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Red Army 75

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So the new women's season is upon us . And women's football is getting more popular by the season. But attendances in England says it's more popular abroad. Financially how can it be sustainable. The crowds are low . I don't know the earnings of a female player. What are the averages. Should they get paid similar to men . What is Bristol city women's average attendance . This isn't a dig at women's football . It's observation from someone who knows nothing about women's football . Discuss

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The best woman footballer in the world signed for Man C a few months ago (presumably due as much to salary as anything else). It's possible I suppose that the top clubs such as Arsenal and Man C finance their ladies team by having them as part of the parent club?

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6 minutes ago, 22A said:

The best woman footballer in the world signed for Man C a few months ago (presumably due as much to salary as anything else). It's possible I suppose that the top clubs such as Arsenal and Man C finance their ladies team by having them as part of the parent club?

Do u think IYO that women's football makes a profit . Because I just can't see how it does.

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The below gives an idea of what the women's team is paid - not much if accurate and most have other jobs to supplement:

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/offsiderulepodcast.com/2016/10/28/bristol-city-women-stars-ready-for-the-game-of-their-lives/amp/

Even with that in mind, I'd say it's likely the women's team is run at a loss. But speaking as a dad of a young girl who is heavily into football, the value it gives the area by showing "This Girl Can" absolutely meets the stated community aims of the Bristol Sport "Project". Ultimately girls are seeing our ladies team go toe to toe this year with the PL ladies teams - and the inspiration that can give the next generation of Bristolian girls is well worth the loss it's likely run at

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8 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

The below gives an idea of what the women's team is paid - not much if accurate and most have other jobs to supplement:

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/offsiderulepodcast.com/2016/10/28/bristol-city-women-stars-ready-for-the-game-of-their-lives/amp/

Even with that in mind, I'd say it's likely the women's team is run at a loss. But speaking as a dad of a young girl who is heavily into football, the value it gives the area by showing "This Girl Can" absolutely meets the stated community aims of the Bristol Sport "Project". Ultimately girls are seeing our ladies team go toe to toe this year with the PL ladies teams - and the inspiration that can give the next generation of Bristolian girls is well worth the loss it's likely run at

Why isn't it as well supported as abroad. It's seems awfully supported in England. But very popular in America 

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7 minutes ago, Red Army 75 said:

Why isn't it as well supported as abroad. It's seems awfully supported in England. But very popular in America 

There isn't one answer I'd say but the main part is the established nature. I remember the US having a strong women's setup 20+ years ago with Mia Hamm etc, but really, other than odd players (Yankee, Powell etc) in this country it really only came to the fore in the last World Cup. Attendances in the WSL are up YOY and it is getting profile/national coverage. The US are at least a generation ahead of us in terms of exposure though.

Also remember "soccer" is the sport of choice for girls in US high schools - we're nowhere near that yet. Ally that with it not being the no 1 sport for boys in the US (as it is here), and you can see why it's got the level of support it has

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3 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

There isn't one answer I'd say but the main part is the established nature. I remember the US having a strong women's setup 20+ years ago with Mia Hamm etc, but really, other than odd players (Yankee, Powell etc) in this country it really only came to the fore in the last World Cup. Attendances in the WSL are up YOY and it is getting profile/national coverage. The US are at least a generation ahead of us in terms of exposure though.

Also remember "soccer" is the sport of choice for girls in US high schools - we're nowhere near that yet. Ally that with it not being the no 1 sport for boys in the US (as it is here), and you can see why it's got the level of support it has

Thanks for the explanation 

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Very good question!

The increasing (largely TV based) profile of women's football has caused a certain amount of interest in the off-field activities. It would simply be wrong to compare earnings to the men's game, but nevertheless the strategies are often identical. Most of the WSL teams you see on the box are very much part of 'the football club'; teams such as Man City, Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea have a distinct benefit from that link. It certainly helps to have the technical, athletic and organisational weight to bring the girls on and improve the level of play - something the FA are pushing for as they eye the international scene. However (and this is what I personally become concerned for) the same effect of the rich clubs at the very top are overbalancing the leagues. There is no doubt that they can wave the cheque-book in the faces of potential players just as in the men's game. The result is the same: the trophies are likely to be shared among a select few every season. Man City have recently signed the American legend Carli Lloyd - can't imagine she will be having to get a part-time job to see her through the week.

It has been said that the cream of the women are earning about £50,000 a year; most of the WSL players will be on a lot less and many at the lower end are not going to buy a Berlingo, never mind a Bentley. At the SGS, we have a number of players who need to supplement their money by doing other jobs. Full-time professionals are thin on the ground still.

As to the clubs themselves, again the usual names are quite happy to spend what will be seen as a bit of pocket money on the women's side. For the same amount, they might be unable to sign just one half-decent male player. Most clubs in the WSL have to cut the cloth, and City is no exception. Wages are not great, and the prospects are limited for the time being. The big impact the women's game has is through television and the media. It has been pointed out that potential sponsors looking to raise their profile by becoming involved with football are rather put off by the sums asked for. The men's game can be beyond the reach of many, but the savvy investor will see the women's game as being much more sensible. There can be good opportunities in what is a rapidly growing and wide-reaching sport.

Interestingly, the management of Man Utd have been asked why they are prepared to let their noisy neighbours expand into the WSL and achieve success whilst they don't run a side. The Glazers replied: 'It's not our core business.' Clearly, women's football is not seen as just some low-level diversion. It has significant value and presence.

How the situation will change in the future is open to debate. I believe the glory and column inches surrounding the Lionesses' World Cup campaign in Canada, 2015, has two legacies. Firstly, the increase in the attendances at league games was highlighted. However, the other impact will not be easily measured (the accountants will not be happy!) and that is the growth in the grass roots game. How many little girls will now look at playing the Beautiful Game not just as a past-time but a real career that has a defined and stable pathway?

In short, the women's game is generally not awash with money and the incomes are small. But the evidence is that it will not be confined to the very rich clubs. If the WSL has a real future, it will have to be founded on the smaller clubs that are not bankrolled; clubs like Durham or Yeovil are two who have separate business identities and are not dependant on a men's side. They are the ones with solid, if not spectacular, finances and will grow.

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Some good female technicians but too much space and time for many who watch mens football regularly to find it exciting.

Difficult to think how to make it more attractive to everyone, one woman I know who coaches and plays want mens and womens football to be mixed together but can't see it happening anytime soon.

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2 hours ago, Silvio Dante said:

There isn't one answer I'd say but the main part is the established nature. I remember the US having a strong women's setup 20+ years ago with Mia Hamm etc, but really, other than odd players (Yankee, Powell etc) in this country it really only came to the fore in the last World Cup. Attendances in the WSL are up YOY and it is getting profile/national coverage. The US are at least a generation ahead of us in terms of exposure though.

Also remember "soccer" is the sport of choice for girls in US high schools - we're nowhere near that yet. Ally that with it not being the no 1 sport for boys in the US (as it is here), and you can see why it's got the level of support it has

Out of interest, what is the top sport of choice for girls in UK schools?

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30 minutes ago, Red Right Hand said:

Out of interest, what is the top sport of choice for girls in UK schools?

Speaking from experience, hockey and netball on a team front. There are now some really good external girls rugby and football clubs but in my experience the schools still err towards the traditional. Will vary school to school and is likely to change as girls football gets bigger.

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1 hour ago, Red Right Hand said:

Out of interest, what is the top sport of choice for girls in UK schools?

Choice there is not.  When looking at Senior Schools for my daughter we were told that in years 7 & 8 the National Curriculum was Rugby and Football for boys and Hockey and Netball for girls... 

I coach a girl's team and the enthusiasm is there from the girls.  There are barriers though. 

Firstly, it lacks the structure at grassroots level. There simply aren't enough girls' teams - just one division in a lot of age groups of the Bristol GIrls' League.  This means that if you're starting off, you face the prospect of heavy defeats against proper established clubs rather than finding your level like with the Hanham Minor League or Avon Youth League for boys.  I have some talented players to coach but also some who are nowhere near as strong and others with a poor attitude.  With my son, players found their level within the club as we have 3 sides in his age group.  It is very hard to coach 15 x 11/12 year olds (on your own) when some need basic technical coaching (ie how to kick a ball) whilst others need challenging to improve. 

Secondly, Girls' football is not taken seriously enough by a lot of people.  I take it seriously but a lot of dads are reticent to get involved but happily do so for their sons.  Very frustrating.   Mums probably lack the confidence to get involved.  They need to as they are the key role models.  I remember watching a report on the news about Women's football in Sweden - it had an interview with a teenage girl (who spoke perfect English) who said she wanted to be a good footballer like her mother and grandmother.  I've never heard anything like that here..  In Scandanavia it is established.  It's being established in the UK now and this isn't a quick process. 

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Loon plage said:

Its great that girls and women play the game. However, ignore the gender and view the product. It is poor at the top level which is why attendances are low.

That is in no small part due to the ban on women's football by the FA, which strangled the potential until pretty recently. When you compare us to the rest of the world we are playing a big game of catch-up. I dare say the women's game will not have the same level of support or media coverage as the men's (as with other sports), but it looks like it will grow and improve for the foreseeable time.

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5 hours ago, Erithacus said:

Very good question!

The increasing (largely TV based) profile of women's football has caused a certain amount of interest in the off-field activities. It would simply be wrong to compare earnings to the men's game, but nevertheless the strategies are often identical. Most of the WSL teams you see on the box are very much part of 'the football club'; teams such as Man City, Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea have a distinct benefit from that link. It certainly helps to have the technical, athletic and organisational weight to bring the girls on and improve the level of play - something the FA are pushing for as they eye the international scene. However (and this is what I personally become concerned for) the same effect of the rich clubs at the very top are overbalancing the leagues. There is no doubt that they can wave the cheque-book in the faces of potential players just as in the men's game. The result is the same: the trophies are likely to be shared among a select few every season. Man City have recently signed the American legend Carli Lloyd - can't imagine she will be having to get a part-time job to see her through the week.

It has been said that the cream of the women are earning about £50,000 a year; most of the WSL players will be on a lot less and many at the lower end are not going to buy a Berlingo, never mind a Bentley. At the SGS, we have a number of players who need to supplement their money by doing other jobs. Full-time professionals are thin on the ground still.

As to the clubs themselves, again the usual names are quite happy to spend what will be seen as a bit of pocket money on the women's side. For the same amount, they might be unable to sign just one half-decent male player. Most clubs in the WSL have to cut the cloth, and City is no exception. Wages are not great, and the prospects are limited for the time being. The big impact the women's game has is through television and the media. It has been pointed out that potential sponsors looking to raise their profile by becoming involved with football are rather put off by the sums asked for. The men's game can be beyond the reach of many, but the savvy investor will see the women's game as being much more sensible. There can be good opportunities in what is a rapidly growing and wide-reaching sport.

Interestingly, the management of Man Utd have been asked why they are prepared to let their noisy neighbours expand into the WSL and achieve success whilst they don't run a side. The Glazers replied: 'It's not our core business.' Clearly, women's football is not seen as just some low-level diversion. It has significant value and presence.

How the situation will change in the future is open to debate. I believe the glory and column inches surrounding the Lionesses' World Cup campaign in Canada, 2015, has two legacies. Firstly, the increase in the attendances at league games was highlighted. However, the other impact will not be easily measured (the accountants will not be happy!) and that is the growth in the grass roots game. How many little girls will now look at playing the Beautiful Game not just as a past-time but a real career that has a defined and stable pathway?

In short, the women's game is generally not awash with money and the incomes are small. But the evidence is that it will not be confined to the very rich clubs. If the WSL has a real future, it will have to be founded on the smaller clubs that are not bankrolled; clubs like Durham or Yeovil are two who have separate business identities and are not dependant on a men's side. They are the ones with solid, if not spectacular, finances and will grow.

On the positive side, I have heard very good things about WIllie Kirk and this 'Spring Season' thing is perfectly timed for our Women's team.  They are very young and will find the jump up a challenge but without the immediate threat of relegation, it allows them time to adapt.   There are a few very good players there and they should be able to establish themselves.  I'll be interested to watch them on Sunday against Man City - they are effectively the England side.  I can't imagine a shock is likely, but we should give them a proper game..

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11 hours ago, Red Army 75 said:

So the new women's season is upon us . And women's football is getting more popular by the season. But attendances in England says it's more popular abroad. Financially how can it be sustainable. The crowds are low . I don't know the earnings of a female player. What are the averages. Should they get paid similar to men . What is Bristol city women's average attendance . This isn't a dig at women's football . It's observation from someone who knows nothing about women's football . Discuss

Sounds more like 20 questions to me.

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