CliftonCliff

Red boxing gloves might have been a better choice…

It was a really mediocre performance, but the overreaction is wearying. For one thing Malta were actually quite a bit better than their ranking would lead you to expect: very disciplined and organised. But in general these qualifiers against low-ranked sides are a bit of a nightmare. If you thrash them it gets dismissed because of the inferior quality of the opposition and if you struggle you get the kind of response we’ve seen on this thread. Patched up team, semi-meaningless game: an underwhelming outcome was almost inevitable. I can’t be the only one who was expecting something of the sort. Reserve judgment for the tournament proper. Last two or three we haven’t been too shabby.

Any local derby victory was a big deal back in the day.

You'd have to ask Maggie. (Or Rudolph: he's probably already had that conversation with her.)

Interesting appointment. Might keep an eye on his career progress.

Yep, mentioned it in an earlier post that you may have missed. I was there. It might just be my favourite memory of all of them, actually, because of the historical context. As you say, start of the long road back after the club came so close to going out of existence. In some ways, on an emotional level, it counted for even more than going up to the top tier. If you could wave a magic wand and transport me back to relive just one iconic moment, that might well be the one I'd nominate.

Interesting what you say about Stoke. I was in the area as a student for four years in the seventies and went to a lot of games. Fifty years or more is a long time and memories fade, but a few things stand out. I saw Best, Law and Charlton (RIP) there during that era, and Bobby Moore for WHU, among many others. George Eastham and Alan Hudson were among the more illustrious names to appear on the home team sheet, and Dennis Smith was a stalwart who of course later managed City. I had a certain affection for them then that has long since dissipated, but I do recall that old Victoria Ground as being a good old-fashioned traditional stadium and the home fans were passionate and very vocal. It used to be rocking for the bigger games. I’ve never been to the new Brittania stadium, but it doesn’t greatly surprise me if it’s somewhat soulless: so many new identikit grounds suffer from that. Any lingering soft spot I might have had for them was effectively extinguished after losing to them at Wembley and their subsequent association with Pulis (or TCP, as I usually refer to him)…

Think you’re allowed a small digression: they’re quite good fun during a slow news week, aren’t they, these little nostalgic trips down memory lane? Again, the Man C games came after I’d hung up my travelling boots, but I was at Forest. Another one for the archives. Both the away and home legs were fantastic games, in fact, and incredibly close. After some of the depressing and infuriating rubbish of a week or two ago, it’s actually therapeutic to be reminded of some of the highs of an adult lifetime spent following City.

Great occasions, all three of those, but I was only present at one of them. I was at University in 1974 - wait for it - sharing a flat with a guy who, though from Bradford, was actually a Leeds supporter. Couldn’t go to the game and hadn’t heard the result until I returned home from a tutorial to find my flat mate in a foul mood. It was a sweet moment. (We’re still in touch: he’s my only surviving friend from university days.) By 2014 my away trips had dwindled to a bare minimum, so wasn’t at Bradford, either, but yes, Portsmouth in 1974 is a treasured memory. I didn’t think of it as the focus was on away grounds, but if we’re talking special occasions whether home or away, that would be right up there. Thanks for reminding me!

Away days an extreme rarity for me these days (I’m getting into my late 70s) and it’s been that way for a long time, but I was keen when much younger and clocked up a few. Without getting bogged down in the nitpicking about what counts and what doesn’t, my total’s in the low forties. Totting them up and reading the nostalgia trips of others brought back some good old memories. I think we should give ourselves a pat on the back: we’ve all put our shift in at some point in our history and God knows it hasn’t always been a bed of roses. If I had to pick the outstanding moments, they would have to include the first ever appearance at Wembley under dear old Coops, the unforgettable (and controversial ) evening at Highfield Road, when City & Coventry effectively stopped playing to ensure both teams stayed up with a draw, and perhaps the sweetest moment of all, a victory at Chester, again under TC, to ensure promotion back to the third tier after the most catastrophic few years in the club’s history. What a day that was!

A Dolman Stand, an Atyeo Stand, a Lansdown Stand (I know,I know, it sticks in the throat,but…) and an Alan Dicks Stand would be a fair representation of the club’s post-war history, actually.

I blame Lee Johnson.

My sentiments exactly.

Some interesting points in the exchange between you two (MRR & Dave), though by the end I was becoming unclear as to exactly where you were in agreement and where you differed. The arguments put forward can all claim some validity. It comes down in the end to personal opinion, but for me the overwhelmingly important feature of the whole sorry business is (and forgive me for repeating what you’ve already said), not the obviously important question of whether the right decisions got made, but the almost unbelievably inept way in which the entire process was handled, a shambles and a PR car crash that is still ongoing and which they continue to make worse with every utterance. The sheer lack of judgment, professionalism and communication skills are breathtaking and have hugely alarming implications about the running of the club that actually go way beyond the question of whether it was right to sack NP. I find the incompetence of these people, given the power they wield, depressing and terrifying in equal measure. I’ve said my piece on Pearson at considerable length while the debate was raging and I’m done with that now, but the wider organisational issues are here to stay and a massive cause for concern.

If I’m being serious, rather than facetious, as in my post above, I agree with you and would say it reflects many of the criticisms that have been made recently of the corporate structure and governance - if you can call it that.. It’s hard to make judgments on paper, of course, but I suspect from the chaotic nature of last week’s events that if you were looking at the real situation on the ground, you’d find all sorts of ambiguities, lack of clear definition or roles, demarcation of responsibilities and blurred lines of communication. Doesn’t fill you with confidence.

Anything missing? Yes, a board of directors with a good blend of business, football and other relevant knowledge and skills, jointly responsible for collective decision making, to ensure that one or two individuals can’t make, in isolation, big calls on huge issues without being accountable to their colleagues. Oh, yes, and somebody with responsibility for communications and media relations, who can actually deliver a simple, coherent statement in front of a camera or microphone without shoving his foot in his mouth. Would that be too much to ask? (There’s more, but that’ll do for starters - don’t want to appear unreasonably demanding.)

Glad to read your reference to neutrality regarding the BT issue. I’m with you on that. I’ve not known what to make of the accusations flying back and forth and am not at all clear about exactly what it is that’s being alleged. I’m not at all comfortable, either, with dark hints about “gaslighting’” and the like in the absence of anything that looks like tangible evidence. By the standards of someone who’s normally only an occasional poster, my activity levels on the forum over the last couple of weeks have been off the scale and I’ve had a lot to say about the actions of various individuals, about which I feel very strongly, but I have avoided any reference to Tinnion and have not mentioned him, even indirectly, until this moment. I have long respected BT and would be very disappointed if he had been involved in undermining NP in any way, though I’m enough of realist to know that nobody’s ever completely squeaky clean. I do hope people have sound reasons and have given careful thought to what they’re saying before taking the step of implicating him in underhand machinations. Even when unfounded, these sorts of comments can tarnish reputations and mud sticks. It’s the one thing about the whole scenario that I’ve chosen to stay out of and, beyond what I’ve said here, will continue to do so.

I’m not exactly a frequent poster, though I have been much more active than usual during this extraordinary period. Nor am I anybody’s idea of a conspiracy theorist, but I’ve never seen so many members in such a short space of time - and nearly all of them with a similar agenda. It would make the most trusting individual sceptical. if I have unjustly implied that any one person is guilty of something they’re not, I’ll be the first to apologise. But really? You’d have to be off the scale naive to think this is mere coincidence. It’s also another devious but hopelessly transparent attempt to manipulate supporter opinion and an insult to people’s intelligence. It’s so ham fisted and self defeating. If’ it’s meant to swing opinion in favour of the ownership, it’s yet another bungled initiative and a classic own goal. Every time one of these posts appears it says to members that they’re taken for fools and makes even the most open minded fan angry and suspicious. I can’t imagine who within the club hierarchy would be so dim witted as to orchestrate this or think this could possibly help their cause. Oh, just a minute…

Hi. New around here, aren’t you? Welcome (though you may find that some people are suspicious about your motives and background. Can’t imagine why.)

Thanks mate, but much as it matters to me, BCFC is part of my life, but very far from all of it. Royally pissed off, for sure; in fact terminally pissed off as far as the ownership is concerned, but it would take more than that bunch of amateurs to affect me to that degree. Appreciate the sentiment, though, cheers.

You could not have summarised it better. Exactly word-for-word how I see it and I think that probably goes for a sizeable majority of the fan base. You can't help wondering how much homework Manning might have done before accepting the job and to what extent he's aware of the dynamics you so succinctly described.

Exactly. And the owners also say the squad is already good enough for a promotion challenge. So you might almost say, no excuses. No pressure, then. Good luck with that Liam. (And I mean that sincerely, as well, but I won't be holding my breath. Let's hope the Lansdowns are!)

And I might have added to my reply that NP didn't just bin people off. There are plenty of examples of his man management skills where someone was out of favour for a while while issues were addressed and came back to do very well - Atkinson, Wells, to name but two.

That was then, and this is now. The flaw in the argument, with respect, is that NP's zero tolerance of under-performing individuals was necessary and appropriate, given the culture of the club at the time. Marley Watkins? Tyreeq Bakinson? Not wanted on voyage, and rightly so. Pearson has left the club and the squad in a place where Manning won't need to do anything similar, which is yet one more reason why the previous manager shouldn't have been sacked in the first place.

I agree with what you say, but reading this I was uncomfortably reminded of Derek McInnes being appointed when regarded as one of the up and coming young managers in the game. That went well. Not that I thought he was as bad as some made him out to be. More that BCFC brought him when in he was doing extremely well and spat him out again with his career in far worse shape than when he joined us. He wasn't the first to suffer that fate and he won't be the last. Hopeful about Manning and hope he does well, despite my fury at the treatment handed out to NP - why would any genuine supporter want any other outcome? - but it's not just the head coach we need to worry about, is it? It's the same regime in place now that was there when DMcI was given the job. They've just made one incredibly wrong-headed decision, in the opinion of many of us. Don't bet against them doing it again at some future point.