Jump to content
IGNORED

How big a part does psychology play in sport ?


Major Isewater

Recommended Posts

I watched our match yesterday and was interested to note that Naarwich gave us a lot of respect and equally we went there believing a result was , if not probable ,  certainly  more so than a defeat.

I know you need the skills to back up your results but I wonder what percentage the psychology plays .

What do you think ? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Major Isewater said:

I watched our match yesterday and was interested to note that Naarwich gave us a lot of respect and equally we went there believing a result was , if not probable ,  certainly  more so than a defeat.

I know you need the skills to back up your results but I wonder what percentage the psychology plays .

What do you think ? 

A massive amount, I'd say. 

Confidence/belief, call it what you will, can alter the whole way a game is approached and means you are more likely to try game changing moments. 

Fear of losing is hard to overcome. Belief you can win is priceless. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A huge part. Self belief, momentum and confidence in your teammates are so important. 

There’s definitely psychological theories which would explain why teams go on runs - good or bad.

Look at Adam Matthews - we know he can be a very good player but something wasn’t right last year. I believe @spudski picked up on his body language and identified it early on last season. I’m certain it was psychological too.

Conor McGregor attributes lots of his success to ‘the law of attraction’. I don’t think it’s a totally watertight theory, but aspects of visualisation and having clear goals to focus on can help anyone achieve success in any field to a degree. 

The psychological warfare in those Utd vs Arsenal games (Keane vs Viera) was all an attempt to get the mental edge.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Warnock will certainly be using Tomlin as a way of winding us up, probably instructed to behave in a way that irritates our fans. Combined with the psychology of falling over dramatically every time we go near a Cardiff player he will be looking for us to lose concentration/our heads....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, City Cat said:

Warnock will certainly be using Tomlin as a way of winding us up, probably instructed to behave in a way that irritates our fans. Combined with the psychology of falling over dramatically every time we go near a Cardiff player he will be looking for us to lose concentration/our heads....

We won't.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Major Isewater said:

I watched our match yesterday and was interested to note that Naarwich gave us a lot of respect and equally we went there believing a result was , if not probable ,  certainly  more so than a defeat.

I know you need the skills to back up your results but I wonder what percentage the psychology plays .

What do you think ? 

Its incalculable.

There are only two types of effort mental and physical. Physical follows mental. Everything does.

In football everything follows mindset. Mindset to do, mindset to follow, mindset to achieve, mindset to get better .... Its all psychological.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you're well drilled and have another player/coach to instruct you, I don't think it plays as big a part. Playing 5 aside at the lowest level of the pyramid I can even understand that. When playing with strong or vocal teammates you only have to concentrate on the basics of your own role. 

When that isn't the case the anxieties of the team not having a plan or shape can affect players individually. You stop concentrating on your own game, increasing the likelihood of mistakes around the pitch and frustration. 

You certainly need these kind of leaders in football for when the plan isn't working and you begin to lose organisation, but not necessarily 11. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It can be huge. Check out this guy Steve Peters (link)  credited as being a huge part of building up British Cycling to the level it is today. Is now very senior within British athletics. Also credited with helping Ronnie O'Sullivan rediscover his form and was personally thanked by ROS after 2017 masters win. Also credited with helping british sprinter Adam Gemmil and Liverpool in their first season under Rodgers. 

Having said that I believe he also worked with the England team in the build up to the Euro's so it shows Psychology can't-do the impossible! 

Has a good book out about applying his principles and how they can apply to everyday life called the Chimp Paradox.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, RichardEdd said:

It can be huge. Check out this guy Steve Peters (link)  credited as being a huge part of building up British Cycling to the level it is today. Is now very senior within British athletics. Also credited with helping Ronnie O'Sullivan rediscover his form and was personally thanked by ROS after 2017 masters win. Also credited with helping british sprinter Adam Gemmil and Liverpool in their first season under Rodgers. 

Having said that I believe he also worked with the England team in the build up to the Euro's so it shows Psychology can't-do the impossible! 

Has a good book out about applying his principles and how they can apply to everyday life called the Chimp Paradox.

Is that the one Michael Vaughan used to bang on about all the time?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

Its incalculable.

There are only two types of effort mental and physical. Physical follows mental. Everything does.

In football everything follows mindset. Mindset to do, mindset to follow, mindset to achieve, mindset to get better .... Its all psychological.

Of course, the mental and physical are inextricably linked.  The brain is the physiological control centre of the body.

The flawed American dream 'believe it to achieve it' rhetoric is largely detrimental, though.  In a game, only one team can win; there is only so much room at the top.  

I also believe that the self-help and actualisation movement is an absolute con:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sham-Self-Help-Movement-America-Helpless/dp/1400054109

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

At the weigh in for the Clay/Liston first fight at Miami Beach in Feb 64, Clay(as he was known at the time) acted like a madman. He even had to have medical assessment as a result of his antics and there were even calls to cancel the fight. Clay reckoned by acting that way he really got into Liston's head. Sonny was afraid of no man. But as Clay figured that everyone is afraid of a madman and Liston didn't appear to be an exception. Liston knew he could intimidate sane opponents...you wouldn't be sane if he didn't intimidate you! But all of a sudden this self assurance left him as he realised he couldn't necessarily intimidate a lunatic, and indeed he was actually intimidated by a lunatic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, WTFiGO!?! said:

Of course, the mental and physical are inextricably linked.  The brain is the physiological control centre of the body.

The flawed American dream 'believe it to achieve it' rhetoric is largely detrimental, though.  In a game, only one team can win; there is only so much room at the top.  

I also believe that the self-help and actualisation movement is an absolute con:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sham-Self-Help-Movement-America-Helpless/dp/1400054109

 

In a sport such as football I would separate the two. Actualisation is a very different thing in football than in real life.

Believe to achieve in football is part of the essential growth mind set of a footballer. We do not leave the womb with an ability to take free kick and kick ups. Positive thoughts and belief feed the pursuit of getting better at those free kicks and kick ups. Negative thoughts and a lack of belief ... Well I have yet to see anybody be good at either thinking I am going to be rubbish at this and am and will always be.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Every person has the ability to be a professional footballer, psychologically only the elite few do.

Yes physique helps but, everyone should be able to hit a ball like ronaldo or dribble like messi it's not a power given to them (although some say it is) but it's the confidence, everytime Ronaldo steps over a free kick he has the confidence in himself that he can find the top corner, same as Messi when faced with 5 defenders in front of him, he knows that he can get passed them.

 

Yes there is natural talent but most boils down to the confidence you have in your ability. 

As posted above it has a massive impact on a team as well, Leicester beamed confidence when they won the league, going into each game to win it, each player was confident that the job they were doing was at an extremely high standard. Teams who struggle don't have that confidence, they go into games being conservative not to have a repeat of the week before, players wandering if they should try and beat there man as they may lose it causing a counter attack etc.

 

As Tomlin, JET etc. prove you can have the talent but the Mental side of the game is what makes you a special player

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's interesting that this post should pop up.

I was reading an interview today by Joe Bryan about Bobby Reid.

JB quotes that BR is the best technical player he's ever played with.

Believes he's a late bloomer, as although he had all the skill, he didn't have the confidence.

Quote...'He just needed that little bit of confidence , that push from someone to say...yeah you are good enough, go and do it.'

Also adding that he feels it's taken him a little longer to mature and learn the game.

From speaking to people who have dealt with BR in the past, it always came across that they felt he had an attitude that he had already made it.

I don't think it's a coincidence, that he struck up a close friendship with Tammy. And since then, his game has improved. Also being made a more forward playing number 10.

Perhaps it needed the maturity of a 19 year old, to show the 24 year old what was needed to succeed? Mentality and graft....and some humility.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, spudski said:

It's interesting that this post should pop up.

I was reading an interview today by Joe Bryan about Bobby Reid.

JB quotes that BR is the best technical player he's ever played with.

Believes he's a late bloomer, as although he had all the skill, he didn't have the confidence.

Quote...'He just needed that little bit of confidence , that push from someone to say...yeah you are good enough, go and do it.'

Also adding that he feels it's taken him a little longer to mature and learn the game.

From speaking to people who have dealt with BR in the past, it always came across that they felt he had an attitude that he had already made it.

I don't think it's a coincidence, that he struck up a close friendship with Tammy. And since then, his game has improved. Also being made a more forward playing number 10.

Perhaps it needed the maturity of a 19 year old, to show the 24 year old what was needed to succeed? Mentality and graft....and some humility.

Yeah  seen that article in the FL paper  also happy to see J B loves the club along with his  good pal B R and unlikely to ever leave

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, cityred exile said:

Yeah  seen that article in the FL paper  also happy to see J B loves the club along with his  good pal B R and unlikely to ever leave

I'm not sure I agree there mate...quote from JB...' If I am as good as I want to be, there will come a time when I do move....but wouldn't want to leave on a sour note'.

From reading the rest of the interview, he doesn't want to leave, but would if it was right for him, the Club and it didn't upset the fans.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, RichardEdd said:

It can be huge. Check out this guy Steve Peters (link)  credited as being a huge part of building up British Cycling to the level it is today. Is now very senior within British athletics. Also credited with helping Ronnie O'Sullivan rediscover his form and was personally thanked by ROS after 2017 masters win. Also credited with helping british sprinter Adam Gemmil and Liverpool in their first season under Rodgers. 

Having said that I believe he also worked with the England team in the build up to the Euro's so it shows Psychology can't-do the impossible! 

Has a good book out about applying his principles and how they can apply to everyday life called the Chimp Paradox.

Lee Johnson has worked with Steve Peters earlier in his management career. 

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/football-league/once-in-a-generation-game-more-than-family-honour-at-stake-for-gary-and-lee-johnson-who-will-be-in-8574257.html

My head says he brought Steve Peters in for a day at City but I can't find anything to back that up.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, You Do The Dziekanowski said:

Every person has the ability to be a professional footballer, psychologically only the elite few do.

Yes physique helps but, everyone should be able to hit a ball like ronaldo or dribble like messi it's not a power given to them (although some say it is) but it's the confidence, everytime Ronaldo steps over a free kick he has the confidence in himself that he can find the top corner, same as Messi when faced with 5 defenders in front of him, he knows that he can get passed them.

I think there is a natural ceiling. I don’t think everyone has the potential to hit a ball like Ronaldo or dribble like Messi. Some people have gifts. 

In very basic terms, if everyone trained like Usain Bolt all their lives - it doesn’t mean they’d be 100m gold medalists. Different sport but same principle.

I believe there is a gift some people have but most don’t. I don’t think it’s just confidence that sets the rest apart from the pros.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Personally, I'm a firm believer that when you take your "exceptions" out like Ronaldo, Messi etc there isn't a huge amount between the natural ability of a league 2 player vs a premier player. People can only be so good with a football.

This is why we get cup shocks. Those league 2 players can play to the level of the prem, but only 1-2 times a season. The ability is there in a large part (hell, they're better than 99.99% of the population) but it's about application and belief. Some lack application (e.g. Jet), but a far bigger problem is belief.

Leicester are undoubtedly the best example of this. Nobody would pick them to win the league, but in essence their players were 0.01% away from Chelseas/Man City's. All they needed was belief, the miracle was that belief sustained for 9 months.

This is a reason I like LJ. I think he genuinely gets this point. Probably stems from being written off as a player and having to prove so many people wrong.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

I think there is a natural ceiling. I don’t think everyone has the potential to hit a ball like Ronaldo or dribble like Messi. Some people have gifts. 

In very basic terms, if everyone trained like Usain Bolt all their lives - it doesn’t mean they’d be 100m gold medalists. Different sport but same principle.

I believe there is a gift some people have but most don’t. I don’t think it’s just confidence that sets the rest apart from the pros.

 

In football that natural ceiling is not so clearly determined. Its a sport where all sort of body shapes from Xavi to Ibrahimovic excel. Unlike sprinters genetics do not wholly define the future.There is no football gene.

Every person has the ability to be a professional footballer, psychologically only the elite few do -  there is a lot of merit in this because it is our lack of desire to be relentless in the pursuit of improvement via practice that defines what we are. Mentally from early ages few have the growth mindset to constantly practice deliberately each day, each week,  each month to get even close to the pro game.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It has to play a big part. 

This is shown on football and all things in life, with the play we've had recently the players are all on a much better mental place than when they are on a loosing run. 

'It's all in the mind' 

The fans also have a lot to do with mental attitude, when we are all singing and cheering the players always comment how good the fans are. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Cowshed said:

In football that natural ceiling is not so clearly determined. Its a sport where all sort of body shapes from Xavi to Ibrahimovic excel. Unlike sprinters genetics do not wholly define the future.There is no football gene.

Every person has the ability to be a professional footballer, psychologically only the elite few do -  there is a lot of merit in this because it is our lack of desire to be relentless in the pursuit of improvement via practice that defines what we are. Mentally from early ages few have the growth mindset to constantly practice deliberately each day, each week,  each month to get even close to the pro game.  

This was my point, there is natural talent involved but you need the mental side of your game to consistent to be like Messi/Ronaldo, do you think if they were 1v1 they would have any doubt in there mind they'll miss? Not a chance, whereas a player at a struggling team or further down the ladder that confidence and mindset isn't there

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...