Players in

[BobBobSuperBob]

12 minutes ago, ScottishRed said:

I think you are right, the club now do face a dilemma, which I suspect, they did not envisage back in August.

We are half way through the season and are second and in the semi-final of a cup.The downside is that we have a lot of injuries, some of them lengthy, and the question marks remain on how long before these players are truly back at it - itsfine to say Duric and Fam will be back mid - Jan but it will be a few weeks after that before they are up to speed and that is assuming they have no set backs.

I think we do need to spend - RB, CM and I would also try and get a young PL striker in in loan.

We most certainly don't want to upset the dressing room with Billy Big Balls signing that could disrupt us, equally we must give ourselves every opportunity of getting promoted.

Getting to the play-offs would be a great achievement but failing in them, and they are a lottery, is no guarantee that we will be up there again next season even with the same squad  - witness Reading and Sheffield Wed from last season.

It is time to seize the moment and aim to finish the season where we are just now.

 

All good points

and particularly in relation to the highlighted para I think that's at the centre of this dilemma and exactly what I was thinking coming home post game yesterday

IIf we miss out this season , as you rightly point out (As you say - see Reading yesterday as last years PO finalists !!) there is no guarantee what fate awaits us next season , especially in a relenting Championship

How much confidence do SL / MA / LJ have that , if we miss out , would we continue to progress and have another serious attempt next season  lies at the heart of this (IMHO)

Thinking about it , I actually think that they will believe , possibly with self confidence considering the last 7/8 months , and the fact we have a young and developing squad , that we would / will ,  and thus , and it's only my hunch is that we will stick to our ethos / philosophy and not 'gamble' in any way (with still a chance that with some injured returning we may get over the line automatically or through the Play Offs anyway)

Add the likelihood that we may lose one or two of our best players if we don't go up and it's one difficult dilemma and not one I envy

[Carey 6]

1 hour ago, RedM said:

This is the info in the pinned thread at the top of the transfer forum which I was updating in the last transfer window:

PLAYERS OUT ON LOAN

Shawn McCoulsky - Newport - Until 01/01/18

Gustav Engvall - Djurgardens - Until 30/11/17

Taylor Moore - Cheltenham Town - Until 01/01/18

Freddie Hinds - Cheltenham Town - Until 01/01/18

Joe Morrell - Cheltenham Town - Until 01/01/18

Scott Golbourne - MK Dons - Until 14/01/18

Diego De Girolamo - Chesterfield - Season long loan.

Morrell will probably have his loan extended, I don't think Hinds will, so he's going to be in the u23's for the rest of the season or around our first team. 

Moore I hope we can secure him a loan in league one. Think he's actually playing below his level in league two. 

If Baker is out for a while, and MK Dons don't extend Golbournes contract, he could add a bit of depth to our squad again. 

[gow2gooseya]

14 hours ago, hodge said:

We already have these once players return from injury, which if reports are to be believed would be end of January. Need right back cover, creative midfielder and a pacy goalscorer. 

By the end of January we could be out of the race. We need them now.

Also, players returning from injury take time to regain their form and fitness

[BobBobSuperBob]

Food for thought

Was Reading an interesting post from. Birmingham City fan - Summarising......

Under Rowett  they had a semi happy squad

In comes Zola who recruits a number of players on higher wages , disgruntlement and divides in dressing room appear

Harry comes in and signs more players on even higher wages and the divides and disgruntlement deepens

In essence they have 3 sets of players in 3 bands of wages and have one unhappy dressing room

 

Any changes have to be done 'in sync' 

[Davefevs]

4 hours ago, palmerred said:

Experience isn’t just about age, you can find a 24yo who has had over 200 games of first team men’s football, that alone is experience. 

Agree, Brownhill has played 150 games at a tender age.

2 hours ago, Neo said:

No I’m with you actually cos Milan is fit and available so often unlike Crouch who has been rarely available all of his career.

I hope Milan recovers and stays fit but even the most rose tinted fan must admit that continued injuries are a concern.

 

50 minutes ago, Crackers Corner said:

Didn’t LJ state that this was a once and for all fix on long term issues he had suffered from, agree he will be excellent when fully fit.

Yes, I suspect his groin has niggled him for a good while and he’s got through.  This is a fix for ‘life’!  Once I had mine done, I never suffered again, apart from a bit of scar tissue pain.  I skied 6 weeks later and played 8 weeks later, without professional rehab.

[LondonBristolian]

I honestly don't think a striker is a priority. We're joint second top scores in the league. It is true that Djuric, Taylor and Woodrow are not prolific but one of the biggest improvements of our game this season is that we are not reliant on our strikers to score goals. If we can sign someone and they improve the team then brilliant but I think that will probably mean moving someone on.

To my mind, we need another full back if there is a realistic possibility of Pisano being out for the long-term. I would have no problem with Wright playing there for the rest of the season, and don't think Pisano will automatically force his way back in ahead of him but it does leave us short of cover defensively.

Beyond that, I think LJ's making the right calls in prioritising a central midfielder and a wide player - the latter cannot be good news for Leko. Personally the central midfielder is the big priority. The games come thick and fast and it is a demanding position. Brownhill, Pack and Smith have been excellent but they need help. 

[LondonBristolian]

4 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Food for thought

Was Reading an interesting post from. Birmingham City fan - Summarising......

Under Rowett  they had a semi happy squad

In comes Zola who recruits a number of players on higher wages , disgruntlement and divides in dressing room appear

Harry comes in and signs more players on even higher wages and the divides and disgruntlement deepens

In essence they have 3 sets of players in 3 bands of wages and have one unhappy dressing room

 

Any changes have to be done 'in sync' 

This is an important point but not one that worries me. I think it was the case for us a few years ago but I think SL, MA and LJ have made our transfer policy much more coherent. I have no doubt whoever signs will be signed to fit in with what we have, both in terms of temperament and wages. 

[RedM]

3 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Food for thought

Was Reading an interesting post from. Birmingham City fan - Summarising......

Under Rowett  they had a semi happy squad

In comes Zola who recruits a number of players on higher wages , disgruntlement and divides in dressing room appear

Harry comes in and signs more players on even higher wages and the divides and disgruntlement deepens

In essence they have 3 sets of players in 3 bands of wages and have one unhappy dressing room

 

Any changes have to be done 'in sync' 

Yes I agree. Or perhaps if we do go ‘big’ which I don’t think we will, it will have to be for a player that all our players would respect and even admire. A player of undoubted quality which will be inspiring to them and they would buy into the idea that he would be on much higher wages due to what he would bring and his reputation. I don’t think any of them would be divided over someone like that, but it would have to be a special player.

[BobBobSuperBob]

3 minutes ago, RedM said:

Yes I agree. Or perhaps if we do go ‘big’ which I don’t think we will, it will have to be for a player that all our players would respect and even admire. A player of undoubted quality which will be inspiring to them and they would buy into the idea that he would be on much higher wages due to what he would bring and his reputation. I don’t think any of them would be divided over someone like that, but it would have to be a special player.

Not so sure they'd be so understanding M

And if they were open to the idea the incoming Star would sure need to deliver otherwise you get players like for example BR , JB , BW , KS .... in fact any of them the way they are giving everything , thinking 'I'm busting my ass off here and Tomlin Star Player is on twice my money and contributing nothing

[RedM]

1 minute ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Not so sure they'd be so understanding M

And if they were open to the idea the incoming Star would sure need to deliver otherwise you get players like for example BR thinking 'I'm busting my ass off here and Tomlin Star Player is on twice my money and contributing nothing

That’s why I said it would have to be a very special player who they would admire. Can’t really think of anyone in our price range who would command that respect. Would have to be someone in the Premiership who is very experienced, but usually these players are looking for managers jobs...and we don’t want that!

[Fordy62]

16 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

I honestly don't think a striker is a priority. We're joint second top scores in the league. It is true that Djuric, Taylor and Woodrow are not prolific but one of the biggest improvements of our game this season is that we are not reliant on our strikers to score goals. If we can sign someone and they improve the team then brilliant but I think that will probably mean moving someone on.

To my mind, we need another full back if there is a realistic possibility of Pisano being out for the long-term. I would have no problem with Wright playing there for the rest of the season, and don't think Pisano will automatically force his way back in ahead of him but it does leave us short of cover defensively.

Beyond that, I think LJ's making the right calls in prioritising a central midfielder and a wide player - the latter cannot be good news for Leko. Personally the central midfielder is the big priority. The games come thick and fast and it is a demanding position. Brownhill, Pack and Smith have been excellent but they need help. 

We definitely haven’t seen the best of Leko yet and I genuinely think that before the end of the season is done he’ll have seen an extended run in the team. 

Leko is very very able. And I wonder if he might just be that extra creative spark that we’ll Need when we hit the difficult times. 

Leko on form would be like a multi million pound signing. 

Given the way he played against them away - and his West Brom origins, I wouldn’t be surprised to see him start on Saturday. 

[BobBobSuperBob]

4 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

We definitely haven’t seen the best of Leko yet and I genuinely think that before the end of the season is done he’ll have seen an extended run in the team. 

Leko is very very able. And I wonder if he might just be that extra creative spark that we’ll Need when we hit the difficult times. 

Leko on form would be like a multi million pound signing. 

Given the way he played against them away - and his West Brom origins, I wouldn’t be surprised to see him start on Saturday. 

Interesting shout that Fordy

Could be a brave and good left field selection

[Phileas Fogg]

2 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

We definitely haven’t seen the best of Leko yet and I genuinely think that before the end of the season is done he’ll have seen an extended run in the team. 

Leko is very very able. And I wonder if he might just be that extra creative spark that we’ll Need when we hit the difficult times. 

Leko on form would be like a multi million pound signing. 

Given the way he played against them away - and his West Brom origins, I wouldn’t be surprised to see him start on Saturday. 

Yeah he’s clearly got talent. I wonder now if there might’ve been something in what @spudski was saying about our present system being better with wide midfielders (Paterson, Bryan, O’Dowda, Brownhill) rather than out and out wingers (Leko, Eliasson).

I think our system relies heavily on understanding and defensive responsibility pressing from the front. Leko and Eliasson may struggle with that given their attacking instincts and inexperience. 

I’ve no doubt Leko (and Eliasson) will grow into great players. I’ve seen flashes of immense ability in both. Vs Derby Leko was unplayable. He’s clearly got it. Reminds me of Bolasie before he really blossomed.

[BobBobSuperBob]

I'd actually rather we use budget to enhance the contracts of our gems and incentives for the whole squad to stay here and be successful and reap ,the rewards both playing wise and financially here

[Fordy62]

12 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

I'd actually rather we use budget to enhance the contracts of our gems and incentives for the whole squad to stay here and be successful and reap ,the rewards both playing wise and financially here

I’m afraid the reality is that it’s promotion or bust in terms of our current squad. 

If we don’t get promoted we’re pretty much guaranteed to lose Joe, Josh & maybe Flinty. That’s a real worry, replacing them will be next to impossible.

If someone offered me the option to go into hibernation until the end of the season I really would. I know it sounds silly, but I’d almost rather have a season of mid table obscurity than this. I’m genuinely scared! I hate hope!

[palmerred]

1 minute ago, Fordy62 said:

I’m afraid the reality is that it’s promotion or bust in terms of our current squad. 

If we don’t get promoted we’re pretty much guaranteed to lose Joe, Josh & maybe Flinty. That’s a real worry, replacing them will be next to impossible.

If someone offered me the option to go into hibernation until the end of the season I really would. I know it sounds silly, but I’d almost rather have a season of mid table obscurity than this. I’m genuinely scared! I hate hope!

I agree those three may be sold if we don't get promoted, but Lloyd Kelly, Baker / Wright and Bakinson are all promising enough to make the step up at this level and that's before accounting for the £20m + we would have from selling that trio to reinvest. I personally don't see it as now or never and that it could be a dangerous approach to treat it that way.

[Selred]

38 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

We definitely haven’t seen the best of Leko yet and I genuinely think that before the end of the season is done he’ll have seen an extended run in the team. 

Leko is very very able. And I wonder if he might just be that extra creative spark that we’ll Need when we hit the difficult times. 

Leko on form would be like a multi million pound signing. 

Given the way he played against them away - and his West Brom origins, I wouldn’t be surprised to see him start on Saturday. 

I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s sent back in Jan. The guy is a liability, we have Eliasson who really should be getting these chances instead.

At QPR it was like playing with 10 men, his positioning is awful.

Playing a very attacking Wolves squad I hope he on the bench at most.

[redapple]

13 hours ago, Ser Davos Ciderworth said:

Just loving the names that we’re throwing out here, massive step up from forum meltdowns over the Dacks and Smiths of windows past! Best City team in years coyr 

I think Matt Smith would be a good loan signing now as cover and then competition for Duric and Diédhiou. He knows the club and most of the players and would fit straight in. 

Otherwise I don’t see the need for anyone else other than Central Midfield where our regular 3 are playing to their max and might just run out of fuel. 

[Davefevs]

22 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

I’m afraid the reality is that it’s promotion or bust in terms of our current squad. 

If we don’t get promoted we’re pretty much guaranteed to lose Joe, Josh & maybe Flinty. That’s a real worry, replacing them will be next to impossible.

If someone offered me the option to go into hibernation until the end of the season I really would. I know it sounds silly, but I’d almost rather have a season of mid table obscurity than this. I’m genuinely scared! I hate hope!

In terms of replacements for Joe, we have Kelly developing, Magnússon now showing he is a good defensive replacement - not as good as Joe with the ball at his feet, but an asset with it in his hands.  If we were going to sign someone, what did those if you who went to QPR think of Bidwell?  Everton youngster, schooled in Brentford’s style, I like him, but interested in others views.

Wright would play alongside Baker....not quite the same, but not a panic - let’s see whether a Moore has developed at CTFC?

Josh - mmmm, tough one.

[BobBobSuperBob]

46 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

In terms of replacements for Joe, we have Kelly developing, Magnússon now showing he is a good defensive replacement - not as good as Joe with the ball at his feet, but an asset with it in his hands.  If we were going to sign someone, what did those if you who went to QPR think of Bidwell?  Everton youngster, schooled in Brentford’s style, I like him, but interested in others views.

Wright would play alongside Baker....not quite the same, but not a panic - let’s see whether a Moore has developed at CTFC?

Josh - mmmm, tough one.

In JB & AFs cases - massive shoes to fill though Dave

As a Centre half and left sided full back / midfielder they have an unusual significant part in this current side - Both Good/ very good in their main task but also two of our most potent attacking threats / game winners

 

Add their characters and attitude and their decent experience - that’s bloody hard to replace !!

Josh has some great ability and a bright future but would probably actually be the easiest to replace / less impactive right now (Though I’m not convinced a Prem Club would come in for him atm) 

[Chappers]

If you want to see teams with big name signings, look below us in the table. What we are doing is very right, working, and sustainable, albeit with a few bumps along the way. We really need to appreciate what we have, a lot of other clubs fans will be envious of our team spirit, quality and entertaining football, without spending big. 

[spudski]

3 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said:

Yeah he’s clearly got talent. I wonder now if there might’ve been something in what @spudski was saying about our present system being better with wide midfielders (Paterson, Bryan, O’Dowda, Brownhill) rather than out and out wingers (Leko, Eliasson).

I think our system relies heavily on understanding and defensive responsibility pressing from the front. Leko and Eliasson may struggle with that given their attacking instincts and inexperience. 

I’ve no doubt Leko (and Eliasson) will grow into great players. I’ve seen flashes of immense ability in both. Vs Derby Leko was unplayable. He’s clearly got it. Reminds me of Bolasie before he really blossomed.

I've yet to see anything from Leko yet mate, that makes me think he'll make it. He's got pace, fancy quick feet...but imo, no footballing brain.

I saw much more in Boalaise, Albert and our own Elliason.

You can have all the ability in the world, but without an understanding and footballing brain it's useless.

Hopefully, that part of his game will improve. But I've seen kids his age with far less talent, yet far superior in the head so to speak. He's got a lot of catching up in my book.

Flashes of brilliance are one thing...it's consistency you want at this level. Someone you can rely on week in week out.

Tomlin and JET had flashes of brilliance occasionally...and they had a footballing brain. It was their physique and mental strength that let them down. Would I have them in my team...no way.

We have seen what you can do with players that have a brain, work ethic and some talent. I'd much rather have that and it's reliability...than some flash of brilliance occasionally.

Perhaps that's my personal choice...but for me, a team like we have right now, is much more successful than when carrying that talent' that might show up occasionally.

[ZiderEyed]

2 minutes ago, spudski said:

I've yet to see anything from Leko yet mate, that makes me think he'll make it. He's got pace, fancy quick feet...but imo, no footballing brain.

I saw much more in Boalaise, Albert and our own Elliason.

You can have all the ability in the world, but without an understanding and footballing brain it's useless.

Hopefully, that part of his game will improve. But I've seen kids his age with far less talent, yet far superior in the head so to speak. He's got a lot of catching up in my book.

Flashes of brilliance are one thing...it's consistency you want at this level. Someone you can rely on week in week out.

Tomlin and JET had flashes of brilliance occasionally...and they had a footballing brain. It was their physique and mental strength that let them down. Would I have them in my team...no way.

We have seen what you can do with players that have a brain, work ethic and some talent. I'd much rather have that and it's reliability...than some flash of brilliance occasionally.

Perhaps that's my personal choice...but for me, a team like we have right now, is much more successful than when carrying that talent' that might show up occasionally.

Bang on. Theres a lot of people who make it as a pro because they're athletic and well built. The amount of kids with good "footballing brains" that don't go anywhere in the game because they're not overly tall, quick or well built constantly astounds me.

IMO football is 70% mentality, 30% ability. It's all about how willing you are to apply your talent. There's obvious exceptions (Balotelli) but largely the best players in the world have good brains behind them.

Leko, from the admittedly little we've seen of him, seems unable to position himself in a way to support the team. He appears to see the game in a very 2D way and it leads to more disjointed performances. Derby is an exception, obviously, and I'm sure he's a good lad, but I've seen nothing that indicates to me that he'll be a success at this level, let alone with West Brom in the PL.

I'd love to be wrong.

[cityred exile]

How many of the 15 players  on loan are due back in January ?? Also what about Gus ?  decision time ?

[spudski]

I think the quote by LJ that stands out the most for me, is that the list of potential signings is getting shorter, as we don't want to lose our identity.

I've not seen a squad of players before be so united.

The quote about us being more together since the 300 Spartans, sums this season and squad up for me.

They work hard for one another...everyone of them. No one complaining...all getting on with the job at hand.

Any signing will be thought through long and hard.

Regardless of talent...their ethics, personality and 'DNA' dare I say, will be just as paramount.

One bad egg could ruin everything we've got right now.

Would rather go down fighting with this bunch and it's ethos.

Even if we weren't where are now, and say mid table, I'm sure most fans would see what we have is better than most.

I can't remember the Club ever feeling this together...fans, Club and players as one.

[JamesBCFC]

On 26/12/2017 at 20:22, luke_bristol said:

So the general consensus from reactions and replies is we shouldn’t strengthen in January, or we only need one or two players  

No, its that we shouldnt waste money just for the sake of spending big.

[GrahamC]

14 hours ago, RedM said:

This is the info in the pinned thread at the top of the transfer forum which I was updating in the last transfer window:

PLAYERS OUT ON LOAN

Shawn McCoulsky - Newport - Until 01/01/18

Gustav Engvall - Djurgardens - Until 30/11/17

Taylor Moore - Cheltenham Town - Until 01/01/18

Freddie Hinds - Cheltenham Town - Until 01/01/18

Joe Morrell - Cheltenham Town - Until 01/01/18

Scott Golbourne - MK Dons - Until 14/01/18

Diego De Girolamo - Chesterfield - Season long loan.

Very interesting.

Even though none of these players can feature until after the Villa game (Engvall aside) I wonder if it is worth keeping a few of them with us for most of January as we are down to bare bones and now also have concerns over Baker & Paterson.

It also allows us to see just how the injury situation is panning out.

I'd certainly get Moore, Morrell and Engvall back & around the squad until it was a bit bigger.

[WelshRobin]

13 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

If we miss out this season , as you rightly point out (As you say - see Reading yesterday as last years PO finalists !!) there is no guarantee what fate awaits us next season , especially in a relenting Championship

 

Considering how long it has taken us to potentially have another shot at the Premiership since the Hull play-off final it feels like it's a case of this season or it will be another long wait. With our players having recently had the spot light on them I fear losing some key components of our team if we fail to go up. If we can get through to the end of Jan in the top 3 I think we'll ultimately do it but it all hinges on those injuries and getting some cover in during January to bolster the depth of the squad that can be picked from.

[Lordofthebling]

I trust Lee, but I don't see how we need a wide player with players returning. I can see one coming in on loan, but not permanent...

Personally, I think we are crying out for a striker. I love Bobby, but I still don't think he is the answer. We need someone in the Kodjia mould...

I also think we need a creative midfielder, someone to break down those stubborn milwall or burton defences... if we got a striker- could Bobby take on this role?

But as said above - in Lee I trust. 

[Touch_my_butter]

On 27/12/2017 at 05:20, palmerred said:

Experience isn’t just about age, you can find a 24yo who has had over 200 games of first team men’s football, that alone is experience. 

Step forward: Mr Joe Bryan