The best and worst of LJ.

[BS3_RED]

Now let me start by saying, I would have taken a point yesterday before kick off and so am more than happy with it now. I thought LJ did everything right pre game. He kept the same team and formation and built on the previous couple of games where we have looked settled and improving. 

I thought we play played Blackburn of the park and if we had taken our chances we would have walked away with a comfortable 4 or 5 nil win. Blackburn only had the one sniff in the first half and that was due to a lucky deflection. I even said to the guy next to me that Lee could not be blamed for not winning this game if they nicked one as he had done everything right.

 

Then comes their goal from their only real attack up to that point and for me Lee returns to type and made completely unnecessary changes. 30 seconds before their goal we could and should have scored with Brownhills and we were in complete dominance. I thought Paterson was playing well and so was Little. 

 

If we had just rode out the following 5 minutes where Blackburn were always going to get a lift I really believe we would have taken control again and would have created at least one more chance. 

 

As it was, we took Patterson off for Odowda and then moved Smith to right back when Cotts came on for Little and from that point on it was always about surviving as I feel our midfield suddenly lost control of a game that they bossed from the first minute.

 

Now someone might come on and tell me that Patterson and Little had taken knocks in which case fair enough to Lee but both looked fine an still motoring when they came off to me.

This was one time where I really thing making subs was the wrong call and we really should have just let the starting 11 reclaim the dominance that they held.

Apart from that, I thought Lee got everything right and as he is here to stay we might as well get behind him.

COYR and bring on Barnsley where I am sure Lee will need our support.

[Port Said Red]

@Olés  report said that Little was injured? 

[cidered abroad]

He can't help himself. He's a tinkerer, a twiddler who does not, Imo, really think through the consequences of his actions.

He cannot learn to do otherwise because it's in his genes.

[BS3_RED]

2 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

@Olés  report said that Little was injured? 

I have not had a chance to read Ole's report but if true  then fair play Lee.

[phantom]

Paterson had run himself into the ground and was clearly struggling

Little appeared to he struggling too, not a fan of LJ but he didn't have a lot of choice yesterday

One disappointed was Cotterill, he seemed a shadow of the player he was a few weeks back, pulling out of tackles and the game bypassing him

 

Had to laugh at the people stood behind me yesterday yelling at Wilbs to chase a ball when the guy was struggling to walk let alone run !

Not sure what happened in the build up to their goal - how our full back is left defending two attackers is wrong

[Super]

I wouldn't put any blame on LJ yesterday. We should have been out of sight. They were battering us after they scored he needed to change things around and thoughts his subs made sense.

[BS3_RED]

2 minutes ago, phantom said:

Paterson had run himself into the ground and was clearly struggling

Little appeared to he struggling too, not a fan of LJ but he didn't have a lot of choice yesterday

One disappointed was Cotterill, he seemed a shadow of the player he was a few weeks back, pulling out of tackles and the game bypassing him

 

Had to laugh at the people stood behind me yesterday yelling at Wilbs to chase a ball when the guy was struggling to walk let alone run !

Fair enough, from my view I thought Patterson looked fine and was still dominating his position. 

 

It just felt like making subs for the sack of making subs but if they were fecked then they had to come off. In which case i should re title this thread the best and best of Lee because apart from the subs I thought he got everything right yesterday

[Port Said Red]

Just now, BS3_RED said:

I have not had a chance to read Ole's report but if true  then fair play Lee.

 

Just now, phantom said:

Paterson had run himself into the ground and was clearly struggling

Little appeared to he struggling too, not a fan of LJ but he didn't have a lot of choice yesterday

One disappointed was Cotterill, he seemed a shadow of the player he was a few weeks back, pulling out of tackles and the game bypassing him

 

Had to laugh at the people stood behind me yesterday yelling at Wilbs to chase a ball when the guy was struggling to walk let alone run !

Actually that raises something I have been wondering about for a little while. Do those "smart vests" the players where give data throughout the game? What i was wondering was whether the coaches are able to see which players are lowest on stamina? It sounds like something out of science fiction, but I hear a lot about these things and wasn't sure what the limitations are.

 

[BS3_RED]

2 minutes ago, Super said:

I wouldn't put any blame on LJ yesterday. We should have been out of sight. They were battering us after they scored he needed to change things around and thoughts his subs made sense.

Agree, as i stated in the opening post, I though (apart from the subs) he got everything right yesterday.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, BS3_RED said:

Fair enough, from my view I thought Patterson looked fine and was still dominating his position. 

 

It just felt like making subs for the sack of making subs but if they were fecked then they had to come off. 

Did the players look tired? I just think back to games like Reading where at 2-0 and 70's mins gone you could tell we needed fresh legs but LJ being LJ waited till we'd conceeded and then we crumbled.

 

[BS3_RED]

4 minutes ago, Tomarse said:

Did the players look tired? I just think back to games like Reading where at 2-0 and 70's mins gone you could tell we needed fresh legs but LJ being LJ waited till we'd conceeded and then we crumbled.

 

Tom, I had completely forgot about playing two games in 4 days tbf. 

[Lrrr]

14 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

 

Actually that raises something I have been wondering about for a little while. Do those "smart vests" the players where give data throughout the game? What i was wondering was whether the coaches are able to see which players are lowest on stamina? It sounds like something out of science fiction, but I hear a lot about these things and wasn't sure what the limitations are.

 

Its hard to measure stamina, what the vests do is give gps data for the distance covered in a game. The staff will then have data for how far a player will run per game on average, this way you can tell which players may be getting fatigued when they're approaching their average. 

[Port Said Red]

Just now, hodge said:

Its hard to measure stamina, what the vests do is give gps data for the distance covered in a game. The staff will then have data for how far a player will run per game on average, this way you can tell which players may be getting fatigued when they're approaching their average. 

Thanks. I think it does show though that the managers and coaches are working with more information than the man on the terraces when it comes to things like substitutions.

[Lrrr]

Just now, Port Said Red said:

Thanks. I think it does show though that the managers and coaches are working with more information than the man on the terraces when it comes to things like substitutions.

oh no doubt, also the fact the manager can ask the player how they're feeling 

[simon uk]

Best of lj : signing tammy abraham

Worst of lj : barely winning any game for 6 months.

We should never be in the position where we are still trying to get safe with the money and players available, he should be fired.

[Port Said Red]

1 minute ago, hodge said:

oh no doubt, also the fact the manager can ask the player how they're feeling 

Oh you traditionalist you!

Actually, in all seriousness, I have heard many a manager down the years say things like, "the player said he was fine" or "he would play with a broken leg if I didn't stop him" so maybe players are worst judges.  

[Lrrr]

Just now, Port Said Red said:

Oh you traditionalist you!

Actually, in all seriousness, I have heard many a manager down the years say things like, "the player said he was fine" or "he would play with a broken leg if I didn't stop him" so maybe players are worst judges.  

Yeah really the worst person to ask more often than not is the player as if they're not on the pitch they can't do anything to impress. Think it was Fabio a few weeks ago got clocked badly and was trying to convince the physio he was okay when you could see he wasn't all there. 

[City Ben]

Just now, Port Said Red said:

Oh you traditionalist you!

Actually, in all seriousness, I have heard many a manager down the years say things like, "the player said he was fine" or "he would play with a broken leg if I didn't stop him" so maybe players are worst judges.  

Yes I think that's right. 

As well as distance covered I think that the vests also measure top speed, and if that is declining over a game there may be a certain point at which it's a clear signal of fatigue. 

All very clever this stuff and I'm glad we use it. 

But obviously a vest is only one data point, really you want to harness as much data as possible... how long until we measure positive/ negative twitter sentiment and take players off accordingly  

[Port Said Red]

1 minute ago, City Ben said:

Yes I think that's right. 

As well as distance covered I think that the vests also measure top speed, and if that is declining over a game there may be a certain point at which it's a clear signal of fatigue. 

All very clever this stuff and I'm glad we use it. 

But obviously a vest is only one data point, really you want to harness as much data as possible... how long until we measure positive/ negative twitter sentiment and take players off accordingly  

Some would say....... yesterday 

[phantom]

Out of interest did anyone else notice the two guys in City tops in the top of the stand to our left?

Looked like an old TV gantry, any idea who they were and why they were up there?

[Major Isewater]

26 minutes ago, phantom said:

Out of interest did anyone else notice the two guys in City tops in the top of the stand to our left?

Looked like an old TV gantry, any idea who they were and why they were up there?

Was it these chaps ? 

 

[Port Said Red]

8 minutes ago, Major Isewater said:

Was it these chaps ? 

 

That's what my wife calls Nigel Turner and Richard Latham on the "Subs Bench" on Made in Bristol

[Olé]

2 hours ago, BS3_RED said:

Fair enough, from my view I thought Patterson looked fine and was still dominating his position. 

Just my opinion but while I agree he was dominating (more down to how poor they were) I thought for ten minutes prior to going off he looked absolutely spent. He was hesitating and turning back on the ball more often rather than just going at them in the manner he's done so well in the past two weeks and for the first hour yesterday.

To my knowledge he hasn't played three full games in a row all season, I felt pretty certain he would go off, he didn't look like he had the legs to keep going at the same pace and it coincided with us starting to go off the boil. I thought LJ got it spot on, O'Dowda was a perfect replacement to keep the momentum on the flanks.

It was Emnes for them and the change of shape for us (Cotterill / Little) where it all really started to go awry.

[The Nest Egg]

I think switching Smith from CM to RB in the same game muddled the team up a bit- especially Pack. I appreciate we don't have many other alternatives, and Smith has had some good games at RB, but from then on the midfield lost their shape and looked confused when for the previous half they had been passing it around for fun as if the Blackburn players were training mannequins.

[The Dolman Pragmatist]

40 minutes ago, Newquay-Red said:

I think switching Smith from CM to RB in the same game muddled the team up a bit- especially Pack. I appreciate we don't have many other alternatives, and Smith has had some good games at RB, but from then on the midfield lost their shape and looked confused when for the previous half they had been passing it around for fun as if the Blackburn players were training mannequins.

But as you say, with Little injured what options did he have?  Put Brownhill at RB, which worked once?  Disappointed that we didn't win, but that was because we didn't take our chances, rather because of the substitutions.

Generally, I think Lee's subs gave been spot on in the last few games.

 

[Robbored]

We are only 90% safe so analysis of LJs season is a tad premature but........

The season could be divided into three parts. Off to a decent enough start, followed by a free fall down the league including a run of 8 consecutive defeats, a club record a a very dangerous flirt with the dreaded DZ. calls for LJs head echoing around AG. Claims that he was too inexperienced in the SBC, that he didn't know what he was doing and that he'd "lost" the dressing room.....SL then publically supports his man which in turn created more angst amongst the faithful. Talk of protests, banners and boycotting games which all turned out to be empty waffle.

More recently results  have improved. 7 points from the last three matches with the same starting 11 and squad. At long last LJ has found his best 11 and players he can "trust". At Blackburn City scored a terrific team goal with 9 of the 11 making a contribution. That alone says that the dressing room is united.

Im optimistic City will be in the SBC next season. A win on Saturday will ensure that and I'm confident that LJ will have gained a huge amount of experience from the pressure he's been under virtually all season and be a better manager for it.

[The Nest Egg]

1 minute ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

But as you say, with Little injured what options did he have?  Put Brownhill at RB, which worked once?  Disappointed that we didn't win, but that was because we didn't take our chances, rather because of the substitutions.

Generally, I think Lee's subs gave been spot on in the last few games.

 

Oh yeah, I understand there was no alternative, it was more of a comment towards what our future recruitment in the summer must be in order to try and prevent such a situation happening again. The two points were lost due to our wastefulness, but there must be no denying that once the subs were made we did look like a weaker side, with Cotterill being particularly ineffective. Can't blame Wilbs for anything though, if anything I give him credit for trying to continue with a potentially serious injury

[bh_red]

7 hours ago, Port Said Red said:

@Olés  report said that Little was injured? 

Question we have to ask is why wasn't their Right Back Cover on the bench?

is Vyner then latest player to suffer the LJ disapeering act.

matthews....

[Gert Mare]

8 hours ago, BS3_RED said:

Now let me start by saying, I would have taken a point yesterday before kick off and so am more than happy with it now. I thought LJ did everything right pre game. He kept the same team and formation and built on the previous couple of games where we have looked settled and improving. 

I thought we play played Blackburn of the park and if we had taken our chances we would have walked away with a comfortable 4 or 5 nil win. Blackburn only had the one sniff in the first half and that was due to a lucky deflection. I even said to the guy next to me that Lee could not be blamed for not winning this game if they nicked one as he had done everything right.

 

Then comes their goal from their only real attack up to that point and for me Lee returns to type and made completely unnecessary changes. 30 seconds before their goal we could and should have scored with Brownhills and we were in complete dominance. I thought Paterson was playing well and so was Little. 

 

If we had just rode out the following 5 minutes where Blackburn were always going to get a lift I really believe we would have taken control again and would have created at least one more chance. 

 

As it was, we took Patterson off for Odowda and then moved Smith to right back when Cotts came on for Little and from that point on it was always about surviving as I feel our midfield suddenly lost control of a game that they bossed from the first minute.

 

Now someone might come on and tell me that Patterson and Little had taken knocks in which case fair enough to Lee but both looked fine an still motoring when they came off to me.

This was one time where I really thing making subs was the wrong call and we really should have just let the starting 11 reclaim the dominance that they held.

Apart from that, I thought Lee got everything right and as he is here to stay we might as well get behind him.

COYR and bring on Barnsley where I am sure Lee will need our support.

Glad it has taken him 40 games to work out how to win! 

[The Dolman Pragmatist]

36 minutes ago, bh_red said:

Question we have to ask is why wasn't their Right Back Cover on the bench?

is Vyner then latest player to suffer the LJ disapeering act.

matthews....

With only seven subs you can't necessarily cover every position.  As Korey Smith was at right back when we beat Wigan and Huddersfield, hardly surprising that he should act as cover for RB.

I would hope that most City fans would understand that Matthews should never wear a Bristol City shirt again.