were you going to Russia?and now changed your mind?

[Gert Mare]

45 minutes ago, Harry said:

I can say exactly the same for every single South African I've ever met.

.....and that's not bloody surprising man!

[Southend Blue]

Many reasons why won't be taking an interest in this summers tournament, primary reasons being England simply aren't nowhere near good enough to make any serious impact and the sense of the worlds greatest football show being hosted in Russia just leaves me indifferent.  

Wasn't there fighting between fans at the last Euro's in 2016, what's to stop that continuing over there i.e. morons with unfinished business.      Went to Portugal in 2004 and saw some games,  the team back then played well on occasion and could have feasibly won it, subsequent years haven't really seen the same enthusiasm for the national team.  

[Portland Bill]

15 hours ago, 1bristolcity said:

Yes I think we understood  from the headline...

I wasn't going to go,anyway, but I doubt any undiplomatic, murderous, drugs cheating, Mafia style thug regime would care, won't put the committed principled England supporter off though.   

Russia’s safe.............all the Russians you mention are living in London now!!!!!

[Portland Bill]

15 hours ago, Chappers said:

Don't believe all that May says, after all, since she has been PM, the Tories has taken over £820k from Russian donors. 

The 9 people who rubbished the post above need to check their facts, because what Chappers has said is completely true.

[Chappers]

5 minutes ago, Portland Bill said:

The 9 people who rubbished the post above need to check their facts, because what Chappers has said is completely true.

Exactly, and Hammond has said it won't be returned as that would send the wrong message to Russia. Funny that the Mail, Scum etc. aren't reporting this.

[NickJ]

2 hours ago, Harry said:

I can say exactly the same for every single South African I've ever met.

Sympathise with some of what you say Harry, but.

Generalising here but South Africans - bar Cape Townonians - are in my experience I agree very arrogant, among other faults, but the one thing South Africa does not try to do is export its unpleasant side.

On the other hand anyone that has travelled to Ukraine and the Baltic states, and spoken with the people there, will know that residents there fear Russia and what they think it wants to do - based on recent history let's not forget - to their countries.

[NickJ]

13 minutes ago, Portland Bill said:

The 9 people who rubbished the post above need to check their facts, because what Chappers has said is completely true.

I've rubbished the post. Not because it isn't correct, but because it is absurd to suggest any relevant significance. 

Skripal is Russian, but he's nearly dead.

[Chappers]

So the Press can vilify JC about a phoney Czech connection, but ignore this rank hypocrisy. Exact figure according to the Times is £826,100. If the Tories are so concerned about UK citizens, maybe they should look at number of deaths and suicides caused by their DWP sanctions.

[Norn Iron]

19 hours ago, Major Isewater said:

I have Russian friends who adore the strongman Putin , and I understand why .

After the fall of the Soviet Union morale was at an all time low for the Russians . They'd been spanked by the West into submission and the country was vulnerable.

Putin gave them back their national pride , the bear showed it's teeth again. 

Russia needs to be strong given the size of the country and with whom they share their borders.

They also have a history of being invaded ( mostly ineffectively by the West ) and this is in their collective consciousness.

Putin is ruthless in protecting his empire . The Russians suck up the propaganda issued from the Kremlin or at best accept it as a necessary evil to live in ' peace ' .

 I believe in democracy and freedom and am sad that in the 21st century countries are still at war .

In the U.K. we are fortunate to be protected by the seas around us and have the luxury of stable borders. 

If we were menaced constantly by let's say , China , who would you prefer at the head of your government ? 

Theresa May or Putin ? 

That , I'm afraid, is the dilemma .

 

Wow, Major, a serious piece of journalism from you. Good points, well put.

However, I was expecting humour so when I read 'the luxury of stable borders' all I could think of was decorative wallpaper strips for the horses to look at.

[Welcome To The Jungle]

15 hours ago, havanatopia said:

I don't see how you can let Russia off so lightly; in what context might they be 'borderline' on anything frankly?

Aside from a few inept years or months under Yeltsin and a few honest but arm tied ones before that with Gorby Russia and the USSR before it and Russia before that has almost always been beligerent. 

I would love to wake up one morning and hear that half a dozen of the big footballing nations are boycotting 2018 and 2022 and then tell FIFA to stick it where the sun don't shine and set up a new International Football Federation. Ironically abbreviated to IFF... If only.

The question I asked myself  is would I go there on holiday? I would go to Russia, I wouldn't go to Qatar. Russia obviously has a lot of very bad points, but Qatar is on the next level in my opinion. By borderline, I meant borderline as to whether or not I'd visit. 

[havanatopia]

21 hours ago, Harry said:

Plenty, and I really mean plenty, of evidence that the Maidan revolution was a covert operation and funded by the ‘West’. 

Not to say there weren’t Ukrainians who were genuinely protesting but the whole thing was planned and had the collusion of the West. 

Can you post some internet links to such evidence please Harry? I always like a balanced view before forming an opinion.

38 minutes ago, Welcome To The Jungle said:

The question I asked myself  is would I go there on holiday? I would go to Russia, I wouldn't go to Qatar. Russia obviously has a lot of very bad points, but Qatar is on the next level in my opinion. By borderline, I meant borderline as to whether or not I'd visit. 

No doubt subjective but I get your point. That said both regimes have proven themselves to be less than open, let us put it like that.

[Red-Robbo]

I don't do business with Russia and I won't be visiting there for the World Cup they paid the crook Blatter for.

Other people can do what they want. 

I choose to boycott.

[The Bard]

15 hours ago, Red Rag said:

Sad to say but every rusian i have ever meet has been down right arogant, ignorant or pi55ed all 3 at times. I would not go there if they paid me. Perhaps i have been unfortunate in the rusians i have meet or just maybe its a national trait.

Israelis win the arrogant graceless p****s award for me.

[Kid in the Riot]

19 hours ago, Harry said:

It's also no coincidence that the ramping up of Russian tensions started a couple of years ago when they kicked the Rothschilds out of the country.  Russia no longer has a central bank owned by the Rothschilds (only a few countries left in the world which don't).  Bad things tend to happen to countries that don't have their money controlled by the Rothschilds - reference Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Sudan, Libya.  Only North Korea, Iran and Russia left to conquer and then they have total world domination.

Keep living your life with your eyes wide shut.

https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4311  

[Anglo-Welsh]

2 hours ago, The Bard said:

Israelis win the arrogant graceless p****s award for me.

Speak as you find I suppose. Every Israeli I have met has been exceedingly friendly.

Every nation has it own set of morons, Britain more so than any, but please don't categorise an entire country or people because you've had a few bad encounters.

[Super]

FA being put under pressure to pull England out.

[Welcome To The Jungle]

7 minutes ago, Super said:

FA being put under pressure to pull England out.

On one hand I'd be gutted for all the fans that have already forked out for flights, tickets etc. However I'd love it if this happened from a moral point of view. 

[pillred]

18 hours ago, Harry said:

I can say exactly the same for every single South African I've ever met.

were you a scriptwriter for spitting image by any chance?

[havanatopia]

 

42 minutes ago, Welcome To The Jungle said:

On one hand I'd be gutted for all the fans that have already forked out for flights, tickets etc. However I'd love it if this happened from a moral point of view. 

Could not agree more. Can't be bothered with the whole fiasco. It is not a world cup in my eyes; its a FIFA Cup run or funded by a murderous or corrupt bunch of neanderthals with less moral fibre than a microwaved potato and about as much brain matter where it counts.

I am sure there would be refunds for flights, tickets and hotels.

[poland_exile]

6 hours ago, The Bard said:

Israelis win the arrogant graceless p****s award for me.

honestly, this whole Russians (as in the ordinary ones, not these poisonous ones running the country) / Israelis / South Africans are awful is absolutely hilarious. Have people ever paused to think how the English are perceived? Do so, because we don't exactly cover ourselves in glory. My point isn't to slag England, but to highlight that there are good, bad, stupid, intelligent, kind, hostile people in every single country. Sweeping statements are being made on this thread that have no place in logic or reality.

[EstoniaTallinnRed]

On 3/13/2018 at 14:18, Major Isewater said:

I have Russian friends who adore the strongman Putin , and I understand why .

After the fall of the Soviet Union morale was at an all time low for the Russians . They'd been spanked by the West into submission and the country was vulnerable.

Putin gave them back their national pride , the bear showed it's teeth again. 

Russia needs to be strong given the size of the country and with whom they share their borders.

They also have a history of being invaded ( mostly ineffectively by the West ) and this is in their collective consciousness.

Putin is ruthless in protecting his empire . The Russians suck up the propaganda issued from the Kremlin or at best accept it as a necessary evil to live in ' peace ' .

 I believe in democracy and freedom and am sad that in the 21st century countries are still at war .

In the U.K. we are fortunate to be protected by the seas around us and have the luxury of stable borders. 

If we were menaced constantly by let's say , China , who would you prefer at the head of your government ? 

Theresa May or Putin ? 

That , I'm afraid, is the dilemma .

 

Agree with you Major,  as you know my wife is Russian and we go quite often to Moscow,  I have never had any problems with any local who knows I'm English and have always been treated with respect by anyone I talk to there, as i treat them with respect also.  My in - laws all are very happy to see me,  as are all of my wife's friends ,as most of them speak English very well.  I have always found the ordinary Russian people very friendly and willing to help you.  I really wouldn't worry about going there for the World Cup,  of course use your common sense and don't go on about anything political, that would be really stupid.  Just behave yourself,  respect the locals and the City,  keep out of trouble, because the Police don't mess about there.  Of course, I wouldn't blame  anyone if they decide not to go, that would be up to them, but I think as I said,  if you behave yourself,  then i don't think you are likely to be involved in any trouble.

[One Team In Keynsham]

I decided some time back that I had no real interest in this world cup, or the next one. And if I did end up going, I had no interest in following England. However, end of last year we concluded "screw it" and applied. Have tickets for our 3 group games, but still have to find sensible travel to 1st and 2nd games.

I am fairly certain I will get annoyed by the team, by our fans, and by the exploitation on costs of travel, accommodation, drink etc. And will vow never again.

Also have conditional semi-final and final tickets, but suspect they will end up being another interest-free loan provided to those cash-strapped FIFA suits.

[LondonBristolian]

On 3/13/2018 at 21:04, Harry said:

Incorrect.  Anti-semetism and anti-zionism are two very very very different things.  Nothing I have said is anti-semetic.

Are you sure? I strongly suspect you are not deliberately being anti-semitic. However you do appear to have been taken in by people who spread rumours about people who *just* happen to be Jewish secretly financing and controlling the world. Of course, they never come out and say they are accusing them of secretly running and financing the world *because*  they are Jewish but still it is somehow only Jewish people they accuse. The ideas you express in your post, and the sources you take them from, are little more than rehashed, updated and thinly veiled expressions of the ideas expressed in the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, a fictional document created by - coincidentally - the Russians to whip up anti-Semitic feeling in the 19th Century.

Going back to what happened last week, a Russian-created nerve agent was used on British soil in an attempted murder that appears to have been designed to be as theatrical as possible. Russia has responded to the allegations of their involvement by laughing, winking, hinting at their involvement and then broadly saying "so what? You can't do anything about it". The only people who can possibly deny knowledge of Russian involvement are the kind of people who would watch an episode Scooby Doo as an adult and be genuinely surprised when the criminal was revealed...

[Harry]

11 hours ago, havanatopia said:

Can you post some internet links to such evidence please Harry? I always like a balanced view before forming an opinion.

 

No probs havana. The following is good for starters.

Evidence of US funding for "democracy" in Ukraine - from the horses mouth.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article37599.htm

Article exploring US involvement in Ukraine - a democratically elected government turns away from the West and looks East instead, suddenly finds itself in a "peoples revolution" with a US Senator on the streets whipping it up and claiming "we're with you".  Who the hell gave McCain the right to do that?  If we had people on the streets protesting against our government for the provision of arms to Saudi against Yemen, would we appreciate a leading Iranian politician to join them and cry "Iran is with you".
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/apr/30/russia-ukraine-war-kiev-conflict

A history of election meddling from the US.  It's a regular thing, Ukraine was no different.  Just as Syria is no different too.
https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/americas-long-history-of-meddling-in-other-countries-elections

Video with plenty of evidence with sources confirming that the US were very much "in bed" with far-right neo-nazi's, whom they placed into power.

 

[Harry]

1 hour ago, LondonBristolian said:

Are you sure? I strongly suspect you are not deliberately being anti-semitic. However you do appear to have been taken in by people who spread rumours about people who *just* happen to be Jewish secretly financing and controlling the world. Of course, they never come out and say they are accusing them of secretly running and financing the world *because*  they are Jewish but still it is somehow only Jewish people they accuse. The ideas you express in your post, and the sources you take them from, are little more than rehashed, updated and thinly veiled expressions of the ideas expressed in the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, a fictional document created by - coincidentally - the Russians to whip up anti-Semitic feeling in the 19th Century.

Going back to what happened last week, a Russian-created nerve agent was used on British soil in an attempted murder that appears to have been designed to be as theatrical as possible. Russia has responded to the allegations of their involvement by laughing, winking, hinting at their involvement and then broadly saying "so what? You can't do anything about it". The only people who can possibly deny knowledge of Russian involvement are the kind of people who would watch an episode Scooby Doo as an adult and be genuinely surprised when the criminal was revealed...

You strongly suspect incorrectly, so with the greatest respect, please do not insinuate that I am anti-semetic.

To be a Zionist, you DO NOT have to be Jewish.
To be Jewish, you DO NOT have to be Zionist.
There are many Jews who are anti-zionist, does that make them anti-semetic?

Back to Russia, all that has been alleged to date is that a nerve agent originally developed in Russia many many years ago is supposedly the chemical with which a poisoning has occurred.  The Russians are nowadays not the only people with knowledge of this chemical.  In fact, the leading chemist in the programme now resides in the US, and the US have previously confirmed that they have worked with and tested this agent (and no doubt to be found at Porton Down too, only 7 miles up the road!).  So, just because the Russians "developed" it 50 years ago, doesn't mean they are the only ones who use it.  A Scotsman first "developed" antibiotics - are Scotland the only country who can administer these?
If you want to find any possible reason for the attempted murder of this Russian, perhaps investigate Orbis Intelligence, the knocked-up dossier which was intended to bring down Trump, which has proven to be a pile of codswallop.  It's quite likely this Skripal fella was closely aligned to that.

The Russians have not laughed and winked their way through this.  Allegations have been put to them by the UK PM, with a somewhat aggressive 36 hour deadline.  The Russians have responded by going through official channels to the OPCW and have asked that evidence be provided directly to them.  Just because this is not the response the UK wanted, doesn't mean they've winked their way through it - they've responded to the official chemical weapons advisory board.  To me, that is surely the correct way to do things, i.e. bring evidence to an already mutually agreed organisation, rather than shouting threats into the public domain.
Whether Russia end up guilty of this charge or not, the way Mrs May has gone about it is both childish and provocative.

[LondonBristolian]

13 minutes ago, Harry said:

You strongly suspect incorrectly, so with the greatest respect, please do not insinuate that I am anti-semetic.

To be a Zionist, you DO NOT have to be Jewish.
To be Jewish, you DO NOT have to be Zionist.
There are many Jews who are anti-zionist, does that make them anti-semetic?

 

Given I said I strongly suspected you were not being deliberate anti-Semitic, it is extremely unfortunate and sad if you are saying I am incorrect on that. However I suspect that, in fact, given that the last three lines in what I have quoted have literally nothing to do with the argument I made, I suspect you simply have not read my post correctly and have instead given a stock response. 

For what it is worth, you are absolutely right that there is a difference between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism. And buying into and feeding into conspiracies that wealthy people who just so happen to be Jewish are secretly running the world has nothing whatsoever to do with anti-Zionism...

[Harry]

3 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

Given I said I strongly suspected you were not being deliberate anti-Semitic, it is extremely unfortunate and sad if you are saying I am incorrect on that. However I suspect that, in fact, given that the last three lines in what I have quoted have literally nothing to do with the argument I made, I suspect you simply have not read my post correctly and have instead given a stock response. 

I read your post as thus :

1) I wrote that there is a difference between anti-semitism and anti-zionism and that nothing I said was anti-semetic.
2) You replied saying "Are you sure", and further "I strongly suspect you were not deliberately being anti-semetic."
3) I read this remark as whilst not being "deliberately anti-semetic", that you felt I was being unknowingly anti-semetic, thus you deemed what I had said to therefore be anti-semetic, thereby insinuating that I was.  Make sense?

If, as you say, I have mis-read your comments, then perhaps your comments shouldn't have been so disguised?

[LondonBristolian]

8 minutes ago, Harry said:

I read your post as thus :

1) I wrote that there is a difference between anti-semitism and anti-zionism and that nothing I said was anti-semetic.
2) You replied saying "Are you sure", and further "I strongly suspect you were not deliberately being anti-semetic."
3) I read this remark as whilst not being "deliberately anti-semetic", that you felt I was being unknowingly anti-semetic, thus you deemed what I had said to therefore be anti-semetic, thereby insinuating that I was.  Make sense?

If, as you say, I have mis-read your comments, then perhaps your comments shouldn't have been so disguised?

1) Actually nothing you said was anti-Zionist. Suggesting people who just so happen to be Jewish are secretly financing and running the world is not related to anti-Zionims.

2. I did say that. And I do strongly suspect that.

3) I apologise if you felt I was insinuating what you said to be unknowingly anti-Semitic. It certainly was not my intention to insinuate it. It was my intention to openly state that as fact. My advice, if you don't want people on the internet to accuse you to be unknowingly anti-Semitic, would be to stop posting unknowingly anti-Semitic things on the internet. 

[Harry]

4 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

1) Actually nothing you said was anti-Zionist. Suggesting people who just so happen to be Jewish are secretly financing and running the world is not related to anti-Zionims.

2. I did say that. And I do strongly suspect that.

3) I apologise if you felt I was insinuating what you said to be unknowingly anti-Semitic. It certainly was not my intention to insinuate it. It was my intention to openly state that as fact. My advice, if you don't want people on the internet to accuse you to be unknowingly anti-Semitic, would be to stop posting unknowingly anti-Semitic things on the internet. 

Apology accepted.  Advice ignored.

[LondonBristolian]

3 minutes ago, Harry said:

Apology accepted.  Advice ignored.

It is your prerogative to ignore the advice if you wish to do so. However, when you ignore the people pointing out you are unknowingly posting anti-Semitic things on the internet and continue to post them anyway, you become a person who is deliberately and knowingly posting anti-Semitic things on the internet. Which is your choice. But my advice would then be to grow used to being called anti-Semitic as that is the word people tend to use for people deliberately and knowingly posting anti-Semitic things on the internet.