Teflon Lee

[REDOXO]

2 hours ago, Distortia said:

This 'dismantling' then..

Sold Derrick Williams to Blackburn, where he got relegated and clearly hasn't set the world alight. Looks like he'll be a League 1 defender this season.

Sold Kieran Agard to MK Dons, where he has an average (at best) scoring record, and finished 12th in League 1. Again, League 1 player this season.

Sold Luke Freeman to QPR. Seems like he has performed okay there. I think most would agree he didn't really make the step up to Championship standard while he was with us. Personally I don't think we miss him at all.

Sold Luke Ayling to Leeds. This, in hindsight, could well be seen as a bad deal. Has done well at Leeds and could've been very useful as a RB this season, with Matthews a clear dud.

Released Osbourne, El-Abd and Wagstaff. All dropped divisions to find a club, none of them in the Championship since.

So, 6/8 playing in a division below, which appear to have found their level. A division or two below the current squad. So I'm not sure your point is valid at all.

 

2 hours ago, Top Robin said:I would say that all of them were either inconsistent or poor for us. The two stand out ones, Freeman and Ayling, had the odd decent game but plenty of poor ones.

There is a certain amount of truth as above, however arguments about who went and why are pretty moot.  Including Kodjia who was missed by us and the post above  

We had the worst run in our clubs history and could not buy a win. LJ spent money on players most of whom have a bucket load to prove netxt season. LJ will not get that latitude again. 

[Andy Horsman]

New season and a clean-ish slate. I didn't mind LJ as a player and had no objection to him as City boss. I want him to take the club forward and succeed. He has however, in my opinion, naively created a rod for his own back with his much quoted 'three transfer windows' statement. If the season doesn't start well, and the August fixtures are not easy, and the team and formation is chopped and changed then the atmosphere will become toxic very, very quickly. I hope that isn't the scenario obviously, but should that happen SL may have no other option than sack his buddy and cut his losses. As it stands I'm impressed with the two signings and hope the team start well and get to 50+ points as soon as possible!!!

[Distortia]

Just now, REDOXO said:

 

There is a certain amount of truth as above, however arguments about who went and why are pretty moot.  Including Kodjia who was missed by us and the post above  

We had the worst run in our clubs history and could not buy a win. LJ spent money on players most of whom have a bucket load to prove netxt season. LJ will not get that latitude again. 

Well the post I replied to was saying how Johnson sold players from the League 1 winning side - which Kodjia wasn't a part of.

[GIBBO THE GREAT]

4 hours ago, Top Robin said:

Now don't get me wrong.....I really hope we will have a decent next season and with our form towards the end of the last one and the new players brought in we should do ok. But we kind of thought this at the start of last season and as we know, things went downhill nastily. Will Lee be with us for the duration no matter how bad things get next season....I think he will. He has a lot riding on next season as he has chosen the players, spent a decent amount of money,picked the team, done the training strategy so its all down to him. In short he has now had enough time to create his own side. Lets hope this never comes into the equation but this is Bristol City.

 

Johnson out

[cidered abroad]

3 hours ago, tommy_b said:

Quite. 

Most promoted squads in football often don't translate into capable squads the division up. Some individuals, yes, but not squads. 

To still have a core of 5/6 within the first team towards the end of last season two years and four windows after promotion? I reckon that is rare these days for successful teams.

Are you implying that we now are a successful team? Or not? My view is that we have too many left to take us any great distance up this league. 

I would say that we were just a teeny weeny bit successful in two consecutive seasons for staying up. Although it's hardly anything to get overjoyed about. I suppose most on here will know that I'm not madly in love with LJ as the City Head Coach. Like son, like father for me. 

But he's here for as long as Lansdown wants him, so while I did renew, it's because after 67 years of watching City, what else would I do on Saturday afternoons. Not because I expect any better than last season. 

[AppyDAZE]

42 minutes ago, GIBBO THE GREAT said:

Johnson out

Kim Jong-un  OUT!

[Benjam!n Ultra]

SL has rolled his final dice on lJ with the signing of a £5.3m striker from another country when it would have been safer, though not guaranteed as we've seen in the past two years, to have gone with Championship experience.

As with those last two seasons it's been a 20 goal plus striker in each which has saved our bacon - one offensively described as an 18 year old educated striker and the other an actual 18 year old. It's not been tactic that's saved us.

If Dheidou fails to hit the ground running, and the past 24 months have shown we can't afford him not to, then City will be in the bottom 3 and no doubt about it, survival will then depend on whether SL keeps him (he won't beyond November imo) or how long it takes for one of our strikers to start scoring at the rate of Tammy or Kodjia. 

Ultimately though LJ can have no complaints. He's now been given his three transfer windows and backed like no other, but if you ain't got it then I'm afraid you ain't got it and he won't be as lucky this time round. 

[Monkeh]

9 minutes ago, Benjam!n Ultra said:

SL has rolled his final dice on lJ with the signing of a £5.3m striker from another country when it would have been safer, though not guaranteed as we've seen in the past two years, to have gone with Championship experience.

As with those last two seasons it's been a 20 goal plus striker in each which has saved our bacon - one offensively described as an 18 year old educated striker and the other an actual 18 year old. It's not been tactic that's saved us.

If Dheidou fails to hit the ground running, and the past 24 months have shown we can't afford him not to, then City will be in the bottom 3 and no doubt about it, survival will then depend on whether SL keeps him (he won't beyond November imo) or how long it takes for one of our strikers to start scoring at the rate of Tammy or Kodjia. 

Ultimately though LJ can have no complaints. He's now been given his three transfer windows and backed like no other, but if you ain't got it then I'm afraid you ain't got it and he won't be as lucky this time round. 

you mean like we did with Tammy and Kodja........oh wait a second,

what about when we signed the experienced stern john oh wait he was shit

[Benjam!n Ultra]

6 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

you mean like we did with Tammy and Kodja........oh wait a second,

what about when we signed the experienced stern john oh wait he was shit

If you'd have properly processed my post without windmilling immediately you'll see i said it's no guarantee. I even highlighted Tammy and Kodjia in the paragraph you've bolded FFS!!

But not sure how anyone can deny signing a £5m Championship experienced striker is more a risk than the same amount for one from another league without any experience of the Championship. 

They're all risks, no doubt, but there's ways of minimising the risks.

[Oops]

How about a bit of optimism?

Nothing but pathetic digs and 'woe is me' attention seeking bullshit as always.

Johnson IN. You tiresome ******* belters.

[Strictly Obi]

17 minutes ago, Oops said:

How about a bit of optimism?

Nothing but pathetic digs and 'woe is me' attention seeking bullshit as always.

Johnson IN. You tiresome ******* belters.

Yes, really excited about this season. And I'm sure many others would like to join me in wishing LJ and BCFC all the very best for this forthcoming season. 

[Monkeh]

22 minutes ago, Benjam!n Ultra said:

If you'd have properly processed my post without windmilling immediately you'll see i said it's no guarantee. I even highlighted Tammy and Kodjia in the paragraph you've bolded FFS!!

But not sure how anyone can deny signing a £5m Championship experienced striker is more a risk than the same amount for one from another league without any experience of the Championship. 

They're all risks, no doubt, but there's ways of minimising the risks.

name a proven championship ship striker we'd get for 5 million,

Lets just list a few of the proven ones shall we

Andre Gray 8 million

Dwight Gayle 10 million

Ross Macormack 12 million

Kodja 15 million

Do I need to go on?, thats why we've gone abroad

[1bristolcity]

43 minutes ago, Benjam!n Ultra said:

SL has rolled his final dice on lJ with the signing of a £5.3m striker from another country when it would have been safer, though not guaranteed as we've seen in the past two years, to have gone with Championship experience.

As with those last two seasons it's been a 20 goal plus striker in each which has saved our bacon - one offensively described as an 18 year old educated striker and the other an actual 18 year old. It's not been tactic that's saved us.

If Dheidou fails to hit the ground running, and the past 24 months have shown we can't afford him not to, then City will be in the bottom 3 and no doubt about it, survival will then depend on whether SL keeps him (he won't beyond November imo) or how long it takes for one of our strikers to start scoring at the rate of Tammy or Kodjia. 

Ultimately though LJ can have no complaints. He's now been given his three transfer windows and backed like no other, but if you ain't got it then I'm afraid you ain't got it and he won't be as lucky this time round. 

What are you banging on about? The not knowing for sure is what keeps us all guessing, honestly your comments put you down as a morbid depressive, almost as if you cannot wait for LJ to fail to prove whatever views you hold...cheer up it might never happen.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

Just now, Monkeh said:

name a proven championship ship striker we'd get for 5 million,

Lets just list a few of the proven ones shall we

Andre Gray 8 million

Dwight Gayle 10 million

Ross Macormack 12 million

Kodja 15 million

Do I need to go on?, thats why we've gone abroad

You need to stop flying into replies without really understanding what people are saying.. or are you missing the point on purpose?

It's pretty obvious what he's saying - a striker with no experience of the league is a risk. There's no getting away from that. Just because Kodjia and Abraham were successful here doesn't change that.

He didn't bring price in comparison to established forwards into it either, he basically just said lack of championship experience if a risk.

[1bristolcity]

2 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

name a proven championship ship striker we'd get for 5 million,

Lets just list a few of the proven ones shall we

Andre Gray 8 million

Dwight Gayle 10 million

Ross Macormack 12 million

Kodja 15 million

Do I need to go on?, thats why we've gone abroad

And why that has succeeded, we have to. 

[The Swan and Cemetery]

14 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

You need to stop flying into replies without really understanding what people are saying.. or are you missing the point on purpose?

It's pretty obvious what he's saying - a striker with no experience of the league is a risk. There's no getting away from that. Just because Kodjia and Abraham were successful here doesn't change that.

He didn't bring price in comparison to established forwards into it either, he basically just said lack of championship experience if a risk.

Signing players is always risk, but it's a greater risk to sign players who've proved they can't succeed at Championship level (ones available within our budget) than those who've shown signs of life in other leagues/environments, surely? 'Proven at Championship level' equates to very expensive as Monkeh is pointing out.

[Phileas Fogg]

10 minutes ago, The Swan and Cemetery said:

Signing players is always risk, but it's a greater risk to sign players who've proved they can't succeed at Championship level (ones available within our budget) than those who've shown signs of life in other leagues/environments, surely? 'Proven at Championship level' equates to very expensive as Monkeh is pointing out.

I don't disagree and our scouting of these types appears to be very good. I'd much rather we took a chance than spend too much on past it players (such as Lafferty for example) personally.

It is still a risk though, which is the point Benjamin Ultra was making. My objection was to the blind leaping in to disagree without fully grasping the point. 

I don't think Benjamin Ultra necessarily meant players who've 'failed' at this level. Perhaps he meant someone like Assombalonga or Afobe (both probably far too expensive but that's another point) who's proved they can hack it at this level. It's fair to argue either of those would be 'less' of a risk than Diedhiou.

The key is how well we've scouted him. I'm sure we wouldn't spend that much on a single player who we weren't absolutely certain could adapt immediately and be a big success. Looking forward to watching him play.

[Monkeh]

1 minute ago, Phileas Fogg said:

I don't disagree and our scouting of these types appears to be very good. I'd much rather we took a chance than spend too much on past it players (such as Lafferty for example) personally.

It is still a risk though, which is the point Benjamin Ultra was making. My objection was to the blind leaping in to disagree without fully grasping the point. 

I don't think Benjamin Ultra necessarily meant players who've 'failed' at this level. Perhaps he meant someone like Assombalonga or Afobe (both probably far too expensive but that's another point) who's proved they can hack it at this level. It's fair to argue either of those would be 'less' of a risk than Diedhiou.

The key is how well we've scouted him. I'm sure we wouldn't spend that much on a single player who we weren't absolutely certain could adapt immediately and be a big success. Looking forward to watching him play.

and thats why you have to trust the manager and scouts, which is what Ben isn't doing, we've got the striker signings right in the last 5 or so seasons

[The Swan and Cemetery]

Just now, Phileas Fogg said:

I don't disagree and our scouting of these types appears to be very good. I'd much rather we took a chance than spend too much on past it players (such as Lafferty for example) personally.

It is still a risk though, which is the point Benjamin Ultra was making. My objection was to the blind leaping in to disagree without fully grasping the point. 

I don't think Benjamin Ultra necessarily meant players who've 'failed' at this level. Perhaps he meant someone like Assombalonga or Afobe (both probably far too expensive but that's another point) who's proved they can hack it at this level. It's fair to argue either of those would be 'less' of a risk than Diedhiou.

The key is how well we've scouted him. I'm sure we wouldn't spend that much on a single player who we weren't absolutely certain could adapt immediately and be a big success. Looking forward to watching him play.

Yep, guess the point I'm making (and Monkeh maybe, but I'm not his PR rep) is that if proven and successful is beyond our budget, then we've no choice but to look elsewhere, it's then about the risks we take: played a lot in the Championship but not done much (and therefore within budget), loan from Prem, look overseas, look lower down the leagues. All are risks, but they're pretty much unavoidable unless we're prepared to spend money it appears we're not prepared to. I.e. our choice is to either spend more than we currently are, take a risk or do nothing. 

[Phileas Fogg]

27 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

and thats why you have to trust the manager and scouts, which is what Ben isn't doing, we've got the striker signings right in the last 5 or so seasons

Agreed. We've done well last few years but I can understand people's added pressure when it's broken our transfer record by quite a margin. If this goes horribly wrong - which it could - then Lee Johnson will come under even more scrutiny.

Big show of faith in Diedhiou. I'm reassured that better teams than us showed an interest in him. Excited to see him play.

25 minutes ago, The Swan and Cemetery said:

Yep, guess the point I'm making (and Monkeh maybe, but I'm not his PR rep) is that if proven and successful is beyond our budget, then we've no choice but to look elsewhere, it's then about the risks we take: played a lot in the Championship but not done much (and therefore within budget), loan from Prem, look overseas, look lower down the leagues. All are risks, but they're pretty much unavoidable unless we're prepared to spend money it appears we're not prepared to. I.e. our choice is to either spend more than we currently are, take a risk or do nothing. 

Agree - I personally like the type of players we are targeting. It's exciting and potentially very high reward. It's sort of similar to a foreign market version of Barnsley's transfer policy or even a Championship version of Stoke's.

[Nogbad the Bad]

16 hours ago, chinapig said:

There may be a case to be made on both sides but I'm afraid as soon as someone resorts to childish phrases like 'Little Lee' any case they might have is fatally undermined.

 

I can't see anything wrong with referring LJ as 'Little Lee'.

Did you take exception to 'Big John' Atyeo and 'Big Paul' Cheesley as well?

[Oops]

But you can guarantee the people who are ALREADY spouting the usual crap would maintain their bleak outlook whatever happens. I've long since accepted that there is a very small minority of fans on here that can't wait for things to go wrong; if it's not the training kit it's the actual kit, if we spend it's too much or not enough, the team is too young or not young enough, the pasties are cold or too hot etc, etc, etc..

Luckily most of the belters on here don't even attend the games, because the general atmosphere down at the Gate last year seemed to be of expectation and optimism for the future rather than the hysterical whining of the not too distant past (even during the October-February struggle).

There is a massive difference between the keyboard heroes on here and the actual active fans. I generally just ignore the doom and gloom but these topics are really starting to piss me off.

 

[BRISTOL86]

1 minute ago, Oops said:

But you can guarantee the people who are ALREADY spouting the usual crap would maintain their bleak outlook whatever happens. I've long since accepted that there is a very small minority of fans on here that can't wait for things to go wrong; if it's not the training kit it's the actual kit, if we spend it's too much or not enough, the team is too young or not young enough, the pasties are cold or too hot etc, etc, etc..

Luckily most of the belters on here don't even attend the games, because the general atmosphere down at the Gate last year seemed to be of expectation and optimism for the future rather than the hysterical whining of the not too distant past (even during the October-February struggle).

There is a massive difference between the keyboard heroes on here and the actual active fans. I generally just ignore the doom and gloom but these topics are really starting to piss me off.

 

It'll certainly be quiet on here if we make a decent start as the usual suspects will be nowhere to be seen as always when things are going OK. 

[Oops]

17 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

I can't see anything wrong with referring LJ as 'Little Lee'.

Did you take exception to 'Big John' Atyeo and 'Big Paul' Cheesley as well?

The difference is, as I'm sure you know, that "Little Lee" is derogatory and patronising. Whereas "Big John" is not. Plus the fact I'm sure you wouldn't have the spuds to say to his face.

[Nogbad the Bad]

Just now, Oops said:

The difference is, as I'm sure you know, that "Little Lee" is derogatory and patronising. Whereas "Big John" is not. Plus the fact I'm sure you wouldn't have the spuds to say to his face.

No it's not, unless you're very easily upset.

You assume all fans referring to him as 'Little Lee' are saying it with some sort of malice?

Nonsense.

There are numerous extremely derogatory names he could be referred to due to his height -  this is not one of them.

As I'm sure you know.

 

[Sir Colby-Tit]

23 minutes ago, Oops said:

The difference is, as I'm sure you know, that "Little Lee" is derogatory and patronising. Whereas "Big John" is not. Plus the fact I'm sure you wouldn't have the spuds to say to his face.

I'm sure LJ wouldn't give a toss if someone called him Little Lee to his face. His twitter handle used to pay homage to the worlds smallest man, so I don't think he can be that precious about his height.

[Oops]

13 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

No it's not, unless you're very easily upset.

You assume all fans referring to him as 'Little Lee' are saying it with some sort of malice?

Nonsense.

There are numerous extremely derogatory names he could be referred to due to his height -  this is not one of them.

As I'm sure you know.

 

I think that's the general assumption, not just mine. It's just another cheap shot from the laptop warriors.

[BobBobSuperBob]

3 hours ago, Monkeh said:

and thats why you have to trust the manager and scouts, which is what Ben isn't doing, we've got the striker signings right in the last 5 or so seasons

Yes Engvall has been a roaring success

From the video cops II do think Fammy looks like he has the tools for the job tho

LK has actually had four windows worth now so no excuses 

[Mtimmy11]

If it upsets him I am sorry for calling him little lee but to me he is little I am 6foot 1inch so to me and my friends he is little lee.looking at recent photos I don't think it will be to long before I call him rolly poly little lee as I don't think he has set a good example to the other staff with his weight gain.

[Kid in the Riot]

1 hour ago, Sir Colby-Tit said:

I'm sure LJ wouldn't give a toss if someone called him Little Lee to his face. His twitter handle used to pay homage to the worlds smallest man, so I don't think he can be that precious about his height.

What? But I want to get offended on someone else's behalf!