Jump to content
IGNORED

Ashton confirms that we are not chasing promotion


Major Isewater

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Major Isewater said:

I'm sorry but " must not be disappointed if we don't get there ( the play offs )",  to have been in the top six for two thirds of the season and then drop out at the business end you'd have to be wired up strangely not to be . 

If this is the attitude that the club take then we are never going to go up.

 

Of course they'll be disappointed, just as we will be. But doesn't mean that they are not trying for it. Just a realistic attitude in case we don't?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, BRISTOL86 said:

I thought Ashton said the other day that we had no first teamers OOC in the summer (Pack summer ‘19 maybe?) 

I think it’s a tough one. Who (attainable targets only) with Championship ready experience was actually available in January that would have genuinely improved us?

Anyone at the wrong end of the table wouldn’t sell their best players and anyone challenging for the right end aren’t going to be selling to a promotion rival. This is why you can’t so great business in January. 

I think people need to accept our place a little and see that we are NOT a competitor to Derby/Villa/Wolves in the transfer food chain, it’s a fantasy to think we’re going to pay £30-£40k a week to snatch the same sort of player they’re targeting. Just not gonna happen under this regime.

Maybe after a few years of consistently challenging for the playoffs we will be competitive/attractive to that sort of player (is that even a desirable prospect??) and the wage budget will reflect that, but it’s evident that Lansdown isn’t just going to chuck sackfuls or cash at money grabbers who are only interested in coming here for a payday. 

After spending all season so far in the top six I’ll be as disappointed as anyone if we don’t see it through. But IMO if that is the case, it won’t be because we didn’t sign Jerome or Grabban or players of their ilk. 

I meant next summer regards contracts. If players are entering their last year and not signing...we will lose them early doors as thats what happens. I can honestly see quite a few moving on this summer, Flint, Bryan and Pack being 3.

Unless Johnson pulls some rabbits out the hat, we wont be as strong next season as this

Ok we can argue he has the summer to strengthen...but if we didnt do it right in January, Im not convinced we will do it in the summer.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Andy082005 said:

I meant next summer regards contracts. If players are entering their last year and not signing...we will lose them early doors as thats what happens. I can honestly see quite a few moving on this summer, Flint, Bryan and Pack being 3.

Unless Johnson pulls some rabbits out the hat, we wont be as strong next season as this

Ok we can argue he has the summer to strengthen...but if we didnt do it right in January, Im not convinced we will do it in the summer.

Tis a fair point but also to a degree the nature of the beast. Like I said the reality is almost every team in the world is lower down the food chain than someone else and thus is ultimately a selling club. We are actually less exposed than he majority in that regard thanks to Uncle Steve.

Also, the only reason Flint, Bryan, Reid and Co are even in the team is because someone else moved on and a chance came up. 

Individuals are not the be all and end all and sometimes it takes someone moving on to get someone else in or for someone else to grab their chance (Reid being a prime example)

We will also be a more attractive proposition next summer than last to new recruits after a good season. 

A lot I feel will depend on exactly how much the current players buy into the ‘vision’ for want of a better word. Do they truly believe in the systems and processes and believe we could go again and give it a good shot again next year? That will play a big part in their decision on stay or go I think  .

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, cidered abroad said:

Of course they'll be disappointed, just as we will be. But doesn't mean that they are not trying for it. Just a realistic attitude in case we don't?

I agree. Most of us will be disappointed but not devastated and go into next season with confidence.

A few fans will go into meltdown and slag off the club from here to breakfast time on facebook, twitter and the like but they will be in a minority, albeit a vocal one. The majority will accept that we`ve had a good season, one much better than pretty much everyone expected, and will look forward to the next one. ST sales will hold up, maybe even increase significantly if a lot of those who bought half-season ones opt to get a full one next year.

The club is in a good place right now, better probably than I can ever remember in my 45 odd years of being a City fan.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Robert the bruce said:

Seems we shopped in Aldi during the whole of January-maybe just the one visit to 'Marks 'n 'Sparks could've raised the quality just a little..?

Aldi has just been voted Britain's best supermarket ahead of M&S. :whistle:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, billywedlock said:

The big positive of this season has come from a core of our L1 championship side. Attitude , application and desire still count for a lot. And at  least this year we have had a game plan and have followed it through. Top ten will be a great result for our budget . SC really did build some heart at our club. LJ is now giving it a game plan . Give it a few more years and some of the younger players time to develop and we can be a top 6 side. We don't have the money to buy the quality Wolves have, but we have made great progress from relegation fodder to a team not many want to play. Our time will come, but not yet. Lj and the players are getting better all the time. When we have been 10 years in this league without relegation battles we will have made a proper jump, let's be clear we are still a L1/Champ yo yo club. The cup run has made people lose perspective. Top 10 and our cup run and the club will have had a massive season and should be happy. 

Ten years in this league before we can be considered a Championship club ! 

:blink:

This is a very special moment on OTIB . 

In years to come people  will say " Do you remember the day when Major Isewater was lost for words ? " 

Well , dear people , today is that day .

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

45 minutes ago, billywedlock said:

 When we have been 10 years in this league without relegation battles we will have made a proper jump, let's be clear we are still a L1/Champ yo yo club. The cup run has made people lose perspective. Top 10 and our cup run and the club will have had a massive season and should be happy. 

Mark, is that you? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Roger Red Hat said:

Lottery numbers please.

Come on lets be realistic here. Take the likes of Flint, Bryan and Pack out the team and we are a lot weaker. 

No doubt they will be replaced with Liam Walsh-esque replacements, i.e ..ones for the future

Be nice one day to be 'ready now'. I swear weve been talking about "the future" for the last 15 years under Steve Lansdowns tenure

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Andy082005 said:

Come on lets be realistic here. Take the likes of Flint, Bryan and Pack out the team and we are a lot weaker. 

No doubt they will be replaced with Liam Walsh-esque replacements, i.e ..ones for the future

Be nice one day to be 'ready now'. I swear weve been talking about "the future" for the last 15 years under Steve Lansdowns tenure

Personally speaking, I will wait and see what happens. I would suggest that is what being realist means.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Who only has 12 months left? As for Dlint and Bryan, we’re always going to be a selling club if bigger come in. Just like about 88 other clubs in the league. Even the likes of Arsenal don’t keep their best players. 

Some seem to think we will be decimated in the summer with interest from premier league clubs. I am sure there will be interest in our players but our valuations I think will put some teams off.

Realistically our biggest threat to losing players is from teams coming down looking for championship proven players. Even then, every team has to worry about that and it depends on who comes down.

Flint, Bryan, Brownhill, Reid, Baker and maybe even Fam may get some interest but will teams spend the 10-15m required to get them? I am not so convinced. I think we may lose 2 of our core, maybe 3. As we have seen this season though, we are not reliant on any 1 player. We have expected Flint to leave and have a good pairing without him. Mags covers LB well if we are being honest. He just isn’t as good as JB. Brownhill plays everywhere and would be a loss but we have CM options and wing options without him. 

This is why recruiting the way we do is necessary. This is why we shouldn’t stray from this. We always have someone ready to step in a fill a role. It won’t always be the same but will always keep us competitive. If we lost JB, Flint and Reid in the summer we could still have a lineup of

Fielding

Pisano Wright Baker Mags

Brownhill Pack Smith COD

Paterson

Fam

Steele, Eliasson, Walsh, Kelly, Vyner, Engvall, Djuirc

That is without spending any of the money received for those players. Maybe not top 6 but not relegation threatened. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Andy082005 said:

Come on lets be realistic here. Take the likes of Flint, Bryan and Pack out the team and we are a lot weaker. 

No doubt they will be replaced with Liam Walsh-esque replacements, i.e ..ones for the future

Be nice one day to be 'ready now'. I swear weve been talking about "the future" for the last 15 years under Steve Lansdowns tenure

If you get MA to work his magic on any outgoings, then you have a chance to re-invest not just with "ones for the now", but you have funds to also get "ones for the future".

For example, you sell Flint for £10m.

You buy ready made replacement for £3-5m on less wages than you’d need to keep Flint, plus you buy a "Taylor Moore" type or even two.  

I’m not convinced your comment in bold above is true.  Nathan Baker disproves that.  Fantastic signing who was both "one for the now" AND an upgrade on what we had.  If rumours are true we were clever in his that deal was structured, using future potential Kodjia add-ons, that may never gave materialised.  SL and MA are not to be be £€%&ed with imho.  Diony, whatever you think, is a fantastic signing in theory by being a loan.  Similar to Woodrow...try before you buy, deal agreed up front.  Ok, ultimately neither may pan out, but it is a very sensible approach.

Lets not forget, we have had to come through a brilliant L1 campaign and excitement of new Championship football on reduced crowds whilst the stadium was developed, and we’ve only had 12 months of 20k gates.  Those now regular 20k (more like 22k of late) are funding anywhere between £8-10m of additional revenue per annum.  That gives more scope in the summer too....possibly on the wages front, not just for incomings, but possibly stopping outgoings.  That’s £160k-£200k per week!!

In the summer I hope we’ve created a persona that makes us more attractive than last summer, and you attract a different calibre of player.  You can be a bit more bullish in attracting those players from say a Norwich, or a Reading, or a Sheffield Wednesday, who will be cutting their cloth accordingly after below-expectation campaigns, and want to go to a team that is gonna be pushing for promotion.

Its a delicate balance / dynamic, and we need to improve our recruitment a bit, to try to get those incoming players to be either:

- ready now and ready to improve the team

- for the future but in less than 18-24 months time

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

Some seem to think we will be decimated in the summer with interest from premier league clubs. I am sure there will be interest in our players but our valuations I think will put some teams off.

Realistically our biggest threat to losing players is from teams coming down looking for championship proven players. Even then, every team has to worry about that and it depends on who comes down.

Flint, Bryan, Brownhill, Reid, Baker and maybe even Fam may get some interest but will teams spend the 10-15m required to get them? I am not so convinced. I think we may lose 2 of our core, maybe 3. As we have seen this season though, we are not reliant on any 1 player. We have expected Flint to leave and have a good pairing without him. Mags covers LB well if we are being honest. He just isn’t as good as JB. Brownhill plays everywhere and would be a loss but we have CM options and wing options without him. 

This is why recruiting the way we do is necessary. This is why we shouldn’t stray from this. We always have someone ready to step in a fill a role. It won’t always be the same but will always keep us competitive. If we lost JB, Flint and Reid in the summer we could still have a lineup of

Fielding

Pisano Wright Baker Mags

Brownhill Pack Smith COD

Paterson

Fam

Steele, Eliasson, Walsh, Kelly, Vyner, Engvall, Djuirc

That is without spending any of the money received for those players. Maybe not top 6 but not relegation threatened. 

And that is a good starting point for summer recruitment.

Go and spend £5m on your right footed Nathan Baker

Go and spend £8m on Afobe (or whoever)

etc

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

Some seem to think we will be decimated in the summer with interest from premier league clubs. I am sure there will be interest in our players but our valuations I think will put some teams off.

Realistically our biggest threat to losing players is from teams coming down looking for championship proven players. Even then, every team has to worry about that and it depends on who comes down.

Flint, Bryan, Brownhill, Reid, Baker and maybe even Fam may get some interest but will teams spend the 10-15m required to get them? I am not so convinced. I think we may lose 2 of our core, maybe 3. As we have seen this season though, we are not reliant on any 1 player. We have expected Flint to leave and have a good pairing without him. Mags covers LB well if we are being honest. He just isn’t as good as JB. Brownhill plays everywhere and would be a loss but we have CM options and wing options without him. 

This is why recruiting the way we do is necessary. This is why we shouldn’t stray from this. We always have someone ready to step in a fill a role. It won’t always be the same but will always keep us competitive. If we lost JB, Flint and Reid in the summer we could still have a lineup of

Fielding

Pisano Wright Baker Mags

Brownhill Pack Smith COD

Paterson

Fam

Steele, Eliasson, Walsh, Kelly, Vyner, Engvall, Djuirc

That is without spending any of the money received for those players. Maybe not top 6 but not relegation threatened. 

And that really is worst case scenario, losing our 3 most coveted players. If we make, say, £25m off that trio, we have a frankly enormous amount of money to invest in to the squad.

I don't think replacing Bryan would be too difficult, and I'm not even convinced we'd lose him at the end of the season, we'd miss Flint's presence and his goals, but ultimately we'd get by with a very good partnership in Wright and Baker, it's just Reid that I'm concerned with replacing.

He doesn't do much difficult work, but he's got probably the best engine of any player I've ever seen at the Gate. How many strikers are there that can run like that, for almost every minute of a Championship season? We'd spend, hypothetically, £12m on replacing those players, and then £13m on brand new players without having to begin worrying about FFP.

Good times ahead.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, CliftonCliff said:

Gavin Williams was actually an extremely talented footballer who'd played in the PL for West Ham. Unfortunately, he also came into the Noble/Emmanuel-Thomas/Tomlin category in terms of application and translating that talent into consistent performances. Another vastly under-achieving player who might well look back and feel that he wasted his opportunities.

He absolutely loved a pint. Or 15. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, BRISTOL86 said:

As a general rule, you don’t do much of your summer business in January. Why would you bring in any more than you need to in Jan when prices are inflated? 

The lack of quality when we stepped up from L1 was due to failings in the summer not the prior Jan. 

As KITR stated our stock has never been higher, why waste that opportunity?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Andy082005 said:

Marlon Pack is one I know that. Not sure about Smith etc

I just dont buy all this sh*t about "long term plans" etc. I just think we have missed a massive, massive opportunity this January, and I for one will be disappointed if we dont finish in the top 6 now. 

I get all the "we would have been happy with top 10 at the start of the season"...but why settle for that when we made such a great and promising start.

We should have bought more Championship ready experience in January. Not spending at the right time is such a Bristol City thing to do

Well said, the last 4 weeks have been very depressing.. Will take a miracle to make the top 6 now!

Cardiff fans on the other hand might have to endure terrible football with a shit team but they won't be complaining next year if their in the premier league... Sometimes a shorter version of the plan can work without spending the earth can't it and the rewards are huge, maybe we're going about this the wrong way?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, CliftonCliff said:

 

All of which you have to respect, although it will undoubtedly piss off some people. It is, after all, how we’ve managed to get to the top six so far, and nobody’s moaning about that.

My concern is that it’ll piss off messrs Flint, Bryan, Reid and Brownhill who may  just pack their bags to more ambitious pastures in the summer ! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Andy082005 said:

Marlon Pack is one I know that. Not sure about Smith etc

I just dont buy all this sh*t about "long term plans" etc. I just think we have missed a massive, massive opportunity this January, and I for one will be disappointed if we dont finish in the top 6 now. 

I get all the "we would have been happy with top 10 at the start of the season"...but why settle for that when we made such a great and promising start.

We should have bought more Championship ready experience in January. Not spending at the right time is such a Bristol City thing to do

Feels a bit like we pulled Beyonce  but binned her because she might be a bit hard work !!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, EstoniaTallinnRed said:

Marks 'n' Sparks quality has been going downhill for years, but the prices haven't.   That's why they have had to close the majority of their stores.

I think that is not the reason. Whether the quality has reduced is open to debate. The reason behind their closures is on line competition. Every retailer faces the same problems but M & S and John Lewis are by far the best prepared for market changes. On the other hand I do not think Debenhams will last a whole lot longer. H of F is Chinese owned and while its losing money they will likely try longer to turn it around. Retail is not in a healthy state though is it.

And finally, M and S have over 1000 stores and have or are closing about 30 of them or so announced; hardly the majority.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 hours ago, Andy082005 said:

It wont be next season either when we lose the likes of Bryan and Flint

Not to mention the ones who only have 12 months left on their contract to

This is my big worry, if we do not get promoted it will surely be a huge task to commit these players to Ashton gate when bigger clubs start to circle.

it could be a interesting summer at Ashton gate if we are still in the championship with the spine and heart of our team the likes of Flint/Bryan/pack/smith surely being targeted by other clubs

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Baldyman said:

My concern is that it’ll piss off messrs Flint, Bryan, Reid and Brownhill who may  just pack their bags to more ambitious pastures in the summer ! 

That’s a possibility, but the reality is that players move all the time, sometimes even leaving quite successful clubs for pastures new for one reason or another. Are you suggesting that the whole planning strategy and long term direction of the club should be altered in the hope of persuading three or four of your better players to stick around? That sounds to me dangerously like player power gone raving mad and would be a very ill advised precedent to set in my view, much as I’d be disappointed to lose any of those named.

I doubt all four will leave this summer, but most fans have long been resigned to one or two moving on. The club is in a strong negotiating position, does not need to sell and will only do so at a price they think is in their interest. The whole way things are run has been set up to profit from player development if individuals leave and to bring on other young players to replace them. It is also worth remembering in the specific case of Flint that we have a solid group of central defenders, that he is approaching thirty and that we will have had arguably his best years for an initial outlay of a few hundred thousand. People really do need to step back an see the bigger picture.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Players come and go just the same as there is staff turnover in every workplace. It can have a detrimental effect but the stagnation caused by the lack of new blood can be much worse. 

Even in the most successful teams, it is normal to change at least a couple each season and we will be no different this summer. 

The trick is to continue to improve and improve and not replace better with worse. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, MC RISK77 said:

This is my big worry, if we do not get promoted it will surely be a huge task to commit these players to Ashton gate when bigger clubs start to circle.

it could be a interesting summer at Ashton gate if we are still in the championship with the spine and heart of our team the likes of Flint/Bryan/pack/smith surely being targeted by other clubs

That's why when you find yourself in this position you must grab it with both hands- I'm not saying we shoulda broken the bank,though i feel we could have done better business in January-for certain there is no guarantee that we will be challenging top six next season,or even the one after..for many reasons,not least of all losing a couple of our better players....... the momentum may be lost.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, Robert the bruce said:

That's why when you find yourself in this position you must grab it with both hands- I'm not saying we shoulda broken the bank,though i feel we could have done better business in January-for certain there is no guarantee that we will be challenging top six next season,or even the one after..for many reasons,not least of all losing a couple of our better players....... the momentum may be lost.

Probably not, i suspect we will start each season under johnson strongly, that plan then gets found and we struggle in the second part of the season.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

Who would you have tried to bring in?

For a beginnings a striker whom isn't bereft of confidence,has experience of playing in England,who won't need considerable adjustment/bedding in time before ( if we're lucky) making genuine contribution...oh,and has some kind of recent goalscoring record..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...