JoeAman08 Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 13 minutes ago, 22A said: Yet there are rumours he's considering the Sunderland job. Same managers get the same jobs. I am not slating MM just saying he may not be the right fit for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Island Posted May 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 Bump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 4 hours ago, Roger Red Hat said: Probably the most ridiculous post I've seen on here in many a long while. Must have given you a headache making that choice Roger - given the amount of competition! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SedRA Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 1 hour ago, Ser Davos Ciderworth said: Bump Still a rubbish post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 4 hours ago, Ser Davos Ciderworth said: A great season where management and players have excelled? We will have to agree to disagree on that one sir. It was a great first half of the season, where management and players truly excelled. However, the second half of the season was the polar opposite. For me the second half of last season and first half of this leaves LJ in credit- but only just, as we cannot afford the violent fluctuations of form and results. I would sincerely hope that SL undertakes a serious post-mortem with LJ , MA and the coaching and management team to identify exactly what caused us to drop off a cliff as we did after the Wolves game. If a major part of that was LJ's management of tactics, selection and players, then I hope that SL makes it clear that anything but a strong start to next season will keep LJ in post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Island Posted May 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 4 hours ago, JBFC II said: Where did you expect us to finish this season before the Barnsley game then? If we haven't 'excelled' then you must have been expecting a top 6 finish? From where we were at Xmas that's exactly what I was expecting, weren't you? What's happened since then has been nothing short of a disgrace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Island Posted May 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 18 minutes ago, RedSA said: Still a rubbish post. Those who can do, those who cannot criticise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Island Posted May 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 16 minutes ago, downendcity said: It was a great first half of the season, where management and players truly excelled. However, the second half of the season was the polar opposite. For me the second half of last season and first half of this leaves LJ in credit- but only just, as we cannot afford the violent fluctuations of form and results. I would sincerely hope that SL undertakes a serious post-mortem with LJ , MA and the coaching and management team to identify exactly what caused us to drop off a cliff as we did after the Wolves game. If a major part of that was LJ's management of tactics, selection and players, then I hope that SL makes it clear that anything but a strong start to next season will keep LJ in post. I worry though due to the pattern - this is classic Lee Johnson and I just can't see next season being any different. In fact can only get worse if he starts with one of his 20-game slumps and we can't recover. Seriously concerned for us given there will be an exodus of our best players over the summer too and LJ-MA's transfer market dealings are very hit and miss. I can see us getting relegated next season if we stick with LJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Red Hat Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 33 minutes ago, downendcity said: Must have given you a headache making that choice Roger - given the amount of competition! Surprisingly pain free! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBFC II Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 13 minutes ago, Ser Davos Ciderworth said: From where we were at Xmas that's exactly what I was expecting, weren't you? What's happened since then has been nothing short of a disgrace. you successfully managed to fully ignore the question... At the start of the season we were predicted to be relegated by basically everyone. Instead we've finished in the top half. Now, I know the second half of the season has been really poor and it needs to be looked in to but fortunately a season doesn't just run from January-May, therefore as a whole we have excelled what many people would have predicted us to do back in August Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Island Posted May 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 16 minutes ago, JBFC II said: you successfully managed to fully ignore the question... At the start of the season we were predicted to be relegated by basically everyone. Instead we've finished in the top half. Now, I know the second half of the season has been really poor and it needs to be looked in to but fortunately a season doesn't just run from January-May, therefore as a whole we have excelled what many people would have predicted us to do back in August So you walked away from the Gate happy this afternoon I presume? And enjoyed the goal-fest against Hull? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBFC II Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 3 minutes ago, Ser Davos Ciderworth said: So you walked away from the Gate happy this afternoon I presume? And enjoyed the goal-fest against Hull? Did I say that? I walked away today happy as I thought at the start of the season today's game would have seen us be relegated, as did many others on here and outside of the club. And you are still yet to answer my question... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 57 minutes ago, JBFC II said: you successfully managed to fully ignore the question... At the start of the season we were predicted to be relegated by basically everyone. Instead we've finished in the top half. Now, I know the second half of the season has been really poor and it needs to be looked in to but fortunately a season doesn't just run from January-May, therefore as a whole we have excelled what many people would have predicted us to do back in August Exceeded , (Bearing in mind Mainly made low predictions because many had a dim opinion of LJs abilities and the evidence of last season ) we certainly haven’t excelled Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Island Posted May 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 38 minutes ago, JBFC II said: Did I say that? I walked away today happy as I thought at the start of the season today's game would have seen us be relegated, as did many others on here and outside of the club. And you are still yet to answer my question... I don't remember how I felt after the game you mention - but more broad brush before the season started I didn't think we'd be relegated, I thought we'd be mid-table. Granted that's where we are but look at the full context - we were pushing for automatic places at Xmas, but club management messed up the January window completely, and then we had the classic LJ full-on slump in form. So that leaves me worried and disappointed now despite being mid-table because we've missed a huge opportunity and we can't assume we will get the same again; and I am very worried that if the inevitable LJ slump next season happens from the start, plus we lose some of our best players, plus we recruit badly that we will get relegated next season. I don't want that and the quickest way to avoid it would be to part ways with LJ and appoint someone who can build on a decent mid-table position. The man who is available, has the necessary backbone to motivate the players and hold his own with MA SL JL, and has a track record of promoting teams to the Premier League is Mick McCarthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havanatopia Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 6 hours ago, Robbored said: That LJ is the manager that SL employed to implement his long term philosophy of recruiting young players, developing them out on loan, gaining competitive league football experience with the idea that some of them will reach Championship standard and become a home grown first team squad player. Already we see Bryan, Reid and Kelly as regulars. It's probable that Vyner will be knocking on the door next season. Long term sustainability and stability is what SL is trying to achieve with LJ as the main man and head coach and MA currently as CEO. So.....holding up a banner or something similar wanting MM in is a complete and utter wastes of time and effort. Don't bother is my advice. What is all this crock of shite about sustainability; nauseatingly dull. The best way to be sustainable is to get to the prem tout suite and bag the 120 million quid.. that is sustainable not this pussy footing around with crap signings on a budget. Arhhhh.... but its Johnson, not Warnock, sorry. as you were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBFC II Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 16 minutes ago, Ser Davos Ciderworth said: I don't remember how I felt after the game you mention - but more broad brush before the season started I didn't think we'd be relegated, I thought we'd be mid-table. Granted that's where we are but look at the full context - we were pushing for automatic places at Xmas, but club management messed up the January window completely, and then we had the classic LJ full-on slump in form. So that leaves me worried and disappointed now despite being mid-table because we've missed a huge opportunity and we can't assume we will get the same again; and I am very worried that if the inevitable LJ slump next season happens from the start, plus we lose some of our best players, plus we recruit badly that we will get relegated next season. I don't want that and the quickest way to avoid it would be to part ways with LJ and appoint someone who can build on a decent mid-table position. The man who is available, has the necessary backbone to motivate the players and hold his own with MA SL JL, and has a track record of promoting teams to the Premier League is Mick McCarthy. In 26 years as a manager, McCarthy has had 2 promotions, 6 of those years were as manager of Ireland but even still he has had 2 promotions in 20 years, that's one every 10 years, hardly a top quality track record. Ipswich fans all wanted him out because of the dreary football he played and although I'm not Johnson's biggest fan, sacking him and going for McCarthy would be a backwards step in my opinion, it would probably guarantee us mid-table security yes, but it is highly unlikely we would get promotion off of it. We have missed a huge opportunity this season, but with the small squad we have, relying on a few players to perform week in week out was hardly going to work, there are going to be changes in the summer to personnel and I think that will see us go into next season rejuvenated. And fair play believing at the start of the season that we would be mid-table, I would have bitten your hand off for it after losing our main goal scoring threat in the summer and replacing him with an unknown quantity from France. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBFC II Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 28 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Exceeded , (Bearing in mind Mainly made low predictions because many had a dim opinion of LJs abilities and the evidence of last season ) we certainly haven’t excelled We have exceeded and excelled in my opinion. Low predictions weren't because of LJ, they were due to the fact we had lost our top goalscorer and most influential player in the summer and replaced them with an unknown quantity from France and Bobby Reid, who before this season had done very little of note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Island Posted May 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 30 minutes ago, JBFC II said: In 26 years as a manager, McCarthy has had 2 promotions, 6 of those years were as manager of Ireland but even still he has had 2 promotions in 20 years, that's one every 10 years, hardly a top quality track record. Since the Premier League started only two managers have a better record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 2 hours ago, Ser Davos Ciderworth said: Those who can do, those who cannot criticise. Who are you criticising ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBFC II Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 2 minutes ago, Ser Davos Ciderworth said: Since the Premier League started only two managers have a better record. That may be because there are only a handful of managers who have been in management since the Premier League started? Anyway, it's highly unlikely Lansdown would A) sack Johnson and B) replace him with McCarthy so it is a pointless discussion really Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Island Posted May 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 1 minute ago, JBFC II said: That may be because there are only a handful of managers who have been in management since the Premier League started? Anyway, it's highly unlikely Lansdown would A) sack Johnson and B) replace him with McCarthy so it is a pointless discussion really There have been almost 80 promotions from the Championship to the Premier League since it was formed two and a half decades ago. If you're going to quibble then at least back it up with something sensible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBFC II Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 2 minutes ago, Ser Davos Ciderworth said: There have been almost 80 promotions from the Championship to the Premier League since it was formed two and a half decades ago. If you're going to quibble then at least back it up with something sensible. Think my point that 2 promotions in 13 years at Championship level isn't exactly 'highly successful' if fair enough. That equates to him having roughly 2.6% of promotions from this league, despite spending 52% of it's existence managing in it, hardly a top quality record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rossi the Robin Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 You are only as good as you are now, great first half of the season - credit was given by ourselves and you people nationally that has disappeared Now we seem to be pretty average and occasionally awful not calling for LJ’s head but he’s barely made us any better than last season as it stands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidered abroad Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 2 hours ago, JBFC II said: you successfully managed to fully ignore the question... At the start of the season we were predicted to be relegated by basically everyone. Instead we've finished in the top half. Now, I know the second half of the season has been really poor and it needs to be looked in to but fortunately a season doesn't just run from January-May, therefore as a whole we have excelled what many people would have predicted us to do back in August Do we have the worst away record in the Championship since Christmas? Yes. We've really set the world alight with our home form though! Sunderland, Hull and now today, a well organised Sheffield United made us look very poor until we remembered to play hoof ball late in the game. If Johnson stays, we will be relegated next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidercity1987 Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 21 minutes ago, JBFC II said: Think my point that 2 promotions in 13 years at Championship level isn't exactly 'highly successful' if fair enough. That equates to him having roughly 2.6% of promotions from this league, despite spending 52% of it's existence managing in it, hardly a top quality record. Well you can only get 33.33% of all promotions in a season so your stats are totally pointless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 1 hour ago, havanatopia said: What is all this crock of shite about sustainability; nauseatingly dull. The best way to be sustainable is to get to the prem tout suite and bag the 120 million quid.. that is sustainable not this pussy footing around with crap signings on a budget. Arhhhh.... but its Johnson, not Warnock, sorry. as you were. Take the other word - stability. Do you suppose that changing the manager creates 'stability?' No is the answer because it's not just the main man that goes, it's the entire backroom staff and coaching set up that becomes disrupted and the whole process destabilises the club with the new man brining his own staff. Why do you suppose Liverpool of the 80s and 90s were so successful? - because they appointed men from within who knew the club through and through and that's why SL gave LJ license to build his own staff in and effort to create the same 'boot room' ethos and why he didn't sack him last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RumRed Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 6 minutes ago, Robbored said: Take the other word - stability. Do you suppose that changing the manager creates 'stability?' No is the answer because it's not just the main man that goes, it's the entire backroom staff and coaching set up that becomes disrupted and the whole process destabilises the club with the new man brining his own staff. Why do you suppose Liverpool of the 80s and 90s were so successful? - because they appointed men from within who knew the club through and through and that's why SL gave LJ license to build his own staff in and effort to create the same 'boot room' ethos and why he didn't sack him last season. I thought the whole point was LJ was head coach and therefore the backroom staff would remain? Surprised that as the chief, and patronising, 'you don't understand the plan' poster you don't actually know LJ's job title? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maggersno1Fan Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 29 minutes ago, Robbored said: Take the other word - stability. Do you suppose that changing the manager creates 'stability?' No is the answer because it's not just the main man that goes, it's the entire backroom staff and coaching set up that becomes disrupted and the whole process destabilises the club with the new man brining his own staff. Why do you suppose Liverpool of the 80s and 90s were so successful? - because they appointed men from within who knew the club through and through and that's why SL gave LJ license to build his own staff in and effort to create the same 'boot room' ethos and why he didn't sack him last season. It’s because he is the son of the most successful manager in the club history & he wanted to try bring him back in away that wasn’t obvious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 1 minute ago, Maggersno1Fan said: It’s because he is the son of the most successful manager in the club history & he wanted to try bring him back in away that wasn’t obvious LJ is Alan Dicks son? I think you might be wrong there M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maggersno1Fan Posted May 6, 2018 Report Share Posted May 6, 2018 1 minute ago, Robbored said: LJ is Alan Dicks son? I think you might be wrong there M. Alan Dicks win percentage 33.1% Gary Johnson win percentage 40.2% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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