Jump to content

Welcome to One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums

Welcome to One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums, like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community, but don't worry this is a simple free process that requires minimal information for you to signup. Be a part of One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums by signing in or creating an account.

  • Start new topics and reply to others
  • Full access to all forums (not all viewable as guest)
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get email updates
  • Get your own profile page and make new friends
  • Send personal messages to other members.
  • Support OTIB with a premium membership

willem ii

Willem Ii

Recommended Posts

Is there someone providing reports on BCFC matches to the Willem II supporters?

 

I don't speak Dutch nor do I attend many BCFC matches so am not volunteering.  I'd be pleasantly surprised to learn if we had a forum-dwelling, match-attending, dutch-speaking fan who could commit to providing them...but you never know.

 

Also this. http://www.otib.co.uk/index.php?/topic/165015-friendly-bcfc-willem-ii/?hl=willem

Edited by ExiledAjax

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What's this ? Load of City fans planning to all go over for a match ? Imagine if a few hundred City turned up for a Willem game.

 

They already do, and have been doing so for a while now. Only just coming onto the radar of many in BS3 now

It is safe to say the amazing welcome City fans get in Tilburg is not reciprocated by our club.

Luckilly the Willem fans understand the limitations of our club, and that the amazing rapport between both sets of supporters is the key

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Time for a whip round

It would not be feasible to attempt to equal that within the ground. Effort will be made to do at least something. It will be humbler.

BristolCity.jpg

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It would not be feasible to attempt to equal that within the ground.

 

Just out of interest, why is it not feasible?

 

I often read comments such as this (from yourself and others), but then I also read comments from DaveL suggesting that any flags are able to be displayed, so just end up being a bit confused.

 

What exactly are the hurdles that have to be overcome? What rules & regs do City have in place to actually stop it from happening?

 

I realise this might come across as a 'challenge' to your statement - it's not meant to be at all, merely intrigued as to the details behind the consistently contradictory posts..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just out of interest, why is it not feasible?

I often read comments such as this (from yourself and others), but then I also read comments from DaveL suggesting that any flags are able to be displayed, so just end up being a bit confused.

What exactly are the hurdles that have to be overcome? What rules & regs do City have in place to actually stop it from happening?

I realise this might come across as a 'challenge' to your statement - it's not meant to be at all, merely intrigued as to the details behind the consistently contradictory posts..

Dave L is the clubs liaison and does not "always" cross reference his remarks and evidence base them.

Bristol City have rules, not national regulations that are arbitrary and peculiar to Bristol City and those in charge of safety. Bristol City's "own" rules are different to numerous other clubs e.g Accrington, Aldershot, Aston Villa, Brighton, Crystal Palace, Exeter, Lincoln, Liverpool, Middlesbrough, Oxford ... It really all comes down to will, and wanting to be different.

Meanwhile In Tilburg depending on level of match you can drink in your seat, smoke, seats are reserved / unreserved [they do not seem to care], the stewarding is hands off, there is colour everywhere in the stadium. City fans here should go there, or to other Dutch clubs and get educated on how aspects [not everything] of their fandom, their relation between fans and club would improve parts of the FC here.

Edited by WTMS_BCFC

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bristol City have rules, not national regulations that are arbitrary and peculiar to Bristol City and its head of safety. Bristol City's "own" rules are different to numerous other clubs e.g Accrington, Aldershot, Aston Villa, Brighton, Crystal Palace, Exeter, Lincoln, Liverpool, Middlesbrough, Oxford ... It really all comes down to will, and wanting to be different.

 

Yeah, I've read this several times too. Can you clarify how they are different? I don't know the rules at any of the above clubs (I can see the result of said rules, but am not privy to the rules themselves), nor do I know them at City.. Size restrictions? Unnecessary paperwork? Certain restrictive protocol?

 

If I were to approach the club and say "I have this big surfer flag, can I use it at x match", what would the response be?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, I've read this several times too. Can you clarify;how they are different? I don't know the rules at any of the above clubs (I can see the result of said rules, but am not privy to the rules themselves), nor do I know them at City.. Size restrictions? Unnecessary paperwork? Certain restrictive protocol?

If I were to approach the club and say "I have this big surfer flag, can I use it at x match", what would the response be?

Bristol City have had rules on number of flags, size and "concerns" regarding materials used - flag and poles. Flags have been restricted to areas. These decisions at Bristol City really do NOT affect all clubs, they are arbitrary, and change season to season as those responsible for safety bring in their new ideas.

Since 2007 Bristol City have had five [?] safety officers, there has been a lack of continuity. Job roles have been downsized. The present officer [from fans experience appears to be a decent bloke] is in his role for the second time, and has different ideas to previous people in charge.

If I were to approach the club and say "I have this big surfer flag, can I use it at x match", what would the response be? Bristol City will require fire certification [fire retardancy]. Again that is no nationally enforced regulation.

If you want to know more http://www.whenthemoonshines.co.uk/

Back on topic, hopefully the brilliant spectacle pictured from Saturday will lead to interest here becoming visual in BS3 in some form. The Tricolores are setting some standard over there, reacting to that can be challenging fun, fun which might create a bit more interest in both clubs.

Edited by WTMS_BCFC

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For clarification: There are two large surfer flags (The Scott Murray and Pride of the West) which have been displayed and surfed at Ashton Gate before. There are currently no rules or regulations which would stop them being surfed again. For reasons best known to himself, WTMS has decreed that all flags should be locked away this season and not surfed or displayed. This is entirely down to him and his mates, and has nothing to do with any restrictions imposed by BCFC.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well now I'm just confused again.

 

Thanks for your clarification though, Dave.

 

To try and get my head round it though: were these two surfer flags required to have a fire certificate? Are they restricted to any specific areas? And would additional flags be allowed?

 

WTMS: why, specifically, have neither been displayed this season? Considering what Dave has said, have you been told otherwise, or made your own decision?

 

 

To be honest, I'm starting to wonder why I asked...  :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

To try and get my head round it though: were these two surfer flags required to have a fire certificate? Are they restricted to any specific areas? And would additional flags be allowed?

 

They do require a certificate, which they both have. They are not restricted to certain areas. All we ask is that we know in advance when they are going to be surfed. Additional flags are generally welcome in all areas of the ground, providing they don't obstruct emergency exits, gangways etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Dave.

 

WTMS, I can definitely see why the additional costs to fireproof/certificate the flags would be prohibitive & frustrating. That does seem unnecessary - especially considering the test carried out.

 

Is the "George" flag you mention the same as the "Pride of the West" one Dave mentions? If so, why does Dave seem to think it does have a certificate (suppose Dave could also/would better answer this question)? If not, why has the "Pride of the West" one not been displayed?

 

Similarly (and I appreciate you may be bored of repeating things you may have mentioned many times in the past), but could you please elaborate on "the reasons why it [the Flying Murray] no longer appears at Ashton Gate"?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Dave.

WTMS, I can definitely see why the additional costs to fireproof/certificate the flags would be prohibitive frustrating. That does seem unnecessary - especially considering the test carried out.

Is the "George" flag you mention the same as the "Pride of the West" one Dave mentions? If so, why does Dave seem to think it does have a certificate (suppose Dave could also/would better answer this question)? If not, why has the "Pride of the West" one not been displayed?

Similarly (and I appreciate you may be bored of repeating things you may have mentioned many times in the past), but could you please elaborate on "the reasons why it [the Flying Murray] no longer appears at Ashton Gate"?

Is the "George" flag you mention the same as the "Pride of the West" one Dave mentions? If so, why does Dave seem to think it does have a certificate (suppose Dave could also/would better answer this question)? If not, why has the "Pride of the West" one not been displayed?

It is not the same flag. Who knows. Maybe those behind it also tired of the uneven treatment of fans by a club who are demonstrating within this thread they cannot get their act / facts straight.

Similarly (and I appreciate you may be bored of repeating things you may have mentioned many times in the past), but could you please elaborate on "the reasons why it [the Flying Murray] no longer appears at Ashton Gate"?

There are more detailed threads stretching back years here - http://www.whenthemoonshines.co.uk/index.php?act=idx

The effort becomes wearing. It all becomes arduous and boring. Eventually fans say no more. You cannot make Bristol City be different if they do not want to be, but the opportunity with Willem II is still there to be.

Edited by WTMS_BCFC

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are more detailed threads stretching back years here - http://www.whenthemoonshines.co.uk/index.php?act=idx

 

Ok, guess I'll have to sign up & have a read through.

 

Just thought you might be able to provide a succinct couple of reasons to save me reading "years" of threads - particularly as I'm asking about this season, not any other.

 

If it is indeed more complicated than that, then fair enough - although you state that Dave L is not addressing the reasoning and yet you're not directly addressing the reasoning either..

 

Anyway, hopefully some sort of resolution will come about sooner rather than later, would be good for everyone to work together to create a new AG of which we (and Willem) can be proud!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just thought you might be able to provide a succinct couple of reasons to save me reading "years" of threads - particularly as I'm asking about this season, not any other.

The years of threads are the reasons. Mr Llyods post here demonstrates he has not taken care to check his facts. That is a norm, but hey ho its only fans efforts, they will keep coming back for more, but eventually reasons accumulate to such a degree people ask why do something beyond the normal, when you can just attend.

An opportunity to do better, to learn could be gained from a club around 400 miles away.

Edited by WTMS_BCFC

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The years of threads are the reasons. Mr Llyods post here demonstrates he has not taken care to check his facts. That is a norm, but hey ho its only fans efforts, they will keep coming back for more, but eventually reasons accumulate to such a degree people ask why do something beyond the normal, when you can just attend.

 

Ah ok, so no specific reasons for this season alone, just a gradual build up of resentment and frustration?

 

That's fair enough, if constant efforts are rebutted or derailed it's certainly not gonna help the situation. Although it does beg the question: if the majority of obstacles were removed by the club, would the resentment and frustration still remain strong enough to prevent any further effort to be put in to bring stuff back, and would it therefore require an injection of energies from another set of fans to rekindle such a culture/atmosphere? Or would you be happy to revive it and dismiss previous issues?

 

It just seems to me that the display at Willem is considered not to be feasible purely due to the fact that those considering it have been knocked back so much in the past that they no longer have the energy and desire to go to the lengths necessary to get it done - which is perfectly understandable.

 

But the display itself is in fact feasible, if it were developed by a group unaffected by previous disagreements, who were happy to produce the flag, get it certificated, alert the club to their intentions & go ahead with it.

 

Or am I wrong here, and there are extra factors that would stop a "new" group (separate to those years of problems) from achieving such a thing?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well for one the Murray flag is a good 40ft long and just won't fit in the Williams due to the make up of the stand (same as the Atyeo stand as the Supporters trust chairman got his tape measure out to see if it would fit).

 

Pillars, split walkway from top and bottom seating and along with the directors box and corporate seating it just would not work.

 

 

554814_152404658222862_666645490_n.jpg?o

 

 

1544486_407374416059217_1941448591_n.jpg

 

 

 

Big George is a fair size and made from hot air balloon material

 

580371_10201225738995094_2084196873_n.jp

 

 

 

Pride of the west is a fraction of the size and to be honest looks lost when surfed (it would fit in just 1 of the white squares on big george)

 

960065_313448775451782_362080324_n.jpg?o

 

1526746_407374396059219_2020667700_n.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah ok, so no specific reasons for this season alone, just a gradual build up of resentment and frustration?

That's fair enough, if constant efforts are rebutted or derailed it's certainly not gonna help the situation. Although it does beg the question: if the majority of obstacles were removed by the club, would the resentment and frustration still remain strong enough to prevent any further effort to be put in to bring stuff back, and would it therefore require an injection of energies from another set of fans to rekindle such a culture/atmosphere? Or would you be happy to revive it and dismiss previous issues?

It just seems to me that the display at Willem is considered not to be feasible purely due to the fact that those considering it have been knocked back so much in the past that they no longer have the energy and desire to go to the lengths necessary to get it done - which is perfectly understandable.

But the display itself is in fact feasible, if it were developed by a group unaffected by previous disagreements, who were happy to produce the flag, get it certificated, alert the club to their intentions & go ahead with it.

Or am I wrong here, and there are extra factors that would stop a "new" group (separate to those years of problems) from achieving such a thing?

Ah ok, so no specific reasons for this season alone, just a gradual build up of resentment and frustration? Cutting it short yes.

A similar display to that in Tilburg within Ashton Gate is not feasible [practical]. It is too deep to think of hypothetical scenarios x as of yet an unidentified group of fans with a connection to Willem II.

Situations and possibility do alter. Seven years ago many Bristol City fans would have been unaware of the team from Tilburg. Now Willem II are part of the supporting culture of a section of Bristol City fans, a growing culture - There will be further trips this season to the Netherlands.

The latest display in Vak E has piqued interest here. A positive change in fan culture may yet stem from what was once a unlikely source.

Edited by WTMS_BCFC

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had a go at doing something different in the Atyeo (picture above) once.

Got fed up of all the politics and everything else that comes with it. I have 2 great flags on poles and a large parkenders flag. None of them used anymore.

I just want to turn up, sing for 90 minutes and wave / hang a few flags. Who would of thought it can cause such a fuss.

From my perspective the atmos at AG is currently dead until one day it rises again (if ever).

Worth sticking something on wtms when everyone's heading over. I know a few miners lads who would be keen

Edited by Forza Revolution

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Would the owners of these flags consider taking them out of storage for potential trip(s) to Wembley Stadium?

The topic is about Willem II, but there are numerous restrictions on flags at Wembley above 250cm in width, or length.

Worth sticking something on wtms when everyone's heading over. I know a few miners lads who would be keen

Regulars attended Saturday, the Landlord was over there v Fortuna Sittard ...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Myself and a few lads are planning to come over to Tilburg for Willem's last home game of the season in May.. I've heard a few more City boys are going over as well does anyone know if this is true? and from a Willem perspective is Tilburg lively on the night before your home games I'm sure its lively on matchday but do you have many lads in the pubs the night before? Cheers

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The night before the last match of the season is a saturday night, so I guess there will be some people in the pubs. I will come back saturday night from turkey, so probably Cannot join you unfortunately...

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I still owe you the report of the away match against FC Twente of one week ago. A Sunday match, three hours driving from Tilburg and we had to go with a bus. Thus only just over 150 went to FC Twente and they had a match to never forget!!!

FC Twente has a nice big stadium and are around 5th place in the eredivisie. They were playing very good in the first half and it didn't last long untill they scored the 1-0. We were prepared for a lost match, but as long as we play well we were satisfied. One point would feel like a victory... But then at the end of the first half Willem II had a very nice attack and scored superb the 1-1. A really nice goal. 1-1 half time.

In the beginning of the second half it was once again FC Twente who were the better team and creating some very good opportunities to score a goal. But after that Willem II was the best team on the pitch, resulting in the 1-2 around the 70th minute with a nice pass before that. 20 minutes to go, Willem II the best team on the pitch: could this result in three points? Just a few minutes later a player of FC Twente got a red card. 10-11 players with only 10 minutes official time to play.... It should be possible to take the three points home. Four minutes extra time, still 1-2 and we were partying in the away box!!! And then: in the 91th minute FC Twente did it: they scored the 2-2.... Gone three points, but still one point that before the match would feel like a victory.... And then the impossible happened. 94th minute last action of the match: a goal scored by FC Twente. End result 3-2 loss for Willem II. A game lost in the last 4 minutes extra time against 10 players.... We were devestated... A real nice journey home it was indeed and a match to never forget (although I would like to forget it today!!!).

The eredivisie has now stopped for a few weeks, starting again on 18 January with a home game against Eagles from Deventer. We are now halfway in the competition on place 12 with a gap of 4 points to the relegation area. Before the start of the competition we would be glad with this position, but we have given away quite some points.... And with a start against some of our rivals for relegation it will be an important start of the second half, especially with the away match against our local enemy NAC on 25 January!!!!

A summary of the match can be found here (I can't watch it anymore, still getting upset):

Congrats with the victories of BCFC of last week and from a snowy Netherlands I wish you already all the best for 2015!!!!!

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Match report of the match of today then:

Home game against Go Ahead Eagles from Deventer on an early Sunday morning at 12.30. With all the "troubles" of last week (see previous post) not the best ingredients for a nice game... The Eredivisie had a winterstop of 4 weeks, so we were quite nervous to see in which shape Willem II was after this period... A very important match too since the Eagles were on place 16 (of 18) in the Eredivisie in the relegation zone, with a 4 points gap with Willem II.

Due to the circumstances the atmosphere today was pretty quiet today but nevertheless Willem II had a good start in the first half. Putting lots of pressure on the Eagles, creating opportunities and not giving away lots of chances for the opponent. So it looks like they are in the same shape as they were before the winterstop. This also implies that they created lots of opportunities to score but they did not manage to do so...... Three very good potential goals went beside the post on the wrong side resulting in a 0-0 score at half time, when it should have been 3-0 for Willem II.

Second half same story. Willem II the best team on the pitch but not able to score a goal and then normally the opponent scores. But not this time. Around 65th minute a nice attack by Willem II and a goal with the head: 1-0!!! A few minutes later the Eagles had a free kick which landed on the post... Last 15 minutes were tense with Willem II still the better team, but some small chances for the Eagles, but we managed to keep the zero.... Endresult 1-0 win for Willem II. Very important after such an intense week and resulting in a 7 points gap towards the relagation zone.....

Next week THE important away match against our local enemies from NAC Breda. Home game won in the extra time with 2-1. Now looking for the same result in Breda.... Getting nervous already!!!!!!

PS met two nice guys from BCFC who attended the game today!!! Nice to have met them!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And as an aside you won the important game 1-0!

Always going to leave a bad taste these things, quite rightly with fans. Was five years ago, and hopefully no club involvement.

Even a rather random Arsenal connection to this story.

http://allarsenal.com/2015/01/news/arsenal-man-questioned-in-relation-to-match-fixing-allegations/

Fingers crossed it all works out for the team.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does sound a little fishy this match-fixing. Really hope nothing bad happens. But roll on the rest of the season Willem!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Some footage of the last training of Willem II on Saturday where the supporters turned up to give the team some extra "motivation" for the match on Sunday against our local rival....

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40gVRM_CKfE

 

No pyro, not party..... If we can't do it during matches, we will do it like this....

Edited by willem ii
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks awesome. Respect to the players as well for applauding it. You just don't seem to get that same interaction. Sure, a clap after the warm-ups but there is no emotion. Amigos dos Amigos.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...