Jack Dawe Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 I don't, myself. So I rely on simple things like the score - who scores the most goals in a game - and the league table - who's at the top, who's at the bottom, etc - to help me understand what is going on. Who is sh**e and who is the dog's doo-dahs. Now, after a few years of watching and following football, it has dawned on me that there are nuances and details and unseen stuff that influence the score in a game and even more so, the position of a club in the table. But people inside the game who know how the game works have always said that the league table "doesn't lie." And they should know. So, I'm sticking with that. They know how the game works. They understand. Unlike me. If we're 21st, or 22nd, no word of a lie, we are sh**e. End of. Because the table does not lie. As the people inside the game that know often tell us, it's a "simple game." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Hunt-Hertz Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 Only Lord Spudulika does, apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reigate Red Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 I'm with you on this. I love going to the footie and used to play (very badly) but I cannot say I really understand the bigger picture within a game. How the many different formations work and the subtlety of the position terminology. Mind you given this seasons flexible formations I don't feel I am alone in that respect. "Take it down the wing and get the ball in" that's what I understand One thing that also always baffles me is how people keep track of all eleven players during the game. @Olé excellent write ups never cease to amaze me at the detail he notices, and remembers. Maybe it's age, or I need a visit to specsavers, but I'm happy if it's "ball to player in red*" Maybe I need to do some homework. * other colours may apply when away from home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Hunt-Hertz Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 9 minutes ago, Reigate Red said: I'm with you on this. I love going to the footie and used to play (very badly) but I cannot say I really understand the bigger picture within a game. How the many different formations work and the subtlety of the position terminology. Mind you given this seasons flexible formations I don't feel I am alone in that respect. "Take it down the wing and get the ball in" that's what I understand One thing that also always baffles me is how people keep track of all eleven players during the game. @Olé excellent write ups never cease to amaze me at the detail he notices, and remembers. Maybe it's age, or I need a visit to specsavers, but I'm happy if it's "ball to player in red*" Maybe I need to do some homework. * other colours may apply when away from home. Brian Clough thought all this talk of formations etc, to be a load of rowlocks. He didn't do so badly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 Bloody hell Jack, that's a bit of a ramble........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pezo Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 43 minutes ago, Mike Hunt-Hertz said: Brian Clough thought all this talk of formations etc, to be a load of rowlocks. He didn't do so badly. Clough said that publicly but was probably the best of a generation when it came to formations and tactics. Actions speak louder than words and all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 1 hour ago, Mike Hunt-Hertz said: Brian Clough thought all this talk of formations etc, to be a load of rowlocks. He didn't do so badly. Several players who played for Clough said that he very rarely talked about tactics and even less about formations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 Would love to have seen cloughie as england manager. he would certainly have pissed off the old farts aka the fa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 12 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said: Would love to have seen cloughie as england manager. he would certainly have pissed off the old farts aka the fa. That's exactly why he didn't get the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Vega Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 2 hours ago, Pezo said: Clough said that publicly but was probably the best of a generation when it came to formations and tactics. Actions speak louder than words and all that. His instructions to his player were, " give it to John Robertson because he is better than you " and he was right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOTBLUE Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 Score one more that your opponents,simple isn't it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 4 hours ago, Jack Dawe said: I don't, myself. So I rely on simple things like the score - who scores the most goals in a game - and the league table - who's at the top, who's at the bottom, etc - to help me understand what is going on. Who is sh**e and who is the dog's doo-dahs. Now, after a few years of watching and following football, it has dawned on me that there are nuances and details and unseen stuff that influence the score in a game and even more so, the position of a club in the table. But people inside the game who know how the game works have always said that the league table "doesn't lie." And they should know. So, I'm sticking with that. They know how the game works. They understand. Unlike me. If we're 21st, or 22nd, no word of a lie, we are sh**e. End of. Because the table does not lie. As the people inside the game that know often tell us, it's a "simple game." Consistently score more than the opposition and the table won't lie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo88 Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 5 hours ago, Mike Hunt-Hertz said: Only Lord Spudulika does, apparently. Unless you call call everyone "fella" you know diddly squat 3 hours ago, Robbored said: Several players who played for Clough said that he very rarely talked about tactics and even less about formations. Harry Rednap was another manager not too bothered by tactics. When Spurs manager playing against Liverpool he made an inspired substitution. Quote from the Independant; "But, this being Redknapp, there was a story to tell too. What did he say to Pavlyuchenko at half-time? "Not a lot," said Redknapp, "he doesn't speak English, he's got an interpreter." What did he tell the interpreter? "I just told him to tell Pavlyuchenko to ******* run around a bit. The boy himself just kept nodding his head. He might be thinking inside: 'What's this tosser saying to me?'" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 5 hours ago, Mike Hunt-Hertz said: Brian Clough thought all this talk of formations etc, to be a load of rowlocks. He didn't do so badly. Game has changed a lot though...Clough was an incredible manager but at the highest levels tactical battles make a big difference. I also think he was better at tactics than he let on, same with Redknapp. And if Redknapp truly was (which I don't think he was), but supposing he truly was anti tactics and all that then it came to the fore pretty often when he was at the highest level. Redknapp is and was a fine manager though but some of his tactical choices were a problem when operating at a high level. Wenger ditto in recent times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 5 hours ago, Jack Dawe said: I don't, myself. So I rely on simple things like the score - who scores the most goals in a game - and the league table - who's at the top, who's at the bottom, etc - to help me understand what is going on. Who is sh**e and who is the dog's doo-dahs. But people inside the game who know how the game works have always said that the league table "doesn't lie." And they should know. As the people inside the game that know often tell us, it's a "simple game." The league table simply tells you where your results have placed you in the pecking order at whatever stage of the season. There's nothing mysterious about that. That's what the " league doesn't lie" means. I mean, come on it ain't rocket science... People "in the game" understand that it's the results that shape the season but to achieve consistent results takes a miriad of other factors to achieve. Like the training facilities, the quality of the coaching. The harmony within the squad and even down to the tea lady and what biscuits the club provides...... Ive never been a professional footballer but I don't have to "in the game" to realise how just how many elements go into any football club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Cloud Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 6 hours ago, Reigate Red said: .... @Olé excellent write ups never cease to amaze me at the detail he notices, and remembers.... 1 I rely on him also RR, how anyone knows the game so well, is beyond me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 So is this a spud post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 6 hours ago, NOTBLUE said: Score one more that your opponents,simple isn't it. Simple for most of our opponents this season then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 9 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Game has changed a lot though...Clough was an incredible manager but at the highest levels tactical battles make a big difference. I also think he was better at tactics than he let on, same with Redknapp. And if Redknapp truly was (which I don't think he was), but supposing he truly was anti tactics and all that then it came to the fore pretty often when he was at the highest level. Redknapp is and was a fine manager though but some of his tactical choices were a problem when operating at a high level. Wenger ditto in recent times. I once read Harrys Autobiography, his instructions were something like, simply go out and play football how you want to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayOutWest Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 Simply you have to watch every City game twice. Once with the passion, foaming at the mouth, f in hell ref, thats our ball...what argh, throw in...fack come on city..... f you johnson, rubbish Then watch again. Take the passion away, you will see the set up, tactics, movement, formations, shape, players run off the ball. Evaluate from a more neutral stand point, able to give credit where credit is due. Try and understand more of the why and how. Stevo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ska Junkie Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 18 hours ago, wendyredredrobin said: Would love to have seen cloughie as england manager. he would certainly have pissed off the old farts aka the fa. What was it he told his players? Something like 'get the ball to Robbo and then get in the box'? Simple and clear, unfortunately Robbo was Scottish wasn't he? Another one who didn't look like a professional footballer but he couldn't half cross a ball! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 6 hours ago, Up The City! said: I once read Harrys Autobiography, his instructions were something like, simply go out and play football how you want to play. Except he downplays it, there are good examples of his tactical changes changing games. As I say it's all well and good in most of the games a manager managers but at the highest level am unsure it works. (By the highest level I am talking last 8 CL onwards, World or Euro Cup quarter finals onwards, title run ins in the top 4 or 5 Leagues that kind of thing- even domestic Cup semis and finals in the big leagues). http://www.zonalmarking.net/2010/11/20/arsenal-2-3-tottenham-tactics/ On that note, Mr Merson said earlier this year that Redknapp is a much better tactician than Wenger. And here's a good artcle by an excellent football writer about Redknapp and Clough tactically speaking, https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2010/dec/01/the-question-harry-redknapp-tactically Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1bristolcity Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 If only, truth is I am afraid that formations coaching etc does and can influence success, something the FA is currently reviewing . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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