are either yes men or are inept when it comes to taking LJ to one side and having a word. If LJ goes, they go.
Our losing margins (it's a fact, not something that I'm making up) are small. If they were otherwise, I'd not be here supporting LJ.
Sacking a manager is a sledgehammer to crack a nut approach. It might do the job but it might also just smash things to bits (it worked when SC came in, it definitely didn't with SOD).
Some people are making outlandish accusations against SL solely because he refuses to acquiesce to the demands of fans (talks of majorities is a pissing contest on both sides). I don't see these people being lambasted in the same manner as supporters of LJ. Just why is this?
Last weeks virtual meltdown, in regards too, 'my mate says' posts was one of the best I've seen in a long time - the gash must have been pissing themselves with laughter.
It was acknowledged on both sides that February was a difficult month and I believe 4 points was bandied around as a figure about what was likely - 5 was achieved (if you have evidence to the contrary, play your card). Not brilliant, but maybe fair, considering what came before.
Despite all the beatings that City have taken, and this is a fact, City remain outside of the relegation zone - that this is down to goal difference is testament to the small margins we've been losing by.
If LJ goes, there has to be a quick replacement. The suggestions bandied around on OTIB are poor and smacks of desparation - we'll be in no better a position with some of the suggestions made than we were with SOD. People need to get a grip.
I tend to look at evidence and not 'what ifs', 'yeah but no but', 'jumping on great pieces of fiction', etc. The only evidence I can see for our current position is form. If this is the only evidence for sacking LJ then I should be allowed to indulge in 'yeah but, not but', 'what if' etc., all things being equal (which clearly they are not when it comes to some on this board).
My support of City is not unconditional, but in the same breath, I don't go stamping my feet at every bump (I see this as a bump, others have elevated it to something where I think I should contact the Guinness Book of Records and ask them to check their facts on the highest mountain) in the road. That some have us relegated already is down to them personally, I don't agree.

No doubt my post will be picked over and criticised with the usual name calling - that's all part of engaging on boards such as this, to be expected. If someone actually says anything intelligent, I'll be surprised.

[EnderMB]

I want LJ to stay, mainly because it will take us being in the relegation zone at the point of no return for him to be sacked. Since SL has backed him twice, I think it'll take relegation to get rid of LJ, and I'd rather have LJ here and stay up over us going down with a new manager.

I wanted LJ to stay, but I'll admit that I was wrong before, and in hindsight he should have gone weeks ago.