Bs11lad Posted October 2, 2017 Report Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Davefevs said: Re the OP. I think all any of can do is have our opinions at the time and decide over what period we base them. Some are more knee jerk than others, some are more black and white than others, etc. None of us are right or wrong really. Had I been SL, I would’ve got rid of LJ based on results and us moving closer to the relegation places. The players were not playing well or consistently, even within individual games. However it’s not that simple. Very few of us know what was happening inside the dressing room, on the training ground, and therefore our opinions are just that....and based on a fraction of the totality. In some ways i’m glad that some (a lot) of it seemed to down to the Tomlin-effect, not because I thought he was a bad-egg as early as pre-season, but because it probably meant that other players might be taking sides and creating a toxic environment. Once Tomlin was removed it enabled the manager a chance to repair. In some ways he finally "grew some" late in the season by leaving him out. Perhaps he needed the security of SL’s backing to do that, to leave the other players in no doubt that he was there to stay and they either bought into it, or find a new club in the summer. That was the start of it, looking back. Easy to base that thought on results, but I think you could see LJ keeping his counsel a bit more, the players playing a bit more structured, understanding they had ten others doing their share. We’ve made a very encouraging start this season. I’m hopeful. The big challenge will now be for LJ to keep his squad of almost two-team’s worth of talent, happy whilst not playing regularly. In some ways, Pisano’s injury has delayed one of those. Wright’s travel back from Oz, might be a blessing too in giving him an easier decision. The games come thick and fast, but we do have a squad to cope, rotate, stay fresh. The likes of Brownhill have now (I consider) to have broken through, he’s no longer second choice, but a perm 2 from 3. O’Dowda is getting there too...end product will define the rise and speed of that rise to the level that Brownhill now has. Thats two examples of players who over the summer might not have had all fans singing their names, or fans questioning the money spent (on COD at least). Okay, I sound like I’m won over. What a hypocrite I am! Not really. I wanted him to succeed, he loves City, but I couldn’t see that happening as things were. I’m enjoying the current form, performances. Long may it continue. Good God I wish you were female ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gert Mare Posted October 2, 2017 Report Share Posted October 2, 2017 11 games played, that is all. I don't think anyone was calling for Johnson Out this time last season. If anything I think people were saying then that Johnson wasn't their first choice but he seemed to be doing a good job of proving people wrong......and then all of a sudden we collapsed for months on end, the worst collapse in the clubs history too and that is when the division amongst fans set in. I make no bones about being firmly in the Johnson Out camp. I felt it was dangerous playing a learning game potentially at the risk of our Championship status, but we survived (just) and that is all that anyone wanted in both camps, regardless of those who kept on saying that negative posters didn't want the club to succeed or were not proper fans and actually enjoyed seeing us fail. Utter nonsense. Confidence and gaining a winning momentum can make a massive difference and we are seeing that so far this season. For me the turning point started with the convincing win at home to Huddersfield, but the most important game was going to Brighton (the Champions elect) with a full stadium and winning to guarantee our survival with an excellent performance to match. I really believe that the Brighton game confirmed to the players that they could compete and beat the best teams in the Championship and psychologically I think it has made a massive difference. I also think that Lee Johnson has learnt a lot from last season and he has ensured that the players are stronger and fitter and we are playing a much more high tempo pressing game. Quick, fit and strong teams with belief, confidence and a winning mentality stand every chance of progressing to the next level and right now we tick all of the boxes. The season is a long one and we have some thought testing fixtures on the horizon. We will need a bit of luck too and pray that injuries don't blight our progress. I'm more impressed than I was last season as I felt we stole a win in some games that we were second best. This season we are imposing our game on the opposition, not the other way round. If somehow this run continues and we attain promotion to the Premier League then it will be a fantastic achievement, especially for Lee Johnson after surviving what no manager of any other club in the football league would have been allowed to under any other chairman. Alan Dicks should have gone in 1974, he didn't, City beat Leeds and gave Liverpool a really tough test. The players started to believe after that and what followed is now stuff of folklore. History has a habit of repeating itself...who knows what might happen? Negative or Happy Clappy we'll all be having a party if something special happens this season that much is guaranteed! Up the City. Enjoy the moment! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted October 2, 2017 Report Share Posted October 2, 2017 @Cheesleysmate nicely put. My sentiments were the same, you don’t let an apprentice manage something at critical as our Championship future. I’m not sure how pivotal Pembo going was. I’m not sure how pivotal Maca coming in was. In fact you can go back to Holden coming in and wondering if that upset the Apple cart too. The dynamic between manager (head coach in our case) and backroom staff is important. The ability to play good cop bad cop is crucial, to know who to trust, and for the players to know they won;t get mixed messages. Those on the fringes need to know who they go to get their bit of faith, even if it’s BS. I think (no substance) that Holden coming in upset the LJ / Pembo dynamic to start with. Players suddenly see you atypical hard-coach Pembo, and then see LJ’s "mate" come in and aren’t sure who their good cop is, whether Pembo and / or Holden is on their side. Dressing rooms can fall apart (not necessarily in-fighting) over a simple change like this. It does seem that the ousting of Pembo (who did a good job here) and bringing in Macca, another "mate" restored that dynamic. It might have been a simple view that the players now knew both were Johnson’s men, and therefore the coaching set up was going to be joined up....no more playing one coach off against another. So that’s the second reason that things have got better imho (Tomlin the other - see post above). What else? A system, a style, a work ethic, a belief, recruiting players for all of those. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cider head Posted October 2, 2017 Report Share Posted October 2, 2017 Play the game come the month of May 2018 still long way to go this season but so far so good... My humble pie is still in the freezer but happy how we are doing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sglosbcfc Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 10 hours ago, Ska Junkie said: Even though LJ has done very well, I stand by the opinion that he could easily have been sacked after the Fulham game and it wouldn't have been a surprise if he had been. The same was said after a particularly bad defeat for Ferguson relatively early on in his Manchester United days. I'm not trying to be wise after the event, the Fulham game was definitely the lowest point as we were ripped to shreds, I'm simply saying managers have to be given more time if boards/fans want them to build anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl&Toby Posted October 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 9 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said: Way too smug and premature - way too early for guff like this.....reminds me of a few posts when we were 0-3 up at Derby last season. Yep, we've made a pretty decent start to this season, but your assertion that we are 'no longer scraping a victory' doesn't make sense. We certainly scraped a draw at Brentford....not sure where you are going with that comment.... It's October 2nd and people are already saying LJ could be 'poached by a premier league side' or he has a 'job for life' at City or that he could be a 'future England manager'....good grief. Decent start to the season, I'm delighted at the way it's going so far, but there is a long, long way to go.... Hang on. What's smug and premature about any of this. I'm just putting forward an alternative view Might not be one that some want to read or hear but I genuinely believe we've made a far better and sustainable start to this season, that we have a far better and stronger squad than last season and that LJ and the team around him now have what it might take for us to achieve real progress. Its the easiest thing in the world to sit on the fence or be negative. In my experience you take that position and life is ******* miserable. Smile and try something different. You never know, you might like it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipdawg Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 I was very much of the opinion that Johnson would turn it round for most of the dark days of last season, but even I wanted him to be gone before the end of that winless run. Fickle fans or not, Johnson was incredibly lucky to keep his job last season and so you can't blame people for even some of the more 'emotional' statements made by fans last year. It's pointless being smug about whether or not you kept faith through the worst of times because the fact is that were it not for a very specific set of circumstances in LJs relationship with the club and the owner, there's no way he'd have made it through. It seems to have been a wise decision so far, but as we saw last season, things can go from good to bad very quickly in football Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Watts Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 13 hours ago, hodge said: We've made pretty much exactly the same start as last season, look how our season turned out. Fans have a perfectly good reason to be cautiously optimistic rather than jumping on the hype train straight away. What an utter load of bobbins. Have you actually seen us this season? Did you see our start last season? It appears as though you've looked at results and the table and nothing else...But that's where the similarities end. We are worlds apart performance and potential wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 can we play this one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 1 hour ago, chipdawg said: I was very much of the opinion that Johnson would turn it round for most of the dark days of last season, but even I wanted him to be gone before the end of that winless run. Fickle fans or not, Johnson was incredibly lucky to keep his job last season and so you can't blame people for even some of the more 'emotional' statements made by fans last year. It's pointless being smug about whether or not you kept faith through the worst of times because the fact is that were it not for a very specific set of circumstances in LJs relationship with the club and the owner, there's no way he'd have made it through. It seems to have been a wise decision so far, but as we saw last season, things can go from good to bad very quickly in football I'm pretty much as you. I always knew he would manage us one day but when he got the job I was surprised as I thought it was at least a couple of years too soon. I quite liked him as a player so was easy to like him as a person, I've met him quite a few times and always find him friendly and appreciative of fans. However I do agree if it had been anyone but him during that run that he would have gone. I was one of the last to admit defeat but it was a long journey back from the Preston night game last season and I fully expected him to be sacked the next morning, with my blessing. I really didn't want another sacking as that would have signified that we had failed yet again, but I really couldn't see how he or the club could recover from that low point in a cluster of low points. I felt sick to the stomach of relegation back to league one and I didn't want his time here to end so badly. I just wanted everyone to be put out of their misery, as that's what it was miserable. The whole thing was toxic and I was pretty certain we would be relegated as SteveL made it clear Lee had his backing and was a bit arrogant with his comments towards the fans on that radio interview. But maybe that's why SteveL is a successful business person and I'm not as he certainly had more nerve than me. As it stands nothing is won or lost October so right now I'm happy for them both to get on with it. I do think though the recruitment of Jamie McAlister and swopping a couple of players has helped the team enormously. We will have losses this season, maybe both matches and players, let's see how we deal with that as people aren't going to be half as patient if we go spiralling downwards again this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 1 hour ago, Steve Watts said: What an utter load of bobbins. Have you actually seen us this season? Did you see our start last season? It appears as though you've looked at results and the table and nothing else...But that's where the similarities end. We are worlds apart performance and potential wise. Yes I watched both thanks, but city operate in a results based business, therefore same start as last season. While performances have been very good we need to still take things one game at a time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl&Toby Posted October 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 1 hour ago, hodge said: Yes I watched both thanks, but city operate in a results based business, therefore same start as last season. While performances have been very good we need to still take things one game at a time. That's bollocks and far too simplistic. Whilst results might be the same - I don't know if they are - the manner of them is poles apart. Goals being scored across the team rather than mostly from a striker on loan. Ok a long way to go but I'm positive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl&Toby Posted October 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 3 hours ago, Super said: can we play this one? Nice. One of my faves. Especially naked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Negan Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 You’re no jigsaw are you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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