Lose or Draw - Barton Twitter poll

[And Its Smith]

Interesting poll on Twitter, in terms of result.  Over 15k votes so result wont change much. 60% of fans voted would rather attack and lose 4-3 than park the bus and draw 0-0. 

I am one of the 60% but always thought I was in the minority on this subject.  Interested to hear people's views on here.  My view is I go to a game to be entertained. I am not interested in watching park the bus football. I want to see attractive football wherever possible and thankfully this team does that, even going to Man City and playing some good stuff. 

[bristolmoose]

Attack every day of the week!

Hate 'Park the bus' football.

Yesterday's match was brilliant to watch. The reason Manchester Blue lost is not because they played attacking football, but because they made three uncharacteristic mistakes in about 15 minutes. Even then they didn't give up and fought back, although there may be an argument that Liverpool should have at least got the bus driver behind the wheel with the engine running at 4-1!

[ExiledAjax]

Yes, I wish we could all go back to WM or 2-3-5 formations.  Screw the inversion.

[cidered abroad]

4 minutes ago, bristolmoose said:

Attack every day of the week!

Hate 'Park the bus' football.

Yesterday's match was brilliant to watch. The reason Manchester Blue lost is not because they played attacking football, but because they made three uncharacteristic mistakes in about 15 minutes. Even then they didn't give up and fought back, although there may be an argument that Liverpool should have at least got the bus driver behind the wheel with the engine running at 4-1!

A similar attitude by us against Man City led to a very good first leg. Not like the two Landan clubs who played a boring 0-0 first leg. Entertainment first everytime.

[Carey 6]

If I was a Man City fan, I'd choose park the bus & get a point for that one game every single time, but most fans took it in a different way to me & were complaining like he was suggesting they play that way all season. 

I can't believe people would rather attack and lose 4-3, **** that. Think a lot of Man City fans would've voted differently if the league wasn't already won. 

Would people genuinely rather we lost 4-3 against Derby than get a point in a boring 0-0 draw?

[O'Garlandinho]

Silly question really. I'd rather a point than lose 4-3.

However, i'd rather win 4-3 over winning 1-0.

[And Its Smith]

26 minutes ago, O'Garlandinho said:

Silly question really. I'd rather a point than lose 4-3.

However, i'd rather win 4-3 over winning 1-0.

Silly question even though your view is a minority one?

[Pezo]

47 minutes ago, Carey 6 said:

If I was a Man City fan, I'd choose park the bus & get a point for that one game every single time, but most fans took it in a different way to me & were complaining like he was suggesting they play that way all season. 

I can't believe people would rather attack and lose 4-3, **** that. Think a lot of Man City fans would've voted differently if the league wasn't already won. 

Would people genuinely rather we lost 4-3 against Derby than get a point in a boring 0-0 draw?

Thats a better question, it makes it personal.

I think people saying losing 4-3 are thinking from a neutral perspective.

Its also got plenty of other variables if its the last game of the season and you need 1 point yo stay up or go up then you take the 0-0 every day. If your playing a considerably better team you take the 0-0.

[ChippenhamRed]

Agree with the principle of playing to win rather than playing for a draw and I am happy that our current philosophy appears to be to do that. 

But I can’t agree that I’d rather lose 4-3 than draw 0-0. It’s a romantic thing to say but I’m struggling to believe that anyone on here would seriously rather we lost 4-3 at Derby than claimed a 0-0 draw. What if we end up missing out on 2nd spot on goal difference?

Perhaps a better statement would be to say you’d rather win 1 and lose 2 with a positive approach than draw 3 games with a negative approach. That takes the points element out of the argument.

[Leveller]

Pointless question. You don’t attack in the knowledge you’re going to lose 4-3, you attack in the hope you’re going to win, but risking a loss.

The majority want risky entertainment instead of risk free boredom.

 

[downendcity]

If that one extra point cost your team promotion, would you vote the same?

[Carey 6]

43 minutes ago, Pezo said:

Thats a better question, it makes it personal.

I think people saying losing 4-3 are thinking from a neutral perspective.

Its also got plenty of other variables if its the last game of the season and you need 1 point yo stay up or go up then you take the 0-0 every day. If your playing a considerably better team you take the 0-0.

The question is situational I guess. Man City fans will all say they'd rather that than watch a boring 0-0 like Mourinho got. But had the league been a lot tighter it would've been a completely different poll result imo 

[ZiderEyed]

4-3. Pulis or Klopp?

[TBW]

If I already know the only outcomes are losing 4-3 or drawing 0-0 then rather take the point.

Nowhere in this poll does it say there is a chance of winning in either one so it's idiotic to pick to lose ultimately.

[reformed_red]

I listened to this on talksport driving to work. Perspective;

Barton was saying that the park the bus style is needed when applicable, he actually said he loves watching Man Blue play and what they're doing is good. But they are one dimensional and they will come unstuck in the Champs League if they don't learn to divert from their star-dazzling way of playing (a bit like what happened to them v Monaco last year).

 

I love the way City play, but if we need to grind a result out on Friday then I'm happy.

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

Interesting question.

Depends on the opposition and circumstances. A 0-0 at the Etihad after parking the bus would’ve been a better result but not as entertaining as watching the game and style that we actually played...I also don’t think that tactic would’ve worked anyway.

Teams have parked the bus against us and it’s frustrating as hell. Under normal circumstances I’d rather we tried to win and lose than successfully playing for and getting a draw.

[Coxy27]

2 hours ago, RedDave said:

Silly question even though your view is a minority one?

I think the meaning behind saying it's a silly question is in the wording... Would you rather lose 4-3 or draw 0-0, obviously 0-0 is better, so taken literally (fixed result only) it is a silly question.

However, I think with a bit of common sense applied, the actual theory behind the question is clear. Would you rather come away from a game knowing you gave it a real go and had the intention of playing attractive attacking football, which may be slightly less likely to yield a positive result, but will be better entertainment? Or would you rather have a more boring, pragmatic approach that is less exciting to watch, but may yield more consistent results?

I can understand someone giving either answer, and I'd imagine the latter would be more popular if we were in desperate need of points at the wrong end of a table (Evidence being prem clubs appointing the likes of Hodgson/Allardyce when in relegation trouble).

[LondonBristolian]

I think the question is poorly phrased - simply in that nobody chooses their tactics with any guarantee or certainty what the result will be.

Surely what is really meant is “is it better to risk losing one point in order to gain three points?”

To my mind, simple mathematics is that, assuming a 50% probably of either consequence, you’ll do better over the course of the season by pushing for the 2 extra points. You may lose games but, over the season, you will end up with a higher points total. Of course you stand a different  chance in different games so there may be games you do take more or less risks but overall you will accrue more points by going for the win.

[JamesBCFC]

33 minutes ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

Interesting question.

Depends on the opposition and circumstances. A 0-0 at the Etihad after parking the bus would’ve been a better result but not as entertaining as watching the game and style that we actually played...I also don’t think that tactic would’ve worked anyway.

Teams have parked the bus against us and it’s frustrating as hell. Under normal circumstances I’d rather we tried to win and lose than successfully playing for and getting a draw.

In some respects, in a 2 legged game, a 4-3 away defeat is as good as a 0-0 draw.

In both cases a goalless or score draw doesn't help, in the former then that's it, in the latter you get 30 minutes extra before away goals come into play.

If you lost then you need to win, but know that you are capable of scoring past them.

If you drew you know you can keep them out, but need to find a way of scoring.

[Chivs]

I can't see Man City doing anything other than playing for a 0-0 against us in the second leg. 

Although, they may play for a 4-3 loss 

[ChippenhamRed]

Playing devil’s advocate here - when we played Wolves, there seemed to be a concensus view that once we’d scored, Flint should have reverted to defence. That’s an understandable viewpoint - but it would have been a defensive approach, prioritising protecting our lead rather than continuing with Flint up front and looking to score a second goal when we were on top in the game. It’s not quite “park the bus”, but it’s a similar mentality.

Yet here we are saying we’d rather our team took a positive approach to the game, risking defeat for a more adventurous approach.

Do these two views not contradict each other?

[The Fat Controller]

27 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said:

Playing devil’s advocate here - when we played Wolves, there seemed to be a concensus view that once we’d scored, Flint should have reverted to defence. That’s an understandable viewpoint - but it would have been a defensive approach, prioritising protecting our lead rather than continuing with Flint up front and looking to score a second goal when we were on top in the game. It’s not quite “park the bus”, but it’s a similar mentality.

Yet here we are saying we’d rather our team took a positive approach to the game, risking defeat for a more adventurous approach.

Do these two views not contradict each other?

No, I don't think so. Putting Flint back in defence having played him up front for a while isn't a "defensive" decision as such but just a revert to normal, balanced play approach. Given that we are, in my opinion, an attacking side anyway I don't think that the two situations compare really. 

If it had been the suggestion that we drop Flint back into position AND make a defensive substitution then it might've been more comparable. 

[marmite]

Do you realise a team could go through the season unbeaten, AND STILL GET RELEGATED, If they drew every game 0-0. i.e. 46 points.

[Davefevs]

6 hours ago, Carey 6 said:

If I was a Man City fan, I'd choose park the bus & get a point for that one game every single time, but most fans took it in a different way to me & were complaining like he was suggesting they play that way all season. 

I can't believe people would rather attack and lose 4-3, **** that. Think a lot of Man City fans would've voted differently if the league wasn't already won. 

Would people genuinely rather we lost 4-3 against Derby than get a point in a boring 0-0 draw?

I’m kinda with you.  There’s something about setting up to stifle for odd games here and there, with a bigger goal in mind.  

I’ll take the 0-0 Friday now, us that ok?

[ChippenhamRed]

36 minutes ago, Chris_Brown said:

No, I don't think so. Putting Flint back in defence having played him up front for a while isn't a "defensive" decision as such but just a revert to normal, balanced play approach. Given that we are, in my opinion, an attacking side anyway I don't think that the two situations compare really. 

If it had been the suggestion that we drop Flint back into position AND make a defensive substitution then it might've been more comparable. 

Good post, respect your view. I’m not sure I entirely agree that reverting Flint back to defence couldn’t be seen as defensive, on the basis that we were playing with only one up front (Reid) against 10 men, and we were controlling the game at the time. If not “defensive” per se, it would certainly have been a more conservative approach.

I actually think it would have been the right thing to do, I just think it does suggest that most fans are happier to take a pragmatic view of the game in reality, rather than the more gung-ho “I’d rather lose 4-3” mentality some are claiming.

[O'Garlandinho]

9 hours ago, RedDave said:

Silly question even though your view is a minority one?

Yes it is a silly question - would you rather draw or lose? Umm let me think 

The poll outcome just speaks a lot for Joey Barton's twitter followers, most of which are probably Man City fans trying to justify the loss yesterday.

[Assassin Reid]

7 hours ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

Depends on the opposition and circumstances.

You took the words out of my mouth!

[Aaron-Bcfc]

12 hours ago, Carey 6 said:

If I was a Man City fan, I'd choose park the bus & get a point for that one game every single time, but most fans took it in a different way to me & were complaining like he was suggesting they play that way all season. 

I can't believe people would rather attack and lose 4-3, **** that. Think a lot of Man City fans would've voted differently if the league wasn't already won. 

Would people genuinely rather we lost 4-3 against Derby than get a point in a boring 0-0 draw?

Absolutely baffling.

[Major Isewater]

We play to our strengths. Each opposition team needs a plan to beat them but should be overcome with our positives and natural way of playing instilled by our coaches which is on the front foot.

 I believe we will manage the game well . We will attack when we can and defend when we have to but we have no choice other than to win .

My gut feeling is a heroic 2-1 to the City but losing out on penalties. 

Hope I'm wrong .

 

[And Its Smith]

10 hours ago, O'Garlandinho said:

Yes it is a silly question - would you rather draw or lose? Umm let me think 

The poll outcome just speaks a lot for Joey Barton's twitter followers, most of which are probably Man City fans trying to justify the loss yesterday.

You've changed the question to a silly one.   Well done.

Is it ALL about winning? Not for me. If winning is everything then presumably you wont be content until we win the Premier League