Multi cultural Bristol

[Bris Red]

For whatever reason the muslim community in this City that do follow football  in my experience all tend to in the main support one of either Arsenal, Man U, Liverpool or Chelsea.. the same goes for the vast majority of the afro Caribbean community aswell.. success and only success ( premier league football) is IMO the only way we will tap into other communities in the city. What you have to understand is many of us probably started watching City because of our fathers, many of the people in the communitys spoken about especially the muslim community’s are second generation.. why would there families have come over and had or probably wanted any affiliation with a pretty unsuccessful third/second tier club? The easy choice is to follow the big clubs and lets be honest there are plenty of white Bristolians that fall into that category aswell..

[Red-Robbo]

2 hours ago, sglosbcfc said:

Now that we could field an entirely Muslim front line - Mohammed Eisa, Famara Diedhou and Milan Djuric (assuming he's Muslim as majority of Bosnian's are) 

Duric is a Bosnian Serb.

[EnderMB]

I would love to see Bristol Sport reach out towards BAME communities in Bristol to try and get them to attend football and rugby matches, and I'm sure these communities would appreciate the club reaching out to them or supporting them with events every year or so.

[Mr Popodopolous]

10 minutes ago, bris red said:

For whatever reason the muslim community in this City that do follow football  in my experience all tend to in the main support one of either Arsenal, Man U, Liverpool or Chelsea.. the same goes for the vast majority of the afro Caribbean community aswell.. success and only success ( premier league football) is IMO the only way we will tap into other communities in the city. What you have to understand is many of us started probably started watching City because of our fathers, many of the people in the communitys spoken about especially the muslim community’s are second generation.. why would there families have come over and had or probably wanted any affiliation with a pretty unsuccessful third/second tier club? The easy choice is to follow the big clubs and lets be honest there are plenty of white Bristolians that fall into that category aswell..

Similar in Bradford I believe.

It's partly that- probably largely that- but the book I read which covered the 92 grounds in a season suggested also it's linked to what others said in the thread about football's past reputation for racial issues, chanting all that. This was written in 1998 though and a lot of time has passed since then so that should have changed by now!

[Nogbad the Bad]

City have a policy of inviting pupils from a different school to form a guard of honour to welcome the team onto the pitch at every home game.

Does this not include schools from ethnic areas of Bristol?

[Son of Fred]

3 hours ago, sglosbcfc said:

I was met a Roma fan outside the ground last season who was going to watch the match v Millwall. I had a spare ticket so he came in with me (shame it was probably the worst game of the season). I now have an open invitation to watch a Roma game whenever I'm in Italy. 

Fantastic-an amazing city..have a great time when you go....

[Alan Dicks]

1 hour ago, Undy English said:

Well said. Probably be branded a racist, but I don't see how it's our effort to get people to integrate with our society - it should be the other way around.

There was a time when I was going to move to La Linea De La Concepcion in Southern Spain (near Gibraltar). I learnt Spanish, inquired about tickets to Malaga FC, made a point of visiting local eateries and bars and even visited the local Church on Sunday. I made the effort to integrate with the society I was about to join and that's how it should be. But in this country, we bend over backwards to accommodate others. All wrong IMO.

I also can't see the club endorsing a campaign where you are encouraging a specific ethnic/religious group who live in the City to attend matches purely because we have players who share their racial background or religion - surely that in itself could be deemed racist by some?

Their are certain types who will never integrate into western society.

Balloon fiesta next week, take a very careful look at who has decided to stay away in mass numbers.

[Olé]

3 hours ago, Alan Dicks said:

Their are certain types who will never integrate into western society.

Balloon fiesta next week, take a very careful look at who has decided to stay away in mass numbers.

Adults?

Since when has going to Balloon Fiesta been a decision about integrating into Western society? I used to go when I was a kid, I wasn't really that bothered by the balloons, I wanted the free promotional tat (mainly badges and paper hats) that the various sponsors gave out, and to have a go on the fairground rides.

I haven't been for about 20 years, it's not a decision not to integrate into western society, it's just having better things to do. But your remarks are more sinister, and slightly bizarre, so hopefully anyone who does attend can let us all know who the absent hot-air balloon hating masses are, so we're fully prepared.

On the subject of this thread as a whole, having to get the odd taxi from BTM when trains are late, I've spoken to enough Bristolian Somali's. There aren't many minority groups in Bristol who are more enthusiastic to talk about football, I agree many like Arsenal, but they can talk quite excitedly about City as well.

There are all sorts of reasons people don't go to football, it's not simply a choice not to integrate. For a start if it's a demographic where men disproportionately drive taxis or do other jobs that serve the rest of us nights and weekends, they probably aren't the type who are able to take their kids to Ashton Gate.

As others have said, provided the Community Trust is doing their job, this will get taken care of, and as @Nogbad the Bad says, extending the invitation to junior football teams across Bristol would seem like the logical way this will happen at some point. So hopefully the integration police can stand down for now.

[stevep38]

5 hours ago, cidercity1987 said:

Glos crowd very white, middle class but some other counties (like Leicestershire for example) have a strong Asian following.

Think that is probably because there are more asians than whites in Leicester. Think there and Bradford are mostly Muslim now. Have heard Birmingham is the same as well with the white indigenous population in the minority.

[Olé]

9 minutes ago, stevep38 said:

Think that is probably because there are more asians than whites in Leicester. Think there and Bradford are mostly Muslim now. Have heard Birmingham is the same as well with the white indigenous population in the minority.

We're rapidly into non-football forum territory now, but those statements literally only apply to Leicester (plus several London boroughs). In the most recent 2011 census Leicester was 51% white, so quite likely has fallen below 50% in 7 years since. But not Birmingham or Bradford.

Bradford was nearly 70% white in the census and Birmingham nearly 60%. People over-estimate Bradford because of the large Asian population, but relative to Birmingham and Leicester it has few other minorities (i.e. mixed, or Afro-Carribean) so overall whites still very dominant.

The real issue judging by my Facebook and Twitter feeds is simply the number of completely made up claims being made about these numbers, which gives rise to people "hearing" all these things (designed normally for one thing) rather than going to official sources to fact check. 

[stevep38]

5 minutes ago, Olé said:

We're rapidly into non-football forum territory now, but those statements literally only apply to Leicester (plus several London boroughs). In the most recent 2011 census Leicester was 51% white, so quite likely has fallen below 50% in 7 years since. But not Birmingham or Bradford.

Bradford was nearly 70% white in the census and Birmingham nearly 60%. People over-estimate Bradford because of the large Asian population, but relative to Birmingham and Leicester it has few other minorities (i.e. mixed, or Afro-Carribean) so overall whites still very dominant.

The real issue judging by my Facebook and Twitter feeds is simply the number of completely made up claims being made about these numbers, which gives rise to people "hearing" all these things (designed normally for one thing) rather than going to official sources to fact check. 

Would be interesting to see the make up of all ethnicitys in the Uk as a whole in say 2021. 2 years after Brexit. Wonder if it would change much in a decade from what the 2011 census found. I think there would be a big difference.

[When the river runs]

In general without stereotyping, I just think football is not as popular with muslim,hindu ,Sikh Asians and I beleive this to be true as there are so few playing in the football league and premiership as oppose to cricket

[WhistleHappy]

7 hours ago, Loon plage said:

 What bubble do they live in and how many were even born or  living in Bristol in the 1970's ?

The demographic of football fan is completely different nowadays and if any could be bothered to watch a match on the tv or actually get their arses down the Gate under their own steam like everyone else they would see that.

Discrimination based on ethnicity and/or faith is divisive and possibly illegal.

 

Agreed,

Besides that, who's gonna drive Bristol taxi's on a Saturday afternoon …. if all the drivers are down The Gate? 

(ps, didn't notice Ole's post before typing this)

[BTRFTG]

There are fewer Somalis in Bristol than turn up at the House of Hair. There are also many reasons why the Muslim community (in all its diverse guises) have little or no interest in football and why sections of that religion actually restrict the open and transparent objectives of 'sport for all' as promoted by Bristol Sport. If Muslims want to come or participate they should be welcomed but no more so than any other self-selecting group.

Of course there is 'that' chant of yore, still doing the rounds, that Muslims may find off-putting given its a long cherished practice within significant sections of their communities yet, for obvious reason, is rightly derided throughout the non-Muslim world. Consanguinity we can leave to The Gas.

[The Bard]

4 hours ago, Alan Dicks said:

Their are certain types who will never integrate into western society.

Balloon fiesta next week, take a very careful look at who has decided to stay away in mass numbers.

I've decided to stay away from the Balloon Fiesta. I've lived in Western Society for 47 years and still not integrated if you use your 'logic'.  

 

[BTRFTG]

4 hours ago, Alan Dicks said:

Balloon fiesta next week, take a very careful look at who has decided to stay away in mass numbers

Globophobes for sure.....

[WhistleHappy]

Actually Balloon Fiesta enthusiasts have a lot to thank 'the gas' for...  

[The Bard]

3 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

There are fewer Somalis in Bristol than turn up at the House of Hair. There are also many reasons why the Muslim community (in all its diverse guises) have little or no interest in football and why sections of that religion actually restrict the open and transparent objectives of 'sport for all' as promoted by Bristol Sport. If Muslims want to come or participate they should be welcomed but no more so than any other self-selecting group.

Of course there is 'that' chant of yore, still doing the rounds that Muslims may find off-putting given its a long cherished practice within significant sections of their communities yet, for obvious reason, is rightly derided throughout the non-Muslim world. Consanguinity we can leave to The Gas.

It's not true that the muslim community have no interest in football.  If you look on Stapleton Road, all the Somali cafes are packed on a Sunday afternoon because they're watching football on Sky. The Boys team I used to manage had 2 Somalis in it.  , Increasingly, more top level players are muslim and more league players are Muslim..

[BTRFTG]

20 minutes ago, The Bard said:

It's not true that the muslim community have no interest in football.  If you look on Stapleton Road, all the Somali cafes are packed on a Sunday afternoon because they're watching football on Sky. The Boys team I used to manage had 2 Somalis in it.  , Increasingly, more top level players are muslim and more league players are Muslim..

I wrote: "little or no interest," for that very reason.

Walk through any Chinatown and you'll see large numbers of Chinese glued to footy on the box but it's gambling not playing the game that floats their boat.

Interestingly, I searched Google and of the many sites listing the world's top Muslim footballers not one is English, with only one each from Wales and Scotland. The Muslim Sports Council does list one role model, though never heard of him myself. The point you make about 'Boys' being apt, Islam being a very forgiving religion in respect children's freedoms. Problem being children grow up and the same religion has altogether different ideas as to how they should behave in what they dictate as adulthood. 

If the Somalian cafes in Bristol are anything like here in London you'd be pushed to find a Somali ( or Yemeni) patron over the age of 13 who wasn't chewing Khat (it's a significant identifier within the community of progression to adulthood akin my nipping around the Mendip Gate's hatch for illicit bottles.)  Khat, being a proscribed Cat C substance, would necessitate an immediate football ban if spotted whereas turning out on a Sunday being three parts cut was encouraged and not subject to charge.

[Miah Dennehy]

7 hours ago, Undy English said:

Well said. Probably be branded a racist, but I don't see how it's our effort to get people to integrate with our society - it should be the other way around. 

There was a time when I was going to move to La Linea De La Concepcion in Southern Spain (near Gibraltar). I learnt Spanish, inquired about tickets to Malaga FC, made a point of visiting local eateries and bars and even visited the local Church on Sunday. I made the effort to integrate with the society I was about to join and that's how it should be. But in this country, we bend over backwards to accommodate others. All wrong IMO.

I also can't see the club endorsing a campaign where you are encouraging a specific ethnic/religious group who live in the City to attend matches purely because we have players who share their racial background or religion - surely that in itself could be deemed racist by some?

A few people have made that point, but I think you have all missed the glaringly obvious point of the OP. Why should any club want to 'reach out' to certain sections of society? Because it's a fair bet that once you get some into your club, you have them for life! Both Bristol clubs have in the past handed out free/discounted tickets to kids to try and get them on board, its common sense.

[Fpcity]

If they were interested then they would go to games without any incentive. Most Muslim, Africans support the top 4-6 clubs. The only people we could get coming to games would be the Polish and other Eastern European counties if we have a player from their country. 

 

[Huntstile Red]

3 hours ago, Olé said:

Adults?

Since when has going to Balloon Fiesta been a decision about integrating into Western society? I used to go when I was a kid, I wasn't really that bothered by the balloons, I wanted the free promotional tat (mainly badges and paper hats) that the various sponsors gave out, and to have a go on the fairground rides.

I haven't been for about 20 years, it's not a decision not to integrate into western society, it's just having better things to do. But your remarks are more sinister, and slightly bizarre, so hopefully anyone who does attend can let us all know who the absent hot-air balloon hating masses are, so we're fully prepared.

On the subject of this thread as a whole, having to get the odd taxi from BTM when trains are late, I've spoken to enough Bristolian Somali's. There aren't many minority groups in Bristol who are more enthusiastic to talk about football, I agree many like Arsenal, but they can talk quite excitedly about City as well.

There are all sorts of reasons people don't go to football, it's not simply a choice not to integrate. For a start if it's a demographic where men disproportionately drive taxis or do other jobs that serve the rest of us nights and weekends, they probably aren't the type who are able to take their kids to Ashton Gate.

As others have said, provided the Community Trust is doing their job, this will get taken care of, and as @Nogbad the Bad says, extending the invitation to junior football teams across Bristol would seem like the logical way this will happen at some point. So hopefully the integration police can stand down for now.

Totally agree. I teach in Easton, on Stapleton Road. Kids there love their football, knowledgeable and gifted, too, altho obviously not all of them. They know about City all right. It's true that like many, many white kids their first choice of club to follow is the one they see on the telly most/the ones who win the most. But they know about City, esp as Bobby Reid, from a local school, provided them with a role model (nothing to do with religion but locality). Not one kid that I know or have taught mentions Rovers. Part of all this then, as someone mentioned, must be about success.

If we make the top div at any time, they'll be as involved as any of their white peers who don't currently go to the Gate. It's not just a question of colour or background, it's more complex than that as with so much of life. But make no mistake, if there was more of a reach out from City they'd attend. Just the same as other poorer areas of Bristol, irrespective of ethnicity of population, if you try to engage them (ticketing, kids activities, player appearances etc) they'll come down the Gate. Admittedly if you reach out to kids in Withywood they're more likely to come back than ones from Easton, but that's a question of geography and culture. For me, this isn't about religion - Somali, Bangladeshi, Kenyan, Ethiopian kids (who I've taught) have no history of going to football in this country. With a large local demographic and two Muslim strikers - and strikers are the best role models, no-one wants to emulate a right-back - now is the time to reach out.

In some ways this comes down to our voting choices, our ideals on Brexit. Left vs Right. That's not the complete picture but it informs us, in part, of whether we should reach out to them or they should make the effort under their own steam. As a left winger, I'm in the first camp but accept others disagree. One thing's for certain: we've not had many (any?) Muslims playing for City before but, as they become more prevalent in British football, get support from Muslim communities and we might well get fathers bringing sons who'll bring their sons and create that tradition.

[Red-Robbo]

1 hour ago, paul_fox said:

If they were interested then they would go to games without any incentive. Most Muslim, Africans support the top 4-6 clubs. The only people we could get coming to games would be the Polish and other Eastern European counties if we have a player from their country. 

 

I think you can say that about most people full stop.  Unfortunately. 

[GrahamC]

3 hours ago, stevep38 said:

Think that is probably because there are more asians than whites in Leicester. Think there and Bradford are mostly Muslim now. Have heard Birmingham is the same as well with the white indigenous population in the minority.

Completely untrue re Leicester.

It has a very large Hindu population, plus a smaller Sikh and Muslim one.

Many are descended from relatives who were kicked out of Uganda by that idiot Idi Amin, so are East Africans of predominantly Indian (so not Muslim) origin.

[BS4 on Tour...]

10 hours ago, Pezo said:

I'm not sure but I don't think people start supporting a football club because some of the players have the same religion.

 

10 hours ago, winsleyred said:

Some might they do in Glasgow

I don’t agree with that - one of Celtic’s greatest ever players (arguably) was a Protestant who supported Rangers...I think the old firm fans support what their clubs stand for, not the religions of the individual players...

[The turtle]

10 hours ago, Undy English said:

Well said. Probably be branded a racist, but I don't see how it's our effort to get people to integrate with our society - it should be the other way around.

There was a time when I was going to move to La Linea De La Concepcion in Southern Spain (near Gibraltar). I learnt Spanish, inquired about tickets to Malaga FC, made a point of visiting local eateries and bars and even visited the local Church on Sunday. I made the effort to integrate with the society I was about to join and that's how it should be. But in this country, we bend over backwards to accommodate others. All wrong IMO.

I also can't see the club endorsing a campaign where you are encouraging a specific ethnic/religious group who live in the City to attend matches purely because we have players who share their racial background or religion - surely that in itself could be deemed racist by some?

Most of the costa del sol from malaga to marbella is full of British communities. 

As is Benidorm and the surrounding area.

Not to mention mallorca and menorca.

 

These communities have no interest in integrating. Have decades of nothing past thank you in Spanish, and will often eat in pubs with British sourced food only. Brits abroad are some of the worst integrators going, even on holiday they speak our language (good luck getting that in reverse in the UK)

It is on both the host to reach out and the newcomer to have have an open mind. Without both you get nothing.

[Bristol Rob]

1 hour ago, Huntstile Red said:

As a left winger, I'm in the first camp but accept others disagree. 

If you can defend as well, there might be an opening at Ashton Gate for you.

[stevep38]

8 hours ago, GrahamC said:

Completely untrue re Leicester.

It has a very large Hindu population, plus a smaller Sikh and Muslim one.

Many are descended from relatives who were kicked out of Uganda by that idiot Idi Amin, so are East Africans of predominantly Indian (so not Muslim) origin.

Okey doke Graham. Didnt realise that. Learn something new every day.

[havanatopia]

19 hours ago, sglosbcfc said:

Now that we could field an entirely Muslim front line - Mohammed Eisa, Famara Diedhou and Milan Djuric (assuming he's Muslim as majority of Bosnian's are) 

Been reading a very good book about the Balkans which delves into the history of the region; full of invasions, cultural impositions, horrific violence and ethnic cleansing going back nearly a thousand years. 

The Ottoman legacy in Bosnia means that in the latest survey of 2017 50.1% said they were Bosniaks or Islamic but the majority of those are secular. The balance of course are Catholic or orthodox Catholic Croats and Serbs respectively.

You are just about correct; was it an educated guess?!

And how do u know Eisa and Famara are muslim? I assume you know this.

[JustinCider]

19 hours ago, ZiderEyed said:

I've always wondered why we didn't do more scouting in places like Poland, considering the large Polish population in Bristol and Weston. I spoke to some Italians living in Bristol last season who went down because of Eros, I'm sure we could do more there.

I once recall a nice Italian lady trying to have a conversation with me went she went down there

but I had to remind her that it was impolite to talk with her mouth full.