Underlying hate - Surfaced

[ZiderEyed]

4 minutes ago, Leveller said:

Booing your own team at half time seems a bizarre thing to do, when you want to encourage them to fight back.

I would never boo my own team, ever, even if I was muttering to myself.  But I could half understand it at the final whistle I suppose.

It wasn't a vociferous boo admittedly, but I was just so pissed off by my perceived lack of fight and spirit from the team. It was better second half. I see what you're saying though and if I was feeling a bit more righteous I'd probably agree with you.

[redfieldred]

1 minute ago, ZiderEyed said:

It wasn't a vociferous boo admittedly, but I was just so pissed off by my perceived lack of fight and spirit from the team. It was better second half. I see what you're saying though and if I was feeling a bit more righteous I'd probably agree with you.

I thought the best spell was the 15 minutes before half time. 

[ZiderEyed]

2 minutes ago, redfieldred said:

I thought the best spell was the 15 minutes before half time. 

Best spell but still not a good spell. Roundly beaten.

[Swede]

1 loss in 13.

Fans need to put things into perspective.

Believe it or not some teams won't just sit back and let us play.

We have to earn that right, especially in this league.

In fairness injuries, illness and I suspect the forthcoming Tuesday's team selection played its part today.

Leeds were better than us today.

With Pato, Baker & Korey Smith it might have been a different outcome.

LJ won't get everything right and I think he deserves a lot more respect than some are giving him.

[joe jordans teeth]

1 hour ago, ZiderEyed said:

I booed because I think it was a piss poor performance first half. Simple as that. And I don't appreciate being called a "joke". I love LJ to bits and I think he will continue to be head coach for a long time, but it wasn't acceptable to me.

Steady on with your sensible post,you will be classed in the Johnson out camp soon

 

[joe jordans teeth]

3 hours ago, ForeverRes said:

Even before today, it's quite obvious there is an underlying hate towards Lee Johnson. And today it has been surfaced once more.

Its been coming, and as much as I dislike it, it's not surprising. 

1 loss in 13, and 2 losses all season, yet there is fans on local radio stations and social media platforms laying into him. A large portion of fans have been waiting for this game to come in my opinion, because those fans are the ones who are still red faced from last seasons revival and a revival that has been carried on thus far this season. 

And they will sit there or reply to this calling me out, saying things like "I just want the best for this club" blah blah blah, but there sat there waiting for it to go wrong so they can say "told you, told you we should of got rid of him". And ofcourse no one will admit this, but today's reaction/ meltdown says it all. 

Its unbelievable how easy it has been for fans to almost flip a switch today and go back to "Johnson doesn't have a clue" & "Team selection doesn't make sense" 

One of the main criticisms I've seen today is Hegelers selection. Well last time he played, against Stoke, he was absolutely fantastic. Admittedly he was poor today, but how dare people berate Johnson over this? He's picked him based off previous performances and rightly so.

And to those fans who booed the players off at half time, you're an absolute joke. We're punching well above our weight at the moment in the top 6, we're not a big club, the sooner people realise this the better. We have the 14th highest attendances in the championship, with a good but not quite a finished article squad. But fans seem to think we have the right to go out and out perform every side we come up against. If people really thought along the way this season, we weren't going to have poor performances now and again, then you're deluded.

The boo's as half time particularly annoyed me like I said, especially after a good 20min spell from City leading up to half time, it was so poor and massively embarrassing. And it goes back to a underlying hate towards Johnson. And like I said, no one will admit this, but it's true. 

This will upset a few, because how dare I criticise fans who pay an entry fee. They can do and say what they want, you're right they can. But doesn't mean it's not highly embarrassing to the rest of us who appreciate the season as a whole so far and appreciate the effort the staff and players have been putting in. 

Get a grip and get behind the boys through the ups and downs. 

Up the City X

 

Not a bad post apart from the"how dare people berate Johnson for this" nonsense and then city fans are a joke,you have come across as a pompous patronising arse 

[Olé]

8 hours ago, ForeverRes said:

because those fans are the ones who are still red faced from last seasons revival

Depending on the circumstances there are some things which are now routine at Ashton Gate so I really can't believe you were surprised by the booing - it wasn't right but it's practically an unwritten rule that if City are losing by any margin it's going to happen (and no, I didn't join in).

With that said, I found the above remark quite provocative. I have given Johnson all the credit due this season and like others have acknowledged the differences in our football, but please let's not start re-writing history or casting the LJ reaction last season as anything other than it was.

Your overall sentiment is welcome and I agree with it, but the idea that people who felt the standard of performance and result last season was poor, should be somehow red faced by their views, or invalidated by the eventual survival of our £15-20m team, is frankly laughable.

Anyone who saw the football last season knows that it was nothing like this year (although Pack gave us flashbacks yesterday) and no one was left red faced by anything Lee Johnson did. We survived because players got roasted after Preston, manned up and Johnson left well alone.

Yesterday was a worrying throw-back to last season in terms of team selection but on the whole we have been playing some fantastic stuff this season and LJ has won over the doubters. But lets not pretend he did anything other than deserve the reaction that he got last season.

[Beni71]

I think it does show that although the squad is deeper and has more quality, the loss of a few key personnel will hurt us. Paterson, arguably our best player this season and Baker (has been a rock with Flint), been at the heart of our success. I'm not a big Korey fan but his tenacity was also lacking from the team yesterday. A fit Gary O'Neil would have also made a difference. 

[DKM Len]

7 hours ago, redfieldred said:

I thought the best spell was the 15 minutes before half time. 

I thought the best spell was half time itself.

[Vincent Vega]

21 minutes ago, Beni71 said:

I think it does show that although the squad is deeper and has more quality, the loss of a few key personnel will hurt us. Paterson, arguably our best player this season and Baker (has been a rock with Flint), been at the heart of our success. I'm not a big Korey fan but his tenacity was also lacking from the team yesterday. A fit Gary O'Neil would have also made a difference. 

A fit Gary O'Neil is a urban myth.

[Harry]

11 hours ago, ForeverRes said:

Why City fans rate Magnússon I really don't know? 

Hegeler started today because he was fantastic against Stoke when he came in. Based off that Johnson was entitled to pick him.

As for the other changes, Eliasson dropped for his appalling performance last week. Fammy was probably more unlucky to be dropped ..

not sure he got a huge much wrong, hindsight is wonderful and all that though 

I never said I rated Magnússon. I don't. But he's definitely a better CB than Hegeler. 

Besides, my point wasn't to have played Magnússon. It was to have played Wright at CB because he was our best available CB. The team was not set up to its strongest potential. Hence we struggled. 

That is the managers responsibility. So he should rightly be criticised. Doesn't mean I want him out, just means I believe he got it wrong yesterday. 

[SStandUp]

6 minutes ago, Harry said:

I never said I rated Magnússon. I don't. But he's definitely a better CB than Hegeler. 

Besides, my point wasn't to have played Magnússon. It was to have played Wright at CB because he was our best available CB. The team was not set up to its strongest potential. Hence we struggled. 

That is the managers responsibility. So he should rightly be criticised. Doesn't mean I want him out, just means I believe he got it wrong yesterday. 

Fair enough mate.

I can see you're point. However, I can also see why Johnson did go with Hegeler and kept Wright at RB. Hegeler let himself down massively yesterday, especially after a couple of very good performances previously. In hindsight though, knowing Hegeler was going to produce what he did, ofcourse you start Wright at CB... 

Pack let himself down yesterday aswell. Shame, because he's better than that

[SStandUp]

8 hours ago, joe jordans teeth said:

Not a bad post apart from the"how dare people berate Johnson for this" nonsense and then city fans are a joke,you have come across as a pompous patronising arse 

Yeh fair play, perhaps it does come across slightly like that. 

But the fans booing after a 12 match unbeaten run and the massive effort the boys have been putting in, was in my opinion, a joke. 

[downendcity]

51 minutes ago, ForeverRes said:

Yeh fair play, perhaps it does come across slightly like that. 

But the fans booing after a 12 match unbeaten run and the massive effort the boys have been putting in, was in my opinion, a joke. 

That's the closest you will get to Bristolians being positive 

[steviestevieneville]

12 hours ago, Harry said:

I think LJ gets fair criticism today. 

Arguably, our best 2 CB's are Baker & Wright. Flint 3rd, arguably Magnússon 4th, Hegeler 5th. 

So, when your number 1 is out, I believe it's essential to make sure your 2nd best one is in there. He had his 3rd and 5th rated CB's instead of his 2nd and 3rd - against what we know will be one of the stronger teams.

Thats mistake 1. Mistake 2 is having 3 nailed on first teamers missing (Baker, Smith, Paterson) and deciding to make 2 additional changes. With 3 big players already missing, meaning you already have to make 3 changes, why then make 2 further unnecessary changes. No need. 

Mistake 3 for me was not making 2 subs at half time. It worked for 15 mins when he made them and we appeared to up our game a little. Should've taken the bull by the horns at half time, took initiative back, by changing it up at half time.

This season has been better by far and I congratulate LJ on that, but today he must accept his fair share of criticism for his selections. Seeing our best/2nd best CB at RB with 2 inferior and dreadfully slow CB's inside him was just horrible. 

Agree with most of this harry. Only thing I would of done differently is start mags instead of Jens. Personally think Zak isn’t ready for championship football yet and would of got destroyed , especially with leko not tracking back to help. Strange decision too start Woodrow as well. 

[reddoc]

So along similar lines, how many more games without Reid scoring is it reasonable to wait, before I can start saying he's crap again?

[Esmond Million's Bung]

13 hours ago, ForeverRes said:

By the way, it's mainly social media platforms I'm referring too! 

How about some evidence to this claim?.

I haven't seen or heard much if any of what you claim, just the odd comment, in fact especially here on OTIB I think that the post match discussions has been mainly one of 'a bad day at the office' but pointing to on and off field weaknesses on the day, surely that is what football forums are all about?.

You will always have people on either side of any LJ debate who are only to willing to pounce after a couple of bad results and by the same token those who will spin an average display into 'all in the garden is rosey'.

I believe your claim is somewhat hysterical, mind you give it a couple more bad results and you might well have a point.

LJ's post match interview seemed to put most of the blame on the team, I didn't see anything that suggested that he believed that he got anything wrong, like team selection, tactics etc.

For me the most worrying aspect over the past 2 games is we haven't looked like scoring.

But hey ho as I said i'm happy to put this one down to a bad day at the office.

[paulcityfan]

What grates on me is the focus on Lee Johnson continually.  This LJ in or out is nonsense.  It is a managerial team effort, backed up by loads of backroom.  McAllister and Holden first, then a raft of others. So they are all to blame for individual games like that. 

That Johnson seems to seek attention by the way he goes about things is another matter.  I don't like it.  He is poor with the media, talks drivel on the whole, blames players individually or as a group and never accepts the flak himself.  This is why I don't like him as the 'head' coach.

[RobintheRed Red]

14 hours ago, Harry said:

I think LJ gets fair criticism today. 

Arguably, our best 2 CB's are Baker & Wright. Flint 3rd, arguably Magnússon 4th, Hegeler 5th. 

So, when your number 1 is out, I believe it's essential to make sure your 2nd best one is in there. He had his 3rd and 5th rated CB's instead of his 2nd and 3rd - against what we know will be one of the stronger teams.

Thats mistake 1. Mistake 2 is having 3 nailed on first teamers missing (Baker, Smith, Paterson) and deciding to make 2 additional changes. With 3 big players already missing, meaning you already have to make 3 changes, why then make 2 further unnecessary changes. No need. 

Mistake 3 for me was not making 2 subs at half time. It worked for 15 mins when he made them and we appeared to up our game a little. Should've taken the bull by the horns at half time, took initiative back, by changing it up at half time.

This season has been better by far and I congratulate LJ on that, but today he must accept his fair share of criticism for his selections. Seeing our best/2nd best CB at RB with 2 inferior and dreadfully slow CB's inside him was just horrible. 

Also how the hell can he play that waste of space from Fulham over Matty Taylor from the off can only be to justify signing him 

[Robbored]

2 minutes ago, paulcityfan said:

That Johnson seems to seek attention by the way he goes about things is another matter.  I don't like it.  He is poor with the media, talks drivel on the whole, blames players individually or as a group and never accepts the flak himself.  This is why I don't like him as the 'head' coach.

You sure you're not referring to his Dad? You're describing GJ perfectly and the reason I had no time for him as a manager.

But.....LJ is far, far more interesting and sensible in his dealings with not only with the media but us fans as well. He's open and candid in his interviews. Shows us fans respect by explaining his thinking behind certain decisions he's made, something many other managers don't do and can you name any manager who accept "flak" themselves?  

I can't think of any.

I pay more attention to LJs interviews because he talks sense and if you think it's drivel then says a great deal about your understanding of the game.

 

[paulcityfan]

20 minutes ago, Robbored said:

You sure you're not referring to his Dad? You're describing GJ perfectly and the reason I had no time for him as a manager.

But.....LJ is far, far more interesting and sensible in his dealings with not only with the media but us fans as well. He's open and candid in his interviews. Shows us fans respect by explaining his thinking behind certain decisions he's made, something many other managers don't do and can you name any manager who accept "flak" themselves?  

I can't think of any.

I pay more attention to LJs interviews because he talks sense and if you think it's drivel then says a great deal about your understanding of the game.

 

I beg to differ and I think that is a ridiculous thing to say to someone you don't know.  I'm giving an insight into the OP, from my perspective anyway, and its got nothing to do with understanding the game

[Mighty Squirrel Kingdom]

I thought yesterday was almost the perfect storm. Selection problems before the Palace game next week, a long unbeaten run, raised expectations due to a better than average start and opponents who we've only beaten once in the last ten meetings. Going two goals down after 15 minutes didn't help but yesterday's result isn't the end of the world. Overall so far I think we've been far better than the last two seasons and are clearly making progress, but if anyone's expecting a free ride to the Premier League they're mistaken.

[Robbored]

19 minutes ago, paulcityfan said:

I beg to differ and I think that is a ridiculous thing to say to someone you don't know.  I'm giving an insight into the OP, from my perspective anyway, and its got nothing to do with understanding the game

I'm basing my view not on you personally but on the opinion you posted. 

I cant believe anyone, even his fiercest critics  thinks that LJ talks "drivel".

Oh ....... Can you tell me which manager is prepared  to accept "flak?"

[Top Robin]

16 hours ago, Alessandro said:

TBF as someone who has given some people stick myself, I haven't read much of what you're taking about. 

Frustration all round, but rightly so, we want to win.

We don't need overreactions from either side of which your LJ toast is buttered.

People are frustrated because they know with the correct selection yesterday we could have got something from that game.

Also, it woudn't have been so bad if we had lost one nil perhaps, but three nil just makes it look and feel horrendous.

Lee is coming on as a young manager but there will be days like this again where his inexperience, naivety and lack of judgement will see the odd poor performances and results.

Lets hope that he learns from these mistakes and as he matures and improves as a manager that these days become fewer and further between.

 

[downendcity]

1 hour ago, Mighty Squirrel Kingdom said:

I thought yesterday was almost the perfect storm. Selection problems before the Palace game next week, a long unbeaten run, raised expectations due to a better than average start and opponents who we've only beaten once in the last ten meetings. Going two goals down after 15 minutes didn't help but yesterday's result isn't the end of the world. Overall so far I think we've been far better than the last two seasons and are clearly making progress, but if anyone's expecting a free ride to the Premier League they're mistaken.

The other element to "the perfect storm" was that Leeds were a team that were on a losing run before the international break and the break seems to have enabled them too regroup. A year ago Cardiff were on a similar poor run before the break and were rejuvenated thereafter against us.

Lesson for LJ - plan a poor run prior to the international break!

 

[Alessandro]

50 minutes ago, Top Robin said:

People are frustrated because they know with the correct selection yesterday we could have got something from that game.

Also, it woudn't have been so bad if we had lost one nil perhaps, but three nil just makes it look and feel horrendous.

Lee is coming on as a young manager but there will be days like this again where his inexperience, naivety and lack of judgement will see the odd poor performances and results.

Lets hope that he learns from these mistakes and as he matures and improves as a manager that these days become fewer and further between.

 

I don't really disagree with what you're saying there mate, I was more talking about the fans reaction.

We've been on a cracking run so far and I think that run and our position in the table has led a few people to get a little carried away. 

Equally, it's our first defeat in 11, so to say "here we go again" and "it's last season all over again" is also, IMO an overreaction.

I've said it before, there will be bad days, and those bad days will be like a hangover to last season, the same negative traits will be seen - but this will happen less, and already is, happening less.

The overall 'progress curve' is very much upwards though. There will be losses. There will be poor performances. From the manager, from the team, from individuals. That's life, that's football. 

Of course let's come on here and talk details, but it's the same old sweeping statements one way or the other.

It is still my opinion that we will be more than fine this season.

[REDOXO]

As a bloke said earlier, LJ has had benefits that no one else would have got.

However the thought that there was a mass of people all waiting to attack the bloke and are just waiting for his failure is paranoid. 

My first point would be, we are Bristol City, waiting for failure is what we do and we do it so well. But now there is expectation that we might actually be a club on the up....Bank rolled by a billionaire, New Ground, Trendy City no rivals to speak of etc etc, expectation has increased. 

We got stuffed yesterday. We were chasing the game due to individual and team errors. Flint crashed the ball into a player and it fell to their forward who passed it to the oncoming midfielder and bang one down. The second goal has comedy defending written all over it and at two down in ten minutes or so we were done. 

This had little to do with Patterson/Smith/Baker being out. This was just utter garbage. We had no fluidity and it took 35 mins to settle where upon we could have been four down

My expectancy is what ever 11 we put out we do not play like effing school boys on a Saturday morning 24500 is not two men and a ******* dog. However LJ is not responsible for individual errors or our inability to mark a runner at a corner. 

BUT the changes are questionable. The Magnússon has been playing LB excuse trotted out was just that an excuse for once again not playing him. Hegeler would have been better employed where Smith would have been, but we were taken back to a snapshot of the square pegs in round holes policy of last season, which many are fearful could happen again. I don't care what anybody thinks some of his decisions last season were bizarre and rightly some of us will worry he has his nose in Einstien again. 

Either way we were simply awful, my expectation is we are not utter shit, that we are competitive and don't make school boy errors. And if a few say that on radio Brizz and on here that's the right think to do that's what these mediums are for. 

So for the benefit of anyone not watching we were crap yesterday and poor last Friday, did not ever really look threatening in either game, one of which contained Smith/Patterson/Baker and as such yesterday was not a one off bad day at the office it was two wasted home games. It's up to LJ to buck it up now. It's what he gets paid for and thus far this season has done a decent job getting them up. Particularly as Brentford and Millwall were pretty crap too. 

[Guest]

Social media:

The place where some think the earth is flat; JFK was murdered by the vicar, in the kitchen with a dirty kipper; and some gas think that they are bigger than City.
You have to just take it that some people would believe anything and spout shite.
Either ignore it or engage in a little trolling yourself.

But what ever you do, just don't try to argue with the idiots as they'll beat you with experience.

Hear endeth the Sunday sermon at the fonteth of knowledge. Amen

[Esmond Million's Bung]

4 hours ago, Robbored said:

You sure you're not referring to his Dad? You're describing GJ perfectly and the reason I had no time for him as a manager.

But.....LJ is far, far more interesting and sensible in his dealings with not only with the media but us fans as well. He's open and candid in his interviews. Shows us fans respect by explaining his thinking behind certain decisions he's made, something many other managers don't do and can you name any manager who accept "flak" themselves?  

I can't think of any.

I pay more attention to LJs interviews because he talks sense and if you think it's drivel then says a great deal about your understanding of the game.

 

Nonsense as usual, just recently Conte took responsibility for Chelsea's defeat at home to Man City, it happens all of time managers seeking to relieve pressure on their players by accepting responsibility.

What I have never seen is a manager who brings on a player at 3-0 and in a game long since lost and after a final 5-0 loss in his post match only singles out only that player for any criticism.

[Robbored]

10 minutes ago, Esmond Million's Bung said:

Nonsense as usual, just recently Conte took responsibility for Chelsea's defeat at home to Man City, it happens all of time managers seeking to relieve pressure on their players by accepting responsibility.

What I have never seen is a manager who brings on a player at 3-0 and in a game long since lost and after a final 5-0 loss in his post match only singles out only that player for any criticism.

I pay little attention to PL managers comments either pre or post match so you pointing out Conte is lost on me.

As for last comment - no idea what you're referring to but there is one thing I don't like about LJ and that's when he calls out a player. He dad did the same I didn't like then and I don't like it now.  

Why they did/do it I don't know but it reflects badly on them and of course the player. Criticism of any player should be kep in house imv.