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Paterson SUBBED due to hamstring injury


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30 minutes ago, class not gas said:

The tactics Johnson uses are great the constant hasseling of the oppsition and the quick fire counterattack but does anyone think the way we play has contributed to all these injury or is it just a coincidence?

I think there must be some kind of correlation between high pressing, energetic teams, and hamstring/leg injuries

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Think some of the injuries are due to it but some are not. Djuric is a big guy and bound to have problems. Think he came in with some issues. Diedhiou and Hegeler both had knee issues from landing awkwardly. COD similarly took a bad tackle.  So things like that no, it isn’t the energetic game we play. 

Pisano and Paterson on the other hand probably. It is bound to happen to someone though. 

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1 hour ago, class not gas said:

The tactics Johnson uses are great the constant hasseling of the oppsition and the quick fire counterattack but does anyone think the way we play has contributed to all these injury or is it just a coincidence?

It’s got to take it’s toll on the players. That’s why you need depth & quality. 

You can see how draining our style of play must be and it can’t be a coincidence that we looked so bright & lively on Saturday, after having a full week since our last game, for a change. 

As noted above though, some of the injuries can’t be attributed to over doing it and are just bad luck. 

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1 minute ago, Bar BS3 said:

It’s got to take it’s toll on the players. That’s why you need depth & quality. 

You can see how draining our style of play must be and it can’t be a coincidence that we looked so bright & lively on Saturday, after having a full week since our last game, for a change. 

As noted above though, some of the injuries can’t be attributed to over doing it and are just bad luck. 

It also raises a question of what we do over Christmas. Games run closely together. From 16th onwards the run between games is 4 days, then 3 days, then 3 days, then 4 days, then 2 days. That's 5 games over 16 days and ironically the only one that isn't crucially important is the Man Utd game. We are doing brilliantly but we are either going to have rotate dramatically or find a Plan B - we are not going to be able to keep that intensity up for 90 minutes that many times in a short space of time. 

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2 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

It also raises a question of what we do over Christmas. Games run closely together. From 16th onwards the run between games is 4 days, then 3 days, then 3 days, then 4 days, then 2 days. That's 5 games over 16 days and ironically the only one that isn't crucially important is the Man Utd game. We are doing brilliantly but we are either going to have rotate dramatically or find a Plan B - we are not going to be able to keep that intensity up for 90 minutes that many times in a short space of time. 

It’s a crazy schedule! All very tough fixtures as well. I think by January we will be able to tell if we are able to be genuine challengers, or we can just be happy with having improved on last couple of seasons. If we are still top 6 come end of January, then I can’t see why we can’t stay there. 

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20 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

It also raises a question of what we do over Christmas. Games run closely together. From 16th onwards the run between games is 4 days, then 3 days, then 3 days, then 4 days, then 2 days. That's 5 games over 16 days and ironically the only one that isn't crucially important is the Man Utd game. We are doing brilliantly but we are either going to have rotate dramatically or find a Plan B - we are not going to be able to keep that intensity up for 90 minutes that many times in a short space of time. 

It is a crazy schedule , race horses wouldn't be permitted to play as many matches in so short a period time so why should these guys ? 

Our club is well placed with data analysts and medical care to maximise the performances of our squad so I'll let them worry about it .

 

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1 hour ago, ZiderEyed said:

I think there must be some kind of correlation between high pressing, energetic teams, and hamstring/leg injuries

If there's any scientific evidence to prove that then the physio/medical team would know about it and that means LJ and his coaches would know.

So I doubt that there is and that the current injury curse is co-incidence. 

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11 minutes ago, Robbored said:

If there's any scientific evidence to prove that then the physio/medical team would know about it and that means LJ and his coaches would know.

So I doubt that there is and that the current injury curse is co-incidence. 

Fairly sure it happened with Klopp at Dortmund when he first introduced his gegenpressing, and the same happened at Liverpool whence he first moved there.

At least if my memory serves it did.

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7 minutes ago, ZiderEyed said:

Fairly sure it happened with Klopp at Dortmund when he first introduced his gegenpressing, and the same happened at Liverpool whence he first moved there.

At least if my memory serves it did.

It might well of done but it's anecdotal and not scientifically proven an unless it is scientifically proven there's no justification for changing it.

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12 minutes ago, ZiderEyed said:

Fairly sure it happened with Klopp at Dortmund when he first introduced his gegenpressing, and the same happened at Liverpool whence he first moved there.

At least if my memory serves it did.

I think the difference with Klopp, at least at Liverpool, is he joined mid-season so players had to achieve levels of fitness and intensity without time to prepare. Johnson has had the pre-season plus a season and a half before and presumably has signed players who have the necessary qualities so it should be less of an issue for us. I honestly think most of the injuries this season have been simply bad luck rather than a wider pattern.

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3 minutes ago, Robbored said:

It might well of done but it's anecdotal and not scientifically proven an unless it is scientifically proven there's no justification for changing it.

Oh i'd not suggest that it needs changing, far from it, it's fantastic to watch and has given City a platform to be this high up the table going in to December.

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I've mentioned this before. I was sat speaking to one of the physio's recently, and I asked him about the injuries.

He alluded to the fact that the whole squad and Academy have mostly been hamstring problems this season. Niggles, tears and pulls.

We play a very energetic, high pressing game...it's not just during 90 mins, but practiced all week.

So it will take a toll eventually, as it would with any athlete.

We close and break very fast....standing start with small sprints. It will eventually have an effect.

But hey...why change it...it's working, it's entertaining, we are winning, and the fans are loving it. Would much rather watch us playing this way than say Cardiff.

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2 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

It also raises a question of what we do over Christmas. Games run closely together. From 16th onwards the run between games is 4 days, then 3 days, then 3 days, then 4 days, then 2 days. That's 5 games over 16 days and ironically the only one that isn't crucially important is the Man Utd game. We are doing brilliantly but we are either going to have rotate dramatically or find a Plan B - we are not going to be able to keep that intensity up for 90 minutes that many times in a short space of time. 

I wonder if due to the crazy schedule we may see the likes of Vyner, Kelly and Bakinson get some minutes?

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3 hours ago, Robbored said:

If there's any scientific evidence to prove that then the physio/medical team would know about it and that means LJ and his coaches would know.

So I doubt that there is and that the current injury curse is co-incidence. 

You say that but Arsenal have suffered recurring muscular injuries for years, and many experts put it down to their way of training and recovery etc. Sometimes maybe the science / physio team dont get it right?

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3 hours ago, Robbored said:

It might well of done but it's anecdotal and not scientifically proven an unless it is scientifically proven there's no justification for changing it.

Who was advocating changing it? Must've missed that.

If we all sat down on the pitch for 90 minutes we'd probably not get a huge amount of injuries, although the number of black eyes from flying balls would skyrocket.

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5 hours ago, class not gas said:

The tactics Johnson uses are great the constant hasseling of the oppsition and the quick fire counterattack but does anyone think the way we play has contributed to all these injury or is it just a coincidence?

Yep. Look how many injuries Liverpool have had since Klopp arrived.

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27 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

You say that but Arsenal have suffered recurring muscular injuries for years, and many experts put it down to their way of training and recovery etc. Sometimes maybe the science / physio team dont get it right?

No doubt that there is enough anecdotal 'evidence' to suggest a link but without scientific evidence essentially that 'link' is unproven speculation and no physio/doctor/manager or coach would act on unproven speculation.

However, if it was proven scientifically then then those involved would have solid eveidence based reasons for redesigning the training programs.

Some of us will remember a fad a few years back of some players wearing a nose clip to so say make breathing easier but eventually it was proven that the nose clip was a complete waste of time - it actually did nothing.

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3 hours ago, spudski said:

I've mentioned this before. I was sat speaking to one of the physio's recently, and I asked him about the injuries.

He alluded to the fact that the whole squad and Academy have mostly been hamstring problems this season. Niggles, tears and pulls.

We play a very energetic, high pressing game...it's not just during 90 mins, but practiced all week.

So it will take a toll eventually, as it would with any athlete.

We close and break very fast....standing start with small sprints. It will eventually have an effect.

But hey...why change it...it's working, it's entertaining, we are winning, and the fans are loving it. Would much rather watch us playing this way than say Cardiff.

I seem to remember Jurgen Klopp having the same issues in his first season at Liverpool. Somebody from Dortmund actually came out and said that they had the same problems there.

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As people have mentioned, most of our injuries haven't really been fatigue-related afaik. More bad luck. Pisano struggling also isn't a huge shock, given the stories we've heard about how how big the step up in pace has been for him.

In any case, it's not like hamstring injuries were uncommon until 5 years ago. I don't doubt that our style of play has a different effect on players, but I don't think we're getting way more injuries than we normally do. It's just a bit of bad luck, highlighted by us having to rush Djuric back after Diedhiou got injured.

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4 hours ago, Robbored said:

No doubt that there is enough anecdotal 'evidence' to suggest a link but without scientific evidence essentially that 'link' is unproven speculation and no physio/doctor/manager or coach would act on unproven speculation.

However, if it was proven scientifically then then those involved would have solid eveidence based reasons for redesigning the training programs.

Some of us will remember a fad a few years back of some players wearing a nose clip to so say make breathing easier but eventually it was proven that the nose clip was a complete waste of time - it actually did nothing.

The vests the players wear in training give all different evidence as to what's going on with a player...even down to whether they are hiding an injury. Or have an injury waiting to happen.

Maybe worth a read...this only covers half of the stats given... http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/10502787/statsports-the-training-technology-used-by-arsenal-man-city-barcelona-and-more

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