The Millwall Debacle

[Nibor]

Well, that was 90 minutes of my life I'm not getting back.  It was truly shite from beginning to end, the high pressing quick moving passing game has vanished and been replaced by players running into each other, giving away needless fouls, passing behind each other, standing still, turning around and going backwards.  We looked devoid of confidence and scared. 

The only ones to come out of that with any credit really are Fielding and Paterson, Baker was OK and that's about it.  Korey Smith had comfortably the worst game I've ever seen him have, I think he completed about two in ten passes and couldn't seem to do anything right.  Diedhiou and Reid might as well have been playing over in the park given how isolated they were by our inability to string two passes together.  

On the plus side we will never concede from a corner again having seemingly decided to use Millwall as an opportunity to practise defending set pieces by giving them about 800 in a row in the first 20 minutes.  It was a testament to their complete lack of any talent that we managed to keep a clean sheet, they missed a couple of sitters and on that showing will be joining Barnsley and probably us in the bottom three.  For the first 30 minutes they pressed us and then they retreated back as two banks of four and sat there happy to play on the break when they realised we had no threat.

We had about ten minutes of reasonable play in the run up to half time which Millwall stifled by fouling and timewasting and arguing, and then we came out after half time looking about half as lively as we did in the first half.  Whatever was said by LJ in the run up to the game and at half time didn't work one bit in either case.

The subs were confusing.  I could just about see bringing GON on but it absolutely should have been Smith that he replaced not Pack as Pack was not nearly as bad.  To be honest I'd have overloaded the midfield as we were getting nowhere - someone like Hegeler who has a calm head might have helped more - is he injured now or just dropped out the squad for no apparent reason again?  There's never any point in bringing O'Dowda on unless we're winning comfortably and it's just to rest someone else, he seems to have very little impact on any game.  Eliasson might be raw but he might have offered some sort of threat.  Woodrow looked reasonable but then so would Bas Savage with that sort of service, all you can really do is close down and run around when your teammates have lost the ability to pass five yards.

It's probably fair to say I didn't enjoy much about the match.

A word on the ref.  He got pretty much every decision right but was ridiculously fussy about where kicks were taken from.  When we're fouled a free kick is supposed to penalise the opposition, preventing a quick one by insisting it's taken from two yards away helps them.  Whatever he was doing with Fielding's free kick was beyond me, Fielding was in line with the linesman's flag but apparently that's not ok.  Who the **** cares where in the 18 yard box it's taken when we all know it's going out of play anyway?  That's probably harsh on Fielding given he again made a couple of great saves but if you can't hit a red shirt reliably why not take the short option or throw it?

Yes, it's only four games in.  Yes it could change.  But out of 8 halves of league football we've had two good, one ok, and five shockers.  That's starting to look more of a worry than a concern.  It's patently obvious that we need some real quality in midfield and soon, but that doesn't seem to be a priority for the club.  I hope they re-evaluate that or I fear we're going to have the most expensive league one side ever seen.  A casual estimate would be that we started today with an XI that cost over £10m to assemble and another £5-6m on the bench.  Value for money is not how I'd put it.

[cheshire_red]

Every other report has Patterson having a mare?

[Nibor]

Just now, cheshire_red said:

Every other report has Patterson having a mare?

He was the only player who did anything positive with the ball and made himself available.  I don't know how anybody having watched that could describe it as mare unless they had far more disparaging words for the other 9 outfield players.

[BRISTOL86]

3 minutes ago, cheshire_red said:

Every other report has Patterson having a mare?

Seen him singled out for criticism multiple times. I often wonder what game other people watch as he was the only attacking player looking to drive into space and make something happen. 

Completely agree about Smith @Nibor - how he survived the 90 I'll never know. Awful from minute one.

[harry may]

We have had nobody in midfield with the attributes of Marvin Elliot since ........................Marvin Elliot. We've need somebody like that more than ever.

[Robbored]

Two major factors contributed heavily today's shite game. 1) Millwall's style of niggling tackles and causing the game to become stop/start.

2) The referee's inconsistency and buying into Milwalls methods.

The whole 90mins was just one huge frustration.

Time to move on to Villa now........

[ashton_fan]

LJ should have rotated the team for this one, too many players looked jaded after a hard game on Tuesday. Hegeler, O'Neil and Woodrow should have started, Diedhiou could have come on as an impact sub for the last 20 mins. Pack and Korey looked particularly out of sorts which is probably why we lost the midfield.

[LC_]

re Paterson I don't think he was as bad as being made out, certainly not the worst performance today. Korey Smith was abysmal and a complete passenger. I thought Joe had a good game all things considered.

[Globe Trotter]

Totally agree with every point you've made. Thought Bryan was good too but wow we were abysmal 

[RedM]

Paterson at least looked willing, but nothing was coming off for him. Korey was very poor by his standards, giving the ball away by passing to one of the Millwall players then having to get it back, and winging at the Ref at every opportunity. Joe at least stuck to instruction and stayed out wide, patiently, as only Pack seemed to realise he was there. Frankie again kept us in the game. Other than that everyone was well below par and allowed themselves to be bullied.

[Numero Uno]

The ONLY positive for me was that Pisano, Baker and Wright put themselves on the line to block shots and attempt to cope with Millwall's physicality and Frank (ignoring his sodding kicking) did his job so that we at least got a clean sheet. Everything else was dire and the phrase "90 minutes you'll never get back" has never been more apt!!

[JoeAman08]

Yea the back 4 and FF come away in good stead for me. Nobody wasn't trying but many were very stagnant when we had the ball. The lack of movement didn't help anyone and we just failed to get the ball to our forwards so they looked poor because of that. Pato is too talented not to be more of a factor than he was today. Again think it's down to some fatigue.

Need this window to close and bed all the new signings in so we can make a few changes when needed. I know some were calling for Eliasson today and I may have been tempted but imagine he made a mistake tracking back and allowed Millwall to score. It's ok bringing him along slowly. I'd hope next week with 3 weeks under his belt he's ready to make an impact. Same with Woodrow. Get a week in training to get a feel for everyone. 

[pongo88]

8 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

The ONLY positive for me was that Pisano, Baker and Wright put themselves on the line to block shots and attempt to cope with Millwall's physicality and Frank (ignoring his sodding kicking) did his job so that we at least got a clean sheet. Everything else was dire and the phrase "90 minutes you'll never get back" has never been more apt!!

The only positives for me was a nice sausage roll at half time and a good couple of pints in the pub post match

[CotswoldRed]

20 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Two major factors contributed heavily today's shite game. 1) Millwall's style of niggling tackles and causing the game to become stop/start.

2) The referee's inconsistency and buying into Milwalls methods.

The whole 90mins was just one huge frustration.

Time to move on to Villa now........

What we chose to do with the ball can't be blamed on Millwall today. 

[Robbored]

8 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said:

What we chose to do with the ball can't be blamed on Millwall today. 

My point was that the tactic of niggling fouls and a stop/start game disrupted City ability to play their usual game............its a familiar style often discussed by pundits during/after such a game.

[tinman85]

35 minutes ago, ashton_fan said:

LJ should have rotated the team for this one, too many players looked jaded after a hard game on Tuesday. Hegeler, O'Neil and Woodrow should have started, Diedhiou could have come on as an impact sub for the last 20 mins. Pack and Korey looked particularly out of sorts which is probably why we lost the midfield.

We took Diedhiou off and had no presence up top. Woodrow is not the type of striker we needed. Looked bang average. Not saying Diedhiou is setting the world on fire either but apart from Baker and Pisano was the only one who looked physically up for it. 

[Red-Robbo]

49 minutes ago, Nibor said:

Well, that was 90 minutes of my life I'm not getting back.  It was truly shite from beginning to end, the high pressing quick moving passing game has vanished and been replaced by players running into each other, giving away needless fouls, passing behind each other, standing still, turning around and going backwards.  We looked devoid of confidence and scared. 

The only ones to come out of that with any credit really are Fielding and Paterson, Baker was OK and that's about it.  Korey Smith had comfortably the worst game I've ever seen him have, I think he completed about two in ten passes and couldn't seem to do anything right.  Diedhiou and Reid might as well have been playing over in the park given how isolated they were by our inability to string two passes together.  

On the plus side we will never concede from a corner again having seemingly decided to use Millwall as an opportunity to practise defending set pieces by giving them about 800 in a row in the first 20 minutes.  It was a testament to their complete lack of any talent that we managed to keep a clean sheet, they missed a couple of sitters and on that showing will be joining Barnsley and probably us in the bottom three.  For the first 30 minutes they pressed us and then they retreated back as two banks of four and sat there happy to play on the break when they realised we had no threat.

We had about ten minutes of reasonable play in the run up to half time which Millwall stifled by fouling and timewasting and arguing, and then we came out after half time looking about half as lively as we did in the first half.  Whatever was said by LJ in the run up to the game and at half time didn't work one bit in either case.

The subs were confusing.  I could just about see bringing GON on but it absolutely should have been Smith that he replaced not Pack as Pack was not nearly as bad.  To be honest I'd have overloaded the midfield as we were getting nowhere - someone like Hegeler who has a calm head might have helped more - is he injured now or just dropped out the squad for no apparent reason again?  There's never any point in bringing O'Dowda on unless we're winning comfortably and it's just to rest someone else, he seems to have very little impact on any game.  Eliasson might be raw but he might have offered some sort of threat.  Woodrow looked reasonable but then so would Bas Savage with that sort of service, all you can really do is close down and run around when your teammates have lost the ability to pass five yards.

It's probably fair to say I didn't enjoy much about the match.

A word on the ref.  He got pretty much every decision right but was ridiculously fussy about where kicks were taken from.  When we're fouled a free kick is supposed to penalise the opposition, preventing a quick one by insisting it's taken from two yards away helps them.  Whatever he was doing with Fielding's free kick was beyond me, Fielding was in line with the linesman's flag but apparently that's not ok.  Who the **** cares where in the 18 yard box it's taken when we all know it's going out of play anyway?  That's probably harsh on Fielding given he again made a couple of great saves but if you can't hit a red shirt reliably why not take the short option or throw it?

Yes, it's only four games in.  Yes it could change.  But out of 8 halves of league football we've had two good, one ok, and five shockers.  That's starting to look more of a worry than a concern.  It's patently obvious that we need some real quality in midfield and soon, but that doesn't seem to be a priority for the club.  I hope they re-evaluate that or I fear we're going to have the most expensive league one side ever seen.  A casual estimate would be that we started today with an XI that cost over £10m to assemble and another £5-6m on the bench.  Value for money is not how I'd put it.

You took the words right out of my mouth, Nibs.  

Maybe a dour no score draw against one of the prachute payment boys wouldn't have seemed so bad - but Millwall!  They still look and play like a L1 side. Yet they came the closest.  16 corners conceded!!! Would a side with a decent goalscorer have let us escape unscathed from that?

[tinman85]

28 minutes ago, RedM said:

Paterson at least looked willing, but nothing was coming off for him. Korey was very poor by his standards, giving the ball away by passing to one of the Millwall players then having to get it back, and winging at the Ref at every opportunity. Joe at least stuck to instruction and stayed out wide, patiently, as only Pack seemed to realise he was there. Frankie again kept us in the game. Other than that everyone was well below par and allowed themselves to be bullied.

Korey Smith has gone backwards for me. He gave the ball away countless times. One of which nearly led to a goal. I always preferred him to Pack but now feel we need a partner for Pack in the middle. To be honest if we replaced Pack and Smith with Irvine and Bridcutt we would look much better. 

[Abraham Romanovich]

43 minutes ago, cheshire_red said:

Every other report has Patterson having a mare?

Too many fancy tricks and spins for my liking sometimes just needs to do the simple things and don't even start me on that attempted lob.

 

[Major Isewater]

47 minutes ago, cheshire_red said:

Every other report has Patterson having a mare?

Was he even playing ?

The problem , amongst others , is that Paterson and Brownhill just don't affect the game enough .

Pack is ok but very slow and rarely moves forward and Smith breaks up play a bit but , once again , doesn't affect the game enough .

I don't see a Championship quality midfield there I'm afraid .

 

[YorkshireSection]

8 minutes ago, tinman85 said:

We took Diedhiou off and had no presence up top. Woodrow is not the type of striker we needed. Looked bang average. Not saying Diedhiou is setting the world on fire either but apart from Baker and Pisano was the only one who looked physically up for it. 

Woodrows record is awful, not really a signing that I'm thrilled about, I thought we were looking for a striker with pace and presence, as for Diedhiou I have a bad feeling.

[RedM]

I really like Pack, and Korey is usually dependable isn't he. They both had their worst game for a while today. One or the other off form is hard to manage, but both in the same game is impossible. We were very lucky we weren't punished as they seemed to affect the whole team, the defence was overrun and the forwards got nothing. Hopefully this will be a one off, we might lose games but we surely can't play as badly as that again.

[YorkshireSection]

8 minutes ago, Major Isewater said:

Was he even playing ?

The problem , amongst others , is that Paterson and Brownhill just don't affect the game enough .

Pack is ok but very slow and rarely moves forward and Smith breaks up play a bit but , once again , doesn't affect the game enough .

I don't see a Championship quality midfield there I'm afraid .

 

Brownhill needs to play in the middle, but we are to weak to even contemplate trying him there as Pack doesn't have the grit and style of play to accompany him and it saddens me to say but I think Smith flourishes when playing with better players, he however seems to have stagnated and not pushed on which is a real shame as I thought he could have been a quality championship midfielder, our midfield needs a complete revamp, bollocks.

[formerly known as ivan]

My first game of the season today. My decision not to renew my ST came down to a financial one. However I must say...

How glad am I that I made the choice not to renew! Everything today reminded me of last season. I know the Barnsley game was decent, particularly the first 45, but I feel performances like that will be few and far between.

Truely was shocking, void of ideas, no attacking threat, no real movement and one at least 3 occasions our own players tackling each other!

With us being weaker without Tammy there lies a long hard season ahead. Really can't see where the goals will come from...

[Kid in the Riot]

1 hour ago, Nibor said:

Well, that was 90 minutes of my life I'm not getting back.  It was truly shite from beginning to end, the high pressing quick moving passing game has vanished and been replaced by players running into each other, giving away needless fouls, passing behind each other, standing still, turning around and going backwards.  We looked devoid of confidence and scared. 

The only ones to come out of that with any credit really are Fielding and Paterson, Baker was OK and that's about it.  Korey Smith had comfortably the worst game I've ever seen him have, I think he completed about two in ten passes and couldn't seem to do anything right.  Diedhiou and Reid might as well have been playing over in the park given how isolated they were by our inability to string two passes together.  

On the plus side we will never concede from a corner again having seemingly decided to use Millwall as an opportunity to practise defending set pieces by giving them about 800 in a row in the first 20 minutes.  It was a testament to their complete lack of any talent that we managed to keep a clean sheet, they missed a couple of sitters and on that showing will be joining Barnsley and probably us in the bottom three.  For the first 30 minutes they pressed us and then they retreated back as two banks of four and sat there happy to play on the break when they realised we had no threat.

We had about ten minutes of reasonable play in the run up to half time which Millwall stifled by fouling and timewasting and arguing, and then we came out after half time looking about half as lively as we did in the first half.  Whatever was said by LJ in the run up to the game and at half time didn't work one bit in either case.

The subs were confusing.  I could just about see bringing GON on but it absolutely should have been Smith that he replaced not Pack as Pack was not nearly as bad.  To be honest I'd have overloaded the midfield as we were getting nowhere - someone like Hegeler who has a calm head might have helped more - is he injured now or just dropped out the squad for no apparent reason again?  There's never any point in bringing O'Dowda on unless we're winning comfortably and it's just to rest someone else, he seems to have very little impact on any game.  Eliasson might be raw but he might have offered some sort of threat.  Woodrow looked reasonable but then so would Bas Savage with that sort of service, all you can really do is close down and run around when your teammates have lost the ability to pass five yards.

It's probably fair to say I didn't enjoy much about the match.

A word on the ref.  He got pretty much every decision right but was ridiculously fussy about where kicks were taken from.  When we're fouled a free kick is supposed to penalise the opposition, preventing a quick one by insisting it's taken from two yards away helps them.  Whatever he was doing with Fielding's free kick was beyond me, Fielding was in line with the linesman's flag but apparently that's not ok.  Who the **** cares where in the 18 yard box it's taken when we all know it's going out of play anyway?  That's probably harsh on Fielding given he again made a couple of great saves but if you can't hit a red shirt reliably why not take the short option or throw it?

Yes, it's only four games in.  Yes it could change.  But out of 8 halves of league football we've had two good, one ok, and five shockers.  That's starting to look more of a worry than a concern.  It's patently obvious that we need some real quality in midfield and soon, but that doesn't seem to be a priority for the club.  I hope they re-evaluate that or I fear we're going to have the most expensive league one side ever seen.  A casual estimate would be that we started today with an XI that cost over £10m to assemble and another £5-6m on the bench.  Value for money is not how I'd put it.

Brentford was far, far worse.

JOHNSON OUT.

[054123]

I honestly don't know what people expect. 

Nothing has changed in the last 18 months.

[robin_unreliant]

1 minute ago, formerly known as ivan said:

 My decision not to renew my ST..... However I must say...

How glad am I that I made the choice not to renew! 

Me too. I just couldn't face another run like last year's mid-season and with LJ still here was worried nothing would change. 

Went to the Barnsley game and was impressed and thought I had got it wrong. Now feeling relieved that I don't feel obliged to spends hours in the m5 holiday chaos coming up from devon to watch the kind of dross served up today, just because I have a ST.

Got a feeling it might be a long hard season - again.

[PolskRed]

1 hour ago, Nibor said:

Well, that was 90 minutes of my life I'm not getting back.  It was truly shite from beginning to end, the high pressing quick moving passing game has vanished and been replaced by players running into each other, giving away needless fouls, passing behind each other, standing still, turning around and going backwards.  We looked devoid of confidence and scared. 

The only ones to come out of that with any credit really are Fielding and Paterson, Baker was OK and that's about it.  Korey Smith had comfortably the worst game I've ever seen him have, I think he completed about two in ten passes and couldn't seem to do anything right.  Diedhiou and Reid might as well have been playing over in the park given how isolated they were by our inability to string two passes together.  

On the plus side we will never concede from a corner again having seemingly decided to use Millwall as an opportunity to practise defending set pieces by giving them about 800 in a row in the first 20 minutes.  It was a testament to their complete lack of any talent that we managed to keep a clean sheet, they missed a couple of sitters and on that showing will be joining Barnsley and probably us in the bottom three.  For the first 30 minutes they pressed us and then they retreated back as two banks of four and sat there happy to play on the break when they realised we had no threat.

We had about ten minutes of reasonable play in the run up to half time which Millwall stifled by fouling and timewasting and arguing, and then we came out after half time looking about half as lively as we did in the first half.  Whatever was said by LJ in the run up to the game and at half time didn't work one bit in either case.

The subs were confusing.  I could just about see bringing GON on but it absolutely should have been Smith that he replaced not Pack as Pack was not nearly as bad.  To be honest I'd have overloaded the midfield as we were getting nowhere - someone like Hegeler who has a calm head might have helped more - is he injured now or just dropped out the squad for no apparent reason again?  There's never any point in bringing O'Dowda on unless we're winning comfortably and it's just to rest someone else, he seems to have very little impact on any game.  Eliasson might be raw but he might have offered some sort of threat.  Woodrow looked reasonable but then so would Bas Savage with that sort of service, all you can really do is close down and run around when your teammates have lost the ability to pass five yards.

It's probably fair to say I didn't enjoy much about the match.

A word on the ref.  He got pretty much every decision right but was ridiculously fussy about where kicks were taken from.  When we're fouled a free kick is supposed to penalise the opposition, preventing a quick one by insisting it's taken from two yards away helps them.  Whatever he was doing with Fielding's free kick was beyond me, Fielding was in line with the linesman's flag but apparently that's not ok.  Who the **** cares where in the 18 yard box it's taken when we all know it's going out of play anyway?  That's probably harsh on Fielding given he again made a couple of great saves but if you can't hit a red shirt reliably why not take the short option or throw it?

Yes, it's only four games in.  Yes it could change.  But out of 8 halves of league football we've had two good, one ok, and five shockers.  That's starting to look more of a worry than a concern.  It's patently obvious that we need some real quality in midfield and soon, but that doesn't seem to be a priority for the club.  I hope they re-evaluate that or I fear we're going to have the most expensive league one side ever seen.  A casual estimate would be that we started today with an XI that cost over £10m to assemble and another £5-6m on the bench.  Value for money is not how I'd put it.

Normally read your posts but after three lines knew it would be "OTIB'b" so ignored the rest. I genuinely opoligise if I missed anything different but I doubt it so cheers. 

 

 

[BigTone]

1 hour ago, Nibor said:

Well, that was 90 minutes of my life I'm not getting back.  It was truly shite from beginning to end, the high pressing quick moving passing game has vanished and been replaced by players running into each other, giving away needless fouls, passing behind each other, standing still, turning around and going backwards.  We looked devoid of confidence and scared. 

The only ones to come out of that with any credit really are Fielding and Paterson, Baker was OK and that's about it.  Korey Smith had comfortably the worst game I've ever seen him have, I think he completed about two in ten passes and couldn't seem to do anything right.  Diedhiou and Reid might as well have been playing over in the park given how isolated they were by our inability to string two passes together.  

On the plus side we will never concede from a corner again having seemingly decided to use Millwall as an opportunity to practise defending set pieces by giving them about 800 in a row in the first 20 minutes.  It was a testament to their complete lack of any talent that we managed to keep a clean sheet, they missed a couple of sitters and on that showing will be joining Barnsley and probably us in the bottom three.  For the first 30 minutes they pressed us and then they retreated back as two banks of four and sat there happy to play on the break when they realised we had no threat.

We had about ten minutes of reasonable play in the run up to half time which Millwall stifled by fouling and timewasting and arguing, and then we came out after half time looking about half as lively as we did in the first half.  Whatever was said by LJ in the run up to the game and at half time didn't work one bit in either case.

The subs were confusing.  I could just about see bringing GON on but it absolutely should have been Smith that he replaced not Pack as Pack was not nearly as bad.  To be honest I'd have overloaded the midfield as we were getting nowhere - someone like Hegeler who has a calm head might have helped more - is he injured now or just dropped out the squad for no apparent reason again?  There's never any point in bringing O'Dowda on unless we're winning comfortably and it's just to rest someone else, he seems to have very little impact on any game.  Eliasson might be raw but he might have offered some sort of threat.  Woodrow looked reasonable but then so would Bas Savage with that sort of service, all you can really do is close down and run around when your teammates have lost the ability to pass five yards.

It's probably fair to say I didn't enjoy much about the match.

A word on the ref.  He got pretty much every decision right but was ridiculously fussy about where kicks were taken from.  When we're fouled a free kick is supposed to penalise the opposition, preventing a quick one by insisting it's taken from two yards away helps them.  Whatever he was doing with Fielding's free kick was beyond me, Fielding was in line with the linesman's flag but apparently that's not ok.  Who the **** cares where in the 18 yard box it's taken when we all know it's going out of play anyway?  That's probably harsh on Fielding given he again made a couple of great saves but if you can't hit a red shirt reliably why not take the short option or throw it?

Yes, it's only four games in.  Yes it could change.  But out of 8 halves of league football we've had two good, one ok, and five shockers.  That's starting to look more of a worry than a concern.  It's patently obvious that we need some real quality in midfield and soon, but that doesn't seem to be a priority for the club.  I hope they re-evaluate that or I fear we're going to have the most expensive league one side ever seen.  A casual estimate would be that we started today with an XI that cost over £10m to assemble and another £5-6m on the bench.  Value for money is not how I'd put it.

I get the impression you weren't impressed

[Lorenzos Only Goal]

Don't panic, it's Millwall these sorts of teams often leave you feeling grim.  They play a horrible game and will make some of the best teams look horrible.