Retained list due out today

[REDOXO]

Magnusson looked ok for the first bit of the season and to be frank, perhaps the whole Iceland thing and where he came from made for some extra hype. Scoring on his debut helped!

I thought he looked as if he took a little too much time to think and was replaced by a signing that really was among the best. However he has to earn a place either as a CB or a LB, for the latter part of the season he didn't. If he had continued to play we would have gone down imo.

See what he does next term.

LJ going after him at PNE was uncalled for as they were all utter crap and the bloke wasn't on the field that long, nevertheless the point was, we are not strong enough all over and he needs to toughen up.

So toughen up and earn your place. That goes for all of them. Oh we only lost by the odd goal wont cut it next season for any of them!

 

 

 

[WarksRobin]

13 hours ago, GrahamC said:

What does that even mean though?

No one realistically expects that we will sign just one player this summer, we do need an experienced Championship standard right back, but no more than we need at least one (in my opinion 2) strikers.

As for Wilbraham, I love the bloke but I cannot fathom any logic in extending his playing time with us now.

We should either have added him to the coaching staff or he should have left.

Maybe Alby was key to Tammy's emergence this season and is seen as a key factor in attracting another young loan star, but isn't ready to retire just yet.

[The Dolman Pragmatist]

14 hours ago, Septic Peg said:

City announce retained list.

 

• Little departs as defender's contract expires
• Wilbraham offered new deal
• Morrell also offered extended terms 

Mark Little will depart Ashton Gate at the conclusion of his contract this summer, City can confirm.

 

The defender, signed from Peterborough United in 2014, made 102 appearances for the club and scored twice, including a goal at Wembley to cap a man of the match performance in the 2015 Johnstone’s Paint Trophy final.

 

Head coach Lee Johnson was quick to pay tribute to the 28-year-old, who featured 34 times last season.

 

Johnson told bcfc.co.uk: “It’s been an absolute pleasure to work with Mark over the last 15 months or so.

 

“He’s a superb character and personality, and I’d like to thank him for his effort, hard work and determination. We wish him every success in his future career.”

 

Meanwhile, club captain Aaron Wilbraham has been offered a new deal to extend his 20-year playing career that includes additional non-playing responsibilities.

 

Youngster Joe Morrell joins a host of development squad players in being offered a new contract.

 

Max O’Leary, Jojo Wollacott, Ash Harper, Cameron Pring, Connor Lemonheigh-Evans and Jake Andrews have already been offered extensions.

 

On-loan quartet Fabian Giefer (Schalke 04), Adam Matthews (Sunderland), David Cotterill (Birmingham City) and Tammy Abraham (Chelsea) have returned to their parent clubs.

 

All other first team players remain under contract for the 2017/18 season.

I don't think anyone has commented on the offer of extended terms to Joe Morrell.  I know we're all for encouraging youngsters, but it is three or four years now since his only first team appearance under Sean O'Driscoll (which ended with him being withdrawn at half time, from what I remember) and he doesn't seem to have been close to the first team squad since then.  His loans to Sutton and Margate achieved very little last season (only four games in total) so I'm really not sure what the thinking is here.  He is 20 now, and you'd expect to have seen more from him.

[Buckeyed]

Just now, Thatch35 said:

hahaha - Where was Tammy on the list I originally quoted? Tammy kept the club in the division, so you could say a one man team - stop Tammy you stop City last season. Have a think about what your replying before jumping in and making comments completely unrelated. 

Your comment was that we should get rid of all those players as they were part of the team that finished 3 points from safety.. so were the rest of the squad so by your inane logic we should get rid of everyone involved last season.

So to be clear - you feel we should get rid of Brownhill, O'Leary and Vyner? 

Have a think about how ridiculous your comments are. 

[Nogbad the Bad]

I'd personally have kept Little, bit disappointed to see him go.

Let's see who we bring in though - if we've got a replacement right back lined up who is demonstrably better, then fair enough.

 

[Major Isewater]

16 hours ago, Robbored said:

Not really a surprise that Little is released. He had some decent surges in to the opposition box  but was often caught out of position and a liability at times.

Wilbraham getting a player extension of a year with non playing responsibilities was predicted on here by Peg I think.

Mystic Peg . 

 

[Monkeh]

2 hours ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

I'd personally have kept Little, bit disappointed to see him go.

Let's see who we bring in though - if we've got a replacement right back lined up who is demonstrably better, then fair enough.

 

Moore, he's been playing RB at Bury for most of his loan spell

[Nogbad the Bad]

17 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

Moore, he's been playing RB at Bury for most of his loan spell

I know people on here like TM but he's completely unproven afaic, and I thought his preferred position is CB?

Bury finished just 1pt off relegation to L2, so really nothing to suggest he's been a huge success at that level at RB, or when played at CB for that matter. He may be no more reliable at that level than Rovers' RB for instance.

Of course it may be TM has been outstanding in an otherwise poor defence - I really don't know - but he'd have to have been exceptional in L1 to be thought of as ML's replacement in August.

Generally I don't agree with playing players in their '2nd position', i.e. Korey, unless it's an emergency, as it can mean weakening the team elsewhere.

We need to sign a new right back, and after letting Little go it's important his replacement is a genuine upgrade. 

[Monkeh]

Just now, Nogbad the Bad said:

I know people on here like TM but he's completely unproven afaic, and I thought his preferred position is CB?

Bury finished just 1pt off relegation to L2, so really nothing to suggest he's been a huge success at that level at RB, or when played at CB for that matter. He may be no more reliable at that level than Rovers' RB for instance.

Of course it may be TM has been outstanding in an otherwise poor defence - I really don't know - but he'd have to have been exceptional in L1 to be thought of as ML's replacement in August.

Generally I don't agree with playing players in their '2nd position', i.e. Korey, unless it's an emergency, as it can mean weakening the team elsewhere.

We need to sign a new right back, and after letting Little go it's important his replacement is a genuine upgrade. 

Eric Dyer is a CB doesn't stop him playing Centre Midfield most of the time, Henry was a left winger, didn't stop Arsne moving him centrally,  Bradley Orr was a central midfielder, didn't stop him becoming a first choice right back

Modern Footballers can play a number of postions and with some development can slot in nicely

Unproven will always stay as unproven unless they are given a chance, Vyner, Smith, Moore can all do a good enough job at right back,

I'm not suggesting we don't sign a right back far from it, but we do have some good young players and with the right guidance they could do the job no problem,

[glynriley]

12 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

I know people on here like TM but he's completely unproven afaic, and I thought his preferred position is CB?

Bury finished just 1pt off relegation to L2, so really nothing to suggest he's been a huge success at that level at RB, or when played at CB for that matter. He may be no more reliable at that level than Rovers' RB for instance.

Of course it may be TM has been outstanding in an otherwise poor defence - I really don't know - but he'd have to have been exceptional in L1 to be thought of as ML's replacement in August.

Generally I don't agree with playing players in their '2nd position', i.e. Korey, unless it's an emergency, as it can mean weakening the team elsewhere.

We need to sign a new right back, and after letting Little go it's important his replacement is a genuine upgrade. 

I expect any new RB will know that he is likely to play the majority of games as he has very little (no pun intended) behind him, so hopefully that means we can attract a decent one.

Expect TM and KS to be the back up.

[Nogbad the Bad]

38 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

Eric Dyer is a CB doesn't stop him playing Centre Midfield most of the time, Henry was a left winger, didn't stop Arsne moving him centrally,  Bradley Orr was a central midfielder, didn't stop him becoming a first choice right back

Modern Footballers can play a number of postions and with some development can slot in nicely

Unproven will always stay as unproven unless they are given a chance, Vyner, Smith, Moore can all do a good enough job at right back,

I'm not suggesting we don't sign a right back far from it, but we do have some good young players and with the right guidance they could do the job no problem,

I'm not convinced they can, Vyner and Moore are very young and largely untested; Smith did OK but was also RB in the capitulation at PNE. Perhaps he was missed in MF?

Since Little came back in for the run in post PNE he's looked every inch a solid Championship RB, and, of course, he can be exceptional going forward.

That's what we've got rid of. A youngster will not replace him unless he is outstanding enough for LJ to believe a few inevitable tentative games are all that are needed for him to blossom and cement a place in the team. Character is as important as ability to emerge as a first team regular.

Little's got that character and experience and it's a gamble letting him go.

I'm assuming it's a gamble LJ believes will come off because he knows a better RB is lined up.

Otherwise, imo., it was a bad move not to keep him.

[Monkeh]

6 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

I'm not convinced they can, Vyner and Moore are very young and largely untested; Smith did OK but was also RB in the capitulation at PNE. Perhaps he was missed in MF?

Since Little came back in for the run in post PNE he's looked every inch a solid Championship RB, and, of course, he can be exceptional going forward.

That's what we've got rid of. A youngster will not replace him unless he is outstanding enough for LJ to believe a few inevitable tentative games are all that are needed for him to blossom and cement a place in the team. Character is as important as ability to emerge as a first team regular.

Little's got that character and experience and it's a gamble letting him go.

I'm assuming it's a gamble LJ believes will come off because he knows a better RB is lined up.

Otherwise, imo., it was a bad move not to keep him.

fair point, but we don;t see the training and we don't see how they are developing ether,

Tammy was unproven when he came here, some people moaned about that and look how it turned out, All players start somewhere, I'd rather start the season with Vyner or Moore starting at right back and then bring one in if needed before the window closes, then sign another Adam Mathews,

We got plenty of time to fill the position but we've also got some good youngsters on the verge of the first team so I'm just as happy to give them a fair crack of the whip, after all some of the many criticism fans give this club is the fact we don't give out youngsters a chance,  

[Olé]

20 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Listened to a Portugese Football reporter the other day who was saying it was Jose Mourinhos golden rule (Not too) and one he got from The European Cup Winning Benfica Coach (Can't remember his name)

Bela Guttman. Who appears to have successfully cursed Benfica until 2062.

On the subject of public criticism, as others have pointed out, even Mourinho uses it now and then, but he does so calculatedly. Both he and Guttman had degrees in psychology. Lee Johnson does not. Most of his criticism has been off-the-cuff, ham-fisted, inconsistent and basically "anyone but me".

You don't need a psychology degree to see that Johnson's handling of players lacked leadership, empathy, or inspiration. He treats them like school kids. The reason Wilbraham has a new deal, it not because we want a 4th first team coach (!) but because he's the only one with any respect from senior players.

[bearded_red]

5 minutes ago, Olé said:

 The reason Wilbraham has a new deal, it not because we want a 4th first team coach (!) but because he's the only one with any respect from senior players.

That's exactly what went through my mind.

Certainly takes 'senior players manage the dressing room' to it's very extreme!

[Jack Dawe]

1 hour ago, Olé said:

Bela Guttman. Who appears to have successfully cursed Benfica until 2062.

On the subject of public criticism, as others have pointed out, even Mourinho uses it now and then, but he does so calculatedly. Both he and Guttman had degrees in psychology. Lee Johnson does not. Most of his criticism has been off-the-cuff, ham-fisted, inconsistent and basically "anyone but me".

You don't need a psychology degree to see that Johnson's handling of players lacked leadership, empathy, or inspiration. He treats them like school kids. The reason Wilbraham has a new deal, it not because we want a 4th first team coach (!) but because he's the only one with any respect from senior players.

When Johnson singled out Magnusson after the Preston defeat, it was in the immediate aftermath of a crushing defeat, a defeat that rubbed out more than half of our GD advantage over Blackburn, who we were then just one point ahead of, with 6 games to play.

Johnson was under massive pressure that evening, unprecedented in his career.

When under pressure, when really really squeezed, we expose what we are really about, what we really have, when the heat is on, when we can least disguise our weakness.

This, remember, was 4 weeks after SL and the board had spoken to LJ about his position, after the Burton game. The heat was on Johnson like never before, and he was talking about the players' "mentality" and singling out Magnusson. In other words, "it's them, not me."

Johnson was not protecting his players by taking responsibility himself, that much is clear.

 

People referencing Mourinho and Ferguson need to keep in mind that both had European success - on top of domestic league titles - to their name at the point they were singling out Joe Cole/Beckham. They were both older than Johnson is, too. They already commanded enormous respect from the players they were managing. World of difference.

 

[RedM]

@Olé @Jack Dawe interesting points re man management. The person I go to football with made a good point once when we were chatting about Warnock. He had saved Rotherhsm last year and Cardiff this season and we were having a moan.  She said he goes into a club and the attention goes straight onto him, he takes the heat off the players by absorbing it himself. Very true I thought, and very different to LJ's approach at times of severe stress. 

I do realise Lee has had it tough with his Dad's health, and I'm not saying I want him to morph into Warnock, but lessons can be learnt I think.

[Davefevs]

10 hours ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

I know people on here like TM but he's completely unproven afaic, and I thought his preferred position is CB?

Bury finished just 1pt off relegation to L2, so really nothing to suggest he's been a huge success at that level at RB, or when played at CB for that matter. He may be no more reliable at that level than Rovers' RB for instance.

Of course it may be TM has been outstanding in an otherwise poor defence - I really don't know - but he'd have to have been exceptional in L1 to be thought of as ML's replacement in August.

Generally I don't agree with playing players in their '2nd position', i.e. Korey, unless it's an emergency, as it can mean weakening the team elsewhere.

We need to sign a new right back, and after letting Little go it's important his replacement is a genuine upgrade. 

Very impressive at Bury, who were really struggling when he joined....in the relegation places.  I joined their forum, and he was well liked.  Played a bit at RWB too.  Is comfy on the ball, quick and good youth pedigree.  Tough for a young footballing centre back to cut it in the Champ - he may come back a tidy right back.

I think he could be the pick of our current youngsters.

[Mr Popodopolous]

On 5/17/2017 at 08:58, Buckeyed said:

I would agree with this, but only if we were struggling with being able to find the wages for a top striker. I would be very concerned if Wilbs wages were putting any strain on the club.

I would guess Wilbs will be on a high wage for League One, but an average amount for the championship.

Yeah he possibly isn't on too high a wage at this level- Championship average probably.

My main thinking was to maximise every pound, every penny- and unsure whether even as backup a striker who is 37 and will be 38 by the end of the year is worth persevering with.

[Mr Popodopolous]

On 5/17/2017 at 12:48, RedM said:

Unless the club see serious potential and benefit to him being a coach here. Would they show him the door and he goes elsewhere to complete his badges whilst playing at the same time, if that what he wants or do we invest in a future coach by letting him do that here? If he moves away he won't be back so we could lose out. Personally I  see limited playing, but still playing, whilst doing badges and then we will go from here.

Yeah maybe worth keeping him in some sort of coaching potential capacity. Hadn't thought of that.