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Guardian article today on SL and Johnson


Nongazeuse

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Not a paper I buy as too irritating politically but a good article today on Landsown and Johnson.

I expect someone can find a link to the on-line version but here are some highlights:

  • Owner's vision intact after backing manager and sealing survival in sack-happy second tier.
  • After Burton game SL told LJ that "we've been talking about whether we should keep you or not".
  • SL "more owners should take longer term view..But unfortunately, if you get relegated, of course you get castigated. So that's the pressure".
  • LJ : "an unbelievable learning curve for us all...You have to make big decisions .. you need big balls .. and I would rather fail bold than fail timid".
  • 11 Championship clubs changed manager during season (four of them twice).

 

 

 

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28 minutes ago, Nongazeuse said:

Not a paper I buy as too irritating politically but a good article today on Landsown and Johnson.

I expect someone can find a link to the on-line version but here are some highlights:

  • Owner's vision intact after backing manager and sealing survival in sack-happy second tier.
  • After Burton game SL told LJ that "we've been talking about whether we should keep you or not".
  • SL "more owners should take longer term view..But unfortunately, if you get relegated, of course you get castigated. So that's the pressure".
  • LJ : "an unbelievable learning curve for us all...You have to make big decisions .. you need big balls .. and I would rather fail bold than fail timid".
  • 11 Championship clubs changed manager during season (four of them twice).

 

 

 

Which website as almost certain it's not on Guardian site...

 

edit: sorry I think you must mean it is in the paper version. Will have to buy that now then!

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Yep a good article. Not sure the little dig by SL at critical fans was needed though ...'they go asleep (sic) when things are going well..'

Compared to other clubs (e.g. Newcastle fans hounding out Pardew with a sustained campaign) LJ and SL have had it easy on that front this season.

But good to see us getting national media coverage all the same...

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Good article

Couple of  bits I found interesting

By his own admission he is “obsessed” with management, to the point that his desire to succeed means he has “probably over-coached a little bit at times”. Johnson also recognises the need to do a better job of keeping a lid on expectations during the good times. “That’s probably a lesson for me – I went with it, rather than saying: ‘Hold on a minute, calm down a little bit,’” he says, recalling the excitement that accompanied City’s excellent early results.

For Johnson the pressure he has worked under in his first full season in charge at City has been unforgiving. “I don’t think anybody will ever realise what it’s like in that hot seat until you’re in it, because it is relentless,” he says. “It [the criticism] comes from all angles. You’ve got the massive boom in social media, you have your kids at school, you have your wife walking down the road, you have the board questioning things – rightly so. You have players’ agents kicking off. It’s all happening and you have to be the calmest man in the room, really.

 

 

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Just now, BS4 on Tour... said:

Yep a good article. Not sure the little dig by SL at critical fans was needed though ...'they go asleep (sic) when things are going well..'

Compared to other clubs (e.g. Newcastle fans hounding out Pardew with a sustained campaign) LJ and SL have had it easy on that front this season.

But good to see us getting national media coverage all the same...

He does come across as he still has the hump !!!

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Just now, BS4 on Tour... said:

Yep a good article. Not sure the little dig by SL at critical fans was needed though ...'they go asleep (sic) when things are going well..'

Compared to other clubs (e.g. Newcastle hounding out Pardew with a sustained campaign) LJ and SL have had it easy on that front this season.

But good to see us getting national media coverage all the same...

I don't think it's a dig, just reflecting what many on here say, i.e. the majority of the critics most prominent on here when things aren't going well, are nowhere to be seen when we doing OK.

 

 

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"... [Lansdown] genuinely believes that some fans would like to see him fail. Asked why that would be the case, Lansdown replies: “Maybe because we’ve broken some of their traditions, or they haven’t got the bar they used to drink in, or whatever it may be – people don’t like change. A lot of people in football want to go back to the good old days – or bad old days."

Haha - he definitely reads OTIB. :laughcont:

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Just now, BobBobSuperBob said:

Who are they then ? 

My thought exactly...I'd say that most of the "critics" were people who've been on here for years! 

Good article, and with the season out of the way all my goodwill towards the owner and the club has returned. I can't really think that SL is surprised when people get annoyed at a record breaking losing streak, annoying though that must be. Comes with the territory.

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Just now, ExiledAjax said:

"... [Lansdown] genuinely believes that some fans would like to see him fail. Asked why that would be the case, Lansdown replies: “Maybe because we’ve broken some of their traditions, or they haven’t got the bar they used to drink in, or whatever it may be – people don’t like change. A lot of people in football want to go back to the good old days – or bad old days."

Haha - he definitely reads OTIB. :laughcont:

Heh, thought that when I saw that quote!

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Just now, Red Exile said:

My thought exactly...I'd say that most of the "critics" were people who've been on here for years! 

Good article, and with the season out of the way all my goodwill towards the owner and the club has returned. I can't really think that SL is surprised when people get annoyed at a record breaking losing streak, annoying though that must be. Comes with the territory.

Don't think he liked the scrutiny & criticism at all (Human nature)

Trying to think back if he'd ever been so scrutinised / discussed , over a sustained period , previously in his tenure

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Its a good article. However, if LJ was indeed receiving "death threats" then that is an appalling state of affairs and as a fan base we must surely be better than that. I personally wanted him sacked and did not see him as the person who would bring us long term success. BUT to make it that personal is way out of order. For me, the jury remains firmly out and I still cant really work out how are season panned out the way it did.... I would also make some observations:

1. Unless I have missed something - LJ has spent and had at his disposal more resources than any other BCFC Manager. 

2. SL did not overspend under GJ IMO - if they paid inflated wages then plainly that is an issue. BUT i always felt that the team was not strong enough. Was Nicky Maynard not our record buy at the time? This season we have had circa 6 million quid worth of players on the bench or on loan....unheard of.

3. How many young players have really been brought through. Vyner had some game time but looked out of his depth. McClouskey had 15 mins or so against Hull. That's it. ODowda is a full international and Brownhill was a star performer when Barnsley went up. I think both have underperformed for large parts of the season. The youth team have not really been knocking on the first team door... 

4. The stadium needed to be done and should have been done much earlier. How much time and £ was wasted at Ashton Vale. 

5. What fans really want BCFC to fail? Come on. We want to win which is why passion for the club turns to anger. We should be doing better and my own view is that we do not have enough winners in the higher echelons of the club. 

6. By its very nature criticism comes when things are not going well. The worst run in the history of the club will no doubt justify criticism from the fan base (and rightly so). However, I have seen loads of posts criticising the board and its policies. To be fair, given where we are, those criticisms are entirely justified.Would SL have tolerated being known as the worst financial advisor in town - NO he would not.   

Progression has come because Cotterill got us up with a thread bear squad playing unbelievable football when we were on the verge of League Two... this now needs to be built on firmly rather than simply rolling out "we have a long term project". 

The decision to stick with LJ only bears fruit if he is away from relegation next season. I for one hope to see progression and that he succeeds. Happy to then eat humble pie.  But the way our form has fluctuated it is difficult to know which BCFC will turn up. Plainly some of LJ's comments reveal that there was unrest behind the scenes regarding his coaching methods and the role of agents..... interesting indeed....

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13 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

"... [Lansdown] genuinely believes that some fans would like to see him fail. Asked why that would be the case, Lansdown replies: “Maybe because we’ve broken some of their traditions, or they haven’t got the bar they used to drink in, or whatever it may be – people don’t like change. A lot of people in football want to go back to the good old days – or bad old days."

Haha - he definitely reads OTIB. :laughcont:

This season I've seen a number of posters stating that what views and whats written on OTIB is irrelevant

I thought at the time , and still do , that that's not the case at all

It remains the simplest way for the Club to take a sample slice of Fan mood 

And if it's so irrelevant , why is it Mrs L (Or is it Mr :whistle:) is a constant visitor and during the dire period of the season was on and off of here every few hours

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Just now, Kid in the Riot said:

The board didn't even discuss the possibility of removing LJ until March! Ha, that's unbelievable. If true.

Not exactly what it says.  It says they discussed the possibility of him leaving in March and gives a single example of that happening.  It doesn't say that was the first time that happened, or that it was the last time.

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5 minutes ago, MarkRed! said:

Its a good article. However, if LJ was indeed receiving "death threats" then that is an appalling state of affairs and as a fan base we must surely be better than that. I personally wanted him sacked and did not see him as the person who would bring us long term success. BUT to make it that personal is way out of order. For me, the jury remains firmly out and I still cant really work out how are season panned out the way it did.... I would also make some observations:

1. Unless I have missed something - LJ has spent and had at his disposal more resources than any other BCFC Manager. 

2. SL did not overspend under GJ IMO - if they paid inflated wages then plainly that is an issue. BUT i always felt that the team was not strong enough. Was Nicky Maynard not our record buy at the time? This season we have had circa 6 million quid worth of players on the bench or on loan....unheard of.

3. How many young players have really been brought through. Vyner had some game time but looked out of his depth. McClouskey had 15 mins or so against Hull. That's it. ODowda is a full international and Brownhill was a star performer when Barnsley went up. I think both have underperformed for large parts of the season. The youth team have not really been knocking on the first team door... 

4. The stadium needed to be done and should have been done much earlier. How much time and £ was wasted at Ashton Vale. 

Progression has come because Cotterill got us up with a thread bear squad playing unbelievable football... this now needs to be built on firmly. 

The decision to stick with LJ only bears fruit if he is away from relegation next season. I for one hope to see progression and that he succeeds. Happy to then eat humble pie.  But the way our form has fluctuated it is difficult to know which BCFC will turn up. 

Can't argue with any of that, one observation though.
SL was stitched up to an extent, AV would have been built along side us playing at AG and the move would have been seamless, no reduction a capacity. Everyone thought it was a go , the redevelopment was a back up that should never have been needed. A mate was working with one of the companies involved , knew architects involved and was adamant that it would go ahead until late on. No one saw the village green bollocks coming, so much so they changed the law. That put the build back and brought in a whole raft of problems of how to do a Stadium in stages.
You have to applaud SL for sticking with it and producing a damn fine ground.

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Just now, 1960maaan said:

Can't argue with any of that, one observation though.
SL was stitched up to an extent, AV would have been built along side us playing at AG and the move would have been seamless, no reduction a capacity. Everyone thought it was a go , the redevelopment was a back up that should never have been needed. A mate was working with one of the companies involved , knew architects involved and was adamant that it would go ahead until late on. No one saw the village green bollocks coming, so much so they changed the law. That put the build back and brought in a whole raft of problems of how to do a Stadium in stages.
You have to applaud SL for sticking with it and producing a damn fine ground.

Fair play - was not aware of that. 

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Just now, ExiledAjax said:

Not exactly what it says.  It says they discussed the possibility of him leaving in March and gives a single example of that happening.  It doesn't say that was the first time that happened, or that it was the last time.

Obviously it's not that specific! However "Johnson’s future was discussed at board level in March, when the threat of relegation started to loom" indicates the threat of relegation finally sparked the board into life as prior to that of course, despite the horrendous run of form, we weren't really in imminent danger of relegation. Despite all the signs being there that we would be involved in a relegation battle mind...

Quote

All the same Lansdown accepts that City were enduring a wretched run of results and admits that Johnson’s future was discussed at board level in March, when the threat of relegation started to loom. “Lee knows we had those conversations,” Lansdown says, looking across at Johnson. “We had a conversation after a game [the 0-0 draw with Burton Albion] where we were all sat around the table and Lee joined us. And I said to him: ‘Look, I’ve got to be honest with you, we’ve been talking about whether we should keep you or not.’”

 

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Just now, Kid in the Riot said:

Obviously it's not that specific! However "Johnson’s future was discussed at board level in March, when the threat of relegation started to loom" indicates the threat of relegation finally sparked the board into life as prior to that of course, despite the horrendous run of form, we weren't really in imminent danger of relegation. Despite all the signs being there that we would be involved in a relegation battle mind...

 

nothing wrong with that to be honest, It's nice to see chairman/owners giving a manager a chance to turn things round, it just happens to be the wrong man, 

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18 minutes ago, MarkRed! said:

Its a good article. However, if LJ was indeed receiving "death threats" then that is an appalling state of affairs and as a fan base we must surely be better than that. I personally wanted him sacked and did not see him as the person who would bring us long term success. BUT to make it that personal is way out of order. For me, the jury remains firmly out and I still cant really work out how are season panned out the way it did.... I would also make some observations:

1. Unless I have missed something - LJ has spent and had at his disposal more resources than any other BCFC Manager. 

2. SL did not overspend under GJ IMO - if they paid inflated wages then plainly that is an issue. BUT i always felt that the team was not strong enough. Was Nicky Maynard not our record buy at the time? This season we have had circa 6 million quid worth of players on the bench or on loan....unheard of.

3. How many young players have really been brought through. Vyner had some game time but looked out of his depth. McClouskey had 15 mins or so against Hull. That's it. ODowda is a full international and Brownhill was a star performer when Barnsley went up. I think both have underperformed for large parts of the season. The youth team have not really been knocking on the first team door... 

4. The stadium needed to be done and should have been done much earlier. How much time and £ was wasted at Ashton Vale. 

5. What fans really want BCFC to fail? Come on. We want to win which is why passion for the club turns to anger. We should be doing better and my own view is that we do not have enough winners in the higher echelons of the club. 

6. By its very nature criticism comes when things are not going well. The worst run in the history of the club will no doubt justify criticism from the fan base (and rightly so). However, I have seen loads of posts criticising the board and its policies. To be fair, given where we are, those criticisms are entirely justified.Would SL have tolerated being known as the worst financial advisor in town - NO he would not.   

Progression has come because Cotterill got us up with a thread bear squad playing unbelievable football when we were on the verge of League Two... this now needs to be built on firmly rather than simply rolling out "we have a long term project". 

The decision to stick with LJ only bears fruit if he is away from relegation next season. I for one hope to see progression and that he succeeds. Happy to then eat humble pie.  But the way our form has fluctuated it is difficult to know which BCFC will turn up. Plainly some of LJ's comments reveal that there was unrest behind the scenes regarding his coaching methods and the role of agents..... interesting indeed....

Good post. Look, the key line in the article is: “The point is, we trust Lee,” Lansdown says. “The aim is to build and develop, and the relationship I have with Lee, the knowledge I have of his career so far, his philosophy, I want to continue. " That's basically all you need to know and the relationship will continue until we are relegated by the sounds of it.

3 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

Can't argue with any of that, one observation though.
SL was stitched up to an extent, AV would have been built along side us playing at AG and the move would have been seamless, no reduction a capacity. Everyone thought it was a go , the redevelopment was a back up that should never have been needed. A mate was working with one of the companies involved , knew architects involved and was adamant that it would go ahead until late on. No one saw the village green bollocks coming, so much so they changed the law. That put the build back and brought in a whole raft of problems of how to do a Stadium in stages.
You have to applaud SL for sticking with it and producing a damn fine ground.

They should've seen the TVG issue, it should've been picked up very early on and could've been guarded against very easily by simply preventing access onto the site. Someone dropped a bollock, certainly not SL's falt though.

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1 minute ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Obviously it's not that specific! However "Johnson’s future was discussed at board level in March, when the threat of relegation started to loom" indicates the threat of relegation finally sparked the board into life as prior to that of course, despite the horrendous run of form, we weren't really in imminent danger of relegation. Despite all the signs being there that we would be involved in a relegation battle mind...

 

For me this is just the way the journalist has phrased it.

In March the board sat down, with Lee, and said to him for the first time, they were thinking about sacking him.

The board could easily have sat down before that and discussed it.

Good article though and shows the level of self analysis and reflection within the club that is the only way we can improve, and we have done so. For now at least, it's working. 

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1 minute ago, Kid in the Riot said:

They should've seen the TVG issue, it should've been picked up very early on and could've been guarded against very easily by simply preventing access onto the site. Someone dropped a bollock, certainly not SL's falt though.

Absolutely right of course, I think they got caught up with things. The word my mate said from the outset was legacy. SL really saw AV as his legacy to Bristol and Bristol City. The Council were very happy, specially with the World Cup potentially coming here and everyone was happily skipping along not looking for pitfall as all parties were onside. Well nearly all .

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Just now, Kid in the Riot said:

And for the wrong reason IMO. ie friendship over actual  best man for the job.

You see my counter to that is that the relationship between boss (SL) and employee (LJ) is just as, if not more, important than pure qualifications.  The number of times I've seen an Oxford grad come into my office with a stunning CV and all the credentials to be a huge success...two months later they've not gelled with anyone and are scrapping for work, no one trusts them and they leave within months.

It isn't purely about the best man on paper.  You have to have the trust - which you highlight as the "key line" in your other post.  That trust can create stability and stability goes a hell of a long way towards success.

Strong and stable leadership innit.

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