Fearing these injuries will do us...

[MC RISK77]

7 hours ago, spudski said:

... I can't help but feel our injuries will take their toll over the next month.

Last night, we really missed O'dowda I thought. Some of our 'squad' players just aren't quite there imo. I didn't think Elliasson made the impact needed that O'dowda usually does. His positioning to receive a pass was often wrong, and we lost an outlet many times.

Add that to the fact players will have off games, which I thought Pack and Reid did, then it will effect your general performance, especially when playing organised sides like Sheff Utd.

To our credit we battled and deserved something from the game. We were resilient and organised.

However...we won't be able to continue this game after game. It will take it's toll.

Seeing Korey hobble off hit home. To his credit, he was having a fine game last night. Long may that continue. Add Duric to the list as well....eeeeeeek.

For me...Elliasson, Leko, Woodrow, Taylor all need to step up a gear, and get up to speed with the rest of the squad. Leko especially...does my head in. Beats his man/men with ease only to run straight into a brick wall or miss pass, or shoot wildly. I can't honestly see how he fits in with our style of play.

If Korey is out...can see Magners being used and Bryan and Pato/Reid having to work extra hard in midfield.

I fear you may be right spudski...what I am holding onto though is we have a couple of quality signings to add to this outstanding group in January that will reinforce us

[downendcity]

4 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

 

I watched the game a second time and watched him closely - although he didn’t have any great impact I thought he did ok , considering he’s still learning and developing and trying to cope with the massive change to English Championship

Good first touch and neat and lively on occasions - also a lot more alert defensively , getting in his position quickly when Sheff had throws etc 

Certainly worked hard to contribute offensively and defensively - great first touch and some obvious ability

Did he have a ‘great game’   - no

but I actually thought there were some promising signs that he can adapt and contribute at this level

Didn't think he did badly but that was a "backs to the wall" type of game where it was difficult for him to show his best going forward.

[Big C]

14 minutes ago, View from the Dolman said:

Only Nathan Baker is close to picking up a ban for 10 yellows (the deadline for 5 yellows has passed).

http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/discipline/suspensions/clubdiscipline?league=31&club=10551931

Don’t you mean Marlon? He’s on eight bookings according to that list. Baker only has 3

[Chivs]

14 minutes ago, View from the Dolman said:

Only Nathan Baker is close to picking up a ban for 10 yellows (the deadline for 5 yellows has passed).

http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/discipline/suspensions/clubdiscipline?league=31&club=10551931

I'm confused.com.  Doesn't that table say that Marlon Pack is near to suspension?  Nathan Baker no where near?

Also, why do they list the foreign players by first name only?

[View from the Dolman]

1 minute ago, Chivs said:

I'm confused.com.  Doesn't that table say that Marlon Pack is near to suspension?  Nathan Baker no where near?

Also, why do they list the foreign players by first name only?

 

1 minute ago, Big C said:

Don’t you mean Marlon? He’s on eight bookings according to that list. Baker only has 3

 

Yep, @Chivs and @Big C have spotted my brain fart. I meant Marlon Pack and not Nathan Baker. D'oh.

[reddoh]

1 minute ago, View from the Dolman said:

 

 

Yep, @Chivs and @Big C have spotted my brain fart. I meant Marlon Pack and not Nathan Baker. D'oh.

don't bring me into your brain fart.

[spudski]

49 minutes ago, The Bard said:

If Eliasson gets the game time he will get used to how the game is played. You could have said the same about O'Dowda last season. He wasn't really affecting games.  Now he's being missed.  

Agree about Leko. He doesn't seem to have any real understanding of the game.  Can see him at Barnet in about 2 seasons. 

That's the point I'm trying to make fella...he may get game time, but during that time, he will be learning. It's during that learning period, that we will be less effective, as we would be with an up to speed Odowda.

Remember...when Odowda, Brownhill, Pato etc were 'learning last season, they were less effective than they are now....hence our poorer results.

[ChubStixx]

Amazing to think we're 3rd approaching Christmas and we've had our star striker out injured. 

[Major Isewater]

15 minutes ago, ChubStixx said:

Amazing to think we're 3rd approaching Christmas and we've had our star striker out injured. 

And we played the first half against the side fourth in the table without a " recognised " striker .

[Pezo]

29 minutes ago, ChubStixx said:

Amazing to think we're 3rd approaching Christmas and we've had our star striker out injured. 

Amazing to think he has played about the same amount of games as one of our central defenders and has scored one less goal!

[Fiale]

2 hours ago, spudski said:

That's the point I'm trying to make fella...he may get game time, but during that time, he will be learning. It's during that learning period, that we will be less effective, as we would be with an up to speed Odowda.

Remember...when Odowda, Brownhill, Pato etc were 'learning last season, they were less effective than they are now....hence our poorer results.

 

Sadly that's what we have signed upto though, enjoy players as their stars ascend and wait for the next crop to fill their boots as/when they leave. We have seen what prolonged game time has done for players Bryan, Reid, O-Dowda, Pack etc have had critics for a long time but have cemented themselves into the team as quality players, hopefully we can get the new lads game time so Vyner etc can benefit like Bryan did so we can have a painless transition when/if players leave and not be stuck back where we have a team full of inexperienced players that we need to bed in, and suffer results with.

[Wrongagain]

We have the big striker! Proven at scoring and full of running, bring one of the youth on and release flinty play where he wants

[JamesBCFC]

10 hours ago, Davefevs said:

 

Just one point.

They hit the woodwork 3 times.

The 4th was a save, and a cracking one at that.

To call it just hitting the woodwork takes credit away from the striker for actually hitting the target, and credit away from Fielding for making the save.

[TBW]

12 hours ago, Carey 6 said:

How far off is Gary O'Neil? 

Could really do with another centre mid if Smiths due to be out for a while. 

O'Neill will never play for this club again.

[Major Isewater]

10 hours ago, JamesBCFC said:

Just one point.

They hit the woodwork 3 times.

The 4th was a save, and a cracking one at that.

To call it just hitting the woodwork takes credit away from the striker for actually hitting the target, and credit away from Fielding for making the save.

The target is not the woodwork. 

[Davefevs]

10 hours ago, JamesBCFC said:

Just one point.

They hit the woodwork 3 times.

The 4th was a save, and a cracking one at that.

To call it just hitting the woodwork takes credit away from the striker for actually hitting the target, and credit away from Fielding for making the save.

Yep, good point.

[cheshire_red]

The club has set out its stall recruiting young players with (maybe) potential. Would the club have decided on this policy if there was genuine belief a promotion push was likely this season?

[ashton_fan]

For at least December we're going to have to make use of players like Woodrow, Bakinson, Kelly and Vyner for at least parts of games rather than just sitting on the bench or our remaining experienced players are going to get burnt out. Once we're into January Engvall will be immediately available and maybe we can get in a couple of loans early on to tide us over to February when the invalids will start to return to the squad. At least we're still OK as far as the defence is concerned which is the most important part of the team. 

[Son of Fred]

On 09/12/2017 at 10:46, spudski said:

... I can't help but feel our injuries will take their toll over the next month.

Last night, we really missed O'dowda I thought. Some of our 'squad' players just aren't quite there imo. I didn't think Elliasson made the impact needed that O'dowda usually does. His positioning to receive a pass was often wrong, and we lost an outlet many times.

Add that to the fact players will have off games, which I thought Pack and Reid did, then it will effect your general performance, especially when playing organised sides like Sheff Utd.

To our credit we battled and deserved something from the game. We were resilient and organised.

However...we won't be able to continue this game after game. It will take it's toll.

Seeing Korey hobble off hit home. To his credit, he was having a fine game last night. Long may that continue. Add Duric to the list as well....eeeeeeek.

For me...Elliasson, Leko, Woodrow, Taylor all need to step up a gear, and get up to speed with the rest of the squad. Leko especially...does my head in. Beats his man/men with ease only to run straight into a brick wall or miss pass, or shoot wildly. I can't honestly see how he fits in with our style of play.

If Korey is out...can see Magners being used and Bryan and Pato/Reid having to work extra hard in midfield.

Yep,bang on....

All squads suffer injury but it's getting silly now-sadly I feel the demands made upon the rest of the squad will be costing us a play off place.

[spudski]

20 minutes ago, cheshire_red said:

The club has set out its stall recruiting young players with (maybe) potential. Would the club have decided on this policy if there was genuine belief a promotion push was likely this season?

What other way is their to compete in this league? Those who don't have the financial clout to pay huge wages like other teams, have to find another way to compete. Like Brentford and Huddersfield have done.

Tbh...regardless off whether we finish in the final 6 or not, I would rather watch a team like we have, than a bunch of overpaid ex Prem players or journeymen pros with 'experience' playing for themselves every week.

Our philosophy is perfect imo.

Find the young hungry talented players, who still need developing...and bring on the Academy kids. Giving a manager time to develop a team and his style of playing. Getting everyone on board fighting in the same direction.

For me...part of the enjoyment of watching football, is seeing young players like Brownhill, Odowda and Pato develop. Watching their progress and journey. Seeing a team of players, all in it together. I'd rather watch that, than someone like Tomlin every week.

I love this team of players...everything we are doing as a Club.

If we were to get promotion, it would be perfect. Showing the football world how it should be done.

[SStandUp]

I think the injuries will have an affect. We're riding on a high at the moment, it's when inevitably we hit a blip that we may see this to its full extent. 

When you have a blip, it's often when you turn to bench/ squad to come up trumps, but we won't have this luxury, we will have to battle on with what we have. Which is very good, don't get me wrong, but you do need alternatives at times and we won't have this. 

However, on a positive, when these injured players come back in, it could work like new signings, which for the last 15 or so games, could work massively in our favour. 

But let's see what happens, we just need to stick by them no matter, even if we do hit a blip, because they've done us so proud up until now. If we lose a couple on the bounce, momentum can easily change, and it's down to us as fans, to try and keep them going! 

[italian dave]

21 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

 

I watched the game a second time and watched him closely - although he didn’t have any great impact I thought he did ok , considering he’s still learning and developing and trying to cope with the massive change to English Championship

Good first touch and neat and lively on occasions - also a lot more alert defensively , getting in his position quickly when Sheff had throws etc 

Certainly worked hard to contribute offensively and defensively - great first touch and some obvious ability

Did he have a ‘great game’   - no

but I actually thought there were some promising signs that he can adapt and contribute at this level

Agree. I think he's now where the likes of O'Dowda, Brownhill, Paterson were last season. As a club that's our game plan now: bring on players like that, but inevitably it will take a season or two. I'd put Maggers in the same place now, and next season it will be the likes of Bakinson, Kelly, Vyner. 

What will be interesting is whether and when we start selling: that's what SL always said was the end game, so make a shed load of money out of Pato when Bakinson is ready, for example. 

[SStandUp]

32 minutes ago, italian dave said:

Agree. I think he's now where the likes of O'Dowda, Brownhill, Paterson were last season. As a club that's our game plan now: bring on players like that, but inevitably it will take a season or two. I'd put Maggers in the same place now, and next season it will be the likes of Bakinson, Kelly, Vyner. 

What will be interesting is whether and when we start selling: that's what SL always said was the end game, so make a shed load of money out of Pato when Bakinson is ready, for example. 

Yeh exactly this. 

I'm loving the way this club is being run at the moment. I look at where we were and how we went about our business 5 years ago and it was a shambles. 

Last season it was imperative that we stayed up, otherwise the plan with this young group would of gone to pot. We stayed up, during tough times, with a young inexperienced squad, and I think in the long run that experienced of last season will serve us well. 

The philosophy is buy young and sell big, however, if we continue like we are, im sure Lansdown won't be keen to stick by this. 

Obviously last season was tough. But Lee Johnson probably isn't getting the credit he deserves because there are still doubters. The way he's nutured the likes of Paterson, O'dowda, Reid, Bryan etc. is a real testament to what a good coach he really is. Especially what he's done with Reid, it's unbelievable. 

Like I said, there are still doubters, because of what went on last year. But even last year, the way we managed to turn it around, is a credit to Johnson. I hope people are realising we've got a serious squad with a seriously good coach, and the long term future could be very bright. 

[downendcity]

1 hour ago, cheshire_red said:

The club has set out its stall recruiting young players with (maybe) potential. Would the club have decided on this policy if there was genuine belief a promotion push was likely this season?

No way the club would have envisaged the number of injuries we've suffered and in articular the longer term ones to key players all at the same time.

It  might well be that in the next month some of our younger players will have to step up to the plate. It might not be the ideal situation, but fingers crossed that if LJ makes the decision to play them they repay his faith and trust.

I well remember the number of times in the past ( going back to GJs time) when fans bemoaned that youngsters were not getting their chance. Many fans commented that being in a relegation battle was not the right time, because of the pressure. We now have the pressure of a promotion challenge, so perhaps we have to accept that there will never be the right time to find out whether you players have got what it takes, so the only way is to try them. 

 

 

 

[robin_unreliant]

Wonder how long it will be before we know how bad Korey's injury is? He took a bit of time after his bad injury to get back to his best. Will be a very big loss if he is out long term again.

[fairweather]

13 hours ago, spudski said:

What other way is their to compete in this league? Those who don't have the financial clout to pay huge wages like other teams, have to find another way to compete. Like Brentford and Huddersfield have done.

Tbh...regardless off whether we finish in the final 6 or not, I would rather watch a team like we have, than a bunch of overpaid ex Prem players or journeymen pros with 'experience' playing for themselves every week.

Our philosophy is perfect imo.

Find the young hungry talented players, who still need developing...and bring on the Academy kids. Giving a manager time to develop a team and his style of playing. Getting everyone on board fighting in the same direction.

For me...part of the enjoyment of watching football, is seeing young players like Brownhill, Odowda and Pato develop. Watching their progress and journey. Seeing a team of players, all in it together. I'd rather watch that, than someone like Tomlin every week.

I love this team of players...everything we are doing as a Club.

If we were to get promotion, it would be perfect. Showing the football world how it should be done.

Spot on  - 100%.

Its taken time for the young signings to step up and gel, but this is special. 

 

[LondonBristolian]

Being a bit controversial here but do you think, if injuries do not abate in the next two weeks, LJ needs to start to decide which games to prioritise?

I hate it as a concept but i cannot see how we are going to have the energy to play forest, Man Utd four days later, QPR three days later, Reading three days and that, Wolves four days after that and Villa two days later with the squad as threadbare as it is. i wonder if we need to heavily rotate the squad, even if it means throwing kids in at the deep end, against Man Utd and at least one other game (depressingly Wolves is the obvious one given where it comes in the fixture calendar).

I absolutely hate the idea of not putting our best team on the pitch for every single fixture but I fear if we do put out our strongest XI that many times in that many games, we’ll end up with a knackered and below par team that struggles to deliver against Reading, Wolves or Villa and a greater risk of further injuries...

[LondonBristolian]

On 09/12/2017 at 14:04, BobBobSuperBob said:

 

I watched the game a second time and watched him closely - although he didn’t have any great impact I thought he did ok , considering he’s still learning and developing and trying to cope with the massive change to English Championship

Good first touch and neat and lively on occasions - also a lot more alert defensively , getting in his position quickly when Sheff had throws etc 

Certainly worked hard to contribute offensively and defensively - great first touch and some obvious ability

Did he have a ‘great game’   - no

but I actually thought there were some promising signs that he can adapt and contribute at this level

Indeed.I think Eliasson is an outstanding prospect - quick and skilful with a super cross on him. It is going to take time before he is consistent but I think it is harder for young wingers to be consistent than any other position and the problem is that, until a player really clicks so beats his man and gets the delivery right each time, he will always look a bit underwhelming.

I remember shortly after Bolasie came to the club - may have been away to Millwall -he got the ball on the edge of the box and literally ran it over the goal line. It looked ridiculous but we judged him too early and missed out on a great player.

If someone told me that one day we would sell a current member of our squad for £30m+ and asked me to guess who it was, Eliasson is where my money would go. There is a long, long way to go until he gets to that point and it may never happen but I really think he has the potential.

[Major Isewater]

1 hour ago, LondonBristolian said:

Being a bit controversial here but do you think, if injuries do not abate in the next two weeks, LJ needs to start to decide which games to prioritise?

I hate it as a concept but i cannot see how we are going to have the energy to play forest, Man Utd four days later, QPR three days later, Reading three days and that, Wolves four days after that and Villa two days later with the squad as threadbare as it is. i wonder if we need to heavily rotate the squad, even if it means throwing kids in at the deep end, against Man Utd and at least one other game (depressingly Wolves is the obvious one given where it comes in the fixture calendar).

I absolutely hate the idea of not putting our best team on the pitch for every single fixture but I fear if we do put out our strongest XI that many times in that many games, we’ll end up with a knackered and below par team that struggles to deliver against Reading, Wolves or Villa and a greater risk of further injuries...

I have faith in the club to manage the squad .

Players are rarely ' injury ' free and accept playing when they can.

We have a strong science and medical team at the club who monitor each squad member and can provide a detailed risk analysis  for each one .

We are particularly unlucky this year with injuries but are well placed to deal with the situation.

[spudski]

1 hour ago, LondonBristolian said:

Indeed.I think Eliasson is an outstanding prospect - quick and skilful with a super cross on him. It is going to take time before he is consistent but I think it is harder for young wingers to be consistent than any other position and the problem is that, until a player really clicks so beats his man and gets the delivery right each time, he will always look a bit underwhelming.

I remember shortly after Bolasie came to the club - may have been away to Millwall -he got the ball on the edge of the box and literally ran it over the goal line. It looked ridiculous but we judged him too early and missed out on a great player.

If someone told me that one day we would sell a current member of our squad for £30m+ and asked me to guess who it was, Eliasson is where my money would go. There is a long, long way to go until he gets to that point and it may never happen but I really think he has the potential.

I agree about Eliasson, he looks like a good prospect and agree with all your points about him.

However...I look at how our team play most weeks, and i'm trying to understand how a traditional 'winger' fits in.

Getting to the byeline and whipping in a cross is all well and good...but how many have we got up front that can win that ball? We must have one of the smallest group of offensive players...Duric and Diediou apart, but how often do we play them? Injuries have dictated.

Sure his accurate crossing will be great at Set pieces, when Duric, Flint, Baker and Wright are in the box...but in general play?

We seem most effective when playing intricate passing in front of the box, either on the offensive or on the break.

Using width to spread play with wide men...yes I can understand. Coming inside or playing accurate passes to feet from wide....yes I can understand.

But as a traditional winger getting to the bye line and whipping in a cross...I can't see the benefits, especially with the likes of Reid, Patto and Taylor up front.

Sure, we might win the second ball...but the chances of winning that first ball are remote imo.