16 Arrested In Dawn Raids

[Fodbarmyarmy]

No, you and the others defending violence at football matches are a disgrace. Every decent human being can see that.

Here's the thing parkender. I simply don't believe the people who claim they or their mates were victimised and did nothing wrong. You see, people who are guilty often protest their innocence.

There's no evidence to corroborate these claims that people are being arrested for nowt, not one bit, and there's plenty of reason not to believe it - not least what I saw with my own eyes at the derby match.

The Charlton fans you're talking about (in this article: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-24746019) deserved everything they got in my opinion. Why would we want someone glorifying racism and murder anywhere near a football match?

On the derby night, I've no sympathy for anybody that ran onto the pitch and made a beeline for the away fans. Anybody who threw something is someone I don't ever want at a football match again. If that upsets you, tough titty. I'm not trying to be a superfan, this is the sort of reaction that normal human beings should have.

We would suffer far less overbearing policing if you people stopped making excuses every time there was violence and started making these "people" unwelcome.

Well said Nibor.... these "type" of so called "fans" have no real arguments in their favour...the bullying attempts on this thread reveal their mentality.

Thanks to years of it being treated with kid gloves we have

Alcohol bans

Bubble matches

Restricted match day travel

Authorities treating supporters like cattle and no respect

Atmosphere killing rules & regulations

Draconian Escorts

the list goes on...

Basically the pathetic minority ruin the enjoyment of a day out by forcing authorities restrictions upon the mass.. so long may they continue to be sought out and banned...

[Mr Mosquito]

It goes further.

Bristol City FC are making their own rules up as they go along with little thought. The five pillars includes Community - the Bristol City Community Trust.

How can the Bristol City Community Trust work with youth offending services/probation etc when the club themselves are banning fans for life!

 

I'm wondering what type of supporters the club actually want. The City v Gas cup game was the only game in years where there was a proper traditional football atmosphere. We actually won the game and many supporters were overcome with emotion and there was much rejoicing.   Maybe if the club put out a team of players that were capable of winning more home games then the supporters would not be so inclined to invade the pitch in celebration. Making winning home games is the priority that the $billionaire Lansdown family should be prioritizing with their ownership of this football club.

[Nogbad the Bad]

Well said Nibor.... these "type" of so called "fans" have no real arguments in their favour...the bullying attempts on this thread reveal their mentality.

Thanks to years of it being treated with kid gloves we have

Alcohol bans

Bubble matches

Restricted match day travel

Authorities treating supporters like cattle and no respect

Atmosphere killing rules & regulations

Draconian Escorts

the list goes on...

Basically the pathetic minority ruin the enjoyment of a day out by forcing authorities restrictions upon the mass.. so long may they continue to be sought out and banned...

It's a vicious circle though.

 

The more bans City have in place - we were already at the top of the table before the events against Rovers - then the worse the club's reputation, and the more the certainty our fans will be treated to over the top policing going forward.

 

The 60+ lifetime bans now seeming likely to result from the Cardiff and Rovers games will ensure we will be near the top the table for years to come, and suffer the consequences - hardly any other clubs (to my knowledge) are taking similar draconian measures, and certainly not in such numbers.

[Cowshed]

No, you and the others defending violence at football matches are a disgrace. Every decent human being can see that.

Here's the thing parkender. I simply don't believe the people who claim they or their mates were victimised and did nothing wrong. You see, people who are guilty often protest their innocence.

There's no evidence to corroborate these claims that people are being arrested for nowt, not one bit, and there's plenty of reason not to believe it - not least what I saw with my own eyes at the derby match.

The Charlton fans you're talking about (in this article: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-24746019) deserved everything they got in my opinion. Why would we want someone glorifying racism and murder anywhere near a football match?

On the derby night, I've no sympathy for anybody that ran onto the pitch and made a beeline for the away fans. Anybody who threw something is someone I don't ever want at a football match again. If that upsets you, tough titty. I'm not trying to be a superfan, this is the sort of reaction that normal human beings should have.

We would suffer far less overbearing policing if you people stopped making excuses every time there was violence and started making these "people" unwelcome.

I have questioned the clubs policy. Where does a player with a criminal conviction fit with BCFC ordering fans be banned for life for minor offences. Players were deemed worthy of rehabilitation. Does this not apply to supporters anymore?

[Monkeh]

People get banned without conviction from Ashton Gate.

People get banned without thuggi thuggery happening.

With respect all the escalators are not reaching all your floors.

there were no coins being thrwon then? no seats were ripped out then? no officers injured then?

People who have been banned deserve it banter is banter but a small bunch always take it too far and don't see it as a problem

[semblar]

I have questioned the clubs policy. Where does a player with a criminal conviction fit with BCFC ordering fans be banned for life for minor offences. Players were deemed worthy of rehabilitation. Does this not apply to supporters anymore?

 

From the BCFC statement (bold added)

 

The club has recently issued 33 lifetime bans to those convicted of violent acts and disorder at the away match at Cardiff City in February, all of which had been handed nationwide football banning orders through the magistrates spanning between three and six years.

 

"Anyone found guilty of offences of this nature for the Bristol Rovers derby match can expect the same punishment with a lifetime ban from Bristol City FC.

 

I would agree (as would most) that while it is an offence a lifetime ban for "just" running onto the pitch would be disproportionate. But for me violence/disorder speak of more serious offences than that....and if found guilty of violent offences (such as the flag-for-javelin one) then the club is not going too far by considering a very lengthy or even a life ban in my opinion.

 

The number arrested over the last couple of days is a tiny proportion of those on the pitch, so I very much doubt that they were all "just" running onto the pitch. If they were then the CCTV evidence is bound to show that which would give them a good defence for any more serious charge...which should mean them not being found guilty of violence/disorder...

 

it is completely possible to be loud and passionate at a match without breaking the law to do so....

[tiz]

Think the main point is that the club give a chance by means of a meeting with those recieving the ban to tell their side of the story. The club in my opinion is posdibly being over zealous. My recent experience at Swindon has left me angry at heavy handed policing and has certainly made me more reflective of this whole debate.

A very good mate of mine suggested that fans should attend a match wearing annonymous masks as means of making the club aware without us they are nothing

I certainly think the club is severing links with the fans and don't like the way that is begining to feel. The contrasts between The Rovers statements and ours are at the opposite end of the spectrum and hate saying it but the rovers are right in this matter.

[Club and Country]

Football without fans is nothing

Bcfc should hang their heads in shame,

They should be asking the police what service they actually recieved on derby night for the money it cost

[Aizoon]

Football without fans is nothing

Bcfc should hang their heads in shame,

They should be asking the police what service they actually recieved on derby night for the money it cost

 

And that is, literally, the bottom line. We paid shedloads of money for policing that didn't do its job and alloweed a minor incident to blow up into a (fairly) major fracas. if the police had cracked down on the few idiots in the lower Dolman, none of this would have happened.

 

Of course, then the police wouldn't have got their cash next time, and the Post wouldn't have got its anti-football story...

[Super]

So the club should not help the police then. Just for the record my best mate took his 6 year old son that night and he hasn't wanted to go since. Should we just ignore the young ones that it upset then? Still as long as they idiots who shame this club are ok that's all that matters. Utterly emabarrasing.

[Cowshed]

From the BCFC statement them

Semblar the club are not adhering to their own statements. Fans are being banned for life who have not committed any violent offences.

If the community trust works with offenders service e.g Community payback shouldn't this work now cease?

Effectively BCFC are saying that offenders cannot be rehabilitated, but players have appeared in City color's who have had criminal convictions. Will BCFC now have a policy in place regarding ex offenders?

[Aizoon]

Yes, the club should help the police. However, the police should help the club, which they manifestly failed to do at the Rovers game.

Also, the club should not hand out life bans to fans who have been systematically provoked and, in the case mentioned above, assaulted by the South Wales Police.

[tiz]

What is utterly embarrassing is your one eyed view on this. The situation you give indeed is one no young or innocent fan should be subjected to. However your failure to weigh up and consider things before branding everyone idiots is indeed very embarrassing. For the record what was it that frightened the six year old lad

[semblar]

Semblar the club are not adhering to their own statements. Fans are being banned for life who have not committed any violent offences.

If the community trust works with offenders service e.g Community payback shouldn't this work now cease?

Effectively BCFC are saying that offenders cannot be rehabilitated, but players have appeared in City color's who have had criminal convictions. Will BCFC now have a policy in place regarding ex offenders?

 

I am in no position to judge that (or see the facebook posts yet - my work blocks fb too...). I do not see any problem with the stance shown in the statement (i.e. a lengthy or lifetime ban for violence/disorder). If people are receiving lifetime bans for minor offences then that would seem to be disproportionate - but I was not there to witness what did happen so cannot ultimately judge each and every case. I have never been kettled so it is hard to judge for sure - but I would almost certainly adopt a tactic of keeping my head down and my mouth shut, preferably nowhere near the edge of the group.

 

The two extremes are "All I/he did was...." and "prison is full of people who claim they are innocent". The truth will almost always lie somewhere in between.

 

For some of the cases at the derby match (e.g. the aforementioned flag throwing) I would agree wholeheartedly with a lifetime ban. For just going on the pitch and making no effortwhatsoever to aggravate the gas fans I would disagree wholeheartedly with a lifetime ban (although not necessarily with a ban of a more reasoned length). There are a whole range of activities in between the two - unfortunately the world is not quite so black and white as OTIB would have us collectively believe. But in general if somebody did something which would be construed as violent (including throwing coins) then they only have themselves to blame.

[Mr Mosquito]

Semblar the club are not adhering to their own statements. Fans are being banned for life who have not committed any violent offences.

If the community trust works with offenders service e.g Community payback shouldn't this work now cease?

Effectively BCFC are saying that offenders cannot be rehabilitated, but players have appeared in City color's who have had criminal convictions. Will BCFC now have a policy in place regarding ex offenders?

 

Excellent points that challenge the very core of the current BCFC ethos. The club board should now make clear its policy towards ex offenders of all categories and not just those that have committed very minor football related offences for which they can now be banned for life.

[Super]

What is utterly embarrassing is your one eyed view on this. The situation you give indeed is one no young or innocent fan should be subjected to. However your failure to weigh up and consider things before branding everyone idiots is indeed very embarrassing. For the record what was it that frightened the six year old lad

Just the nastiness of the evening really, he saw coins being thrown and bottles not pleasant. People who threw this stuff should be banned for life that is not even a debate.

[Sixtyseconds]

there were no coins being thrwon then? no seats were ripped out then? no officers injured then?

People who have been banned deserve it banter is banter but a small bunch always take it too far and don't see it as a problem

Deserve what? Birching? Branding? Ducking stools?

Some of them?

All of them?

As retrospective LIFE bans are being handed out to the wrong sorts for virtually sweet fa how about CRB checking all the fans, employees and players to check they are made of the right stuff to enter this virtuous paragon FC's gaff on Saturdays??

[phantom]

Just the nastiness of the evening really, he saw coins being thrown and bottles not pleasant. People who threw this stuff should be banned for life that is not even a debate.

 

Thought the only coins etc thrown were from the Away end?

 

Where we they sat?

[Nibor]

Thought the only coins etc thrown were from the Away end?

Just from waiting to leave the Dolman I saw dozens of "City fans" hurling things into the away end personally and there were many well documented reports as well as Sky footage of the same, and you can bet there's a whole lot of cctv of it too. I find it hard to believe anybody in the ground could miss this.

[dezgimed]

Heres a thought, go to a football match, enjoy yourself, but don't give it the big I am trying to act like a tough guy, showing off to your mates and then blaming the police when you get a telling off or whatever it is the lower class do.

 

 

I suspect the IQ of those arrested/in trouble is pretty low and no doubt they think the police are scum and blah de blah.

 

Usual chav nonsense.

[Rich_s]

FFS. Maybe it's just me but surely this thread has been done to death by now. ******* boring beyond belief.

[phantom]

Just from waiting to leave the Dolman I saw dozens of "City fans" hurling things into the away end personally and there were many well documented reports as well as Sky footage of the same, and you can bet there's a whole lot of cctv of it too. I find it hard to believe anybody in the ground could miss this.

 

Why would anyone find it hard to miss?

People in the Atyeo or far ends of the Williams / Dollman would not have seen this

 

Never saw any sky footage of City fans throwing anything - certainly wasn't broadcast on the programme.

 

So you are saying people from the EE throwing things ?

Not heard that one before

[phantom]

FFS. Maybe it's just me but surely this thread has been done to death by now. Fucking boring beyond belief.

 

Stop reading it then - Simple!

[phantom]

Heres a thought, go to a football match, enjoy yourself, but don't give it the big I am trying to act like a tough guy, showing off to your mates and then blaming the police when you get a telling off or whatever it is the lower class do.

 

 

I suspect the IQ of those arrested/in trouble is pretty low and no doubt they think the police are scum and blah de blah.

 

Usual chav nonsense.

 

Oh dear - and there was me thinking football "hooligans" had the stereotype of being 40's+ and holding down decent jobs

[dezgimed]

Oh dear - and there was me thinking football "hooligans" had the stereotype of being 40's+ and holding down decent jobs

 

Its just nonsense, all of this. Stop defending this rubbish.

 

Do any of them have successful careers/lives? Find it hard to believe.

[Barrs Court Red]

Its just nonsense, all of this. Stop defending this rubbish.

Do any of them have successful careers/lives? Find it hard to believe.

Then dont ccomment on what you know arse all about.

[phantom]

 

Do any of them have successful careers/lives? Find it hard to believe.

 

Based on what?

[dezgimed]

Ok let me try and explain it very clearly.

 

I know several people who have been involved in such incidents in the past, and none of them are very bright.

 

I know several people who have been to hundreds of football matches home and away and never had any problems, and they have good jobs and have done well for themselves.

 

FFS would you expect your board of directors or company secretary to go off on weekends getting arrested because of football altercations?

 

Just think about it. There is a very common theme with the offenders and their apologists 99% of the time. Perhaps it isnt the case this time, who knows.

[Barrs Court Red]

Common theme? Which offenders, all offenders?

[One Team In Keynsham]

Well said Nibor.... these "type" of so called "fans" have no real arguments in their favour...the bullying attempts on this thread reveal their mentality.

Thanks to years of it being treated with kid gloves we have

Alcohol bans

Bubble matches

Restricted match day travel

Authorities treating supporters like cattle and no respect

Atmosphere killing rules & regulations

Draconian Escorts

the list goes on...

Basically the pathetic minority ruin the enjoyment of a day out by forcing authorities restrictions upon the mass.. so long may they continue to be sought out and banned...

I have been checking this thread periodically to see if someone would pipe up with this gem of a phrase.  Amazed it took post #274.

 

My own thoughts on the original discussion:  as much as I think a life-ban from football for running on the pitch is draconian, I also realise that one would have to have lived under a rock for many years to not be aware it is an offence, and sooner or later someone, somewhere was going to fall foul of it.  In my view, similar deal to speeding:  every one knows that the limit in a built up area is 30, many people go faster and get away with it and don't consider it a problem, but it is an absolute, and one day you'll speed past the copper who decides to take you in for it.