Londonisation of Bristol?

[Mr Popodopolous]

Little bugbear of mine. Basically we seem to be becoming a mini London.

Take few examples. 

• One mate who I know who lives in and around London, I took to Bristol nearly 4 years ago now compared it to London- favourably, but London nonetheless.
• Booming house prices- good and bad! Booming rents too (probably not a good thing)
• Rapid expansion in population.
• Food outlets- more varied than ever, absolutely a positive IMO. Costlier than before? Not so good.

Overall though I reckon it has more negatives than positives. Not knocking either city- love Bristol my home, and London obviously great to visit...whether I would wanna live there though,  I dunno.

And then- and yes people are free to support who they like, but I was mildly surprised to hear Arsenal chanting earlier this evening and indeed an anti Conte song from said same Arsenal fans. Mini London indeed.  That aside, we do to me seem to be becoming like a mini London- with the challenges it brings, but not necessarily the benefits. Dunno what to make of it tbh.

What do others think?

[WTFiGO!?!]

Think we're the best city in the country.

I'd rather London be regarded as a 'Big Bristol' if anything.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Yeah in a way- would be nice, but direction of travel seems to be heading in one way only.

[Maesknoll Red]

If only we had an underground, makes getting round London so easy.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Yup. Dunno how geography would fit with an underground here though i.e. loads of hills!

In general though I do wonder- and is not a conspiracy theory just one of those things-if we get the negatives of London living here coming here but not all that many positives!

[Reigate Red]

I work in South London and amongst the younger staff there is positive interest in Bristol as a place to move to. I had one grad come up to me recently having spent the weekend there and say "why did you ever move away"!  I am also responsible for recruitment for my team and our Bristol office is usually top preference for location.

Not having lived in Bristol for a long time I cannot say for sure but when I return it does seem different - fewer "real" Bristolians about.  Our team in the Bristol office (about 10 staff) doesn't have a Bristolian amongst them. Can't help but feel the Colston Hall naming shenanigans is in part a reflection of the greater impact "incomers" are having. Cue joke about it being a "local city for local people"

[exAtyeoMax]

I live in London and always compare Bristol (to anyone asking what it is like) to London. I say it's got a lot going on, a similar vibe, the people are nice and friendly but it's obviously a lot smaller. And that Bristol doesn't really have public transport…

[exAtyeoMax]

On 28/05/2017 at 02:05, Mr Popodopolous said:

Little bugbear of mine. Basically we seem to be becoming a mini London.

Take few examples. 

• One mate who I know who lives in and around London, I took to Bristol nearly 4 years ago now compared it to London- favourably, but London nonetheless.
• Booming house prices- good and bad! Booming rents too (probably not a good thing)
• Rapid expansion in population.
• Food outlets- more varied than ever, absolutely a positive IMO. Costlier than before? Not so good.

Overall though I reckon it has more negatives than positives. Not knocking either city- love Bristol my home, and London obviously great to visit...whether I would wanna live there though,  I dunno.

And then- and yes people are free to support who they like, but I was mildly surprised to hear Arsenal chanting earlier this evening and indeed an anti Conte song from said same Arsenal fans. Mini London indeed.  That aside, we do to me seem to be becoming like a mini London- with the challenges it brings, but not necessarily the benefits. Dunno what to make of it tbh.

What do others think?

London does have some fabulous low-cost greasy spoons, if you know where to look. I live in Tufnell Park, quite near The Emirates and the area is mixed, I think of it a bit like Bedminster (Bedminster Parade, East St, then moving on to North St). Lots of different kinds of people getting on with their lives. In that way, I think London is similar to Bristol.

 

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

@exAtyeoMax I don't doubt that about greasy spoons- has some excellent, not too pricy pubs too, but depends where you go. (thinking outer London, Dartford places like that). Bethnal and areas like that also Decent comparison of the two also!

@Reigate Red you are not wrong. Seems a big hub for incoming Londoners for sure, Brighton is another big one.  Definitely it has a lot of upsides and indeed similarities. Quite true- similar to my main job- well is a grey area, is South Gloucestershire Bristol or not for example? Have a few of them, office of about 80-100. Depends where you are, to me real Bristol is away from the centre, or as I like to call it the open air university campus  but seriously South of river real Bristol to me, up parts of Gloucester Road too. Centre, Clifton and such surrounding areas...not especially now.

 

 

[...]

On 2017-5-28 at 02:05, Mr Popodopolous said:

Little bugbear of mine. Basically we seem to be becoming a mini London.

Take few examples. 

• One mate who I know who lives in and around London, I took to Bristol nearly 4 years ago now compared it to London- favourably, but London nonetheless.
• Booming house prices- good and bad! Booming rents too (probably not a good thing)
• Rapid expansion in population.
• Food outlets- more varied than ever, absolutely a positive IMO. Costlier than before? Not so good.

Overall though I reckon it has more negatives than positives. Not knocking either city- love Bristol my home, and London obviously great to visit...whether I would wanna live there though,  I dunno.

And then- and yes people are free to support who they like, but I was mildly surprised to hear Arsenal chanting earlier this evening and indeed an anti Conte song from said same Arsenal fans. Mini London indeed.  That aside, we do to me seem to be becoming like a mini London- with the challenges it brings, but not necessarily the benefits. Dunno what to make of it tbh.

What do others think?

Are you saying Cockneys are WORSE than Bristolian's??

Steady pal.

 

tfj

[Mr Popodopolous]

No no no no no.

I think both are excellent cities and fine people. Just wondered if anyone else thinks is becoming a mini London in some ways.

[exAtyeoMax]

Just now, Mr Popodopolous said:

@exAtyeoMax I don't doubt that about greasy spoons- has some excellent, not too pricy pubs too, but depends where you go. (thinking outer London, Dartford places like that). Bethnal and areas like that also Decent comparison of the two also!

@Reigate Red you are not wrong. Seems a big hub for incoming Londoners for sure, Brighton is another big one.  Definitely it has a lot of upsides and indeed similarities. Quite true- similar to my main job- well is a grey area, is South Gloucestershire Bristol or not for example? Have a few of them, office of about 80-100. Depends where you are, to me real Bristol is away from the centre, or as I like to call it the open air university campus  but seriously South of river real Bristol to me, up parts of Gloucester Road too. Centre, Clifton and such surrounding areas...not especially now.

 

 

I think in any suburb of London you will find both…Hackney, Notting Hill Gate, Vauxhall, Holloway, Archway, Highgate, Hampstead… not everyone is well off by any means.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, exAtyeoMax said:

I think in any suburb of London you will find both…Hackney, Notting Hill Gate, Vauxhall, Holloway, Archway, Highgate, Hampstead… not everyone is well off by any means.

Oh yeah I am sure, but Bethnal, do like there. New Cross has some positivity, Greenwich too but gentrification seems to be coming in there.

[...]

3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

No no no no no.

I think both are excellent cities and fine people. Just wondered if anyone else thinks is becoming a mini London in some ways.

Cockneys and Bristolian's are fine people, are they?

You sure about this?

 

tfj

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, Taxi for Johnson said:

Cockneys and Bristolian's are fine people, are they?

You sure about this?

 

tfj

Oh yeah.

I suppose by Londonisation what I was getting at was it is becoming really rather pricy- like London of say 10, 15 years ago. That's for housing and generally pubs are increasingly also, round the centre, Clifton places like this.

[Reigate Red]

3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Oh yeah I am sure, but Bethnal, do like there. New Cross has some positivity, Greenwich too but gentrification seems to be coming in there.

Believe it or not even Croydon is moving upmarket - it even has a tram you know

[...]

Just now, Mr Popodopolous said:

Oh yeah.

I suppose by Londonisation what I was getting at was it is becoming really rather pricy- like London of say 10, 15 years ago. That's for housing and generally pubs are increasingly also, round the centre, Clifton places like this.

£850,000 for a two bed garden flat?

Is that REALLY too much to pay??

 

tfj

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, Reigate Red said:

Believe it or not even Croydon is moving upmarket - it even has a tram you know

Yes I knew a few people from Croydon...heard about that tram :laugh:.

[SARJ]

On 5/28/2017 at 02:05, Mr Popodopolous said:

Little bugbear of mine. Basically we seem to be becoming a mini London.

Take few examples. 

• One mate who I know who lives in and around London, I took to Bristol nearly 4 years ago now compared it to London- favourably, but London nonetheless.
• Booming house prices- good and bad! Booming rents too (probably not a good thing)
• Rapid expansion in population.
• Food outlets- more varied than ever, absolutely a positive IMO. Costlier than before? Not so good.

Overall though I reckon it has more negatives than positives. Not knocking either city- love Bristol my home, and London obviously great to visit...whether I would wanna live there though,  I dunno.

And then- and yes people are free to support who they like, but I was mildly surprised to hear Arsenal chanting earlier this evening and indeed an anti Conte song from said same Arsenal fans. Mini London indeed.  That aside, we do to me seem to be becoming like a mini London- with the challenges it brings, but not necessarily the benefits. Dunno what to make of it tbh.

What do others think?

I was born and raised in Ashton, now live on North Street BS3, one of the areas massively affected by internal migration from other UK cities, namely London. This brings with it good and bad points.

Bad:

- House prices are now astronomical as these people make 2 bed terraces with no parking or garden a £300k purchase nowadays. These means people born and bred on these streets now struggle to afford a decent family house. I had to settle for a flat as I will never be able to buy a house as much as it kills me to say it.

- Alike myself, if you want a house, many Bristolians are looking further afield. Go to Spytty (South Wales), Newport or Chepstow on a weekend and you'll hear lots of Bristolian accents; our own people are being priced out, forced to live elsewhere. A brand new 4 bed with double garage in Spytty would cost you approx £200k. Compare that to a 2 bed terrace with 1 bathroom, no parking, no garden etc on Hebron road at £300k. No wonder why Bristolians are leaving.

- Pretentiousness: I've heard people mocking the Bristolian accent and people. Also certain local pubs as being vulgar, namely the Masonic, despite it being here years before any of these people turned up. Places which are clearly Bedminster are now being classed as 'Southville' or 'Lower Clifton'. Makes my blood boil.

- Hipsters: literally crawling everywhere with their John Lennon glasses, baggy buddha trousers, chequered shirts, beards, bobble hats and top knots. Vile. Why a grown man would want to look like that I do not know. Not the Bemmy I grew up in.

- Kids: nothing against small children or families, but these London people types tend to pack the pubs and let their kids run riot 'off the leash'. Try going for Sunday Lunch at the Steam Crane. It more resembles Planet Kids soft play centre, not a restaurant. ****ing annoying. If I messed around like that as a kid I'd have gotten a firm clip round the ear.

 

Good:

- For those looking to sell, your house is now worth quadruple than what the bricks and mortar are actually worth. So if you're looking to go elsewhere, take advantage and rip people off, because the yuppies will happily part with their cash.

-For someone like me, with a flat, if I decided to up sticks and move in a few years, I could charge astronomical rent and make a killing. People queuing up around the block to rent a tiny 1 bed flat for over £950 a month not including bills. Ker ching. Pay off my mortgage and some. And would I feel guilty? Hell no, because Mummy and Daddy bankroll these people, along with the big city salaries they demand.

- Area has been massively regenerated. Whether you agree with all the craft pubs and trendy eateries or not, certainly better having them here than the run down or vacant shop fronts that used to adorn North Street

- Safer: North Street/Bemmy always used to be a bit rough and ready/nawty back in the day. No longer like that (excep East Street obviously) which is a good thing.

[Erithacus]

Londonisation? It depends which aspect you want to look at - and there are many.

If you compare size, population, financial or the socioeconomics then there are more similarities than differences. This is partly due to the inevitable forces impacting on any expanding city. The more noticeable points are usually made when it comes to the differences. Yes, as an old duffer who has grown up (allegedly!) in South Bristol since the sixties, I notice the changes. They are obvious in areas which are easily quantifiable (as above). But the real changes - people, attitudes, outlooks and such - weigh heavier; as a city I can see that inexorable process at work now I am getting on a bit. Accent is a good example: the multi-cultural influences and our massively intrusive world of communications is reshaping our sound, everywhere. Cultural change is like a glacier: you can't see it move but it shifts almost everything given time.

I cannot imagine some things we have today occurring in my youth: naked bike ride? Would never have made it out the pub. Sexuality issues? Would have kept your mouth shut. People blowing weed in the centre in broad daylight? Unthinkable. These are indicators that the world does not stop spinning, just your view.

I only visit London on odd occasions so I can't make direct comparisons with Bristol, but the impressions I have made strike me that I would never be able to live in the Capital. Bristol sometimes makes me happy, sometimes enraged, sometimes amazed, sometimes lost for words. But it's home and will remain so if I have any say in it.

[CyderInACan]

People can still "work" in London but live in Bristol. Huge advances in broadband and workspace flexibility have made it easy to sell up in London for £500k, move to BS3 for £400k, trouser a big wedge of cash and only visit the London office once or twice a month. Who wouldn't prefer that! Of course it creates its own house-price bubble as a result and that's not a great thing, but Bristol is a great place to live - SOTR though!

[exAtyeoMax]

15 hours ago, SARJ said:

- Pretentiousness: I've heard people mocking the Bristolian accent and people. Also certain local pubs as being vulgar, namely the Masonic, despite it being here years before any of these people turned up. Places which are clearly Bedminster are now being classed as 'Southville' or 'Lower Clifton'. Makes my blood boil.

Yes, there was a leaflet for new students at UWE mocking the Bristolian accent. I wasn't happy with that! How rude!  (Even the Masonic has been gentrified with its new sign!)

 

15 hours ago, SARJ said:

- Hipsters: literally crawling everywhere with their John Lennon glasses, baggy buddha trousers, chequered shirts, beards, bobble hats and top knots. Vile. Why a grown man would want to look like that I do not know. Not the Bemmy I grew up in.

Funny, I haven't seen an actual living hipster since I've been in London. Perhaps they're in hiding…

[Mr Popodopolous]

@SARJ I certainly agree with all of that. Certainly seems the case to me whenever I am down in South Bristol- a good balanced summary there IMO. Especially hate the pretentiousness- South Bristol is real Bristol to me.

@Erithacus I agree, many of the processes are same in large and even medium large cities.

@CyderInACan Yep, this house price bubble shows no sign of abating...but then it is a great place to live! That is exactly what happens here though and that sell up is probably for a flat or a small property- £400k=big property.

@exAtyeoMax Shoreditch...that is a hipster area for sure! You will see them there no doubt! (Sadly also a gentrifying, pricing up area). Masonic gentrified? I only go there every so often so that's a bit annoying if so but so long as a signon the outside and not much more!  

 

 

[SARJ]

3 hours ago, exAtyeoMax said:

Yes, there was a leaflet for new students at UWE mocking the Bristolian accent. I wasn't happy with that! How rude!  (Even the Masonic has been gentrified with its new sign!)

 

Funny, I haven't seen an actual living hipster since I've been in London. Perhaps they're in hiding…

That's because all the hipsters have moved here mate!!! Bloody everywhere.

[Star of a gunner]

On 31 May 2017 at 02:39, SARJ said:

That's because all the hipsters have moved here mate!!! Bloody everywhere.

is hipster another name for scruffy old tramp ?

[Lanterne Rouge]

2 minutes ago, Star of a gunner said:

is hipster another name for scruffy old tramp ?

No, no, no. A tramp gets his scruffy old ripped trousers from the bins round the back of a charity shop and a hipster pays £400 for his distressed retro pantaloons from a pop up gentleman`s outfitters in Stokes Croft.

Do keep up.

[exAtyeoMax]

I went to Camden Market yesterday, haven't been there for years. It was pretty grim. I have noticed that house prices in London don't necessarily reflect the area. Houses in N7 cost around £650,000 to £2,000,000 but the area around is quite ropey. There's lots of empty or rundown shops, empty boarded-up pubs and large properties ripe for development (not being developed). I guess there is a 'ceiling' where any rise to the current cost of housing, will be detrimental to the area.

[JamesBCFC]

Am I the only one who doesnt particularly like London then?

 

As for the accent thing, at university I was called posh by 2 of the girls in the flat above mine based on my accent. I had spent my entire life living in Bristol or the outlying South Glos area (Alveston and Easter Compton and Thornbury as the outermost points) and am from a very much working class background- the girls had been to private schools, I went to Speedwell and Kingsfield!

Edit- my accent was later clarified as "posh farmer" which seems a contradiction to me!

[WTFiGO!?!]

16 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

Am I the only one who doesnt particularly like London then?

 

As for the accent thing, at university I was called posh by 2 of the girls in the flat above mine based on my accent. I had spent my entire life living in Bristol or the outlying South Glos area (Alveston and Easter Compton and Thornbury as the outermost points) and am from a very much working class background- the girls had been to private schools, I went to Speedwell and Kingsfield!

Edit- my accent was later clarified as "posh farmer" which seems a contradiction to me!

No, not alone.  I find the place too 'in your face' and Londoners' mannerism aggressive and rude.  I  do find them to be socialable though, with big hearts generally.  Just rather abrasive in manner.

As for accent: I've been lovingly mocked outside of Bristol for my West Country twang but been considered posh within Bristol.  

I have quite an adaptive accent, I think.  I can speak either rather really properly if required in one situation and gert proper farmer like in another.   

It seems an involuntary response!

I'm very proud to be Bristolian, though!  I love my city of birth more than I do my country and especially more than I do my species.

[JamesBCFC]

5 minutes ago, WTFiGO!?! said:

No, not alone.  I find the place too 'in your face' and Londoners' mannerism aggressive and rude.  I  do find them to be socialable though, with big hearts generally.  Just rather abrasive in manner.

As for accent: I've been lovingly mocked outside of Bristol for my West Country twang but been considered posh within Bristol.  

I have quite an adaptive accent, I think.  I can speak either rather really properly if required in one situation and gert proper farmer like in another.   

It seems an involuntary response!

I'm very proud to be Bristolian, though!  I love my city of birth more than I do my country and especially more than I do my species.

I dont think I am particularly adaptive with my accent, but there are certain words or phrases that emphasise it.

I also remember my Dad telling me to "talk properly" when I was younger and saying "I" came out as more of an "Oi" sound.

Completely agree with your final paragraph, and while not Bristol, one weekend I got an instant reminder of being in the South West. I was at University in Wales at the time, but went to Bath to visit a mate. As soon as I stepped outside the station I could hear The Wurzels being blasted out a car- someone was just driving around the block with music at full volume and the windows down. Couldn't help but chuckle to myself.

Out of the places I have been Bristol is definitely my favourite though, with Scarborough of all places in second!