are people really boycotting because of LJ?!!

[richwwtk]

7 minutes ago, SARJ said:

No problem with anything you've said, but I don't like the idea of some tax exile saying I can't boo a poor performance or criticise an inept manager. 

In short: Lansdown says pay up then shut up.

I'm pretty sure that hasn't been a club owner in history that would want the fans of their club booing and criticising, and SL is quite within his rights to suggest he doesn't like it.

On the other hand, your right to do so has never been suppressed and people regularly do, it's all part of the healthy debate that goes on around the team.

[The Joker]

15 hours ago, Cowshed said:

In my forty five years of supporting BCFC this season is a low point. The lowest. Its not results it the realisation that BCFC is a toy. Lansdown junior was running Bristol City, now a family friend is Managing the XI. Mr Lansdown is BCFC. Its not a club. It is a product. 

No problem with people opting to not suck it up, and choosing to come back when the product improves/the family friend is finally fired, or get other past times. 

 

Lansdown junior was running Bristol City, Ah yes,that's when Senior announced that he was stepping back,wanted to pursue his other interests,new blood and all that baloney, well that went well didn't it,what a pile of rectum relish that appointment was,Senior had to bin his pipe n slippers, get his arse off the rock and sort junior out,now we have the same scenario with LJ as JL,family friend, massive gamble,well good luck with that one Mr decision maker,you will need it.

[richwwtk]

5 minutes ago, RumRed said:

There are passionate feelings, I hope we finish strongly too, I have just never felt so disconnected from the club.  The results are not what most of us are whinging about it's the feeling that we are supporting a particular part of SL's Bristol Sport's project rather than our club.

 

The feeling of disconnection from the club is something I went through a few years ago, around the time that Bristol Sport first appeared. I was very critical on here around that time but now I look back I'm really not convinced that Bristol Sport was the reason for my disconnect.

When I was younger/single the football was a huge part of my life, meeting friends at the pub, going to away games......but getting married, having kids etc. means that as time goes on it becomes less important. I had all this going on at the time and I suspect that that was a larger part of my feelings towards the club than the appearance of Bristol Sport. I obviously have no idea about other people's lives or their reasons but I am just saying that is what is was for me.

I am now back with a ST after a few years of intermittent attendance at best, and am enjoying it again. I can even see the sense in the Bristol Sport model as a way of making the club (eventually) more successful.

[1953]

As in life, there are two types of contributor on here.... those whose glass is half full and those whose glass is half empty. Those with half full glasses are optimistic for the future and realise things could have been a damned sight worse. Those with half empty glasses only see the bad in  every situation and collectively cheer themselves up by collectively moaning (misery loves company) and sniping at the happy clappers as they like to call the optimists. Of course for good measure they can always slag off Rovers too, though even that is probably borne of jealousy of three seasons of success and stability (it doesn't really matter what league, if you're winning.) One thing everyone dreams of is reaching the promised land of the Premiership, but let's be honest, the team is a million miles from that standard. They need two or three seasons of building a youngish side that finishes in the top half  of the table, so that they can then mount a serious campaign pushing for promotion. The glass half empty mob will still be moaning about the lack of achievement but unless there  are strong foundations, it just won't stand up. At least  LJ seems to have finally realised that constant rotation doesn't work. And the side looks so much better now for starting with two up front. It would be nice  if Taylor  could grab a couple of goals on  Saturday  too. He's no Messi, but I think his work rate is  an example to some who are not now playing, of what was missing during that  miserable run. 

[Bat Fastard]

23 minutes ago, richwwtk said:

The feeling of disconnection from the club is something I went through a few years ago, around the time that Bristol Sport first appeared. I was very critical on here around that time but now I look back I'm really not convinced that Bristol Sport was the reason for my disconnect.

When I was younger/single the football was a huge part of my life, meeting friends at the pub, going to away games......but getting married, having kids etc. means that as time goes on it becomes less important. I had all this going on at the time and I suspect that that was a larger part of my feelings towards the club than the appearance of Bristol Sport. I obviously have no idea about other people's lives or their reasons but I am just saying that is what is was for me.

I am now back with a ST after a few years of intermittent attendance at best, and am enjoying it again. I can even see the sense in the Bristol Sport model as a way of making the club (eventually) more successful.

Bloody hell Rich - it sounds like you are growing up! Now that you have a good family life and are back enjoying your footy - we just need to sort out your politics!

[Nogbad the Bad]

1 hour ago, hoxton casual said:

 I have learnt that the anti SL brigade feel he treats the club as a plaything and risks his money, and the therefore the future of the club, over his sons friendship with the manager. 

 

If you are convinced the long term friendship with SL and JL was not a huge factor behind LJ's appointment, perhaps you could give your theory as to why a novice with no previous experience at this level, who was average at best in L1, and who had achieved nothing whatsoever to support his elevation to manage a Championship club, was appointed manager of BCFC?

There's no doubt that no other Championship club would have entertained the idea of appointing Lee Johnson as their manager.

So, why did Bristol City? 

 

[Cowshed]

2 hours ago, JoeAman08 said:

Then I don't know what you call it when you say you're a fan but stop going when they aren't winning but that's what the thread is about. Nobody hated SL or LJ when we were winning. All the negativity is because we lost a few games. You were supporting for 30 years then stopped going. So I guess when you come back you've been a fan less than I have. You "long time fans" seem to have this superiority complex. That the club deserves the be good because you've been there the whole time. The club deserves nothing and nor do you. The best you and I can hope for is a few special seasons we can talk about for years and all the bad ones and what could've gone better. You don't disappear when it gets tough. 

Who hates anybody? That is hyperbole. I hate nobody. Nobody. 

The superiority complex is yours. You have avoided addressing a point - Anybody supporting BCFC for more than thirty years is not glory hunting. So there must have been something else present to keep many watching and attending.

In 1982 the hope was the football club would continue to exist. The clubs constitution meant that the very scenario that has occurred where an individual takes over the football club, puts his Son temporarily in charge and a family Mate in charge of the XI could not become a reality. A fact.

Fans have been reduced to consumers. You state more or less fans(consumers) should be mute and complainant.

The best I hope is not European football in five years. Never has been. I hope that Bristol City becomes a engaging partner in its community, a club worthy of being looked upon as a community asset in the manner European clubs operate. As somebody who is fortunate enough to be employed in a role which sees me working in the community (including football) I can see Bristol City is a million miles away from that. My hope is Bristol City (Mr Lansdowns) finds that soul.

Lee Johnson is a catalyst for some = Time to wind in faithful non glory hunting support of Bristol City ... He is here because Bristol City is a billionaires play thing. Its no club. That goes beyond results.

[richwwtk]

Just now, Nogbad the Bad said:

If you are convinced the long term friendship with SL and JL was not a huge factor behind LJ's appointment, perhaps you could give your theory as to why a novice with no previous experience at this level, who was average at best in L1, and who had achieved nothing whatsoever to support his elevation to manage a Championship club, was appointed manager of BCFC?

There's no doubt that no other Championship club would have entertained the idea of appointing Lee Johnson as their manager.

So, why did Bristol City? 

 

I would imagine that the friendship, if it really existed to that extent, would indeed have been a factor in both his appointment and retention.

This doesn't make LJ a bad manager, SL has faith in him and only time will tell if that is misplaced or not.

In fact, the friendship having an influence on the retention rather than sacking, could turn out to be one of the best things to have ever happened to us if that faith is proved to be worthwhile. Only time will tell for sure....

[JoeAman08]

1 hour ago, glynriley said:

We've been going down this road for the best part of 20 years. Joe Bryan and Bobby Reid are academy products, as were the likes of Danny Coles, Matt Hill, Tommy Doc et al.

We may be putting more emphasis on it now, but the highlighted part is disingenuous.

Yea I get that and it may have been a waste in years past. Like you said more emphasis now but we can't change how we ran it in the past, all we can do is run in better now. The academy is full of 16-18 year olds not ready to play for us now or even soon. That's why we spent to buy us some time and earn us some money until it's up to scratch. At least that's how I see it. 

[Trueredsupporter]

@JoeAman08been here since the seventies. must have missed the glory !!!! people who stuck with it that long are superior. dyed in the wool reds because most didn't.

[JoeAman08]

9 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

Who hates anybody? That is hyperbole. I hate nobody. Nobody. 

The superiority complex is yours. You have avoided addressing a point - Anybody supporting BCFC for more than thirty years is not glory hunting. So there must have been something else present to keep many watching and attending.

In 1982 the hope was the football club would continue to exist. The clubs constitution meant that the very scenario that has occurred where an individual takes over the football club, puts his Son temporarily in charge and a family Mate in charge of the XI could not become a reality. A fact.

Fans have been reduced to consumers. You state more or less fans(consumers) should be mute and complainant.

The best I hope is not European football in five years. Never has been. I hope that Bristol City becomes a engaging partner in its community, a club worthy of being looked upon as a community asset in the manner European clubs operate. As somebody who is fortunate enough to be employed in a role which sees me working in the community (including football) I can see Bristol City is a million miles away from that. My hope is Bristol City (Mr Lansdowns) finds that soul.

Lee Johnson is a catalyst for some = Time to wind in faithful non glory hunting support of Bristol City ... He is here because Bristol City is a billionaires play thing. Its no club. That goes beyond results.

No I get the glory hunting thing and fair enough but what is a supporter for 30 years who stops showing up because we didn't have as many points this year as they expected? That's the issue I have. Anybody can choose to go or not to go and I've got no issue with that. Just say the true reason you aren't going. It isn't SL or LJ, it's purely results based because no one was complaining in October. That's my main issue. If you've been supporting 30 years and are tired of second and third tier football and don't want to show up, I'm all for it. Don't try and spout poisonous rubbish about an owner and coach who may not be the best on their field but have best interests at heart. 

The community stuff you mention would be nice and I won't comment on it because I don't know what they do other than what they post online themselves. More communication from the club would be nice. I don't have any hopes for on the field other than we have XI that work hard and don't give up whichever league we are in. 

[JoeAman08]

Just now, Trueredsupporte said:

@JoeAman08been here since the seventies. must have missed the glory !!!! people who stuck with it that long are superior. dyed in the wool reds because most didn't.

I don't want to belittle your support. It's not my intentions. Fans that have been here a long time and continue to be have my respect. To me, most of the malcontent has been because we didn't have that great of a season. That's not enough in my eyes to boycott a club. A majority are upset LJ didn't go but SL has put enough into the club to stick by the guy a bit longer. Not every little detail needs to be criticised. The simple way to sort it as I've said is to ask the boycotters whether they'd still be doing it if we are top 6 this time next year? If the answer is no then maybe the boycott was a bit petty. 

[Trueredsupporter]

@JoeAman08long time fans of BCFC cant be glory hunters can they? go on admit you got caught out on that one. that's respect.

 

 

 

 

[Nogbad the Bad]

1 minute ago, JoeAman08 said:

I don't want to belittle your support. It's not my intentions. Fans that have been here a long time and continue to be have my respect. To me, most of the malcontent has been because we didn't have that great of a season. That's not enough in my eyes to boycott a club. A majority are upset LJ didn't go but SL has put enough into the club to stick by the guy a bit longer. Not every little detail needs to be criticised. The simple way to sort it as I've said is to ask the boycotters whether they'd still be doing it if we are top 6 this time next year? If the answer is no then maybe the boycott was a bit petty. 

Perhaps you aren't yet in a position to realise just how much many long term fans have invested into Bristol City F.C.

Not just money, but time and - most importantly - emotion.

Sometimes you've got to make a stand to show you won't be taken for granted, however painful it is, and even if that stand is comparatively short lived.

These fans won't change things in the short term, that's clear, but a message has been sent to the club via their empty seats, something that definitely will have been noted by those they wish to influence.

[Sixtyseconds]

I am hunting for this glory.

I cannot see it.

What setting do people have their eyes on?

[hoxton casual]

1 hour ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

If you are convinced the long term friendship with SL and JL was not a huge factor behind LJ's appointment, perhaps you could give your theory as to why a novice with no previous experience at this level, who was average at best in L1, and who had achieved nothing whatsoever to support his elevation to manage a Championship club, was appointed manager of BCFC?

There's no doubt that no other Championship club would have entertained the idea of appointing Lee Johnson as their manager.

So, why did Bristol City? 

 

I believed they thought LJ was young manager with a lot of good ideas, who would implement their new strategy because he shared their vision. They didnt want another "experienced old hand who would want to do it thier way. He also had to be someone who was happy to work with a Director of Football. Why did we appoint Millen he had no experience? I think they genuinely believed he was the man for the job, as he may well turn out to be. The idea that SL a very hard headed businessman would appoint someone because he was a friend of the family, sounds very far fetched to me. I think SL nepotist believers, are clutching at straws because we have had a disappointing season. SL does not strike me as a sentamentalist. He built his business from the ground up and now has now no major stake in it. If he was arrogant or sentimental he would have stayed on and tried to continue to influence what he and Hargreaves had created and satisfy his ego.

[Jack Dawe]

4 hours ago, KnowleUtd City said:

My thoughts exactly.

It's been great to see crowds around the 20k mark this season, by miles the biggest average I've seen in my time down the Gate, exciting to think that if we have a decent season they could get even bigger.

Plenty of people love to moan, never been any different, I've been going regular since 1986 and it makes me proud to see the forward steps the club has made in terms of facilities, and getting people through the gates with cheaper tickets for the Atyeo, and kids etc, £50 a season ticket for my two boys and a shirt thrown in is incredible value. I actually like the fact that our board are bucking the trend and sticking with a manager, effectively saying to problematic players 'either get on board with the bloke, or do one'.

We've sacked an endless string of managers and where has it got us? I really hope that LJ proves a lot of people wrong next season, and repays SL's faith in him.

I hope a lot of the lads who have decided not to come down during the tough run this season, have a change of heart and get back down to support the lads!! Come on you Reds!!

If we somehow knew, for sure, 100%, that this - your highlighted bit above - was the case, the number one route  cause of the problem this season, that some players had deliberately conspired against the head coach, and in so doing, plunged the club into a relegation struggle, putting themselves before every one and every thing, then I reckon many, if not most, of the 'moaners' would take a different view of things, and get behind SL at least, if not the head coach as well. They would be behind the club, not a few mercenary players.

If this was true, plain to see, and obviously so.

But we don't know the truth, we know so little, we can only guess. In fact, one of the rumoured conspirators, Lee Tomlin, during a club press conference, was at pains to say that he and LJ had not fallen out, and had both had a good old chuckle at the very thought. This, at a time when, more than once, the head coach states that he will pick a team he can "trust." Confused? Me too.

If it was true though, it would beg the question: why would those players do this? Why? 'Because Lee Tomlin is well known to be.......' might be one answer to this, which then begs another question: why did we sign him then? What happened to the 'DNA' checks, to make sure we sign the right characters? 

Last time we were relegated, the players were largely blamed - for not giving a toss; for being over the hill  - and here we are again, saying it is the players. How unlucky are we to always end up with such useless, disinterested players?! How the hell do other clubs avoid this situation?........

 

 

[hoxton casual]

Just now, Jack Dawe said:

 

But we don't know the truth, we know so little, we can only guess. In fact, one of the rumoured conspirators, Lee Tomlin, during a club press conference, was at pains to say that he and LJ had not fallen out, and had both had a good old chuckle at the very thought. This, at a time when, more than once, the head coach states that he will pick a team he can "trust." Confused? Me too.

If it was true though, it would beg the question: why would those players do this? Why? 'Because Lee Tomlin is well known to be.......' might be one answer to this, which then begs another question: why did we sign him then? What happened to the 'DNA' checks, to make sure we sign the right characters? 

 

 

 

Do you believe he missed that penalty on purpose?

[Natchfever]

Just now, hoxton casual said:

I believed they thought LJ was young manager with a lot of good ideas, who would implement their new strategy because he shared their vision. They didnt want another "experienced old hand who would want to do it thier way. He also had to be someone who was happy to work with a Director of Football. Why did we appoint Millen he had no experience? I think they genuinely believed he was the man for the job, as he may well turn out to be. The idea that SL a very hard headed businessman would appoint someone because he was a friend of the family, sounds very far fetched to me. I think SL nepotist believers, are clutching at straws because we have had a disappointing season. SL does not strike me as a sentamentalist. He built his business from the ground up and now has now no major stake in it. If he was arrogant or sentimental he would have stayed on and tried to continue to influence what he and Hargreaves had created and satisfy his ego.

A point of reference for you Hoxton - Bristol Rugby.

Lansdown's mate a certain Chris Booy is Chairman. He is a complete belter, proclaimed the squad was premiership ready last May when everyone knew that was total bollocks, gave a shite coach a 12 month extension when he limped out of the second tier at the third attempt,and makes stupid public statements that makes the club a national laughing stock. He will be chairman forever unless he walks under a bus because he is Lansdown's mate. No other reason, and not someone who would be tolerated in any other professional rugby club.

As for Hargreaves Lansdown, no idea who was the power behind their success and whether one was a passenger but I have heard they haven't exactly stood still since SL went abroad, but perhaps someone could confirm either way.

[hoxton casual]

Loon plage

I agree the rugby is even more frustrating than the football. Robinson was tolerated for far too long, whilst everyone could see he was completely out of his depth in modern professional rugby and Booy should have acted far sooner. I have heard top players would not want to join Bris becuase of Robinson. Our relegation is testemant to that. The difference in my analysis of why these failings were allowed carry on, is that SL and Booy share a trait which can be advantage and disadvantage. They believe in stability and long term support for managers coaches, unless we are in a complete crisis.   This has cost us a few times in both teams. The alternative is knee jerk or unnecessary changes such as brum or derby. what I would like is a happy medium. Long term support for the right person! there is no point supporting someone is obviously not up to it. 

[Jack Dawe]

3 minutes ago, hoxton casual said:

Do you believe he missed that penalty on purpose?

So it was the players last time, Kilkenny et al.

And it's the players this time, Tomlin and whoever.

No doubt, the next time we struggle in this league, it will be - don't tell me - the players!

These bloody players that sign themselves for this club and pick themselves in the team. There's nothing we can do about all this, it's all out of our hands! Help! We are helpless!

[hoxton casual]

Ok I see your point. Yes they signed Tomlin and yes he picked him. He got it wrong there is no doubting that but Tomlin was a world beater 7 months ago and we all loved him. Funny old game.

[Jack Dawe]

Just now, hoxton casual said:

Ok I see your point. Yes they signed Tomlin and yes he picked him. He got it wrong there is no doubting that but Tomlin was a world beater 7 months ago and we all loved him. Funny old game.

You can blame the players, up to a point.

You can blame referees, and injuries, and lady luck, if you so wish, but only up to a point.

At some point, the success and direction of a football club, over a longer period of time than 90 minutes, or even 46 games, comes down to the people with the greatest influence over that direction. And Lee Tomlin was not here in 2013, and Neil Kilkenny is not here now.

I've said before though, and say it again, we have to give SL a reasonable amount of time to make good use of a fully functioning, modernised stadium with the crowds and revenue to compete at this level and put out a competitive team. This is only the first year that we have been 'up to speed' off the pitch. 

[JoeAman08]

1 hour ago, Trueredsupporte said:

@JoeAman08long time fans of BCFC cant be glory hunters can they? go on admit you got caught out on that one. that's respect.

 

 

 

 

I did concede that in another post. Then asked what the term would be for supporters who have supported for so long and then stop because we haven't won as much as they thought. That was the whole point in everything I've said here. Why support so long then stop just because a coach didn't get the sack? 

[JoeAman08]

1 hour ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

Perhaps you aren't yet in a position to realise just how much many long term fans have invested into Bristol City F.C.

Not just money, but time and - most importantly - emotion.

Sometimes you've got to make a stand to show you won't be taken for granted, however painful it is, and even if that stand is comparatively short lived.

These fans won't change things in the short term, that's clear, but a message has been sent to the club via their empty seats, something that definitely will have been noted by those they wish to influence.

I've also conceded that but just because it isn't Bristol City doesn't mean I haven't put the same time, energy and money into other entities. If not completely similar I think it gives me a perspective to add to the conversation. 

Mostly I don't know what the boycotters are trying to change so I'm baffled there are any at all. As poor as the season has been it's only based on results. The team still seems to be playing hard and for the current head coach and mistakes seem to have been learned from. Even SL is going against what he's done in the past. 

[Jack Dawe]

19 minutes ago, hoxton casual said:

Ok I see your point. Yes they signed Tomlin and yes he picked him. He got it wrong there is no doubting that but Tomlin was a world beater 7 months ago and we all loved him. Funny old game.

SL took the trouble to remind us, recently, that we can not make an "informed decision" about Bristol City because we do not know what happens "inside" the club. Fair enough. 

We do not have access to people "inside" the game who might advise us as to the advisability of signing Lee Tomlin permanently, so we can only judge things with the benefit of hindsight. On results, and outcomes.

SL pays people - two people, specifically - a lot of money to make these very difficult judgments. That is what they are paid to do, and paid to get right. No good 'moaning' about Lee Tomlin being this, or that. Not when you are "inside" the game and in a position to make an "informed decision" about Lee Tomlin, and after you have told everyone about the 'DNA' checks you make to ensure you don't sign any wrong 'uns.

If you are going to say: "We are always prepared for anything. If you are not, then you are not doing your job properly" as Lee Johnson did last August, then you cannot be looking to place responsibility for the team anywhere but yourself. Can you?

 

[Redbo]

4 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Another exciting , interesting post from you - one of your longest - 13 words

Congratulations

It's not about length BobBobSuperBob, it's  about what you can do with it. Apparently. 

[Trueredsupporter]

30 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

What was the whole point in everything I've said here. Why support so long then stop just because a coach didn't get the sack? 

because they do not agree with how things are being run. quite normal and its happened before in thousands at City with Kew and Osman. Steve Lansdowns has said what the score is with an extended contract for ???? god knows what and that he calls the shots because he puts the money in. personally think both were very bad calls and some will decide you can keep it then Steve

[JoeAman08]

20 minutes ago, Trueredsupporte said:

because they do not agree with how things are being run. quite normal and its happened before in thousands at City with Kew and Osman. Steve Lansdowns has said what the score is with an extended contract for ???? god knows what and that he calls the shots because he puts the money in. personally think both were very bad calls and some will decide you can keep it then Steve

Fair enough but I just can't see what difference it'll make. Fans can disagree but in today's game they don't get a say. The best we can do is support. Again it's just the way I see it. It was probably different 20-30 years ago and I'll not understand that bit of it. Too much money involved now I think for us to be part of decisions. 

[Sir Leigh of Somerset]

Some interesting (and colourful) comments on this subject.

In the case of my son and i, we outlaid a lot of money for our Season Cards in the Dolman, we then went on to spend a fair bit at each game on programmes, pies, beers etc and this was against a backdrop of having to make a 3 hours' round trip to watch The City.

None of this is a problem when the football is of an even half decent standard but too many games this season have been really really poor and the Fulham game ultimately proved to be a bad experience too far for me and I've not been to Ashton Gate since.

I didn't consciously decide to boycott anything or anyone but I just decided that, as someone defined by the club as a 'customer', the 'product' wasn't up to scratch right now so I'd take time out and do something else on a Saturday.

I'm obviously not a 'die hard' fan but City have been my team for over 50 years, they'll always be the team whose results I look for first, I'll always watch only their games/highlights on TV and I'll undoubtedly return to Ashton Gate to catch a few key games next season (and POTD.) no matter who the Head Coach/Manager is.

I guess, in summary (and possibly like a number of other people), I've just been so disappointed by how the management team at BCFC found the way to turn a silk purse in to a sow's ear that I needed a break from it all!!