Manchester Arena Explosion (Merged)

[Northern Red]

From a mate who knows how this stuff works, though isn't involved curently:

"If a bomb maker has managed to make bombs and find ways of distributing them to suicide bombers without being caught that would be a reason to raise the level. They think a terror cell is on the loose effectively - or that the bomb used was the construction of a bomb maker."

[screech]

As this must be the work of somebody who has had specialist training, I wonder if the security intel has found a link to this guy with a person or group that were part of the returning from Syria, with fresh training of making explosives and this being a totally new strategy.

Knife crime and car ramming doesn't need any kind of planning, the security risk has been raised and I get the impression that we are on borrowed time to catch the person or people with this specialist training before the next one goes off. Hopefully they have a load of names and the whereabouts and get the off the street asap.

Edit, Northern Red beat me to it.

[BobBobSuperBob]

29 minutes ago, Northern Red said:

From a mate who knows how this stuff works, though isn't involved curently:

"If a bomb maker has managed to make bombs and find ways of distributing them to suicide bombers without being caught that would be a reason to raise the level. They think a terror cell is on the loose effectively - or that the bomb used was the construction of a bomb maker."

Forensic and bomb squad officers are studying the remains of the device recovered so far but initial indications are that the bombmaker had used a 'level of sophistication' suggesting he had received training and not made it from 'a terror recipe' on the Internet.  

One security source said: 'It is unlikely that if the device was sophisticated that the suicide bomber made it – experience shows that organisations are reluctant to 'waste' the expertise of a bombmaker in an attack, preferring to keep him or her for another attack. 

'It is therefore highly likely that this terrorist is part of a cell or had a support network and they are the priority. 

'Are there other devices, other terrorists out there and you can expect to see raids carried out in the next 48 hours linked to this.' 

Detectives are also studying the bomber's links to Syria or other jihadi hotbeds amid intelligence that he may have travelled abroad to the region. 

At least 16 convicted or dead jihadi terrorists are known to have come from a small area of Manchester and several surveillance operations on suspects from the region have been on-going.

[BobBobSuperBob]

Amongst all the sadness - What a heartwarming story

 

Another hero mother has told how she a cradled a 14-year-old victim for an hour as she desperately waited for help.

Kim Dick and husband Phil were waiting in the foyer of the Manchester Arena to pick up their granddaughter, Sasha, 15, and daughter Tamla, 17, who had been treated to tickets to the Ariana Grande concert. 

But they were blown into the air as the suicide bomber detonated his device just yards away.l

As Phil Dick desperately searched the bodies to see if the two young girls were there, Kim went to the rescue of a badly injured 14-year-old until paramedics were allowed in the building.

Mother-of-three Kim, 54, from Idle, Bradford, said: 'There was a massive blast and when we got up there was a little girl, she was 14. Her long blonde hair was shrivelled up, singed, a plastic bag had melted in her hair.

'Blood was coming out of her mouth and down her shoulder. I said the girls, the girls and Phil said he would look for Sasha and Tamla and I would look after this little girl.

'I grabbed her and she was a puppet. I was walking to her towards the door and got her through the foyer and she collapsed in her arms.

'I put her down and blood was coming out of her mouth and I thought she would have choked. Her eyes were staring up and I lifted her up and her little arms were broken. She had shrapnel in both her legs, her shoulder and her face

She lost pints and pints of blood in the time I was there. 'We made makeshift compressions to press on her wounds on her legs and shoulder. I was holding her up and talked to her, asking her name.

She asked me if she was going to be okay and I said you are, your dad is coming. Her eyes were staring ahead.' 

 

Her husband Phil managed to speak to his girls to find they were safe before returning to his wife and the 14-year-old girl.

He phoned her distraught mother and co-ordinated with her desperate father was was waiting outside the police cordon.

But for nearly an hour Kim cradled the girl as police swept the area before allowing in paramedics. 

We stopped the bleeding but I couldn't move as she screamed if I did,' she said. 

 'It took so long for help to come. I was holding her all the time crying we need help we need help. Every time i moved a little bit she screamed she was in that much pain.

'The armed police swarmed in and sit seemed to take forever to check the place. I was sat there so long and all I could see was the bodies and the blood. I saw a body in half, there was so much blood. Peoples clothes had been blown off them and people crying in agony. 

Eventually Phil and the police used the table that was selling Ariana Grande merchandise just minutes before as a makeshift stretcher. Two hours after the blast, they were reunited with their girls.

He said: 'I am absolutely convinced Kim is responsible for that little girl being here. She saved her life.' 

The 14-year-old girl's grateful family were full of praise for the couple.

In a text her sister said: 'She is in the high dependency unit and she is doing alright. She has a lot of shrapnel in her skin. 

'She has broken her arm. but currently she doesn't appear to have any life threatening injuries. We are very hopeful. She is still conscious and she hasn't stopped talking about Ariana. Thank you so much for caring my sister.'

 

 

 

Wonderful bravery and compassion from this Good Samaritan - Heartwarming

 

[pnefcok]

These things always seem a bit more shocking when they're so close to home.

Unfortunately the 8 year old who died was from Leyland just on the outskirts of Preston.

One of my most long-term friends was asked to work at this event last night, thankfully he said no/wasn't able to do it. Frightening really.

As for the threat level/operation temperer they clearly believe there's an active cell in Manchester, probably in the Fallowfield (generally a student suburb) and Whalley Range (pretty rough) areas given the raids that took place earlier today.

[Rascal]

5 hours ago, redsfan said:

Amidst all the bickering about who is a racist and what conclusions people will come to, can I just state that there surely will be a special corner of hell reserved for someone who thinks that it is acceptable to blow himself up at a concert specifically aimed at children.  

I can't find any other words.

 

 

This morning, ISIS claimed responsibility and threatened further attacks, saying 'one of the caliphate's soldiers placed bombs within a gathering of the Crusaders'

Starting to wish I wasn't going to the Cup final on Saturday

But I know that I must - I will be nervous but I will not let these scum win.

I've been feeling same for 18 months, very nervous when in large gatherings, i am pretty street wise to be fair, and tend to sense danger to a degree, for cup final last year we stayed in kings cross drinking until a hour before kick off then made our way to the ground and went straight in, to minimise the amount of time we spent in the crowds outside the stadium, think we'll be doing the same this time might even leave a little earlier as well so we don't get stuck on Wembley Way after the game. It's the tube stations that'll be targeted if anywhere, we're looking into walking to a less populated station if possible. 

Be safe 

[Northern Red]

9 minutes ago, pnefcok said:

These things always seem a bit more shocking when they're so close to home.

Unfortunately the 8 year old who died was from Leyland just on the outskirts of Preston.

One of my most long-term friends was asked to work at this event last night, thankfully he said no/wasn't able to do it. Frightening really.

As for the threat level/operation temperer they clearly believe there's an active cell in Manchester, probably in the Fallowfield (generally a student suburb) and Whalley Range (pretty rough) areas given the raids that took place earlier today.

That's exactly it, too close to home and the fact that there's kids involved makes it even worse. Think the 18 year old girl who died is from your neck of the woods as well.

If you live in the North West, chances are you've been to an event at that arena at least once in your life. My mate's 13 year old daughter was there last night with her auntie, they were both safe and unharmed but understandably shaken up. My mate said the few minutes when he and his Mrs had seen what had happened and were trying to get hold of them were the most horrendous thing they've ever experienced, can't even begin to imagine what the parents whose kids are either missing or confirmed dead are going through.

[BobBobSuperBob]

Confirmed Terror Threat now classed as

Critical   ( 'Attack Imminent' )

Sounds like they are going to deploy the army to support the police and take on some protection of locations and transport hubs 

BBC stating armed officers are sat in vehicles in London on 'standby' to respond to any attack 

 

[Offside]

What a terrible 24 hours as we have learned more about the atrocity. Absolutely heartbreaking. I can't begin to imagine what the families of those killed, missing or injured are going through. My son is 8 and the fact that a child of that age was a victim, and others not much older, fills me with horror. I just hope that those with serious injuries in hospital pull through.

[Alan Dicks]

Time for a blanket ban on islam in the uk

[BarnzFM]

The fact they've felt the need to use the army is really disturbing to me - I've never seen this happen before. From what I've read there's a few people linked to this terrorist that they can't find hence the threat level. 

[Guest]

Factor in the sporting events we have next week or so and it gets very worrying - FA cup final, Rugby play off final and small matter of the European Cup Final Saturday week in Cardiff.

Stay safe people. 

[daored]

I think the worrying aspect of this , is that he was on the security watch list but deemed to be low risk.

The problem as I see it, is there are so many British people gone to Syria and such like its impossible to keep check in them all. Plus they recruit new people, a security nightmare.

I have no idea how this will be conclude.

RIP to the victims and just goes to show what brain dead individuals we're dealing with, who attack a venue full of young children 

[The Coach]

16 minutes ago, daored said:

I think the worrying aspect of this , is that he was on the security watch list but deemed to be low risk.

The problem as I see it, is there are so many British people gone to Syria and such like its impossible to keep check in them all. Plus they recruit new people, a security nightmare.

I have no idea how this will be conclude.

RIP to the victims and just goes to show what brain dead individuals we're dealing with, who attack a venue full of young children 

 

I couldn't give a flying **** if you're high risk or low risk. Any risk at all, either have a short drop and a sudden stop, or ship them back to Syria, and don't let them back in. How much longer are we going to follow the same broken protocol before more people are killed? We weep, we remember, COBRA meeting, raise terror levels, repeat. No action is ever f****** took to do anything about the situation, and Islamist groups like ISIS are laughing at us. I've woken up again today very emotional. How many more men, women, and children have to be murdered in this country until we actually take action against Islam?

You can't paint everyone with the same brush.. bla bla... I do not care anymore, if a group of people ruin it, they ruin it for everyone else. 

[Red Army 75]

Enough is enough. Our government has to act now . Deport these ***** . Lock um up . Anyone associated with them . I'm so angry about this . Soldiers on our streets for **** sake. They got to syria lybia. All these countries and we let them back in . They march through Luton preaching there shit . This can't continue. And if this upsets people tough shit 

[phantom]

3 hours ago, BarnzFM said:

The fact they've felt the need to use the army is really disturbing to me - I've never seen this happen before.

It has been used before, hate to say the affect it has had on you is exactly what they want

[phantom]

Just now, Big Brother said:

Some interesting points made in this article particularly about members of that community having at least an inkling about who are the bad guys and doing nothing, and the collective shrug of the shoulders after events like this.  

Sadly been seen before, Catholic church covering up paedophiles, Grooming gangs and this - there is a pattern of people not wanting to speak out

[Super]

1 hour ago, Red Army 75 said:

Enough is enough. Our government has to act now . Deport these ***** . Lock um up . Anyone associated with them . I'm so angry about this . Soldiers on our streets for **** sake. They got to syria lybia. All these countries and we let them back in . They march through Luton preaching there shit . This can't continue. And if this upsets people tough shit 

Absolutely. I'm sick of hearing the another one slipped through the net quote. This piece of filth was in and out of Libya apparently and is allowed just to wander back in whenever he wanted.

[Mr Popodopolous]

16 hours ago, Big Brother said:

If I may ... you're missing the point.

Let me ask you (and you don't have to answer - I'm not aiming this at you or anyone, but it's something to think about) ...

How much Islam inspired terrorism would it take for you to say "Enough.  Enough of Islam in the UK"?

- A bomb in a football stadium?  

- A Bataclan in the UK?

- A dirty bomb in London / Birmingham / Wherever ?  

- Assassination of the PM?  

- More industrial scale rapes of English girls?

For me 'enough' was reached back in 2005.  

I think Islam should be removed from our society (people are free to do what they want in their own homes obviously).  As far as I can see this religion causes trouble wherever it goes. They have even spent centuries butchering each other.  And before anyone reading this thinks "The Crusades" ... Islam has not stopped, not reformed, not joined the bloody 19th century, let alone the 21st.

More is coming.  ISIS have promised this and they tend to deliver.

I'll leave you with one personal thought:

One innocent English life is worth more than the entire religion of Islam.

 

 

 

 

I didn't talk about this yesterday out of respect for the victims- felt it was too soon.

You raise interesting points and I do wonder what will happen in the future. However is some of this a bit one sided in some ways?

Three points some of which arguably feed into how this whole mess began to really grow:-

• Do you think Iraq had no impact on the terror risk? Would not surprise me if it radicalised lots of people...a great many civilians over there died and that will cause severe issues of radicalisation won't it.
• I lean towards agreement on Islam per'se. Not in 19th Century never mind 21st...yeah had no Enlightenment which is a major part of the problem arguably- especially for those who twist it for their own ends such as the bastard in Manchester.
• Israel-Palestine problem...intractable. Yet I have a feeling that a genuine 2 state solution there would pop the balloon of many would be jihadists. 
• We now know he's been and gone to Libya...would it have happened with Gadaffi in place? I doubt it- as Gadaffi in place wouldn't have seen a country go to shit and see terrorists help fill a void, seduce people etc.

Any thoughts on these? I am not saying that all terrorism is caused by this especially 1 and 3, but it is far from helpful is it? The Libya connection was notable in point 4 as well.

[glynriley]

35 minutes ago, Super said:

Absolutely. I'm sick of hearing the another one slipped through the net quote. This piece of filth was in and out of Libya apparently and is allowed just to wander back in whenever he wanted.

As someone said above, it's high time we stopped letting these people back in to the country.

And turn that watch list into a hit list.

 

[phantom]

2 minutes ago, Big Brother said:

Sorry that I am quoting the Sun, it came-up in a feed  and maybe it's bullshit but ...

 

PANIC IN BRUM Cops swoop on man ‘armed with axe and stick’ during Birmingham vigil for Manchester victims
The 39-year-old man could be heard screaming and shouting as he was handcuffed by officers
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3634047/cops-swoop-birmingham-manchester-attack/

Was shown on Sky news last night

[IAmNick]

Interesting picture of the guy is coming out: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/may/23/manchester-arena-attacker-named-salman-abedi-suicide-attack-ariana-grande

Some describe him as quiet etc. but others aren't so sure. A couple of bits stood out to me - and I have to wonder why he wasn't confronted or people weren't made aware if some of the things in that article are true?

It mentions a senior figure at his mosque gave a sermon strongly criticising ISIS etc. and that while the majority agreed a few (this guy included) didn't like what he he said - so why was this not reported previously?

[Northern Red]

16 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

Interesting picture of the guy is coming out: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/may/23/manchester-arena-attacker-named-salman-abedi-suicide-attack-ariana-grande

Some describe him as quiet etc. but others aren't so sure. A couple of bits stood out to me - and I have to wonder why he wasn't confronted or people weren't made aware if some of the things in that article are true?

It mentions a senior figure at his mosque gave a sermon strongly criticising ISIS etc. and that while the majority agreed a few (this guy included) didn't like what he he said - so why was this not reported previously?

It mentions a petition against the cleric who condemned ISIS. I'd hope that every single person who signed that petition is now on the terror watch list.

[Northern Red]

30 minutes ago, Big Brother said:

Sorry that I am quoting the Sun, it came-up in a feed  and maybe it's bullshit but ...

 

PANIC IN BRUM Cops swoop on man ‘armed with axe and stick’ during Birmingham vigil for Manchester victims
The 39-year-old man could be heard screaming and shouting as he was handcuffed by officers
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3634047/cops-swoop-birmingham-manchester-attack/

It's true, the BBC were reporting last night that the WMP said the bloke was known to them and has mental health issues. 

[BobBobSuperBob]

33 minutes ago, glynriley said:

As someone said above, it's high time we stopped letting these people back in to the country.

And turn that watch list into a hit list.

 

Problem being Glyn , asa UK Citizen we cannot refuse him entry back to the UK

Your second sentence is an option and one I've suggested on here (Once there is sufficient evidence / indicators that he is a 'threat' in violence terms)

[glynriley]

Just now, BobBobSuperBob said:

Problem being Glyn , asa UK Citizen we cannot refuse him entry back to the UK

Your second sentence is an option and one I've suggested on here (Once there is sufficient evidence / indicators that he is a 'threat' in violence terms)

Then it's about time we did something about it. Pass a law that says ANY UK citizen traveling to Syria, Libya, Afghanistan etc.(especially ones on the 'watch list'). without a good reason (business etc..) has their passport revoked, because lets be fair, unless you work for the government or BP you ain't going to these places for a holiday!!

 

 

[BobBobSuperBob]

7 minutes ago, glynriley said:

Then it's about time we did something about it. Pass a law that says ANY UK citizen traveling to Syria, Libya, Afghanistan etc.(especially ones on the 'watch list'). without a good reason (business etc..) has their passport revoked, because lets be fair, unless you work for the government or BP you ain't going to these places for a holiday!!

 

 

Ohhh I'm totally with you

but will never happen - International Law and numerous , impossible (Legal) obstacles to overcome even if we had the will to

[The Gasbuster]

13 minutes ago, glynriley said:

Then it's about time we did something about it. Pass a law that says ANY UK citizen traveling to Syria, Libya, Afghanistan etc.(especially ones on the 'watch list'). without a good reason (business etc..) has their passport revoked, because lets be fair, unless you work for the government or BP you ain't going to these places for a holiday!!

 

 

100% with you on this, mate.

What I don't understand is how they got back here in the first place.

From what I understand is that when these wanchors arrive in Syria, one of the first thing they do is to destroy their passport, and assume a new identity.

Are the false passports they must be using to get back here really that good ?

[Tipps69]

Having heard the shocking results of this attack, even the people currently in hospital sound like they're going to live with a life sentence of this horror!!

It's time we stopped 'mamby pambying' about & worrying about 'human rights', what 'human rights' are they allowing our children, women & men? No longer is it safe to take yourself or your family out to enjoy some entertainment without being in fear & that's not what this great country is about!! We should be able to go about our daily business without fear & now we can't!!

Stop 'mamby pambying' about, if we have intelligence on more of these 'scum bags', round them up & send them to Syria / Libya / Iraq / Afghanistan & let them enjoy the free life they clearly crave, stop allowing these 'scum bags' back into the country once they have left!!

Find another Guantanamo Bay & let them fizzle out in their own little version of Butlins!!

It's time to stop worrying about their 'human rights', they rave on about how they hate the western world, well it's time they f**ked off out of the western world, let them enjoy the life they crave & blow each other up!!

This 'scum bag' may have been born here but his parents were allowed to enjoy our lifestyle because they couldn't handle life in their home land & this is how we've been repaid?!? Well **** off back where life was so unpleasant because I no longer want to live in a country / world where I have to live in fear while I aim to enjoy my life!!

For all these 'scum bags' that are out there, let's stop waiting for them to do something before we attempt to stop them, if they are known as any sort of risk, round them up & stop them before it's too late (again)!!

One life lost is one life too many, irrelevant of who or what that person does in our great country!!

If this religion are uncomfortable with this, tough shit!! Your people have incited hate & encouraged the maiming & killing of westerners for too long, go & find somewhere else that is willing to put up with your beliefs because I've had enough of it & don't want you in my country anymore!!

And before anyone starts, I'm not racist but human nature means that I will look at all muslims with an eye on them that fears that they are about to carry out another attack on my country & I will defend my country & myself, whatever it takes!!

[BobBobSuperBob]

5 minutes ago, Tipps69 said:

Having heard the shocking results of this attack, even the people currently in hospital sound like they're going to live with a life sentence of this horror!!

It's time we stopped 'mamby pambying' about & worrying about 'human rights', what 'human rights' are they allowing our children, women & men? No longer is it safe to take yourself or your family out to enjoy some entertainment without being in fear & that's not what this great country is about!! We should be able to go about our daily business without fear & now we can't!!

Stop 'mamby pambying' about, if we have intelligence on more of these 'scum bags', round them up & send them to Syria / Libya / Iraq / Afghanistan & let them enjoy the free life they clearly crave, stop allowing these 'scum bags' back into the country once they have left!!

Find another Guantanamo Bay & let them fizzle out in their own little version of Butlins!!

It's time to stop worrying about their 'human rights', they rave on about how they hate the western world, well it's time they f**ked off out of the western world, let them enjoy the life they crave & blow each other up!!

This 'scum bag' may have been born here but his parents were allowed to enjoy our lifestyle because they couldn't handle life in their home land & this is how we've been repaid?!? Well **** off back where life was so unpleasant because I no longer want to live in a country / world where I have to live in fear while I aim to enjoy my life!!

For all these 'scum bags' that are out there, let's stop waiting for them to do something before we attempt to stop them, if they are known as any sort of risk, round them up & stop them before it's too late (again)!!

One life lost is one life too many, irrelevant of who or what that person does in our great country!!

If this religion are uncomfortable with this, tough shit!! Your people have incited hate & encouraged the maiming & killing of westerners for too long, go & find somewhere else that is willing to put up with your beliefs because I've had enough of it & don't want you in my country anymore!!

And before anyone starts, I'm not racist but human nature means that I will look at all muslims with an eye on them that fears that they are about to carry out another attack on my country & I will defend my country & myself, whatever it takes!!

And where are those parents now  - back in Libya , with father reported as having returned to get involved in the fighting there, and have been for some time ,

leaving that piece of s**t behind

Noticeably they have enough money to all travel to and fro though

Agree with you Tipps - Too many limp waisted apologists in this country