Aden Flint - Badly Treated? (Too many merges to mention)

[1960maaan]

1 hour ago, Kid in the Riot said:

This is an exact repeat of the Kodjia situation and one assumes it will be announced on Saturday that Flint isn't in the squad as a bid has been accepted from Brum and he will officially join them on Sunday!

As @Benjam!n Ultra rightly said, why are we throwing our players (popular ones who are making us money) under a bus just before they leave? No need.

This is happening more often now, in most divisions. 
Now while no-one knows for sure how this was driven, reading as much as I could be bothered I have seen a couple of mentions of his agents. I was also told ( how the lad knew I don't know ) Flint would get a pay rise of £12k , elsewhere was told double his pay. 
Flints stock is/was high and at his age , and previous links with Perm clubs , his agents may has rolled the dice thinking it could be a feeding frenzy. I think they got it wrong, at least in the timing, at with our previous experiences (Freemen & Kodjia) LJ got cover in first which weakened the players and agents bargaining position with us. Now seeing as LJ and the club were slaughtered for selling Kodjia with no cover and so late on, I can't see a problem with anything the club has done. 
I would have been happy for Flint to have started the season, he has improved year on year and has never given less than 100%. That said he was happy to sign his deal and if he wants to chase the money, or the idea has been put in his head, then fair play who wouldn't take the chance with maybe 4 or 5 years of his career left. The poxy opening bid smack of agent and Harry having a conversation, Harry maybe thought they could force a move on the cheap while the agent maybe thought force a new contract.

All this is just guesswork, but in my mind makes sense. Why he pulled/was pulled out of the squad is another question.

Just to add, I said before the season started I'd be amazed if Flint gave less than 100%, and I wouldn't have worried if he would have started the season.

[B-Rizzle]

The way I see it...

Flint wants a pay day whilst his stock his high. Told the club in the summer. Club made plans without him and signed Baker. All fair enough.

Flint left out of team v Barnsley as talks ongoing with Brum and given a goodbye/ olive branch cameo appearance at the end. Again all for enough.

Developments this week show he's almost certainly off-ski so possibly a bit naughty and provocative from LJ to pick him last night when he's days away from leaving and will be left cup tied by playing. Could also argue, of course, that we have every right to pick him. Either way, a convo was had and he was removed from the team. Better off for all involved that he leaves as soon after Sat as possible.

Thanks for everything Aden but you've made your bed and we've moved on too. Time to all get on with it!

 

[WhistleHappy]

Assuming the 'deal' is all but done, barring dotting and crossing a few iii's and ttt's ,wouldn't it be in all parties interests, both clubs and player not to play him in a relatively minor game (even an important one) days or perhaps hours before the player departs?

Why risk injury in a nothing game that could ultimately scupper the deal for all concerned? 

If its to happen this week and he's off to Brum it would be nice if it can happen with mutual respect all round... how about handshakes and hugs in the centre circle on Saturday, publicly exchanging the player for a cheque as Flint says goodbye to the Reds & hello to the Blues and moves from the away dug out to the home one at half time ??

It'd be reminiscent of the Brandenburg Gate bridge  East/West prisoner exchanges of the 60s ... all done and dusted.

[B-Rizzle]

It's absolutely standard for players to be left out when they are immenently leaving or serious talks are going on. Let's look at Vassel as an example!

Bit surprising then that LJ picked Flint last night. I'm not surprised there was a conversation! As a result, I won't be getting on Flints back too much for (potentially!) refusing to play.

[Strictly Obi]

52 minutes ago, Robbored said:

That's pretty much what I was thinking......but certain posters just can't help slagging off the club at every opportunity........

Yes I agree totally, some on here are starting to look very stupid in slagging off the club at any opportunity. I get the feeling that as it goes on, they will look more and more like the pathetic losers they are. Especially if we have a decent season!

[Nibor]

JM should have kept his mouth shut, much like LJ last week.  All we have is speculation.  

My speculation:  Flint's got a track record over hundreds of games with full commitment.  We changed half the side anyway last night.  Nobody cares about being cup tied for the league cup, but if there's a big move in the offing there's no need to risk him against a side we're likely to beat.  Perhaps the conversation was a perfectly sensible one about risks.

[CotswoldRed]

2 minutes ago, bcfcRobbo said:

It's absolutely standard for players to be left out when they are immenently leaving or serious talks are going on. Let's look at Vassel as an example!

Bit surprising then that LJ picked Flint last night. I'm not surprised there was a conversation! As a result, I won't be getting on Flints back too much for (potentially!) refusing to play.

If he has refused to play then I hope he enjoys his 2 weeks wage fine.

[bengalcub]

Phantom spot on . Flint is a Bristol city player personally sl comment we'll take £10 million was the wrong thing to say , yes every player has a value it's up to the offering clubs to offer not out bouts to start saying publicly what we would or would not accept !!! Just about her case of horrendous management from all levels. 

[CotswoldRed]

2 minutes ago, Nibor said:

JM should have kept his mouth shut, much like LJ last week.  All we have is speculation.  

My speculation:  Flint's got a track record over hundreds of games with full commitment.  We changed half the side anyway last night.  Nobody cares about being cup tied for the league cup, but if there's a big move in the offing there's no need to risk him against a side we're likely to beat.  Perhaps the conversation was a perfectly sensible one about risks.

Presumably there was less risk on Saturday then. 

[Kid in the Riot]

2 minutes ago, Nibor said:

JM should have kept his mouth shut, much like LJ last week.  All we have is speculation.  

My speculation:  Flint's got a track record over hundreds of games with full commitment.  We changed half the side anyway last night.  Nobody cares about being cup tied for the league cup, but if there's a big move in the offing there's no need to risk him against a side we're likely to beat.  Perhaps the conversation was a perfectly sensible one about risks.

Indeed, so why did LJ select him to play.... (or did he)

[Nibor]

Just now, CotswoldRed said:

Presumably there was less risk on Saturday then. 

Well yes, 10 minutes of a won game is less risky than 90.  Perhaps a move is nearer.  Perhaps the league cup is less important.  There are many factors.

[Nibor]

Just now, Kid in the Riot said:

Indeed, so why did LJ select him to play.... (or did he)

He didn't select him, he may or may not have been thinking of doing so.  It's not unreasonable to have a conversation about it in this situation which is what JM says happened.  Basically talking in the press about players moving on is unprofessional and shouldn't happen.

[Kid in the Riot]

17 minutes ago, Nibor said:

He didn't select him, he may or may not have been thinking of doing so.  It's not unreasonable to have a conversation about it in this situation which is what JM says happened.  Basically talking in the press about players moving on is unprofessional and shouldn't happen.

Macca said he was 'picked for the starting 11'. A conversation was then had and he didn't play. So yes he was selected to play last night. My question is given current circumstances - why? And 'because he's our player so we can do what we want with him' doesn't really cut it for me.

[keflav]

19 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Indeed, so why did LJ select him to play.... (or did he)

Because Currently and until any further information comes out he is a Bristol City player and should play when selected...

All this speculation is a bit silly if he's to go then Thanks for all the matches Played and off he goes and all the best for the Future, if not then just get on with your job its seems fairly simple...????

[Nibor]

Just now, Kid in the Riot said:

Macca said he was 'picked for the starting 11'. A conversation was then had and he didn't play. So yes he was selected to play last night. My question is given current circumstances - why? And 'because he's our player so we can do what we want with him' doesn't really cut it for me.

Well, quibbling over definitions but nobody is selected until the team sheet goes in so all you have before that is an intention and it's perfectly reasonable to have a conversation about that in these circumstances.  There are lots of possible explanations (for example maybe LJ wasn't aware of an impending bid and thought Flint needed match time,  Flint made him aware of something).  It needn't be sinister.  LJ and JM should pipe down though.

[robinreliant]

1 minute ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Macca said he was 'picked for the starting 11'. A conversation was then had and he didn't play. So yes he was selected to play last night. My question is given current circumstances - why? And 'because he's our player so we can do what we want with him' doesn't really cut it for me.

How Macca kept a straight face during the AF questions is amazing to be honest. (I know nothing just like Manuel)

[Robin101]

How is it throwing him under a bus by revealing the - I assume - truth? If Flint was chosen to play and then after 'a conversation' was dropped then I think it's entirely fair that fans are given the truth. 

Its only throwing him under a bus if it's not true. Otherwise he jumped in front of the bus himself! 

Anyway, get rid. Decent player and a great servant but is he irreplaceable? No, no, no.

[pigeon]

Did anyone think it could simply be to avoid him being cup-tied as he is obviously be transferred at some point during this window? 

Most logical thing in my eyes is that maybe talks are ongoing and that part of the discussion was that the buying team didn't want him to be cup tied? Not just that but if he is off for a relatively large amount of money then why risk him getting injured?

[Aizoon]

Thank you Aden and all the best in your future career. That is all.

[LC_]

I doubt Birmingham have expectations to go on and win the League Cup this season, so pulling him from the squad to avoid him being cup-tied would seem a little extreme to me. More likely it's to avoid him picking up a knock in a meaningless game. I'd hazard a guess it's as much us protecting our interest in getting a good price for an injury free Flint now as it is his. 

[pigeon]

3 minutes ago, LC_ said:

I doubt Birmingham have expectations to go on and win the League Cup this season, so pulling him from the squad to avoid him being cup-tied would seem a little extreme to me. More likely it's to avoid him picking up a knock in a meaningless game. I'd hazard a guess it's as much us protecting our interest in getting a good price for an injury free Flint now as it is his. 

I don't think many teams have the expectations to win a cup unless you're a top flight team. However, if you're spending a lot of money on a player then surely you'd want to maximize the use of your investment so I'm sure having him available for the cup, should they find themselves in it further down the line, would be a positive for them. I bet Bradford didn't think they were going to be in the League Cup final a few years ago but that is the beauty of footy, it's unpredictable.

[Dave]

If a deal with BiRmingham is close, as is suspected. It does seem strange as Harry Rednapp announces most things with a megaphone.

[screech]

1 minute ago, Dave said:

If a deal with BiRmingham is close, as is suspected. It does seem strange as Harry Rednapp announces most things with a megaphone.

Yep, probably the worst offender for openly tapping up players in the game.

 

 

[Esmond Million's Bung]

2 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Did you read my post? What I've done is take the evidence we have and made a judgement on how I think the club have dealt with the situation. I've clearly backed up my opinion with reasoning, yet you still ask 'in what way'? Sorry if using reasoning to back up an opinion is beyond your understanding  

Let me put this another way, within the '5 pillars' to sell a player bought cheapish and to be sold on at the top of his market value, the club needs several things to make this happen.

1). A player that several 'bigger' clubs seem to covet.

2). Said player on a long enough contract to influence the price.

3). Obviously age of the player, enough potential years to make the buying club stump up the cash.

4). And a replacement.

5). And the most important ingredient, make sure the player leaves, whether he want's to or not.

it's called business, cold hard business, there is absolutely in these days with the of amount of money in the game no room for sentiment.

I see this as the club doing exactly what many, many players have done since the big money arrived in the game, engineer transfers.

The only pity for me is that it happens to be Flint a good loyal hard working servant, but hey it's business and for once BCFC, after all of the catalogue of mistakes made on sales of players, we seem to be in the driving seat for once.

Get used to this manner of conducting business, it's part of the 5 pillars.

Edit:- As @Benjam!n Ultra rightly said, why are we throwing our players (popular ones who are making us money) under a bus just before they leave? No need.

Players have been throwing their clubs and fans under buses for at least 10 years, they are employees and the endless pundits on the various TV gravy trains keep telling us football is a business, big business, this is what happens in big business.

[HIGHRIDGE BCFC]

1 hour ago, Nibor said:

Well, quibbling over definitions but nobody is selected until the team sheet goes in so all you have before that is an intention and it's perfectly reasonable to have a conversation about that in these circumstances.  There are lots of possible explanations (for example maybe LJ wasn't aware of an impending bid and thought Flint needed match time,  Flint made him aware of something).  It needn't be sinister.  LJ and JM should pipe down though.

So LJ as the manager of the selling club wouldn't know of an impending bid but the player makes him aware that one could be incoming?

Surely that indicates an illegal approach?

The buying club goes to the selling club and arranges a fee. Until that happens they're not allowed contact with the player.

So you're suggest the old master of tapping up has tapped Flint up?

Sounds more than a bit sinister to me!

 

[LC_]

1 hour ago, Dave said:

If a deal with BiRmingham is close, as is suspected. It does seem strange as Harry Rednapp announces most things with a megaphone.

If the weather in sandbanks is anything like it is here, Hary aint rolling his Range Rover window down today

[Nibor]

28 minutes ago, HIGHRIDGE BCFC said:

So LJ as the manager of the selling club wouldn't know of an impending bid but the player makes him aware that one could be incoming?

Surely that indicates an illegal approach?

The buying club goes to the selling club and arranges a fee. Until that happens they're not allowed contact with the player.

So you're suggest the old master of tapping up has tapped Flint up?

Sounds more than a bit sinister to me!

 

Technically you're probably right but agents facilitate all this and usually know of interest first.  It was just an example anyway.  There are lots of reasons that LJ might have intended to play Flint and lots of reasons they might subsequently have agreed to not play him.  None of them need to be that LJ wanted to throw Flint under a bus or that Flint refused.

[Bar BS3]

I find the whole Flint thing boring now. The sooner he leaves, without letting things turn regrettably sour, the better. 

We will be fine without him. Arguably better, with Baker already on board. 

[Charlie BCFC]

14 hours ago, RaspberryRed said:

Aeden I wouldn't want anyone to deny you a big money move but refusing to play. Just **** off

JMcA: "Aden Flint was picked in the starting XI...after a conversation with the gaffer it was decided to take him out of the team."

I had so much ''Man love'' for you but it's being eroded by the hour

If he's going to go then he'll be cup tied though that's probably why he wasn't playing

[HIGHRIDGE BCFC]

32 minutes ago, Nibor said:

Technically you're probably right but agents facilitate all this and usually know of interest first.  It was just an example anyway.  There are lots of reasons that LJ might have intended to play Flint and lots of reasons they might subsequently have agreed to not play him.  None of them need to be that LJ wanted to throw Flint under a bus or that Flint refused.

Yeh I understand that mate. I'd just be very surprised if Flint had the minerals to stand there in front of LJ and admit he was aware of said illegal approach.

Wouldn't really leave him in the strongest position if he did as it could open up a massive can of worms!