Thatwasclose Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Firstly let me state that I believe all women should be able to play whatever sport they like including football or any other male dominated sport. i have two daughters and a wife so I write this with a view that they would never be upset with the way this is articulated. Here is a suggestion to grown the game that doesn't involve bashing men who don't care for it: I think women's football would be as big as men's football if as many women supported it I.e similar numbers to men who support men's football this is not to say men shouldn't support women's football (as there are millions of female fans who love the men's game) but simply pointing out that maybe women's football needs to make a better effort getting more women to support rather than despairing that existing male fans don't care much for their sport. I only say this because there seems to be a tone / a narrative from all women's football officials/players/journos that almost wants to claim they deserve same number of audience as the men's game and money etc..... but surely if more women went to support their game and they filled stadiums then TV companies would also want their matches live, they would sell more merch etc. Of all articles demanding more respect to the game I never see much around women supporting other women playing the game and that's curious. lastly a more controversial view perhaps - a humble suggestion that maybe the pitch and goal sizes for women's football (and even men at younger age groups) should be smaller because physically most are not as strong as men and yet they have to play under same conditions - a smaller pitch would mean better games in my view with more focus on technique. if women's tennis is only best of 3 compared to men best of 5 why can't the women's game be adapted so that it becomes a better spectacle and also produces better skilled players? I am not suggesting there are no restrictions due to lack of opportunities and facilities for females etc but I think the above would go a long way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidercity1987 Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 They want equality (same with the ladies of Wimbledon). Stick them in the mens league and see how much they can earn in the 10th division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolcitysweden Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Women prefer to stay fit and train themselves. Not like men getting fat and watch fit men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolcitysweden Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 lastly a more controversial view perhaps - a humble suggestion that maybe the pitch and goal sizes for women's football (and even men at younger age groups) should be smaller because physically most are not as strong as men and yet they have to play under same conditions - a smaller pitch would mean better games in my view with more focus on technique. Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Maesknoll Red Posted July 31, 2017 Admin Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Some interesting points, but I have no interest in women's football (or cricket) I only have so much spare time and I'll spend that on watching the men's game, maybe others feel that way and even though it's being heavily promoted, to achieve high support levels women's sport will have to take time and money from other sports, which if they do, well done to them, but I think they'll have a battle on their hands to compete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob k Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 12 minutes ago, Thatwasclose said: Firstly let me state that I believe all women should be able to play whatever sport they like including football or any other male dominated sport. i have two daughters and a wife so I write this with a view that they would never be upset with the way this is articulated. Here is a suggestion to grown the game that doesn't involve bashing men who don't care for it: I think women's football would be as big as men's football if as many women supported it I.e similar numbers to men who support men's football this is not to say men shouldn't support women's football (as there are millions of female fans who love the men's game) but simply pointing out that maybe women's football needs to make a better effort getting more women to support rather than despairing that existing male fans don't care much for their sport. I only say this because there seems to be a tone / a narrative from all women's football officials/players/journos that almost wants to claim they deserve same number of audience as the men's game and money etc..... but surely if more women went to support their game and they filled stadiums then TV companies would also want their matches live, they would sell more merch etc. Of all articles demanding more respect to the game I never see much around women supporting other women playing the game and that's curious. lastly a more controversial view perhaps - a humble suggestion that maybe the pitch and goal sizes for women's football (and even men at younger age groups) should be smaller because physically most are not as strong as men and yet they have to play under same conditions - a smaller pitch would mean better games in my view with more focus on technique. if women's tennis is only best of 3 compared to men best of 5 why can't the women's game be adapted so that it becomes a better spectacle and also produces better skilled players? I am not suggesting there are no restrictions due to lack of opportunities and facilities for females etc but I think the above would go a long way! I've never understood why the women play in the same size goals as men, it makes no sense and gives people something to laugh at which is unfair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolcitysweden Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 I said it on another thread but when it comes to handball women are as skilled as men if not better and the game far more enjoyable to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolcitysweden Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 As long as they can't bring a GPS on the pitch and intrigeration not quite comes to it's right I see a problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowshed Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 26 minutes ago, Thatwasclose said: lastly a more controversial view perhaps - a humble suggestion that maybe the pitch and goal sizes for women's football (and even men at younger age groups) should be smaller because physically most are not as strong as men and yet they have to play under same conditions - a smaller pitch would mean better games in my view with more focus on technique. There are already differing pitch and goal sizes for male and female football from u7's to under 18's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 22 minutes ago, Thatwasclose said: Firstly let me state that I believe all women should be able to play whatever sport they like including football or any other male dominated sport. i have two daughters and a wife so I write this with a view that they would never be upset with the way this is articulated. Here is a suggestion to grown the game that doesn't involve bashing men who don't care for it: I think women's football would be as big as men's football if as many women supported it I.e similar numbers to men who support men's football this is not to say men shouldn't support women's football (as there are millions of female fans who love the men's game) but simply pointing out that maybe women's football needs to make a better effort getting more women to support rather than despairing that existing male fans don't care much for their sport. I only say this because there seems to be a tone / a narrative from all women's football officials/players/journos that almost wants to claim they deserve same number of audience as the men's game and money etc..... but surely if more women went to support their game and they filled stadiums then TV companies would also want their matches live, they would sell more merch etc. Of all articles demanding more respect to the game I never see much around women supporting other women playing the game and that's curious. lastly a more controversial view perhaps - a humble suggestion that maybe the pitch and goal sizes for women's football (and even men at younger age groups) should be smaller because physically most are not as strong as men and yet they have to play under same conditions - a smaller pitch would mean better games in my view with more focus on technique. if women's tennis is only best of 3 compared to men best of 5 why can't the women's game be adapted so that it becomes a better spectacle and also produces better skilled players? I am not suggesting there are no restrictions due to lack of opportunities and facilities for females etc but I think the above would go a long way! Some interesting points. Perhaps the pitch and goal should be smaller…don't know. Re-watching and supporting - I enjoy the 'blokeiness' of football. The fans, atmosphere and the physicality. I don't know if I'd go to support women's football even if it was as well supported as the men's game. Men's football has something special about it, you don't get it with other sports. Plus there is the history of the clubs/league etc. I might, one day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltshoveller Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 No interest what so ever Athletics is the only sport with women in that i will watch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gl1 Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 Most straight men I know only watch women's beach volleyball. Can't think why Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin101 Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 Not sure the argument makes sense even if made with the best intentions. Professional women's teams would play men's Sunday league teams off the pitch, and would no doubt be stronger, fitter, and more skilled than 99% of amateur men. But nobody calls for amateur men's teams to play on smaller pitches. As for tennis, there are many calls for women's grand slam tennis to be played over 5 sets not 3. The view is that it's patronising to suggest women can't play for 5 sets, and reinforces the view that women are the 'weaker' sex. It is hard to imagine a future in which the women's game is as popular as the men's, but things are slowly changing. Differner sport I know, but didn't the England women's cricket final draw 1.5million tv viewers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erithacus Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 There's no doubting that women's football in this country has had to break off the strangulation of the FA, who closed the sport down in the early years. It is, and will continue to grow at a fast pace for at least the short term - playing catch-up. How much the growth is due to the top level and the media coverage and not the grass roots game is debatable, but the clear intention is to promote the best teams to produce the best international side. 1 hour ago, Robin101 said: didn't the England women's cricket final draw 1.5million tv viewers? Apparently the Lionesses quarter-final game against France last Sunday attracted over 3 million (terrestrial TV, not Sky of course!). But to return to the OP's point, I think the general principle of men supporting the men's game and women going to the women's game is a little fanciful. Clearly, there is a long-established 'culture' of men and sport, whereas women have traditionally had other responsibilities and occupations that would have precluded them from more participation. However, in these more enlightened days, the 'culture' is changing and female support is growing. I don't know if it will reach the stage where attendances are broadly equivalent, but it's a curious feature that the sociologists will probably be examining. Along with the financial types. Women may not have been used to being an important part of sport in general, but with little daughters now playing and being involved in a club environment as much as sons this will open the door wider. I fully expect that women fans will have a bigger say and have a louder voice in the future. Whether this will achieve an equality with men is to be seen. I've been a keen follower of the women's game for a good few years now and am intrigued how the two facets of the beautiful game are being embraced. In comparing them, it's much easier to see the many similarities, yet we naturally focus on the differences. Where this really strikes me is how the players react at the end of a match. In the men's game, the losers just trudge back to the changing rooms; the winners celebrate then run off into the changing rooms. Women have a different approach: win or lose, the players usually stay on the pitch and meet the fans at the perimeter and talk for a good while (warm-downs not forgoing). They like to share their experiences with family and friends, chatting and posing for selfies. The men don't - and probably for obvious reasons. Is this the thing that women will pick up on and become supporters? That makes me ponder the thought that would we see women's football as being successful when it replicates the men's in all its aspects? Would we want it to have the same gamut as we have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harvey54 Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 It's always ticked me off the amount of coverage and hype it gets when it's basically a minority sport. The average Women's Prem gate is about the same as your average Conf....sorry National League crowd. I know which I'd rather watch. Pandering to the pink and fluffy politicos imho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUSSEL85 Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 1 minute ago, harvey54 said: It's always ticked me off the amount of coverage and hype it gets when it's basically a minority sport. The average Women's Prem gate is about the same as your average Conf....sorry National League crowd. I know which I'd rather watch. Pandering to the pink and fluffy politicos imho BBC tend to push this as it is high on their agenda. Its fine to have it there but it should be a separate tab on the BBC Football site, of Sky etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welcome To The Jungle Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 The problem for me is comparing the women's game to the men's. They are different games. A mens team would generally beat a Women's team but that's the case in almost every sport. I'm really enjoying the Women's Euros at the moment and wish I was going on Thursday. 5 minutes ago, harvey54 said: It's always ticked me off the amount of coverage and hype it gets when it's basically a minority sport. The average Women's Prem gate is about the same as your average Conf....sorry National League crowd. I know which I'd rather watch. Pandering to the pink and fluffy politicos imho Womens football is the 4th biggest participation sport in the country after mens football, rugby union and cricket. And other than major tournaments, it is almost never broadcast whereas BT have a non-league game most weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Hitler Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 19 minutes ago, harvey54 said: It's always ticked me off the amount of coverage and hype it gets when it's basically a minority sport. The average Women's Prem gate is about the same as your average Conf....sorry National League crowd. I know which I'd rather watch. Pandering to the pink and fluffy politicos imho I wonder if it's TV execs thinking they're getting into the next big thing cheaply. Darts was huge then went away, snooker rose and fell, cricket has gone from mainstream in the late 70s / early 80s to minority status now. Or maybe they just want to fill a lot of TV time cheaply and are bigging it up because they've got it. They can just about get away with women's football in a way that they couldn't with bog snorkeling for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 7 minutes ago, Welcome To The Jungle said: The problem for me is comparing the women's game to the men's. They are different games. A mens team would generally beat a Women's team but that's the case in almost every sport. I'm really enjoying the Women's Euros at the moment and wish I was going on Thursday. Womens football is the 4th biggest participation sport in the country after mens football, rugby union and cricket. And other than major tournaments, it is almost never broadcast whereas BT have a non-league game most weeks. That's because most people aren't remotely interested in watching something of such poor quality, and find the prominence and publicity it is given on BBC radio, for instance, a source of irritation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welcome To The Jungle Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 7 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said: That's because most people aren't remotely interested in watching something of such poor quality, and find the prominence and publicity it is given on BBC radio, for instance, a source of irritation. 3.4 million watched their last game against France... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowshed Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 1 hour ago, harvey54 said: It's always ticked me off the amount of coverage and hype it gets when it's basically a minority sport. The average Women's Prem gate is about the same as your average Conf....sorry National League crowd. I know which I'd rather watch. Pandering to the pink and fluffy politicos imho In participant terms womens football is not a minority sport. Unfortunately womens participation levels in all sport versus European nations is low. Sport for females and males is important and needs to be encouraged. One way of doing this is via the successful women's football team. The Lionesses are excellent role models for young females to follow interested in sport - football.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddoh Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 7 hours ago, gl1 said: Most straight men I know only watch women's beach volleyball. Can't think why most un straight women I know also watch the same games but each to there own :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderMB Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 I agree completely with you, except on the smaller pitches. While women might not be as strong, football doesn't have to be a game based on strength. It also makes sharing pitches a bit more difficult, which is important at grassroots level. It's to do with perception, and not with skill. If it was all about skill we wouldn't be watching Bristol City! The FA could go a long way towards legitimising women's football by making it all free to watch, either online or on a freeview channel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 Is there anything in the rule book that stops women playing "men's" football? What age are kids split into girls and boys? Does it help keep girls interested? Does it stunt how quickly they develop as players? I sometimes wonder if we shouldn't just have mixed football all the way up - what would happen if we did? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowshed Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 36 minutes ago, Nibor said: Is there anything in the rule book that stops women playing "men's" football? What age are kids split into girls and boys? Does it help keep girls interested? Does it stunt how quickly they develop as players? I sometimes wonder if we shouldn't just have mixed football all the way up - what would happen if we did? Is there anything in the rule book that stops women playing "men's" football? In England and most of Europe yes and EUFA/FIFA err on the side of no, but there are National FA's who allow women to play the mens football. What age are kids split into girls and boys? 16 rising to 18 next or the season after? Some junior clubs split genders early and separate female teams, most Bristol junior clubs struggle to accommodate this. In Bristol females can play with a mixed team in the HML league (the largest), or a females only league. Does it help keep girls interested? Splitting genders does. Female football is on the up. Young girls often want to be around their peers to play football rather than males - They are kids after all. Many kids male and female find competitive/organised football hard to deal with emotionally v kicking a ball around in a park without being placed into squads where they may be the only female out of twenty plus. Does it stunt how quickly they develop as players? Difficult to answer. Players even at early ages benefit from training and playing with/versus others of the same and higher ability. Its an area which can be improved upon. For Bristol and around the area females do play in the JPL league (standard below academy above normal junior football) in mixed teams, a league where City enter female only teams v males. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reformed_red Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 Regarding the point about equality of pay - male footballers get paid what they do because of the money in the game generated primarily by advertising and sponsorship which is funnelled through the huge TV deals. So it's not sexist is commercial. It will be decades (if ever) that women professionals can commercially attract the pay that the male games can. Smaller pitches - a bit patronising, but I've not watched much of any women's footy, so can't really comment. What gets me is the media driven "catch up" that women's football seems to be having with the male game. It won't ever happen. Therefore - I totally get why you suggest women should go support the women's game; build a culture, a fanbase, breed tradition. Could end up being pretty awesome, so long as it's not just a "copy the supporters of the men's game". And I'm sure blokes would be welcome and want to go watch and supportvtoo, just like women do the men's game. Football clubs have a longstanding and unique tradition that will (hopefully) never be lost. If the women's game wants to be successful it has to have a long-term plan and vision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 1 hour ago, Nibor said: Is there anything in the rule book that stops women playing "men's" football? What age are kids split into girls and boys? Does it help keep girls interested? Does it stunt how quickly they develop as players? I sometimes wonder if we shouldn't just have mixed football all the way up - what would happen if we did? If we did it would fall apart. Most blokes I know would not go out and flatten a woman in a a aerial challenge or go in with a 2 footed challenge (although many women would do this to men) it would make the game even more of a non contact sport than it is at the moment. What ever way you look at it most women are not physically strong enough to compete with men so huge changes to the physicality of the game would have to be enforced. Technically there are a lot of women out there that can teach many male pros put there how to control a football. But for me making combining men and women into one team would kill the game. Keep them separate.. I have to say women's football has come on leaps and bounds in the past 10 years... eventually it may get the following and money and the tv exposure it deserves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 I don't understand why girls are seemingly being encouraged/pushed to play football? In my day the boys played football in the playground and, bar the occasional tomboy, the sporty girls - most weren't particularly - much preferred to play shinty and netball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowshed Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 3 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said: I don't understand why girls are seemingly being encouraged/pushed to play football? In my day the boys played football in the playground and, bar the occasional tomboy, the sporty girls - most weren't particularly - much preferred to play shinty and netball. All kids regardless of sex should be encouraged to get involved in physical activity/play sport. It is hard to understand any adult who does not see the advantages of encouraging kids to play sport including one with obvious benefits for the individual and society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 1 minute ago, Cowshed said: All kids regardless of sex should be encouraged to get involved in physical activity/play sport. It is hard to understand any adult who does not see the advantages of encouraging kids to play sport including one with obvious benefits for the individual and society. You didn't read my post. There are traditional sports for girls - shinty, netball, hockey etc -which give them the involvement in sport, and exercise required. Why are they seemingly being pushed to play football, a physical game the majority are not naturally suited to playing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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