Joe Bryan on the move

[ciderbeans]

9 minutes ago, The Bard said:

Tha all?. 

Sometimes it's simple things that make a huge difference

[Rich_s]

I'm amazed by the amount of people who are happy to see him go. The amount of starts he's made this season suggests he's fairly decent when considering our overall squad. 

I think he could do more at a bigger club due to random and inconsistent formations not because he's a poor player whom we should sell. 

[The Bard]

Just now, Rich_s said:

I'm amazed by the amount of people who are happy to see him go. The amount of starts he's made this season suggests he's fairly decent when considering our overall squad. 

I think he could do more at a bigger club due to random and inconsistent formations not because he's a poor player whom we should sell. 

The amount of starts means we're in a much better position to judge than someone in and out the side. Also,  it increases his value. Both reasons to sell 

[Rich_s]

Just now, The Bard said:

The amount of starts means we're in a much better position to judge than someone in and out the side. Also,  it increases his value. Both reasons to sell 

The primary reason we struggled last season but survived was due to chopping and changing the formation. With a consistent formation and team over the last half dozen games we did well. Getting rid of players who on merit are regular starters and going back to the random team selection tactics will see us struggle again next season. It's more than a passing coincidence that our double winning season saw consistent squad and formation week in week out. 

[Londoner]

Key player for us.

[Charlie BCFC]

20 hours ago, deadredfred said:

Joe Bryan on the move. I was hoping to see a bit of that against Birmingham. Useless 

You could say the same about all of the other players though...

[Red Army 75]

I wouldn't sell him for 2.5 million. If Clubs like Sunderland and derby apparently sniffing around. He must have something about him . He's a versatile athletic player. Who can and will improve. We don't want the Ayling situation we're we sell. Then it all goes tits up . Keep Bryan for sure . Or do we replace him with a left footed Adam Matthews .

[steviestevieneville]

5 hours ago, Monkeh said:

accept in the 2 seasons prior to that he was doing it,

No he wasn't , he played left wing or wing back and had cover which didn't show his weaknesses. Also in league one two years ago the players weren't good enough to exploit it either  . He hasn't got the cover at left back. He has improved slightly towards the end of the season probably down to Mcallister but he still has mayor problems with switching off mentally  

[hoxton casual]

not the finished artilcle  but I think his best years are ahead of him. great attitude and loves the club. stick.

[BRISTOL86]

3 hours ago, Thatch35 said:

 

Indeed, they obviously see him as a midfielder with his excellent crossing.

Excellent crossing? I must be thinking of a different Joe Bryan! 

[Dullmoan Tone]

I'm surprised no-one has mentioned his goal against Villa - he showed then, in flashes, what great positioning he has.

I appreciate he does miss place too many crosses and I agree he suddenly seems to have lead in his boots when jumping, but I think the right coach could yet make him another Danny Rose - if only we had the right coach...

[Pezo]

It seems to me that he feels like he has made it, a bit like Skuse was here, almost as if he is so comfortable within the club and has his position in the side that he maybe subconsciously doesn't feel like he has anything to prove. Lack of quality - many misplaced balls, lack of grit (for want of a better word) maybe passion or drive.

Never seems to be the player I come away thinking we would be in trouble if we didn't have him.

All that said I think he makes a good enough left back for a relegation potential second tier team - which is what we have been for 2 seasons now.

[Shtanley]

Lloyd Kelly coming through will essentially force him to improve

[AppyDAZE]

4 hours ago, hoxton casual said:

not the finished artilcle  but I think his best years are ahead of him. great attitude and loves the club. stick.

Great attitude?  mnn

[Garland-sweden]

Little gone, Bryan? Not good. Think we need both.

[tinman85]

On 18/05/2017 at 17:14, redcherryberry said:

I think he needs a move to kick start his career again. The odd excellent performance doesn't make up for the fact he's been poor overall in 2 Championship seasons.  Footballs all about timings, cash in now if true.  Aaron Brown springs to mind when we rejected WBA's 700k. 

Take the money for him and Flinty. Reinvest elsewhere. 

[Robbored]

On 18/05/2017 at 17:21, Major Isewater said:

I still don't think his best position is Left Back . 

He does tho.........

[Cowshed]

6 hours ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Excellent crossing? I must be thinking of a different Joe Bryan! 

It is certainly a notable part of his game. Very capable. Very good, but crossing generally is an ineffective form of creating chances. I would expect the conversion rate from Joe Bryans crosses to be more than reasonable e.g a goal every fifty plus v norms which are above sixty.  

[Phileas Fogg]

14 hours ago, shepton red said:

This is reverse snobbery. How about the lads from a less privileged background who are star struck by the excessive cash in the game who do not know how to manage it and lose their drive and appetite. This has been levelled at Rubens Liftus Cheek at Chelsea who was rated higher than Deli Ali in the England youth set up.

JB is a hugely talented player who's potential is noted by professional managers across the country but not the Football Manager 2017 players on this forum. Probably the same ones who thought that Cotteril, Murray, Albert and Bolasie were not good enough for us.

It's just a blog I read that I thought was interesting and could apply here, don't necessarily agree or disagree as I don't know the player in question personally.

I don't think many of our fans ever thought any of Murray, Adomah or Bolasie 'weren't good enough'. In Bolasie's case I think most wanted to see more of him and were disappointed when he moved. On balance, not that many of players who've departed us over the last 10 years have seemed to go on spectacularly better things. 

[TBW]

Although it would be reasonably sad to see him go, not many Bristol products in the first-team right now, I think that's where my main disappointment would lie.

He's seemed a bit comfortable for a while now and his end product can sometimes be questionable. For the right money it could be a good move for both sides and in the current market I'd expect more than 2.5m for a promising, young, English player who is starting regularly at this level.

[shepton red]

15 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said:

It's just a blog I read that I thought was interesting and could apply here, don't necessarily agree or disagree as I don't know the player in question personally.

I don't think many of our fans ever thought any of Murray, Adomah or Bolasie 'weren't good enough'. In Bolasie's case I think most wanted to see more of him and were disappointed when he moved. On balance, not that many of players who've departed us over the last 10 years have seemed to go on spectacularly better things. 

Was not personal, just that JB is undoubtedly talented and should be part of the core of players to take us forward. His socioeconomic background should not be used as a stick to beat him with.

[Phileas Fogg]

8 minutes ago, shepton red said:

Was not personal, just that JB is undoubtedly talented and should be part of the core of players to take us forward. His socioeconomic background should not be used as a stick to beat him with.

It's not a 'stick to beat him with' but *could* be a contributory factor on why his drive for the game might be less than say Gabriel Jesus coming from a slum in Sao Paolo with no other way out of poverty than football.

[Nogbad the Bad]

Whatever fee we might get for JB this Summer we could double it if he'd had a contented season playing consistently well in his preferred position.

LJ's insistence he's a left back, where his demeanour has often looked ill at ease and fractious, and where he's been inconsistent to say the least, means any clubs putting a bid in now must know that with better coaching they can create a far more valuable player in a different position.

We shouldn't accept that isn't achievable at AG.

Keep him, and do it.

[BobBobSuperBob]

19 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

It's not a 'stick to beat him with' but *could* be a contributory factor on why his drive for the game might be less than say Gabriel Jesus coming from a slum in Sao Paolo with no other way out of poverty than football.

History alone tells you where the majority of top footballers come from , in this country alone

The council,estates of Merseyside , North East and the like

Why - could be all sorts of reasons but as you say PF it's often the obbvious way to a better life

Also produces 'tough' characters

I put it even more down to those games on the streets and in the parks

[REDOXO]

8 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

Whatever fee we might get for JB this Summer we could double it if he'd had a contented season playing consistently well in his preferred position.

LJ's insistence he's a left back, where his demeanour has often looked ill at ease and fractious, and where he's been inconsistent to say the least, means any clubs putting a bid in now must know that with better coaching they can create a far more valuable player in a different position.

We shouldn't accept that isn't achievable at AG.

Keep him, and do it.

I agree with the sentiment. Unfortunately the bloke picking the side insists he is mediocre Left Back, not a decent winger/left sided midfielder with two good feet. 

If I was Bryan I would be looking at the Ayling, Freeman exit!

[Nogbad the Bad]

5 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

I agree with the sentiment. Unfortunately the bloke picking the side insists he is mediocre Left Back, not a decent winger/left sided midfielder with two good feet. 

If I was Bryan I would be looking at the Ayling, Freeman exit!

Tbf, LJ's right on that score. Very mediocre. 

Good, and valuable player, elsewhere though.

The way things are going another club will get the best out of him, and we won't get the fee he merits.

Not the way to do things.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

39 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

History alone tells you where the majority of top footballers come from , in this country alone

The council,estates of Merseyside , North East and the like

Why - could be all sorts of reasons but as you say PF it's often the obbvious way to a better life

Also produces 'tough' characters

I put it even more down to those games on the streets and in the parks

Agree. Definitely a trend. Same can be applied to boxing - so many champions come from broken homes and tough upbringings. From the UK there's a disproportionate amount of successful gypsy boxers relative to population. 

I don't know JB and it's unfair to say it definitely applies to him.. but maybe sometimes he wishes he was studying at University rather than being bollocked at half time for being 3-0 down away to Hull on a cold Tuesday night. When you've got intelligence and come from a good family like him, you've got options instead of football. 

[cidered abroad]

51 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

History alone tells you where the majority of top footballers come from , in this country alone

The council,estates of Merseyside , North East and the like

Why - could be all sorts of reasons but as you say PF it's often the obvious way to a better life

Also produces 'tough' characters

I put it even more down to those games on the streets and in the parks

A good deal of truth in this post. I remember Gerry Gow once saying that he worked so hard at becoming a professional footballer because the alternative back home in Glasgow was the dole queue. He succeeded at City where some very talented local lads only showed their true skills very intermittently and never had a hope of becoming regulars in the first team.

Many have the skills required in all sports and other walks of life but it's the grit and determination to succeed that takes anyone to the top of their chosen profession. Eric Bristow once said that there are thousands of pub darts players who can throw doubles and trebles all day long. But they cannot do it on a stage, with bright lights, TV cameras, 2 or 3,000 people screaming at them.

PS. Like previous poster this is not any sort of dig at Joe Bryan who I consider to be a very good footballer with his inconsistency highlighted by the dreadful team season we've just had.

[Davefevs]

Just been thinking back to Bryan's performances at LB this season.

Much as I don't think he anticipates situations quick enough, and sometimes dawdles, rather than committing to what he needs to do, I can't really think of a game where his opponent constantly got the better of him (maybe selective memory on my part).  So one on one I think he's sound.

Then I started to think about the way he compliments his left sided CB (mainly Hordur early season and Wright Kate season.  This is an area where I think he can improve and some of that comes from his anticipation and reading if the game.  You'll often see a top LB (or RB for that matter) intelligently covering a beaten CB.  Ayling did that well, Matthews did in 15/16.  Joe doesn't do this, which is why I've always insisted that Golbourne was good for Hordur but Joe wasn't.

So that's one plus and one development area.

Then I start to think about him with the ball....and I think this is where most of our views come from.  At times he can be great, others awful.  He can put in great crosses, but he can also hit some dreadful ones.  Trying to put pace on his crosses can lead to inconsistency.  But he always tries the same type of cross....the low fizzer.  It doesn't always need that type of cross.  Sometimes just stand it up to be attacked.  Djuric would be happy to get time to adjust a run and attack it.  So a bit mixed here.  Pluses and minuses.

Finally the angles he gives to receive the ball are bad, especially when he's not playing well.  He hides behind an opponent so he can't receive it.  This is more prevalent when he played LM....poor old SG never had a pass on.

In summary, can be good, can be bad.  

[JoeAman08]

53 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Just been thinking back to Bryan's performances at LB this season.

Much as I don't think he anticipates situations quick enough, and sometimes dawdles, rather than committing to what he needs to do, I can't really think of a game where his opponent constantly got the better of him (maybe selective memory on my part).  So one on one I think he's sound.

Then I started to think about the way he compliments his left sided CB (mainly Hordur early season and Wright Kate season.  This is an area where I think he can improve and some of that comes from his anticipation and reading if the game.  You'll often see a top LB (or RB for that matter) intelligently covering a beaten CB.  Ayling did that well, Matthews did in 15/16.  Joe doesn't do this, which is why I've always insisted that Golbourne was good for Hordur but Joe wasn't.

So that's one plus and one development area.

Then I start to think about him with the ball....and I think this is where most of our views come from.  At times he can be great, others awful.  He can put in great crosses, but he can also hit some dreadful ones.  Trying to put pace on his crosses can lead to inconsistency.  But he always tries the same type of cross....the low fizzer.  It doesn't always need that type of cross.  Sometimes just stand it up to be attacked.  Djuric would be happy to get time to adjust a run and attack it.  So a bit mixed here.  Pluses and minuses.

Finally the angles he gives to receive the ball are bad, especially when he's not playing well.  He hides behind an opponent so he can't receive it.  This is more prevalent when he played LM....poor old SG never had a pass on.

In summary, can be good, can be bad.  

This Is a good summary. My question would be, what do people expect from Joe? If he was good at all those things he wouldn't be here. That said, he attracting attention from bigger clubs despite his flaws. The argument about his best position I think is overblown as well. He's definitely not a out and out winger. I think his worst performances have been there. I think his best and most consistent performances have been in CM. At LB, he has had ups and downs but when we have possession and are on top of teams he's one of the better on the league imo. Full back is probably the toughest position in the league to play. The amount of pacy tricky wingers is unreal and real quality there. He will only get better there. 

Personally, I think he'd be our biggest loss over the past few seasons. Look at players like Freeman, Cunningham and Ayling. All have moved on and done well making us think what if? Now this could be a change of scenery that these players have kicked on but I think Joe would be better than all of those. Sell Joe and I could see him celebrating at Wembley in a years time going to the premier league and as a left back. He has his flaws but we need to persevere and make him better.