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planning for the next slump


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6 hours ago, spudski said:

I look at the injuries we've had...many long term, illnesses...have said Patto looks like he has something wrong with him, and again last week he was away ill.

We've had so, so many injuries this season. So the squad effectively got smaller. Add to that players having to play more time to cover, then in turn getting tired and niggles and having to play through them.

That takes it's toll...it all adds up.

I agree for the most part with your argument about injuries @spudski - I posted this graph on here after the Cardiff game, to show our points per game each month, over-layed with key injuries (red) and additions or returns (green). We very obviously suffer for loss of players. (Full disclosure: to make it easy to see the overall trend, I removed an anomaly of points per game actually rising briefly in December prior to losing Djuric, this is the line if we didn't get last minute winners vs Hull / Sheff Utd).

2089326937_ScreenShot2018-04-17at16_57_05.png.7f4c33d802c0fee8fe502755e830aea4.png

However, while this makes clear the correlation between injuries and reduced points return, for me there is an equally clear story that players brought in to refresh the team, did nothing of the sort and just added to our problems. As such, I'd be very worried if we excused all our problems as simply down to injuries. The club must learn lessons about what happened with our January recruitment too AND dare I say prior acquisitions (Woodrow, Eliasson), that should have been good enough to step in.

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19 minutes ago, lenred said:

Every team has its injuries and I don’t think you can say that ours have been massively worse than anyone else’s? O’Dowda has been the main one and Fammy for a while from the team that was doing so well pre Xmas. Pisano as well.   Our squad though and also the funds that we spent on bringing cover during January should’ve been able to cover it off. But we tried the cheap option in Diony for Famy and Djuric and the player who had a reputation but who hadn’t pulled up trees anywhere in Kent for O’Dowda. And we chose not to bring a right back in at all. The management needs to accept responsibility for those decisions imho and we should have been able to cover it. Can’t see injuries being the main reason. 

I don't have time to go through other clubs currently, but Wolves to name one have had nothing- and I mean nothing- like the injuries like we have. Maybe they are the anomaly, but I doubt it.

In our case, the cover, the backup was injured too- example.

  • Pisano injured and then injured again- Wright has to fill in.
  • Diedhiou injured and then Djuric too- ironically it helped bring about Paterson behind Reid which was a great variant of Plan A. However both main cover type strikers injured at same time, and then when Diedhiou came back, the next on the list- Taylor- then got injured.
  • No chance to rest a few and change team, e.g. shore up midfield or pick different tactics for different games in that area (experience of O'Neil, shoring up capability of Hegeler for example- or even Hegeler at CB vs an ultra defensive side for example). Why? Because both were injured.
  • O'Dowda- just when he was hitting form too, terrible luck.

I'd say that doesn't tend to be the standard, no. However mistakes have undoubtedly been made in other areas from LJ down.

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6 hours ago, spudski said:

Whilst there has been slumps with LJ...I don't think ours this season has anything to do with what LJ has been doing perse.

I look at the injuries we've had...many long term, illnesses...have said Patto looks like he has something wrong with him, and again last week he was away ill.

We've had so, so many injuries this season. So the squad effectively got smaller. Add to that players having to play more time to cover, then in turn getting tired and niggles and having to play through them.

That takes it's toll...it all adds up.

 Then the players come back 'fit'....but not match fit, so have to play catch up.

 That in turn makes things harder as a team...we struggle to get going, confidence gets hit...and it has a downward spiral, because the players will feel it and know it when playing on the pitch.

It's those fine margins that make a difference. We haven't been absolutely walloped apart from Villa...but imo, the culmination of all those facts, and then you add the coach trying to find a way to overcome that, like all managers it won't always work, sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.

It's no coincidence that we've taken a downturn since January...you only have to look at what's happened to the playing staff.

 I'm not surprised by the results or performances tbh.

I am surprised we are still within 4 points of a play off place.

Even more so.....we are 9 points higher than the teams below us.

It really is a league of two halves this season it seems.

I then look at a team like Derby and all that they have been building over the past few years and see them struggling and put the whole thing into perspective and realise we really aren't in that bad a position overall.

I think we will build next season again.

I agree with much of this but can't say LJ, or the club, are exonerated of blame. We've had injuries, yes, but not to the extent that four months of relegation form becomes inevitable. And LJ has to take some of the flak (but not all of it, MA's sole job is off-the-field work and signings are the only thing he ever talks about) for the absolute shitshow we've had on the loan front. Kent, Diony, Leko, Woodrow, all horrifically bad for this club.

His inability to motivate a team low on confidence has bitten him before and definitely has something to do with it as well in my mind.

Don't get me wrong, good season absolutely. It's not wrong to be concerned about being on such a horrendous run that we've been on though.

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So the majority agree injuries have been a problem. (Too many to individually quote...but thanks for the replies...)

But then we look at our January transfer window and who we brought in.

Yes...they haven't worked in the main.

But all have done well at previous clubs.

And like I keep repeating over and over again. We have no idea of budgets, contracts, pre contract agreements, further plans, players available and who wanted to come here, who we contacted etc.etc.

If it was like picking up your shopping and sticking in the basket, then I'd get it....but it's not.

But the constant moaning about January is futile, If we don't know the situation within the club.

I just wish all of us, could live one year in the life of a manager/coach to experience how difficult the footballing world is these days.

I just don't get the mentality of some, just looking and looking for 'problems'....when it's staring us all in the face.

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20 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I don't have time to go through other clubs currently, but Wolves to name one have had nothing- and I mean nothing- like the injuries like we have. Maybe they are the anomaly, but I doubt it.

In our case, the cover, the backup was injured too- example.

  • Pisano injured and then injured again- Wright has to fill in.
  • Diedhiou injured and then Djuric too- ironically it helped bring about Paterson behind Reid which was a great variant of Plan B. However both main cover type strikers injured at same time, and then when Diedhiou came back, the next on the list- Taylor- then got injured.
  • No chance to rest a few and change team, e.g. shore up midfield or pick different tactics for different games in that area (experience of O'Neil, shoring up capability of Hegeler for example). Why? Because both were injured.
  • O'Dowda- just when he was hitting form too, terrible luck.

I'd say that doesn't tend to be the standard, no.

I think Helder Costa was out for quite a bit at the start of the season - first couple of months - and I would think he is up there being their best player.  Jota was also injured for a few weeks and Bonatini also.  But its not really comparing like with like as we don't have Wolves budget nor their (dubious) contacts with one of the biggest agents in the word and I'm not saying we should have the same level of cover as them.  I am saying though that we should have been able to cover the injuries we had in our own way with the players we already had as bought in by LJ and that also the players we brought in January were not up to the task - evidently.  We had cover - it just wasn't good enough judging by the results.

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7 minutes ago, lenred said:

.  I am saying though that we should have been able to cover the injuries we had in our own way with the players we already had as bought in by LJ and that also the players we brought in January were not up to the task - evidently.  We had cover - it just wasn't good enough judging by the results.

Targets according to Spudski brought in January were not to cover injuries. These new clubs in the bag left the team short!! Poor recruitment all round.

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13 minutes ago, spudski said:

So the majority agree injuries have been a problem. (Too many to individually quote...but thanks for the replies...)

But then we look at our January transfer window and who we brought in.

Yes...they haven't worked in the main.

But all have done well at previous clubs.

And like I keep repeating over and over again. We have no idea of budgets, contracts, pre contract agreements, further plans, players available and who wanted to come here, who we contacted etc.etc.

If it was like picking up your shopping and sticking in the basket, then I'd get it....but it's not.

But the constant moaning about January is futile, If we don't know the situation within the club.

I just wish all of us, could live one year in the life of a manager/coach to experience how difficult the footballing world is these days.

I just don't get the mentality of some, just looking and looking for 'problems'....when it's staring us all in the face.

I wish the manager/coach could spend one year living the life of any disgruntled supporter to realise what they experience, feel and have to put up with.

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19 minutes ago, spudski said:

So the majority agree injuries have been a problem. (Too many to individually quote...but thanks for the replies...)

But then we look at our January transfer window and who we brought in.

Yes...they haven't worked in the main.

But all have done well at previous clubs.

And like I keep repeating over and over again. We have no idea of budgets, contracts, pre contract agreements, further plans, players available and who wanted to come here, who we contacted etc.etc.

If it was like picking up your shopping and sticking in the basket, then I'd get it....but it's not.

But the constant moaning about January is futile, If we don't know the situation within the club.

I just wish all of us, could live one year in the life of a manager/coach to experience how difficult the footballing world is these days.

I just don't get the mentality of some, just looking and looking for 'problems'....when it's staring us all in the face.

Absolutely spot on Spudski. 

 

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20 minutes ago, spudski said:

But then we look at our January transfer window and who we brought in.

Yes...they haven't worked in the main.

But all have done well at previous clubs.

Diony was a disaster at his previous club. Kent struggled for game time at his previous club and Walsh also.

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42 minutes ago, lenred said:

I think Helder Costa was out for quite a bit at the start of the season - first couple of months - and I would think he is up there being their best player.  Jota was also injured for a few weeks and Bonatini also.  But its not really comparing like with like as we don't have Wolves budget nor their (dubious) contacts with one of the biggest agents in the word and I'm not saying we should have the same level of cover as them.  I am saying though that we should have been able to cover the injuries we had in our own way with the players we already had as bought in by LJ and that also the players we brought in January were not up to the task - evidently.  We had cover - it just wasn't good enough judging by the results.

I think if there had been outright poor cover, we would have dropped off to midtable sooner personally- especially during the Cup run.

I also think various cover was not utilised sufficiently, or at the right times.

Let's have a quick look at key and even not quite key players for Wolves and losses- Bonatini lost form and Afobe was brought in and they mix and match those 2, but I digress.

  • Ruddy- Possible 43 games, Started 43.
  • Coady- Possible 43 games, Started 42- he got a red card so can't be classed as an injury.
  • Doherty- Possible 43 games, Started 42. The game he missed was through suspension, so it can't be classed as an injury.
  • Cavaleiro- Possible 43 games, Played 42 (31 starts and 11 sub appearances). 1 game injured.
  • Jota- Possible 43 games, Played 41 (40 starts and 11 sub appearances). Missed 2 through injury.
  • Neves- Possible 43 games, Played 39. All four he missed were through suspension- not one injury absence,
  • Saiss- Possible 43 games, Play 39 (34 starts 5 Subs). Missed 3 through injury- one of these was through suspension.
  • Douglas- Possible 43 games, Played 36 (35 starts, 1 sub appearance). 6 injured and one suspended.
  • Boly- Possible 43 games, Played 34. Missed 9 through injury.
  • Bonatini- he started their first choice forward but then came Afobe. Possible 43 games, Played 40 (29 starts, 11 subs). Think he missed three through injury.
  • Afobe- Luxury of riches for this level- those 2! Far less appearance potential, but Possible 14 games/apps. Played in all 14 (5 starts and 9 sub appearances).

That's a brilliant continuity of selection- is it not?

Two I will concur with you on?

  • Helder Costa, appeared in only 33 out of 43 Championship games (18 starts, 15 sub appearances). Missed 10 out injured.
  • Ryan Bennett missed 14 after assorted injuries.

Overall, I think our injuries this year were amongst the worse end of the promotion and playoff contenders.

Fulham?

  • Sessegnon- Possible 43 games, 42 Starts and 1 sub appearance.
  • Johansen- Possible 43 games, 40 Starts and 2 sub appearances. 1 game injured.
  • Fredericks- Benched once, Possible 43 games, with 43 starts and 1 game injured.

Could go on- but fortunately I won't!

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3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I think if there had been outright poor cover, we would have dropped off to midtable sooner personally- especially during the Cup run.

I also think various cover was not utilised sufficiently.

Let's have a quick look at key and even not quite key players for Wolves and losses- Bonatini lost form and Afobe was brought in and they mix and match those 2, but I digress.

  • Ruddy- Possible 43 games, Started 43.
  • Coady- Possible 43 games, Started 42- he got a red card so can't be classed as an injury.
  • Doherty- Possible 43 games, Started 42. The game he missed was through suspension, so it can't be classed as an injury.
  • Cavaleiro- Possible 43 games, Played 42 (31 starts and 11 sub appearances). 1 game injured.
  • Jota- Possible 43 games, Played 41 (40 starts and 11 sub appearances). Missed 2 through injury.
  • Neves- Possible 43 games, Played 39. All four he missed were through suspension- not one injury absence,
  • Saiss- Possible 43 games, Play 39 (34 starts 5 Subs). Missed 3 through injury- one of these was through suspension.
  • Douglas- Possible 43 games, Played 36 (35 starts, 1 sub appearance). 6 injured and one suspended.
  • Boly- Possible 43 games, Played 34. Missed 9 through injury.
  • Bonatini- he started their first choice forward but then came Afobe. Possible 43 games, Played 40 (29 starts, 11 subs). Think he missed three through injury.
  • Afobe- Luxury of riches for this level- those 2! Far less appearance potential, but Possible 14 games/apps. Played in all 14 (5 starts and 9 sub appearances).

That's a brilliant continuity of selection- is it not?

Two I will concur with you on?

  • Helder Costa, appeared in only 33 out of 43 Championship games (18 starts, 15 sub appearances). Missed 10 out injured.
  • Ryan Bennett missed 14 after assorted injuries.

Overall, I think our injuries this year were amongst the worse end of the promotion and playoff contenders.

Fair enough some good research.  But as I said before,  I don't think that comparing us with Wolves is comparing like with like.  If it were we would have been signing Afobe not Diony!  My original point is that I don't think that our injuries are or can be the main reason for our spectacular slump since December and I stand by that.  No doubt its a contributing factor but not the main one imho. 

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1 hour ago, downendcity said:

I don't think this is what LJ coaches but it is the go to way of playing for players under pressure or where they are short on confidence.

We have reverted to hoofball  all too many times  over recent years - usually when we are under pressure and players are short on confidence, because we have been in relegation scraps - so don't think this is a LJ phenomenon. 

 

Neither do I, but the intent of this team was different. That intent was altered by Mr Johnson. 

Frank Fielding rarely play the ball short, his goal kicks, a larger front two to provide a platform (LJ coaching speech) to hit and get runners off is moving away from former football.

1 hour ago, spudski said:

You're making it sound like an xbox game fella...not sure if you are on a wind u now.

You slate LJ for 'hoofing it' up to Famara nd Duric....yet glorify Warnock for doing the same. Duric and Famara have all the attributes to play a different way, and others playing off of them.

I've explained why LJ most likely 'twisted' out of necessity.

Have Wolves and Fulham had the injury list like ours? Perhaps if they did, they would be forced to change.

Your last paragraph doesn't make sense. We have a squad...but it was depleted by injury.

 

I did not glorify Mr Warnock.

Lee Johnson altered the style due to intent. He had targets lined up. They do not just happen. Mr  Ashton tells us about how much work is done. It is meant to be methodical. They signed? Did not go well.

Team suffered. All due to injury? For you yes, me no. 

Last paragraph. Your words were Why would you bring in players to cover what you already have long term? Injuries, loss of form. fresh legs, players being challenged ...  

Injuries you are stating caused Citys football and style to go South. Players brought in did not cover injuries. Players brought in were not meant to is your point. I agreed with that months ago.

Uneven and poor recruitment there it is ...  My point months ago as well. 

 

 

 

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Just now, lenred said:

Fair enough some good research.  But as I said before,  I don't think that comparing us with Wolves is comparing like with like.  If it were we would have been signing Afobe not Diony!  My original point is that I don't think that our injuries are or can be the main reason for our spectacular slump since December and I stand by that.  No doubt its a contributing factor but not the main one imho. 

Yeah, they were working to a very different budget to us, (and indeed to the rest of the League in the main).

Personal view is, that it is a key reason for the slump- but yeah where I certainly tend to agree is it is definitely not the only one.

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38 minutes ago, spudski said:

So the majority agree injuries have been a problem. (Too many to individually quote...but thanks for the replies...)

But then we look at our January transfer window and who we brought in.

Yes...they haven't worked in the main.

But all have done well at previous clubs.

And like I keep repeating over and over again. We have no idea of budgets, contracts, pre contract agreements, further plans, players available and who wanted to come here, who we contacted etc.etc.

If it was like picking up your shopping and sticking in the basket, then I'd get it....but it's not.

But the constant moaning about January is futile, If we don't know the situation within the club.

I just wish all of us, could live one year in the life of a manager/coach to experience how difficult the footballing world is these days.

I just don't get the mentality of some, just looking and looking for 'problems'....when it's staring us all in the face.

No point in arguing it to some mate. LJ has gotten som things wrong for sure during this run(and before). The recruitment argument will never end. On paper, Diony and Kent were good business. Ok Diony had a rough spell at St. Etienne but without that he’d have been well out of our league. Kent done well enough to get a move to the Bundesliga. So unless the argument is are they in form at that moment, it will go on forever. Grabban, Mitrovic and Afobe all went to clubs I’d call bigger clubs right now. 

Where LJ has gone wrong is not having some faith in players that were already here. Eliasson, Kelly and Vyner all should have been used to spell some players. We were bare bones but had players we weren’t using and were fit. How do we fit them in?

That brings me to my next point with LJ, creativity or lack thereof. Eliasson could have spelled either wing. Kelly could have spelled LB or LCB. Bryan could have been pushed forward or moved into midfield to give Korey a break. Brownhill could have also been moved centrally to spell either CM. Vyner could have covered RB and Wright LCB for Baker who we know struggles with little niggles. This could have been done every few games to not only keep players fresh but on their toes of they performed well enough. 

Also he is not creative enough with formations. It is always this narrow 442. Why not try 3 at the back against a team like Burton who we struggle to break down but don’t threaten? Why not drop a striker against a team like Preston that we usually struggle against with their talented midfield 3? Why not get a crosser like Eliasson on the right of a 433 to whip crosses in and to he creative have Famara on the left so he can cut in and shoot(which he is quite good at) and also attack fullbacks aerially at the back post? We had enough options to match up with different teams in certain situations. Especially after teams figured out our 442. 

Mistakes have been made from board level to playing staff and everything in between. There have been numerous reasons so I think they should be accounted for. At the same time people should be held accountable. So as I see it, this season has been a success. Though a major question about LJ has not been answered and that is can he prevent a stretch of bad form? Or stop a stretch of bad form quicker? Those are legitimate questions about LJ and ones that need to be answered soon. He has earned his summer and early season but we need to start strong and keep the form from dipping too much. 

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3 hours ago, spudski said:

Why does it have to be seen as an 'excuse' BBSB?

We had an in depth interview with out physio about our ongoing injury problems this season. The worst he has ever seen.

That's not an 'excuse'...it's a fact.

The knock effects from that are what we've witnessed. Spoken about in posts above.

That's not an excuse...it's what's happened. A cause and effect.

Do you honestly believe we would have had such a drop in form like we have had, if we had more prominent squad members to have selected from, throughout the season?

We showed great promise up to January...it's easy to see why it all caught up with us.

Why does there have to be a 'reason' other than that. Why does it have to be someone's fault? Why do we have to blame recruitment when we don't know the budgets etc?

Why?

Is it not the most likely reason we've had a drop in form because of all that's been spoken about on this thread....the obvious?

And yes...certain players haven't worked out...but name one club where they do?

Name one coach that doesn't make mistakes?

Why does it have to be someone's fault?

I just don't get it.

Frustration and disappointment I get...but the constant looking for someone to blame...I don't.

Interestingly I didn’t specifically refer to the injury ‘reason’ - only you did

But

For me , to hide behind it , or in this case tbf to Lee Johnson , not him but the people constantly providing reasons / mitigation  / Excuses (Choose your own) on his behalf is akin to an excuse or certainly something to blame it on

If not the injuries

They are tired

They are a young squad

We don’t have the budget

We are still a work in progress

We are new to this level

 

All May or may not have some relevance and/or be true or not and  are all debatable and have been 

As you have suggested injuries for the drop in form I’ll make some points IMHO 

 

A reoccurring point claimed is that the injuries left us short as we don’t have the squad to cope

So after recruiting 30 players and over 2 years we are even now saying we don’t have enough depth in the squad - If correct that opens up a whole new question or questions for me

There were a number of players injured during that period Engvall , Eliasson, Woodrow , Kelly , Vyner ,  (Kelly & Vyner a slightly different case as young players coming through but Kelly has proved himself capable of games) who hardly made an appearance between them and a number of others like Magnusson and Taylor who were only used when it appeared he had to

So the actual reason that injuries will have had a detremental effect can be layed  at the door of LJ  in poor recruitment and/or not rating or trusting players he has recruited 

Iknow the claim will come that the injuries were to key players

The first obvious point to make is that it’s universally accepted we played our best football during the period we had those injuries

Another claim will be that we could have changed it up more and saved any chance of burnout

Looking at the long term injuries and the players affected I am far from convinced that they are important or integral and would strongly suggest that we wouldn’t have reached the heights of 2nd or been as successful against Utd &. O had we not had that cohesive unit that it was

Looking at the injured players and my view on the impact of their absence

Pisano

Like him as a character and his attitude , very un Italian like as a defender - Much better going forward than he is a defender and often caught out of position (Far more than JB who has been slated for it) Overall a decent squad member but during the pre Xmas spell BW played really well and was certainly very solid defensively , far more than Pisano would have been IMHO but was ‘limited’ coming forward from RB (But where did we miss this ?) 

His availability would have helped for the games where KS and JB played there and of course would have freed BW -But BW wouldn't get in / have got in ahead of Flint and Baker for me -

Not sure about Pisano - will be interesting to see where he is come August .Nowhere near as good as Luke Ayling in my book and controversially I wonder how much different he is in lots of ways or better than Little

(I’d be actively looking at RB options)

So would a fit Pisano have made us a better side at that time   IMHO.  No

Gary O’Neil

Had high hopes for him as a signing but we will probably never know what he might or might not have added here .Possibly a miss but in honesty that would be a guess

Callum O’Dowda

The clearest and biggest loss for me for the qualities he was showing and gave us legs and pace which we are not over abundant with - His absence has suddenly turned him into the Messiah , poor lad , he’s decent , going to be very decent but still a work in progress

Would he have improved the team, or at least the squad and been a decent help.  IMHO Yes

 

Milan Djuric

Think I’m in a small camp on here that doesn’t quite get the hype about Milan. Definitely a power in the air and hold up play can be decent. Lacks mobility IMHO and a decent squad player or for me one to use off the bench.Whether he’s started or used off the bench needs decent service - not balls pumped in his direction from deep

Would he have been a good addition to squad   IMHO Yes, But doesn’t fit in with our preferred style of play and thus an alternative but needs to be part of a coached plan including service

 

Famara Diedhiou 

Looks very decent one moment and non league the next - decent goal return and can have some real ‘moments’ but inconsistent , not quick , very poor touch IMHO , poor athleticism / strength IMHO . Doesn’t fit in with our high press busy bee ethos so another alternative who I believe needs to be in box and supplied with crosses to see the best of him - not the way we play

Does he make us ‘better’ as a side ? No - Not if referring about our best side as being the style and way of pre Xmas 

(I see qualities and limitations in both MD and FD but in very broad terms and summary neither fit into our preferred ethos of high press , busy , quick sharp passing etc etc and I’d go further and say both put a big hole in it and immediately stop us playing that way)

 

Jans Hegeler

Might be a smooth footballer but just don’t see and have never seen where he fits - Certainly not a ‘busy bee’ and lacks the pace and physicality to play CB or CM in Championship on what I’ve seen

So would his availability been a help - Not really or minimal IMHO

 

Harsh as those assessments may be viewed they bring me to the suggestion that the injuries in terms of improving the side are IMHO illjudged or over egged when you actually assess those players , whatever strengths and weaknesses , and their positive or negative effects on the side that rolled on pre xmas

They may have offered options but their returns have , to date shown little side of improvement or any form and I maintain if we had been using most of them I don’t believe we would have got to 2nd or played as well in the three Manchester ties

COD will be a good addition - still likely to blow hot and cold but definitely a starting contender who is busy and can play a part in our preferred style of play

FD and MD could be very useful options if IMHO doing %75 of their work in opposition penalty box and provided with decent service from wide -Not only a totally different style from our preferred method but something we don’t seem to be able to have provided them with on their return - muddled approach

Can be incorporated into a Plan B but needs some serious work on 

 

i actually believe a combination of good coaching / drilling pre season by LJ & Co and a stroke of fate / fortune (Ironically the injuries & controversially IMHO  injury to FD  ) forcing his selections which clicked into his ethos nicely , got us rolling on tha pre Xmas run

the lack of toys for LJ to tinker with , actually benefitted everyone IMHO

Although we weren’t purrring at the time , the return of the injured  ,compounded by the January recruitment and shoehorning some new toys in, sent us completely off kilt with no noticeable plan and changing week by week as Lee fiddled and fuddled

 

some of these aspects I’ve gone onto are whole new subjects and debates that have all sorts of sections themselves , but I hope I’ve explained that if people are clinging onto the hope that the injuries were a major part in what went ‘wrong’

IMHO  they are misguided

The recruitment at the club doesn’t match Lees primary ethos sufficiently IMHO and that’s been exposed in recent months 

We have players who are decent players if used in a certain way and others like Hegeler who I don’t see as a fit here and in the Championship

Lee needs to decide how he wants to play primarily and first and foremost get a squad of sufficient depth and quality to sustain this 

On top but after the above he should recruit additions or use the ones we have , possibly recruiting to assist the plan B and get coaching it

 

 

Quite a few have suggested ‘It’s happened let’s move on’ -

We’ll just a small point , if you don’t self analyse and scrutinise and identify what’s gone wrong , you’re pretty unlikely to be able to fixit or not repeat it)

You constantly have digs at posters finding fault or wanting to discuss what they thinks gone wrong

What I find irritating is a certain number posters who in response to any criticism or scrutiny jump to the Clubs or more often LJs defence on each and every occasion or subject - no balance , just an immediate defence stance fiercely protecting the head coach you’d believe he was a loved one at times

Theres a few on here who would try and justify LJ playing Bobby Reid in goal

(There’s also a few who will never like  LJ and struggle to give him a chance or any credit for anything but I’d say less than those that I’ve described above)

The Forum is for fans to debate and still remains probably the best in terms of decent content and debate of any forum of the many I have a read of

Some need to realise that being a supporter does not necessitate never scrutinising , criticising or finding fault with the Club or LJ

For  the record I don’t  strongly like but certainly don’t dislike LJ and even that is not relevant

I judge him simply , at any given point , on his performance as the Head Coach and what that entails , and his ability and suitability it stabalise and progress at our Club

Hes a bit like FD - shows in flashes some real exciting promise but there’s then a sinking feeling as you see real flaws

Id be sticking with him , but wanting some answers , and giving it another run next season 

(Some real alarm bells / concern , looking forward , are creeping rapidly back for me though)

But personally I’d be constantly assessing that we are actually progressing , and not about to fall into anything like a relegation battle at any point

And when I say progression I’m only talking about showing progression to becoming a established well assembled and planned Championship Squad / Side - not too much to ask IMHO

 

And

@Redstart after you rubbished my post - if you read the above you will understand why I think your injury excuse post isn’t a simple or decent reason as far as I’m concerned 

 

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1 hour ago, downendcity said:

I don't think this is what LJ coaches but it is the go to way of playing for players under pressure or where they are short on confidence.

We have reverted to hoofball  all too many times  over recent years - usually when we are under pressure and players are short on confidence, because we have been in relegation scraps - so don't think this is a LJ phenomenon. 

 

I don't see LJ getting too animated on the touchline when we kick ball after ball upfield over the top of the midfield. 

If it wasn't "his way", why isn't his spitting chips about the player's tactics during the game?

He must advise/coach it. 

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It annoys me when people say we are punching above our weight ,

really ? A wealthy owner , who’s given his favoured manager  every gadget , drone , grass measuring device , holidays to  dubai, Tenerife ,we have wasted millions.  The embarrassing engvall situation , transfer fee , wages , not forgetting. Fees for eliason , Walsh, 

the likes of burton , Brentford , Barnsley , Bolton all fall in to punching above their weight ? 

They haven’t got half the money , or facilities we have.   

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3 minutes ago, kivsy said:

It annoys me when people say we are punching above our weight ,

really ? A wealthy owner , who’s given his favoured manager  every gadget , drone , grass measuring device , holidays to  dubai, Tenerife ,we have wasted millions.  The embarrassing engvall situation , transfer fee , wages , not forgetting. Fees for eliason , Walsh, 

the likes of burton , Brentford , Barnsley , Bolton all fall in to punching above their weight ? 

They haven’t got half the money , or facilities we have.   

But what about Derby :dunno:

They have a much bigger budget and have messed up more than we have

:tumbleweed:

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8 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

But what about Derby :dunno:

They have a much bigger budget and have messed up more than we have

:tumbleweed:

Unfortunately, the "there's someone who's made a worse hash of it than us" argument does little more than cement small minds and lack of ambition. It excuses poor performance. 

I want to see the hierarchy at the club being bloody livid about the last few months. 

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22 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said:

Unfortunately, the "there's someone who's made a worse hash of it than us" argument does little more than cement small minds and lack of ambition. It excuses poor performance. 

I want to see the hierarchy at the club being bloody livid about the last few months. 

Too true. The likelihood is that we'll finish a win short of the playoffs and miss out on hundreds of thousands of pounds in gate and tv revenue.

And we're expected to put it down to Lemony Johnson's Series of Unfortunate Events.

It'll be excuses, excuses and illustrate what a nice club we are.

Happy to fail.

"It's fun to lose and to pretend...."

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14 minutes ago, Curr Avon said:

Too true. The likelihood is that we'll finish a win short of the playoffs and the club will miss out on hundreds of thousands of pounds in gate and tv revenue.

And we're expected to put it down to Lemony Johnson's Series of Unfortunate Events.

It'll be excuses, excuses and illustrate what a nice club we are.

Happy to fail.

'It's fun to lose and to pretend...."

I keep on hearing this, reading this but the evidence is mixed.

'What a nice club we are'

Mr Ashton is pretty commercially minded. SL, well someone with his career background is hardly liable to be that tolerant of mediocrity. LJ has a property portfolio or such I believe, again not exactly fitting the bill in a way.

Not saying I dislike them, certainly not but 'nice' or 'cosy' aren't exactly the words that spring to mind with these.

Before even factoring in Bristol sport and how corporate it is.

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2 hours ago, spudski said:

So the majority agree injuries have been a problem. (Too many to individually quote...but thanks for the replies...)

But then we look at our January transfer window and who we brought in.

Yes...they haven't worked in the main.

But all have done well at previous clubs.

And like I keep repeating over and over again. We have no idea of budgets, contracts, pre contract agreements, further plans, players available and who wanted to come here, who we contacted etc.etc.

If it was like picking up your shopping and sticking in the basket, then I'd get it....but it's not.

But the constant moaning about January is futile, If we don't know the situation within the club.

I just wish all of us, could live one year in the life of a manager/coach to experience how difficult the footballing world is these days.

I just don't get the mentality of some, just looking and looking for 'problems'....when it's staring us all in the face.

Again, I've been a staunch defender of LJ but Spudski, it doesn't matter who we spoke to and didn't come here. The only thing that matters is that they didn't. It's the club's job to recruit well and they collectively didn't do it. I can't help but think you wouldn't give previous managers such a generous viewpoint as "coaching is very difficult these days".

And I still don't buy our injuries being enough to cripple us into producing relegation form. And that's before you bring LJ's historical record of slumps into the equation.

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2 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Interestingly I didn’t specifically refer to the injury ‘reason’ - only you did

But

For me , to hide behind it , or in this case tbf to Lee Johnson , not him but the people constantly providing reasons / mitigation  / Excuses (Choose your own) on his behalf is akin to an excuse or certainly something to blame it on

If not the injuries

They are tired

They are a young squad

We don’t have the budget

We are still a work in progress

We are new to this level

 

All May or may not have some relevance and/or be true or not and  are all debatable and have been 

As you have suggested injuries for the drop in form I’ll make some points IMHO 

 

A reoccurring point claimed is that the injuries left us short as we don’t have the squad to cope

So after recruiting 30 players and over 2 years we are even now saying we don’t have enough depth in the squad - If correct that opens up a whole new question or questions for me

There were a number of players injured during that period Engvall , Eliasson, Woodrow , Kelly , Vyner ,  (Kelly & Vyner a slightly different case as young players coming through but Kelly has proved himself capable of games) who hardly made an appearance between them and a number of others like Magnusson and Taylor who were only used when it appeared he had to

So the actual reason that injuries will have had a detremental effect can be layed  at the door of LJ  in poor recruitment and/or not rating or trusting players he has recruited 

Iknow the claim will come that the injuries were to key players

The first obvious point to make is that it’s universally accepted we played our best football during the period we had those injuries

Another claim will be that we could have changed it up more and saved any chance of burnout

Looking at the long term injuries and the players affected I am far from convinced that they are important or integral and would strongly suggest that we wouldn’t have reached the heights of 2nd or been as successful against Utd &. O had we not had that cohesive unit that it was

Looking at the injured players and my view on the impact of their absence

Pisano

Like him as a character and his attitude , very un Italian like as a defender - Much better going forward than he is a defender and often caught out of position (Far more than JB who has been slated for it) Overall a decent squad member but during the pre Xmas spell BW played really well and was certainly very solid defensively , far more than Pisano would have been IMHO but was ‘limited’ coming forward from RB (But where did we miss this ?) 

His availability would have helped for the games where KS and JB played there and of course would have freed BW -But BW wouldn't get in / have got in ahead of Flint and Baker for me -

Not sure about Pisano - will be interesting to see where he is come August .Nowhere near as good as Luke Ayling in my book and controversially I wonder how much different he is in lots of ways or better than Little

(I’d be actively looking at RB options)

So would a fit Pisano have made us a better side at that time   IMHO.  No

Gary O’Neil

Had high hopes for him as a signing but we will probably never know what he might or might not have added here .Possibly a miss but in honesty that would be a guess

Callum O’Dowda

The clearest and biggest loss for me for the qualities he was showing and gave us legs and pace which we are not over abundant with - His absence has suddenly turned him into the Messiah , poor lad , he’s decent , going to be very decent but still a work in progress

Would he have improved the team, or at least the squad and been a decent help.  IMHO Yes

 

Milan Djuric

Think I’m in a small camp on here that doesn’t quite get the hype about Milan. Definitely a power in the air and hold up play can be decent. Lacks mobility IMHO and a decent squad player or for me one to use off the bench.Whether he’s started or used off the bench needs decent service - not balls pumped in his direction from deep

Would he have been a good addition to squad   IMHO Yes, But doesn’t fit in with our preferred style of play and thus an alternative but needs to be part of a coached plan including service

 

Famara Diedhiou 

Looks very decent one moment and non league the next - decent goal return and can have some real ‘moments’ but inconsistent , not quick , very poor touch IMHO , poor athleticism / strength IMHO . Doesn’t fit in with our high press busy bee ethos so another alternative who I believe needs to be in box and supplied with crosses to see the best of him - not the way we play

Does he make us ‘better’ as a side ? No - Not if referring about our best side as being the style and way of pre Xmas 

(I see qualities and limitations in both MD and FD but in very broad terms and summary neither fit into our preferred ethos of high press , busy , quick sharp passing etc etc and I’d go further and say both put a big hole in it and immediately stop us playing that way)

 

Jans Hegeler

Might be a smooth footballer but just don’t see and have never seen where he fits - Certainly not a ‘busy bee’ and lacks the pace and physicality to play CB or CM in Championship on what I’ve seen

So would his availability been a help - Not really or minimal IMHO

 

Harsh as those assessments may be viewed they bring me to the suggestion that the injuries in terms of improving the side are IMHO illjudged or over egged when you actually assess those players , whatever strengths and weaknesses , and their positive or negative effects on the side that rolled on pre xmas

They may have offered options but their returns have , to date shown little side of improvement or any form and I maintain if we had been using most of them I don’t believe we would have got to 2nd or played as well in the three Manchester ties

COD will be a good addition - still likely to blow hot and cold but definitely a starting contender who is busy and can play a part in our preferred style of play

FD and MD could be very useful options if IMHO doing %75 of their work in opposition penalty box and provided with decent service from wide -Not only a totally different style from our preferred method but something we don’t seem to be able to have provided them with on their return - muddled approach

Can be incorporated into a Plan B but needs some serious work on 

 

i actually believe a combination of good coaching / drilling pre season by LJ & Co and a stroke of fate / fortune (Ironically the injuries & controversially IMHO  injury to FD  ) forcing his selections which clicked into his ethos nicely , got us rolling on tha pre Xmas run

the lack of toys for LJ to tinker with , actually benefitted everyone IMHO

Although we weren’t purrring at the time , the return of the injured  ,compounded by the January recruitment and shoehorning some new toys in, sent us completely off kilt with no noticeable plan and changing week by week as Lee fiddled and fuddled

 

some of these aspects I’ve gone onto are whole new subjects and debates that have all sorts of sections themselves , but I hope I’ve explained that if people are clinging onto the hope that the injuries were a major part in what went ‘wrong’

IMHO  they are misguided

The recruitment at the club doesn’t match Lees primary ethos sufficiently IMHO and that’s been exposed in recent months 

We have players who are decent players if used in a certain way and others like Hegeler who I don’t see as a fit here and in the Championship

Lee needs to decide how he wants to play primarily and first and foremost get a squad of sufficient depth and quality to sustain this 

On top but after the above he should recruit additions or use the ones we have , possibly recruiting to assist the plan B and get coaching it

 

 

Quite a few have suggested ‘It’s happened let’s move on’ -

We’ll just a small point , if you don’t self analyse and scrutinise and identify what’s gone wrong , you’re pretty unlikely to be able to fixit or not repeat it)

You constantly have digs at posters finding fault or wanting to discuss what they thinks gone wrong

What I find irritating is a certain number posters who in response to any criticism or scrutiny jump to the Clubs or more often LJs defence on each and every occasion or subject - no balance , just an immediate defence stance fiercely protecting the head coach you’d believe he was a loved one at times

Theres a few on here who would try and justify LJ playing Bobby Reid in goal

(There’s also a few who will never like  LJ and struggle to give him a chance or any credit for anything but I’d say less than those that I’ve described above)

The Forum is for fans to debate and still remains probably the best in terms of decent content and debate of any forum of the many I have a read of

Some need to realise that being a supporter does not necessitate never scrutinising , criticising or finding fault with the Club or LJ

For  the record I don’t  strongly like but certainly don’t dislike LJ and even that is not relevant

I judge him simply , at any given point , on his performance as the Head Coach and what that entails , and his ability and suitability it stabalise and progress at our Club

Hes a bit like FD - shows in flashes some real exciting promise but there’s then a sinking feeling as you see real flaws

Id be sticking with him , but wanting some answers , and giving it another run next season 

(Some real alarm bells / concern , looking forward , are creeping rapidly back for me though)

But personally I’d be constantly assessing that we are actually progressing , and not about to fall into anything like a relegation battle at any point

And when I say progression I’m only talking about showing progression to becoming a established well assembled and planned Championship Squad / Side - not too much to ask IMHO

 

And

@Redstart after you rubbished my post - if you read the above you will understand why I think your injury excuse post isn’t a simple or decent reason as far as I’m concerned 

 

Thanks for your thoughts BBSB...I agree with certain points but not all. However I appreciate you taking the time to write so much.

I guess we like others see it differently.

As for your last sentence...under LJ we have improved our position in the league each season, so I see progress and signs on the pitch that we can get even better.

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10 hours ago, where's the joy said:

the best bit of planning for next season the directors could address is how to break out of the 'LJ slump' 

you can bet we will have at least one next season based on past experience and they do tend to last for extended periods

do we bring in a temporary extra coach, do we make LJ drive the coach, do we ask LJ to stop coaching altogether until the slump is over?

these are the vital questions for the board to ponder.

we loved the good times and being in 2nd place in december 2017

but that sense of impending doom will dampen our hopes for next year without a plan to bounce out of any slump. so lets be 'aving you. 

I think you will find that lots of managers and teams go though it.  It's either fatigue, injuries, confidence or all three.  Look at Derby they have suffered a slump, then there is villa they had a slump too.

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19 hours ago, Bar BS3 said:

One day some people might realise that pretty much every club in every division has good & bad periods of form throughout a season. 

Those that don’t, usually end up getting promoted, or relegated. 

Why anyone thinks we have a divine right to just win every game is beyond me! 

We are punching above our weight (historically, budgets, crowds, parachute payments) 

Some people need to stop acting like spoilt brats! 

I swear in December all the noise coming from the media and the club was that we were ‘Premier league club in the making’ ‘Premier league ready’. 

Which is it? All I see fans doing is making excuses and that on its own is the perfect recipe for failure, Performances have been unacceptable since January and recruitment a disaster.

#alwaysmakingexcuses

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12 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Interestingly I didn’t specifically refer to the injury ‘reason’ - only you did

But

For me , to hide behind it , or in this case tbf to Lee Johnson , not him but the people constantly providing reasons / mitigation  / Excuses (Choose your own) on his behalf is akin to an excuse or certainly something to blame it on

If not the injuries

They are tired

They are a young squad

We don’t have the budget

We are still a work in progress

We are new to this level

 

All May or may not have some relevance and/or be true or not and  are all debatable and have been 

As you have suggested injuries for the drop in form I’ll make some points IMHO 

 

A reoccurring point claimed is that the injuries left us short as we don’t have the squad to cope

So after recruiting 30 players and over 2 years we are even now saying we don’t have enough depth in the squad - If correct that opens up a whole new question or questions for me

There were a number of players injured during that period Engvall , Eliasson, Woodrow , Kelly , Vyner ,  (Kelly & Vyner a slightly different case as young players coming through but Kelly has proved himself capable of games) who hardly made an appearance between them and a number of others like Magnusson and Taylor who were only used when it appeared he had to

So the actual reason that injuries will have had a detremental effect can be layed  at the door of LJ  in poor recruitment and/or not rating or trusting players he has recruited 

Iknow the claim will come that the injuries were to key players

The first obvious point to make is that it’s universally accepted we played our best football during the period we had those injuries

Another claim will be that we could have changed it up more and saved any chance of burnout

Looking at the long term injuries and the players affected I am far from convinced that they are important or integral and would strongly suggest that we wouldn’t have reached the heights of 2nd or been as successful against Utd &. O had we not had that cohesive unit that it was

Looking at the injured players and my view on the impact of their absence

Pisano

Like him as a character and his attitude , very un Italian like as a defender - Much better going forward than he is a defender and often caught out of position (Far more than JB who has been slated for it) Overall a decent squad member but during the pre Xmas spell BW played really well and was certainly very solid defensively , far more than Pisano would have been IMHO but was ‘limited’ coming forward from RB (But where did we miss this ?) 

His availability would have helped for the games where KS and JB played there and of course would have freed BW -But BW wouldn't get in / have got in ahead of Flint and Baker for me -

Not sure about Pisano - will be interesting to see where he is come August .Nowhere near as good as Luke Ayling in my book and controversially I wonder how much different he is in lots of ways or better than Little

(I’d be actively looking at RB options)

So would a fit Pisano have made us a better side at that time   IMHO.  No

Gary O’Neil

Had high hopes for him as a signing but we will probably never know what he might or might not have added here .Possibly a miss but in honesty that would be a guess

Callum O’Dowda

The clearest and biggest loss for me for the qualities he was showing and gave us legs and pace which we are not over abundant with - His absence has suddenly turned him into the Messiah , poor lad , he’s decent , going to be very decent but still a work in progress

Would he have improved the team, or at least the squad and been a decent help.  IMHO Yes

 

Milan Djuric

Think I’m in a small camp on here that doesn’t quite get the hype about Milan. Definitely a power in the air and hold up play can be decent. Lacks mobility IMHO and a decent squad player or for me one to use off the bench.Whether he’s started or used off the bench needs decent service - not balls pumped in his direction from deep

Would he have been a good addition to squad   IMHO Yes, But doesn’t fit in with our preferred style of play and thus an alternative but needs to be part of a coached plan including service

 

Famara Diedhiou 

Looks very decent one moment and non league the next - decent goal return and can have some real ‘moments’ but inconsistent , not quick , very poor touch IMHO , poor athleticism / strength IMHO . Doesn’t fit in with our high press busy bee ethos so another alternative who I believe needs to be in box and supplied with crosses to see the best of him - not the way we play

Does he make us ‘better’ as a side ? No - Not if referring about our best side as being the style and way of pre Xmas 

(I see qualities and limitations in both MD and FD but in very broad terms and summary neither fit into our preferred ethos of high press , busy , quick sharp passing etc etc and I’d go further and say both put a big hole in it and immediately stop us playing that way)

 

Jans Hegeler

Might be a smooth footballer but just don’t see and have never seen where he fits - Certainly not a ‘busy bee’ and lacks the pace and physicality to play CB or CM in Championship on what I’ve seen

So would his availability been a help - Not really or minimal IMHO

 

Harsh as those assessments may be viewed they bring me to the suggestion that the injuries in terms of improving the side are IMHO illjudged or over egged when you actually assess those players , whatever strengths and weaknesses , and their positive or negative effects on the side that rolled on pre xmas

They may have offered options but their returns have , to date shown little side of improvement or any form and I maintain if we had been using most of them I don’t believe we would have got to 2nd or played as well in the three Manchester ties

COD will be a good addition - still likely to blow hot and cold but definitely a starting contender who is busy and can play a part in our preferred style of play

FD and MD could be very useful options if IMHO doing %75 of their work in opposition penalty box and provided with decent service from wide -Not only a totally different style from our preferred method but something we don’t seem to be able to have provided them with on their return - muddled approach

Can be incorporated into a Plan B but needs some serious work on 

 

i actually believe a combination of good coaching / drilling pre season by LJ & Co and a stroke of fate / fortune (Ironically the injuries & controversially IMHO  injury to FD  ) forcing his selections which clicked into his ethos nicely , got us rolling on tha pre Xmas run

the lack of toys for LJ to tinker with , actually benefitted everyone IMHO

Although we weren’t purrring at the time , the return of the injured  ,compounded by the January recruitment and shoehorning some new toys in, sent us completely off kilt with no noticeable plan and changing week by week as Lee fiddled and fuddled

 

some of these aspects I’ve gone onto are whole new subjects and debates that have all sorts of sections themselves , but I hope I’ve explained that if people are clinging onto the hope that the injuries were a major part in what went ‘wrong’

IMHO  they are misguided

The recruitment at the club doesn’t match Lees primary ethos sufficiently IMHO and that’s been exposed in recent months 

We have players who are decent players if used in a certain way and others like Hegeler who I don’t see as a fit here and in the Championship

Lee needs to decide how he wants to play primarily and first and foremost get a squad of sufficient depth and quality to sustain this 

On top but after the above he should recruit additions or use the ones we have , possibly recruiting to assist the plan B and get coaching it

 

 

Quite a few have suggested ‘It’s happened let’s move on’ -

We’ll just a small point , if you don’t self analyse and scrutinise and identify what’s gone wrong , you’re pretty unlikely to be able to fixit or not repeat it)

You constantly have digs at posters finding fault or wanting to discuss what they thinks gone wrong

What I find irritating is a certain number posters who in response to any criticism or scrutiny jump to the Clubs or more often LJs defence on each and every occasion or subject - no balance , just an immediate defence stance fiercely protecting the head coach you’d believe he was a loved one at times

Theres a few on here who would try and justify LJ playing Bobby Reid in goal

(There’s also a few who will never like  LJ and struggle to give him a chance or any credit for anything but I’d say less than those that I’ve described above)

The Forum is for fans to debate and still remains probably the best in terms of decent content and debate of any forum of the many I have a read of

Some need to realise that being a supporter does not necessitate never scrutinising , criticising or finding fault with the Club or LJ

For  the record I don’t  strongly like but certainly don’t dislike LJ and even that is not relevant

I judge him simply , at any given point , on his performance as the Head Coach and what that entails , and his ability and suitability it stabalise and progress at our Club

Hes a bit like FD - shows in flashes some real exciting promise but there’s then a sinking feeling as you see real flaws

Id be sticking with him , but wanting some answers , and giving it another run next season 

(Some real alarm bells / concern , looking forward , are creeping rapidly back for me though)

But personally I’d be constantly assessing that we are actually progressing , and not about to fall into anything like a relegation battle at any point

And when I say progression I’m only talking about showing progression to becoming a established well assembled and planned Championship Squad / Side - not too much to ask IMHO

 

And

@Redstart after you rubbished my post - if you read the above you will understand why I think your injury excuse post isn’t a simple or decent reason as far as I’m concerned 

 

Great post Bob.

The recruitment at the club doesn’t match Lees primary ethos sufficiently IMHO and that’s been exposed in recent months.

Lee needs to decide how he wants to play primarily and first and foremost get a squad of sufficient depth and quality to sustain this 

Those two lines. recruit these different options when you have strength in depth. fit strength in depth (spudski!!) Stick to this ethos or you will always be chasing your tail and results  show it.

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Last years playoff finalist, Reading, sit 19th in the table at the moment having won only 10 games this season against our 17. Sheffield Weds who made the semi finals are in 16th. So there is no guarantee of what happens in a season will happen next. Fulham who finished 6th last season are currently 3rd, but they have climbed and not been in that form all season.

I expect Reading and Sheffield will be wondering why they have slumped so badly this season compared to last and won’t be able to explain it either. Wenger will be pulling his hair out wondering why Arsenal are the only club in the whole league not to get an away league point in 2018. All clubs have slumps it seems.

I think we had the worlds attention for ball the Manchester games, of course everyone enjoyed that. We looked good especially against ManC as we were playing similar styles, of course the players raised their game. But we can’t play well against teams that don’t play like us, Bolton, Burton and Millwall for example all took too many points from us as we just had no plan B, or not an effective one.

Yes too many long term injuries, but Preston for example had a similar if not worse crisis at the start of the season, but manybe they had better quality returning as they sit ahead of us now. Injuries contributed for sure but they are only part of this season.

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