Why has one game shut everyone up?

[Alan Dicks]

One jammy win last night and the happy clappers are out in force i see.

[Between heaven and hell]

2 hours ago, Flint says No said:

Bore off mate 

Quality reply that.

I take it you enjoyed the brand of football that was dished up last night.

[REDOXO]

Big Game Saturday!....Lets Gee everyone up for it!

This thread should do it nicely!

[Kingswood Robin]

2 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

Yes but Warnock has got Cardiff to the verge of promotion - unless they screw it up. I suspect he has a bigger budget and they are a much more established Championship club with recent Premier League history but that is the only reference point LJ is to be measured against.

Never mind the fact that Pearson - who most wanted when LJ was appointed - did a terrible job at Derby, or that 13 Championship managers (so far) have not lasted the season, or that 12 of the clubs below us are ex-Premier league clubs, most of them with bigger budgets and better power to attract players. Or that six of the seven teas above us are ex-Premier league clubs, most of them with bigger budgets and better power to attract players. Ultimately LJ will never be seen as even a decent manager until he does better than Warnock, and even then there will be some excuse or other as to why LJ is still the wrong man for the job.

For the record, I was as frustrated as anyone about our recent slump. After Brentford and Millwall, I questioned LJ's ability to pick the right players and get the most out of them. But overall we have had a very good season, and overall LJ has done an excellent job of taking a team in the Championship relegation zone and establishing them in the Championship as a team ready to sustain a play-off challenge.

In the long term, he might or might not be the person to take the next step but certainly there is a lot more than one more win last night to show he is a good manager who has done a good job on the whole. 

Makes me wonder why we're the only ones out of that lot that have never made it to the Premier League.

We should have shown we had a pair in January, and picked up our PL money. Then we could have stopped feeling like little Bristol City, with our little budget and our oh dear it's all too difficult (especially in January) mentality.

Cardiff, a much more established championship club, really? The difference is they have a manager that knows how to do it. We have a perfectly decent chap that's still learning. 1980 was a long time ago and some of us just don't want to wait another 5-10 never/never years. Having to watch Bournemouth and Huddersfield on Match of the day and seeing teams like Wigan make it (and even win the FA Cup) and the best we can do (with a dedicated team in place) is sign Diony? It just doesn't cut of for me.

[Robin1988]

17 minutes ago, Between heaven and hell said:

Quality reply that.

I take it you enjoyed the brand of football that was dished up last night.

Speak for yourself but if it won us the next four I’ll be hoofing mad

[LondonBristolian]

15 minutes ago, Kingswood Robin said:

 

Cardiff, a much more established championship club, really?

Erm. yes. Obviously. They've been in the Championship or higher for 15 consecutive seasons whilst we've yo-yo'd between divisions. In their most recent available accounts, they had a turnover of around £31 million compared to our £14 million and staff costs of £33.5million compared to our £17.4 million. Anyone who pretends it is simply the manager and not that they - and most of the Championship promotion contenders -  are considerably outspending us is simply ignoring facts. 

And yes, we could have spent big in January. And that might have worked and got us up. Or it might not have worked and ended us up with players on big wages who had about as much impact as Kent and Diony have, who we could not move on. We tried going big quickly before from 2008 - 2011 and the resultant mess financially stifled the club, took 4 years to resolve and nearly saw going down to League Two. Personally I prefer the "softly, softly" approach. 

[Esmond Million's Bung]

4 hours ago, Robin1988 said:

4-2? They missed two great chances through Jota and someone else but the goal was a fluke, if we're going on clear-cut opportunities.

If Bryan is still struggling for form I must have missed all the chances they had down their right, or someone else put the ball in for Reid's goal.

Fine it's all about opinions and you have read mine, i'm not asking you to like or even agree.

What I believe is being missed is that up until the Wolves game, we had set certain standards and even after a defeat during that time we quickly returned to those standards, since then I can only think of a couple of instances where we have played to those standards, if we continue our current standard of performance into next season it will be a very hard season.

 

[Davefevs]

Updated table now that Derby’s accounts in, and notes showing that Boro (overdue), Sunderland (not due) who’ve yet to post their accounts are due c£55m in parachute in their 17/18 accounts!  This supports my resident accountant guru @LondonBristolian‘s post.

 

 

[Kingswood Robin]

4 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

Erm. yes. Obviously. They've been in the Championship or higher for 15 consecutive seasons whilst we've yo-yo'd between divisions. In their most recent available accounts, they had a turnover of around £31 million compared to our £14 million and staff costs of £33.5million compared to our £17.4 million. Anyone who pretends it is simply the manager and not that they - and most of the Championship promotion contenders -  are considerably outspending us is simply ignoring facts. 

And yes, we could have spent big in January. And that might have worked and got us up. Or it might not have worked and ended us up with players on big wages who had about as much impact as Kent and Diony have, who we could not move on. We tried going big quickly before from 2008 - 2011 and the resultant mess financially stifled the club, took 4 years to resolve and nearly saw going down to League Two. Personally I prefer the "softly, softly" approach. 

It's not just about recent seasons though. Not so long ago we were about the same as we are now (surprise surprise) and Cardiff were languishing in the bottom division (with Fulham, Burnley, Bournemouth, Wigan, Brighton, Hull and friends). How much of that turnover (and ability to spend) was down to their one season in the PL? Where else would this more than double our turnover come from? Figures I saw suggested we're averaging 1300 more at home than them (accepted that might not line up with your finance period). They must have some pretty salty season ticket prices or sell one hell of a lot of shirts compared to us. If we want to get that spending power up, you need to take your chance when it comes along. Next season, 5 years, 10 years time, if we don't take our chance when it comes along, we'll still be complaining about our small budget. We had a chance to put that right and didn't take it.

Now to Warnock. As unpleasant as I find him at times, employing him would be merely be a means to an end. His record speaks for itself. If he was in charge with us in second place at Christmas, regardless of budget, where do you think we would be now? Struggling to make the play-offs? Not a chance.

[LondonBristolian]

39 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Updated table now that Derby’s accounts in, and notes showing that Boro (overdue), Sunderland (not due) who’ve yet to post their accounts are due c£55m in parachute in their 17/18 accounts!  This supports my resident accountant guru @LondonBristolian‘s post.

 

 

Really makes you marvel at what Millwall are doing. If they make the play-offs, or even if they don’t, he surely is the manager of the season in this division. I know Millwall are not a fashionable club but he deserve way more in the way of plaudits than he gets...

[Mr Popodopolous]

54 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Updated table now that Derby’s accounts in, and notes showing that Boro (overdue), Sunderland (not due) who’ve yet to post their accounts are due c£55m in parachute in their 17/18 accounts!  This supports my resident accountant guru @LondonBristolian‘s post.

 

 

One that stands out for me on that- Burton have a turnover of £11.4m??

Would have thought it would be the lowest in this Division, for sure.

[Davefevs]

9 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

Really makes you marvel at what Millwall are doing. If they make the play-offs, or even if they don’t, he surely is the manager of the season in this division. I know Millwall are not a fashionable club but he deserve way more in the way of plaudits than he gets...

Agree.  Will be interesting how much they have increased their budget this season.  From reading a few bits and pieces it looks like contract extensions triggered by things like 15 appearances, relegation avoidance, etc.  Sounds like they have been very sensible on their return to the Champ.

[Davefevs]

7 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

One that stands out for me on that- Burton have a turnover of £11.4m??

Would have thought it would be the lowest in this Division, for sure.

It was for clubs that were in the Champ in 16/17 (which is what the annual accounts are based on).  Circa £6m of that will be tv money, so only £5m(ish) from other revenue streams, and if that only £1.5m from match day income (City is over £5m!).  Yet they still managed a profit and haven’t over-committed themselves in case of return to Lg1 (which now looks imminent).

The lower turnover clubs listed were all Lg1 clubs last season.

[Robin1988]

59 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Updated table now that Derby’s accounts in, and notes showing that Boro (overdue), Sunderland (not due) who’ve yet to post their accounts are due c£55m in parachute in their 17/18 accounts!  This supports my resident accountant guru @LondonBristolian‘s post.

 

 

These accounts are for last season right Dave? But even with that, it makes our basic cost/return for this year at least look pretty good.

[LondonBristolian]

1 hour ago, Kingswood Robin said:

It's not just about recent seasons though. Not so long ago we were about the same as we are now (surprise surprise) and Cardiff were languishing in the bottom division (with Fulham, Burnley, Bournemouth, Wigan, Brighton, Hull and friends). How much of that turnover (and ability to spend) was down to their one season in the PL? Where else would this more than double our turnover come from? Figures I saw suggested we're averaging 1300 more at home than them (accepted that might not line up with your finance period). They must have some pretty salty season ticket prices or sell one hell of a lot of shirts compared to us. If we want to get that spending power up, you need to take your chance when it comes along. Next season, 5 years, 10 years time, if we don't take our chance when it comes along, we'll still be complaining about our small budget. We had a chance to put that right and didn't take it.

Now to Warnock. As unpleasant as I find him at times, employing him would be merely be a means to an end. His record speaks for itself. If he was in charge with us in second place at Christmas, regardless of budget, where do you think we would be now? Struggling to make the play-offs? Not a chance.

Warnock has succeeded and he has failed. Yes, he has had more success than most but Palace were in relegation and financial trouble at the end of his first spell and Leeds did not work out either. I am not knocking his record but getting teams - often with relatively large budgets - promoted does not guarantee he would get us promoted.

Similar too with the argument of spending money in January. It only really makes sense on the basis you can guarantee signings equal success and of course, if there were signings we could make that guaranteed success, we’d all agree the club should go for them.

But the reality is no signings guarantee success and we are spending so much less than our rivals that, even if we spent a fortune, we’d still be spending less than them. You only need to look at what Diony moved for in the summer to see that expensive signings are risks. SL has learned in the past that risks do not pay off.

My honest view of our January transfer window is that, without the benefit of hindsight, we should have identified our need for a right back and that might have avoided the Bolton result that spiralled things downwards. We also should have bought a central midfielder who could immediately strenghten our midfield, although I have no idea who was available. That is the underlying gap to me.

I did not feel and do not feel we needed a winger. The one signing I did not understand and still do not is Kent as I do not feel we needed a winger. On the other hand Diony - a striker with great attributes, coveted by other clubs, who had stood out in a division we have successfully recruited from in the past and has then moved for big money - made absolute sense. We can knock it with hindsight but the rarionale was sound and it just shows how unpredictable these things are.

[Between heaven and hell]

2 hours ago, Robin1988 said:

Why is it luck? It's like LJ picked two target men but was then lucky our play was so direct? Why does @Between heaven and hell paint it as a bad thing? Our style over the past few weeks hasn't worked so we changed it up.

If you are happy to see defenders  constantly  knocking long  balls to a target man that can barely get off the ground let  alone  run then fair play to you but it's not my cup of tea.

[Robin1988]

4 minutes ago, Between heaven and hell said:

If you are happy to see defenders  constantly  knocking long  balls to a target man that can barely get off the ground let  alone  run then fair play to you but it's not my cup of tea.

Yeah, I am pretty happy when we win 3-1.

[Wrongagain]

Can’t be any fan that watched last night that did not enjoy the game, had brum been able to take their chances we would have had to fight it out, only surprise on the teamsheet was Joe switching flanks. My instinct on LJ is that he still has too much to learn, our 2 previous performances were dire and why he repeated the worst selection errors of the last 2 games, leaving it too late to take off Kent and Wright is still beyond me, mistakes that lead to the bad fan reaction, a reaction that began before a ball had been kicked, no fans could have been happy with the announced starting 11 when there were better options available.

selection issues and the huge dip in performance AGAIN demand that the management as a whole needs some direction

[Between heaven and hell]

7 minutes ago, Robin1988 said:

Yeah, I am pretty happy when we win 3-1.

That's good I'm pleased for you.

All the best.

[Robbored]

7 hours ago, Robin1988 said:

I might have missed it, but the LJ out calls seems to have subsided after last night. We've played 42 games, and getting three points in one of them is enough to change people's minds?

Not at all - I've always rated him as a manager. 

Shit player but a decent head coach.

[Robin1988]

5 minutes ago, Between heaven and hell said:

That's good I'm pleased for you.

All the best.

And people say we can't be civil on Otib! Haha.

[tinman85]

7 hours ago, DaveInSA said:

Yes. Apparently.

The posters who wanted him out have obviously disappeared. 

No. Still here. Still don't rate him. Last night was ok. We won. We got some luck. But it was better. Are going to make play offs. I hope so but doubt it and that would mean blowing it. 

[RobintheRed Red]

7 hours ago, Robin1988 said:

I might have missed it, but the LJ out calls seems to have subsided after last night. We've played 42 games, and getting three points in one of them is enough to change people's minds?

No not everyone i can see through him

[tin]

It’s not about 1 win over a profligate Birmingham side, it’s about everyone’s aspirations for the club that divides opinion on LJ the manager IMO. 

If we genuinely are looking at getting into the PL, then LJ isn’t the right man as he’s wasted millions and shown to be tactically inept many times. Plus no team can ever be in contention to go up if they endure  those prolonged losing runs that LJ has had in every year of his managerial career. 

But, if we’re happy to rest on our laurels and accept a top-half finish and progress on last year, LJ is the right man because he won’t rock the boat and he’s good at developing young talent to sell on. 

Personally, I didn’t think he’s the right man in the first place - but that’s because I aspire to see us in the PL in my lifetime and don’t think he can deliver that. 

[Kingswood Robin]

3 minutes ago, tin said:

It’s not about 1 win over a profligate Birmingham side, it’s about everyone’s aspirations for the club that divides opinion on LJ the manager IMO. 

If we genuinely are looking at getting into the PL, then LJ isn’t the right man as he’s wasted millions and shown to be tactically inept many times. Plus no team can ever be in contention to go up if they endure  those prolonged losing runs that LJ has had in every year of his managerial career. 

But, if we’re happy to rest on our laurels and accept a top-half finish and progress on last year, LJ is the right man because he won’t rock the boat and he’s good at developing young talent to sell on. 

Personally, I didn’t think he’s the right man in the first place - but that’s because I aspire to see us in the PL in my lifetime and don’t think he can deliver that. 

Spot on, I'm pleased to finally see the word aspiration!

If you want more, you've got to demand more and keep on demanding, it's the way of the world.

[Alessandro]

1 hour ago, LondonBristolian said:

Warnock has succeeded and he has failed. Yes, he has had more success than most but Palace were in relegation and financial trouble at the end of his first spell and Leeds did not work out either. I am not knocking his record but getting teams - often with relatively large budgets - promoted does not guarantee he would get us promoted.

Similar too with the argument of spending money in January. It only really makes sense on the basis you can guarantee signings equal success and of course, if there were signings we could make that guaranteed success, we’d all agree the club should go for them.

But the reality is no signings guarantee success and we are spending so much less than our rivals that, even if we spent a fortune, we’d still be spending less than them. You only need to look at what Diony moved for in the summer to see that expensive signings are risks. SL has learned in the past that risks do not pay off.

My honest view of our January transfer window is that, without the benefit of hindsight, we should have identified our need for a right back and that might have avoided the Bolton result that spiralled things downwards. We also should have bought a central midfielder who could immediately strenghten our midfield, although I have no idea who was available. That is the underlying gap to me.

I did not feel and do not feel we needed a winger. The one signing I did not understand and still do not is Kent as I do not feel we needed a winger. On the other hand Diony - a striker with great attributes, coveted by other clubs, who had stood out in a division we have successfully recruited from in the past and has then moved for big money - made absolute sense. We can knock it with hindsight but the rarionale was sound and it just shows how unpredictable these things are.

Agree with this broadly - but disagree on the winger point.

The solution to the central midfielder problem you mentioned is already at the club IMO.

I think what we needed was a RW - we only really have 2 out and out wingers in the first squad, Callum and Eliasson. One has been injured the other clearly isn’t seeing a lot of game time. 

That would have mean’t we can bring Mr Brownhill in from the wing, where despite all his industry and endeavour, he is not at his most potent.

He has more assists from the centre than the RW and in less games. I often think Brownhill central and getting forward is the player we are missing.

[BCFC Rich]

27 minutes ago, tinman85 said:

Last night was ok.

 

Last night was ok?! Last night was ok!? Wow! how gave tinman such a huge dose of optimism? That's almost a positive comment!

[tinman85]

28 minutes ago, BCFC Richard said:

Last night was ok?! Last night was ok!? Wow! how gave tinman such a huge dose of optimism? That's almost a positive comment!

That's the best you will get for now. 

[Hampshire Red]

no-one i know (and i only talk football to CIty fans) has ever thought LJ should leave BCFC in the past 12 months (unless he gets offered an irrestistable job in the EPL or Europe

Muppets on here are entitled to any opinion but no-one can believe this has been anything but a good or great season and we have one of the best managers int he league. End of.

If you disagree please explain to me at Boro

[General Zod]

For the first time in ages I was proud of the team last night, yes Brum could have scored a hat full in the first half and on a different night they would have but we attacked, tried to play the right way, created enough chances and showed plenty of bottle especially when it went 2-1 and throughout the second half

At the moment it feels like this performance and re found creativity is two games too late but from the clubs around us it’s only Millwall really making a statement about wanting a playoff place and follow it up with a good performance and rare away win on Saturday and we are suddenly at the start of a run and who knows what could happen if the confidence comes back.