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JonDolman

West Brom actually making move for LJ!?

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9 hours ago, Ska Junkie said:

 

 

There's your answer CR. I thought I was correct and at the time I was quite taken aback by SL's total disregard of the fans/ supporters / customers opinion. 

I take no pleasure in this BTW but it does show that we are now part of HIS empire and our opinion really doesn't matter. Whatever SL wants to do happens and that is to back LJ regardless of how shit we are. The second half of this season has been crap, end of, regardless of anyone's opinion about our head coach.

If it wasn't't the GT interview, it may have been the Subs Bench interview. I can't find the actual footage but I definitely heard him say it (or words to that affect)

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3 hours ago, exAtyeoMax said:

If it wasn't't the GT interview, it may have been the Subs Bench interview. I can't find the actual footage but I definitely heard him say it (or words to that affect)

So did I, no doubt about it.

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3 hours ago, exAtyeoMax said:

If it wasn't't the GT interview, it may have been the Subs Bench interview. I can't find the actual footage but I definitely heard him say it (or words to that affect)

It was definitely the GT interview 

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1 hour ago, Red_Wizard said:

It was definitely the GT interview 

His words were staggering as he said that he didn't care how much the fans complained as he put more money in than all fans combined it was his decision as it was his club. It was a pre match interview with Gt

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2 hours ago, Busterrimes said:

His words were staggering as he said that he didn't care how much the fans complained as he put more money in than all fans combined it was his decision as it was his club. It was a pre match interview with Gt

That's all correct, although I don't think it was a pre match interview. I believe it was on the GT show on a Monday/Tuesday night. Left many on here raging. Rightly so, but yes it was a massive middle finger to the supporters. 

Edited by Red_Wizard
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2 hours ago, Busterrimes said:

His words were staggering as he said that he didn't care how much the fans complained as he put more money in than all fans combined it was his decision as it was his club. It was a pre match interview with Gt

Yes, interview on RB before a home game last spring - I nearly crashed the car.

You can think it, you can KNOW it, but to say it on radio.......

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20 hours ago, italian dave said:

Last 5 years:

League 1 - 12th

League 1 - 1st

Championship - 18th

Championship - 17th

Chamionship - 10th (probably)

How is this evidence of a club that will 'never ...push on'?

Don’t fall into the trap of measuring progress solely by league position.  If we finish lower down the league next year the excuses will have dried up.

If the clubs aim is to move closer to promotion year on year then I want to see a style of football being played which gives us our identity, which we stick to and which we can be proud of, a transfer policy which we can have faith in, a young manager and coaches showing that they are learning and have more than just unrealised potential and finally an effective plan b for when games aren’t going as the interactive tv and computer analysis told us it would.

With some of the team selections in 2018, zero creativity football, disappearance of a number of fairly big money signings, reliance on the league 1 promotion team, consistently clueless away performances, extremely inconsistent at home, manager who doesn’t appear to have learnt lessons from last season and a coaching set up that lack the experience to help make big decisions I’m not so sure we should be patting ourselves on the back and praising a remarkable rise up the table.

 

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On 28/04/2018 at 17:52, spudski said:

What you fail to realise or understand is that we have spent Millions on players to develop...it's long term.

Get that but at what point do these boys for the future fully develop?

To take an example Moore cost £2m and spent his first season in L1, the second in L2, both with struggling teams and isn’t exactly tearing up trees.

Just one from the army of signings over the past 2 years. 

The strategy sounds grand but is flawed.

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22 hours ago, WhistleHappy said:

Could do worse than going for someone very much like Gomes...

tumblr_mv3l44AJlL1s1h50uo1_500.gif and some much appreciated silverware! 

 

just speak french to him and be prepared.

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8 minutes ago, NickJ said:

Get that but at what point do these boys for the future fully develop?

To take an example Moore cost £2m and spent his first season in L1, the second in L2, both with struggling teams and isn’t exactly tearing up trees.

Just one from the army of signings over the past 2 years. 

The strategy sounds grand but is flawed.

I expect to see Moore in the match day squad next season...and others that have been out on loan like Vyner, plus Kelly. As well as the likes of Elliason getting more time.

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3 hours ago, Red_Wizard said:

That's all correct, although I don't think it was a pre match interview. I believe it was on the GT show on a Monday/Tuesday night. Left many on here raging. Rightly so, but yes it was a massive middle finger to the supporters. 

There was a Monday night interview January/February time and then a pre-match interview (I think before Wolves home) both of which left me fuming, particularly the latter. Big reason why I didn't renew my season ticket as SL displayed a complete lack of regard for the fans of this club.

I do recall him saying something along the lines of LJ being in charge even if we went down HOWEVER subsequently he said in an interview with the Guardian back in May that LJ was close to losing his job after the Preston home game. 

I think had we lost that Wolves home game things would've got very ugly and SL would've been left with little choice but to fire him.

Interestingly, the playing staff/management had a big meeting on the Friday before that Wolves game.  Whatever was said obviously helped save our season.

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16 minutes ago, spudski said:

I expect to see Moore in the match day squad next season...and others that have been out on loan like Vyner, plus Kelly. As well as the likes of Elliason getting more time.

I think it will be a year too early for TM , only from the reports I've seen, may be wrong and he does have a few months and a pre-season to work on it. Kelly has already looked the part and Vyner has had rave reviews so I'd expect them to be there, or there about. Eliasson, I'm not sure. Can't trust the reviews coming out of the club, just look at Engvall, from what I've seen he has been hit and miss. That said a year to acclimatise and next year he could be another COD (who I rate just to clarify what I mean by that).

14 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

There was a Monday night interview January/February time and then a pre-match interview (I think before Wolves home) both of which left me fuming, particularly the latter. Big reason why I didn't renew my season ticket as SL displayed a complete lack of regard for the fans of this club.

I do recall him saying something along the lines of LJ being in charge even if we went down HOWEVER subsequently he said in an interview with the Guardian back in May that LJ was close to losing his job after the Preston home game. 

I think had we lost that Wolves home game things would've got very ugly and SL would've been left with little choice but to fire him.

Interestingly, the playing staff/management had a big meeting on the Friday before that Wolves game.  Whatever was said obviously helped save our season.

I do wonder if he comes out with those statements because he has been hurt by the criticisms , which have been quite vocal at times. If I had tried my best, spent loads of money , then not just failed but got slagged off for it I might be snapping back.
Then again, he may just be a complete control freak, I dunno :flex:

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23 hours ago, Ska Junkie said:

Didn't SL say something similar last season after the Fulham game when he had a pop at the dissenting supporters? I thought he did anyway. :badmood:

SL said he was prepared to "go down to the wire" with LJ last season. In other words, to give him every chance to get us out of relegation including taking it to the last game if necessary.

 

On the Thursday in Feb after the Fulham defeat, Adam Baker did a club interview teeing SL up so that he could tick off those that jeered LJ that night, asking them to make their "noise" on social media but not at games (as he could see the players "shrink." Tbf, everyone complied and this worked well).

On the day of Wolves at home, before the game, SL told GT he put loads more dosh in than us.

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34 minutes ago, spudski said:

I expect to see Moore in the match day squad next season...and others that have been out on loan like Vyner, plus Kelly. As well as the likes of Elliason getting more time.

And yet Cheltenham fans are quoted as saying Moore is barely League Two standard

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32 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

There was a Monday night interview January/February time and then a pre-match interview (I think before Wolves home) both of which left me fuming, particularly the latter. Big reason why I didn't renew my season ticket as SL displayed a complete lack of regard for the fans of this club.

I do recall him saying something along the lines of LJ being in charge even if we went down HOWEVER subsequently he said in an interview with the Guardian back in May that LJ was close to losing his job after the Preston home game. 

I think had we lost that Wolves home game things would've got very ugly and SL would've been left with little choice but to fire him.

Interestingly, the playing staff/management had a big meeting on the Friday before that Wolves game.  Whatever was said obviously helped save our season.

Seems you got it nailed on. It does make you wonder what the rest of the board currently think regarding how this season has panned out, and the clear similarities in run of form to last season. It must be getting rather unnerving for Lansdown. 

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36 minutes ago, spudski said:

I expect to see Moore in the match day squad next season...and others that have been out on loan like Vyner, plus Kelly. As well as the likes of Elliason getting more time.

Really - what are you basing this on?

He has done Ok for a first full year but those I know who have seen him would be surprised he has Championship quality at this stage.

i would have expected he'll be loaned to L1 and then I suspect his contract will be up. That's how we do it.

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21 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

I think it will be a year too early for TM.....Can't trust the reviews coming out of the club, just look at Engvall, from what I've seen he has been hit and miss....

Not aiming this reply solely at you mate, but I had to quote someone! I just don’t get it with City and some of LJ’s signings...how many millions did we shell out for Taylor Moore and Engvall? And they aren’t ready yet?! LJ’s comments when we signed Engvall are cringey now....I remember Sky Sports reporting that LJ said: “He is an international who will adjust quickly to the pace and tempo of the championship”.....quickly?! How much bloody longer do we have to wait?!

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46 minutes ago, spudski said:

I expect to see Moore in the match day squad next season...and others that have been out on loan like Vyner, plus Kelly. As well as the likes of Elliason getting more time.

I think it would be great for this to happen.  I think a lot depends on what happens with Baker and Flint.  It wouldn’t surprise me if it’s Flint still here and Baker gone.

If LJ came out and said something along the lines of "I’m gonna give Moore, Vyner and Kelly a lot of Champ football this season" and stuck to it, I’d give him a lot of leeway results wise.  You probably can’t play all three every week, but they’ve now had enough men’s football.  They need to give pre-season a real shot, build more strength, ready to challenge.

Ditto, for Eliasson and Hinds.  I’m not saying Hinds is ready for Champ, but he is similar to Reid in style, and ought to be around the fringes of the 18.

We ought to be integrating these types of players with 2 or 3 good signings (dependent on who leaves).

Sink or swim for a few of the young ones, to show they have the ability, even if they aren’t quite ready to play 12, 15, 20 games.  Show they’re worth extending their contracts.  We know Bobby took to 24 to make that full breakthrough.

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15 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

Not aiming this reply solely at you mate, but I had to quote someone! I just don’t get it with City and some of LJ’s signings...how many millions did we shell out for Taylor Moore and Engvall? And they aren’t ready yet?! LJ’s comments when we signed Engvall are cringey now....I remember Sky Sports reporting that LJ said: “He is an international who will adjust quickly to the pace and tempo of the championship”.....quickly?! How much bloody longer do we have to wait?!

Agreed. Obviously there will be gambles and transfers that dont work out, but the sums of money’s being gambled do make you wonder is this transfer policy actually any better than trying to get some experienced heads in that will have a higher probability of hitting the ground running.. 

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2 hours ago, Jack Dawe said:

SL said he was prepared to "go down to the wire" with LJ last season. In other words, to give him every chance to get us out of relegation including taking it to the last game if necessary.

 

On the Thursday in Feb after the Fulham defeat, Adam Baker did a club interview teeing SL up so that he could tick off those that jeered LJ that night, asking them to make their "noise" on social media but not at games (as he could see the players "shrink." Tbf, everyone complied and this worked well).

On the day of Wolves at home, before the game, SL told GT he put loads more dosh in than us.

That's the one, thanks Jack! Dreadful by SL.

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3 hours ago, NickJ said:

Get that but at what point do these boys for the future fully develop?

To take an example Moore cost £2m and spent his first season in L1, the second in L2, both with struggling teams and isn’t exactly tearing up trees.

Just one from the army of signings over the past 2 years. 

The strategy sounds grand but is flawed.

Playing the same standard as Bobby and Joe were out on loan at his age. 

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23 minutes ago, hodge said:

Playing the same standard as Bobby and Joe were out on loan at his age. 

Fair comment but Bobby andJoe didnt cost £2 million i think is the point. £2 million quid for a club our size is still a decent chunk of money to be gambled is what people are getting at i think.. say Moore dosnt work out add to that Engvall and its almost £5 million we have gambled and lost on. Fair enough if thats the way this new strategy is going to work then so be it but its going to start getting damn expensive and in the long run why is this way necessarily any better than trying to go down the route of bringing more experienced players in.. wasting money is wasting money weather your bringing in journeyman players like Stern John were or if you are bringing in below par ‘ones for the future’ like Engvall and so far Taylor has been..

Taylor could go on to be a massive hit of course and be worth triple what we payed in a few years that is the gamble with bringing in youth so im not knocking the system just a bit concerned as to weather i trust Lee Johnsons judgement on players.

Edited by bris red
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6 hours ago, spudski said:

I expect to see Moore in the match day squad next season...and others that have been out on loan like Vyner, plus Kelly. As well as the likes of Elliason getting more time.

You clearly have not seen Moore play this season. 

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8 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

Not aiming this reply solely at you mate, but I had to quote someone! I just don’t get it with City and some of LJ’s signings...how many millions did we shell out for Taylor Moore and Engvall? And they aren’t ready yet?! LJ’s comments when we signed Engvall are cringey now....I remember Sky Sports reporting that LJ said: “He is an international who will adjust quickly to the pace and tempo of the championship”.....quickly?! How much bloody longer do we have to wait?!

I agree with money spent Vs first team ready. I’m going by reports. vyner has played in a decent side near the top, this has to be easier than in a struggling side but. Moore’s not been praised the way Vyner has and I think he needs to prove he’s capable at L1 at least before we consider him for us. There are a lot of young players we have spent a lot of money on that really need to start pushing this coming year.

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15 hours ago, Busterrimes said:

His words were staggering as he said that he didn't care how much the fans complained as he put more money in than all fans combined it was his decision as it was his club. It was a pre match interview with Gt

Cant be bothered to work it out BUT over the years, 50plus in my case x the number of fans he`s probably got that wrong; its our club and I wish he`d hurry up and pass on through it and take his suits and Johnsons with him....they are here but a moment in time....dictator.

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6 hours ago, bris red said:

Fair comment but Bobby andJoe didnt cost £2 million i think is the point. £2 million quid for a club our size is still a decent chunk of money to be gambled is what people are getting at i think.. say Moore dosnt work out add to that Engvall and its almost £5 million we have gambled and lost on. Fair enough if thats the way this new strategy is going to work then so be it but its going to start getting damn expensive and in the long run why is this way necessarily any better than trying to go down the route of bringing more experienced players in.. wasting money is wasting money weather your bringing in journeyman players like Stern John were or if you are bringing in below par ‘ones for the future’ like Engvall and so far Taylor has been..

Taylor could go on to be a massive hit of course and be worth triple what we payed in a few years that is the gamble with bringing in youth so im not knocking the system just a bit concerned as to weather i trust Lee Johnsons judgement on players.

£1.5m, still a decent wedge for us but is 25% less then some people have been quoting. It's the same amount Derby paid for Cameron Jerome for your experience argument, given the wages Jerome would command too I know I'd rather have Moore.

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6 hours ago, Curr Avon said:

Project, bloody project.

“It’s a project and I'm already looking forward to next season.”

What project is that then? Play like FA Premier League for half a season and then Conference Premier for the other half?

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10 hours ago, Jack Dawe said:

SL said he was prepared to "go down to the wire" with LJ last season. In other words, to give him every chance to get us out of relegation including taking it to the last game if necessary.

 

On the Thursday in Feb after the Fulham defeat, Adam Baker did a club interview teeing SL up so that he could tick off those that jeered LJ that night, asking them to make their "noise" on social media but not at games (as he could see the players "shrink." Tbf, everyone complied and this worked well).

On the day of Wolves at home, before the game, SL told GT he put loads more dosh in than us.

 

7 hours ago, Ska Junkie said:

That's the one, thanks Jack! Dreadful by SL.

If the “going down to the wire” quote is the one everyone is referring to when they say “Johnson would still be here even if we were relegated” - that’s not what he said.

Giving him up to and including the last game to save us from relegation is not the same thing as keeping him even if we were relegated.

That’s backing him to recover the situation but doesn’t extend to continued support if he were to fail. A very different statement.

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4 hours ago, billywedlock said:

You clearly have not seen Moore play this season. 

You'd be surprised on how many times I've had to watch him ;-)

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1 hour ago, ChippenhamRed said:

 

If the “going down to the wire” quote is the one everyone is referring to when they say “Johnson would still be here even if we were relegated” - that’s not what he said.

Giving him up to and including the last game to save us from relegation is not the same thing as keeping him even if we were relegated.

That’s backing him to recover the situation but doesn’t extend to continued support if he were to fail. A very different statement.

I remember that one CR and there was something about LJ 'being in charge even if we were relegated' as that's SL's choice. I may be wrong though and stand to be corrected. It's water under the bridge now regardless but I'm certain he said something like that. 

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Could it be possible that to take one example, Taylor Moore has regressed? Or stagnated at least.

Put it this way- he was England U19 captain. From Lens wasn't it? Quite a good academy system, well respected, Lens has.

Can go either way of course,but a loan to a struggling League One in Bury and a lower mid table League Two side in Cheltenham- basic basic football! Might it have been better for his development to loan him to more of a footballing side?

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1 hour ago, Tiree said:

I don't often agree with Robbo but fans of other clubs read the media, watch TV (our wonderful football this season on air to millions) and will still recall 25000 'bouncing'  around Ashton several times this season

They would be rightly excited about the prospect of one of England's best young coaches arriving at their club DESPITE possibly reading a few dozen, mouthy 'glass empties' on this forum. 

Trouble is our 'wonderful football', and it certainly was, disappeared after the Man City games and was replaced by tactically clueless cr@p. 3 matches out of recent games where we have not even managed a single shot on target FFS. As for being a 'few dozen' who think LJ is not up to it - that's balls too. LJ is as divisive a figure as a manager as he was a player for us. I'd wager if he did go to WBA, then half the fans would be made up and half fed up.

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3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Could it be possible that to take one example, Taylor Moore has regressed? Or stagnated at least.

Put it this way- he was England U19 captain. From Lens wasn't it? Quite a good academy system, well respected, Lens has.

Can go either way of course,but a loan to a struggling League One in Bury and a lower mid table League Two side in Cheltenham- basic basic football! Might it have been better for his development to loan him to more of a footballing side?

Think too much is made of TM going down a step. Perhaps the reason he was selected as captain for the U19s is that he had the correct mentality, and was a LEADER in the dressing room. 

The lads 20, at that age Bobby Reid and Joe Bryan were hardly setting the world alight. I've not kept right up with how he's been playing down at Cheltenham, but he's played 24 times this season according to wikipedia, that is vital experience of mens football in a highly competitive, physical division. He played 19 times for Bury on loan in League 1 up against the likes of Danny Graham. However he's actually playing, that can only help a player at his age make the transition in to the first team. It is so important actually being able to experience first team environments, especially lower down the leagues as people are grafting dead hard to make a living. 

Additionally, when players come in from abroad, especially from Ligue 1, they really struggle with the physicality and pace of English football (eg. Hegeler, Pisano).He needed to go somewhere that would toughen him up, just looking at him he seems quite sleight for a centre half.

I think people need to temper their expectations for Taylor in the short term. I've seen people on here writing him off as an expensive flop already.

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11 hours ago, Davefevs said:

I think it would be great for this to happen.  I think a lot depends on what happens with Baker and Flint.  It wouldn’t surprise me if it’s Flint still here and Baker gone.

If LJ came out and said something along the lines of "I’m gonna give Moore, Vyner and Kelly a lot of Champ football this season" and stuck to it, I’d give him a lot of leeway results wise.  You probably can’t play all three every week, but they’ve now had enough men’s football.  They need to give pre-season a real shot, build more strength, ready to challenge.

Ditto, for Eliasson and Hinds.  I’m not saying Hinds is ready for Champ, but he is similar to Reid in style, and ought to be around the fringes of the 18.

We ought to be integrating these types of players with 2 or 3 good signings (dependent on who leaves).

Sink or swim for a few of the young ones, to show they have the ability, even if they aren’t quite ready to play 12, 15, 20 games.  Show they’re worth extending their contracts.  We know Bobby took to 24 to make that full breakthrough.

Yep completely agree with this. We could find ourselves in a weird situation similar to United in the mid 90's where we see a load of first teamers going, hopefully for a big chunk of money (if we see 3 or 4 players go for their value we could be looking at nigh on £20m), with plenty of capable youngsters ready to step into their shoes.

The big test will be to sign 2 or 3 older professionals, as LJ put it 'leaders', to help them on their way. The future could be bright but we might have to be prepared for another season of transition if that is the case, though ultimately for the right reasons.

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12 minutes ago, ZiderEyed said:

Think too much is made of TM going down a step. Perhaps the reason he was selected as captain for the U19s is that he had the correct mentality, and was a LEADER in the dressing room. 

The lads 20, at that age Bobby Reid and Joe Bryan were hardly setting the world alight. I've not kept right up with how he's been playing down at Cheltenham, but he's played 24 times this season according to wikipedia, that is vital experience of mens football in a highly competitive, physical division. He played 19 times for Bury on loan in League 1 up against the likes of Danny Graham. However he's actually playing, that can only help a player at his age make the transition in to the first team. It is so important actually being able to experience first team environments, especially lower down the leagues as people are grafting dead hard to make a living. 

Additionally, when players come in from abroad, especially from Ligue 1, they really struggle with the physicality and pace of English football (eg. Hegeler, Pisano).He needed to go somewhere that would toughen him up, just looking at him he seems quite sleight for a centre half.

I think people need to temper their expectations for Taylor in the short term. I've seen people on here writing him off as an expensive flop already.

Agree, something else for us to consider is although he has played for England at youth levels he was brought up in France and most of his football education would be French. So he would need to get use to the physicality of the English game.

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49 minutes ago, nebristolred said:

The big test will be to sign 2 or 3 older professionals, as LJ put it 'leaders', to help them on their way.

I have a 'hunch' that signing leaders could be problematic for LJ. Do older experienced  professionals / leaders have opinions / views on the game and tactics that might differ from those of Lee and his coaching team? Could LJ 'manage' these people?

I appreciate the experienced Hegeler and O'Neil have had injury issues this season, but I understand they are fit now but still don't get bench/game time. Are they not experienced / older professionals who could help out now? I was at Forest on Saturday and only saw the usual suspects (and no shots on target).

As I say, just a hunch.

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4 minutes ago, Red Grovesy said:

I have a 'hunch' that signing leaders could be problematic for LJ. Do older experienced  professionals / leaders have opinions / views on the game and tactics that might differ from those of Lee and his coaching team? Could LJ 'manage' these people?

I appreciate the experienced Hegeler and O'Neil have had injury issues this season, but I understand they are fit now but still don't get bench/game time. Are they not experienced / older professionals who could help out now? I was at Forest on Saturday and only saw the usual suspects (and no shots on target).

As I say, just a hunch.

Totally agree with your opinion on this. I think his dad had similar issues

IMO, you are right about O'Neil too. He had so much to offer but has been ignored.

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5 minutes ago, Red Grovesy said:

I have a 'hunch' that signing leaders could be problematic for LJ. Do older experienced  professionals / leaders have opinions / views on the game and tactics that might differ from those of Lee and his coaching team? Could LJ 'manage' these people?

I appreciate the experienced Hegeler and O'Neil have had injury issues this season, but I understand they are fit now but still don't get bench/game time. Are they not experienced / older professionals who could help out now? I was at Forest on Saturday and only saw the usual suspects (and no shots on target).

As I say, just a hunch.

If you believe what you hear, a few experienced professionals/leaders took issue with LJ's management last year and found themselves moved on/out in the cold...

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2 minutes ago, ZiderEyed said:

If you believe what you hear, a few experienced professionals/leaders took issue with LJ's management last year and found themselves moved on/out in the cold...

Was one of these experienced professionals/leaders from last year playing in red on Saturday? Probably one of the best players on the pitch!

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1 minute ago, Red Grovesy said:

Was one of these experienced professionals/leaders from last year playing in red on Saturday? Probably one of the best players on the pitch!

He was indeed :fear:

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2 minutes ago, Red Grovesy said:

Was one of these experienced professionals/leaders from last year playing in red on Saturday? Probably one of the best players on the pitch!

Is that the one that doesn't settle anywhere for too long under any manager?

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3 minutes ago, Red Grovesy said:

Was one of these experienced professionals/leaders from last year playing in red on Saturday? Probably one of the best players on the pitch!

 

1 minute ago, ZiderEyed said:

He was indeed :fear:

Same person who didn't look interested half the time he was on the field last season? The same player that signed for Cardiff in the summer and now finds himself on loan elsewhere again? Hardly setting the world alight is he....

I'm not the biggest LJ fan, but probably best to use a better example then said player...

With that being said, I do actually agree that LJ struggles with older, more experienced players....

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1 minute ago, Taz said:

 

Same person who didn't look interested half the time he was on the field last season? The same player that signed for Cardiff in the summer and now finds himself on loan elsewhere again? Hardly setting the world alight is he....

I'm not the biggest LJ fan, but probably best to use a better example then said player...

With that being said, I do actually agree that LJ struggles with older, more experienced players....

I'm not a fan of him at all, and he's finally playing for a contract now he knows he's getting moved on most likely.

However, I think Wilbraham was an experienced professional/leader moved on in recent years, and O'Neil hasn't even got his cheeks on the bench since he came back from injury.

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1 hour ago, ZiderEyed said:

Think too much is made of TM going down a step. Perhaps the reason he was selected as captain for the U19s is that he had the correct mentality, and was a LEADER in the dressing room. 

The lads 20, at that age Bobby Reid and Joe Bryan were hardly setting the world alight. I've not kept right up with how he's been playing down at Cheltenham, but he's played 24 times this season according to wikipedia, that is vital experience of mens football in a highly competitive, physical division. He played 19 times for Bury on loan in League 1 up against the likes of Danny Graham. However he's actually playing, that can only help a player at his age make the transition in to the first team. It is so important actually being able to experience first team environments, especially lower down the leagues as people are grafting dead hard to make a living. 

Additionally, when players come in from abroad, especially from Ligue 1, they really struggle with the physicality and pace of English football (eg. Hegeler, Pisano).He needed to go somewhere that would toughen him up, just looking at him he seems quite sleight for a centre half.

I think people need to temper their expectations for Taylor in the short term. I've seen people on here writing him off as an expensive flop already.

I thought that was the whole point of his loan. I don't think his 'footballing' ability was ever in question but his physicality certainly was. A year with the bruisers in league 2 will have done him no harm at all on that score. 

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19 hours ago, Busterrimes said:

His words were staggering as he said that he didn't care how much the fans complained as he put more money in than all fans combined it was his decision as it was his club. It was a pre match interview with Gt

That’s how I remember it too. I was sat listening in the car after we parked up before a match one Saturday. I remember there being a lot of comments about it at the time but don’t remember which match it was. Certainly the message that we weren’t going to keep changing managers came across loud and clear. I can’t remenber if it was actually said or the interpretation was that if fans walk away there are always others to take their place. I was quite shocked at the time.

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