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(Certain) Johnson Supporters


Fuber

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I can understand why your supporting him - he gave us some outstanding moment, can get us playing good football, he's a good coach, he's improved the odd player in his time with us, got us in profit, and we've finished higher year on year.

However, many (not most, nor all) of you are pretentious self-rightious cock-wombles who have managed to get it into your head the only people wanting LJ out hated him as a player. On here and on Twitter I've noticed it and it's not helping this so-called division.

I'll point out, if it was any other manager, be it Cotts, McCarthy, Rowett, anyone. Who:

- Went 28 games with 4 wins, 2 of which were lacklustre.

- Blew a net spend of £10m. Leaving us selling our best players - replacing them with average CH players.

- Had two pretty dreadful transfer windows. And what has to be one of the worst overall transfer portfolios Ive witnessed watching City bar McInnes.

- Lost £3.5m on their recruitment portofolio in the space of 32 months. And our best player was signed while in League One by O'Driscoll.

- Had overarching on-pitch issues with regards to defending; that hadn't been solved with multiple players and selections, insinuating fault and critiscim of indivual player and squad members in press conferences.

They'd of been sacked.

With us, and any other club at this level. GONE.

If they had not yet been sacked. Fans would still be calling for their head.

The only positive at the moment (for me) is Lee has time. For better or for worse.

But besides that. We need a result at Loftus Road Tuesday. Because between Swansea away and Hull. The only other game I feel confident of a possible three points is Rotherham.

For me, it was also the last game where we won, to a comfortable degree, moreover with 10 men.

This may get rubbished, but between the moaning threads, Londoners thread recreating a realistic rendition of snakes on a plane, and some of the non-constructive bitching happening.

Why do people feel the need to shove the 'you probably didn't like him as a player' in everyone's faces - give reasons why LJ should be our manager. Besides the two usual suspects or excuses, namely "we've improved each season" and "We don't have the budget" because being blunt. I wouldn't mind not getting results. As long as we were committed for 90 minutes. Bodies on the line.

We have improved each season, great. But only because the seeming 'feel good factor' lasted longer. We returned to the way we played the majority of the previous season and we still werent consistant when things were going well. For example we had a massive slices of luck and a single inspired moment to thank for beating Sheff Utd. The wins against Ipswich and Sheffield Wednesday - they were already dead and buried. Nothing to play for. One had fans putting pressure on the manager. Another was financially (still is) struggling and had a massive injury crisis.

As for budget? Well I mean, we better not tell Wigan, Ipswich, Rotherham, Blackburn, Preston, Brentford, Reading, Hull, Leeds, and Birmingham, they've got similar/lower wage budgets to us. The horror. We have about an average budget for this division. It's not an excuse for failing to win a 6th of our last 28 matches. Ruddy Hell.

I've tried being factual. I would appreciate reciprocation.

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Decent post, and the fact it was at 4am is even more impressive.

I never had any issues with LJ as a player and I have no issues with him as a manager - I've always found this "cult of never-liked LJ" nonsense bizarre. I think he is a very likeable manager. He has a massive affinity for the club, he wants to play football the right way and he wants to promote and develop youth.

There is no agenda with LJ. What there is, as you illustrated, is the opposite - a repeated pre-emptive attempt to defend him and gloss over months and months of poor results. From people who then say LJ is treated unfairly! You couldn't make it up.  Either he's a proper manager who is accountable or he's not.

I feel conceited pointing this out as I've done it a number of times on here before and it's not meant to sound smug or intellectual, but as always it's not about the results it's about how we're playing. What are our ideas? How are we going to win matches? Is it something we can build on? How do we adapt?

I have no good answers to these questions. I just see a team shorn of it's talent, which has doubled down on an LJ clone army of slow, methodical, possession footballers. We look very good - that isn't a debate, Weimann is the best player we've acquired at this level. But we're zero threat, 25 yards deep of goal.

There's no pace, there's no change of pace, there's no pattern of play we return to because it causes problems (other than shooting from 20 yards). Bolton were comfortable soaking it up and Boro may as well have had the pipe and slippers out. We look decent in places opponents are happy for us to look decent.

I know less than 1% about football compared to LJ, so I'm not qualified to second guess him, but I just see a nice bloke who wants to be remembered as a bright innovative coach but whose "ideas" are incompatible with the players he signs and his use of them. @Harry's thread is excellent and just one example.

And to cap it all, Plan B, which has always been our achilles heel, and which more than ever feels like an inconvenience to LJ's stubborn determination to prove that he can get a low budget team playing like Man City, involved Webster suddenly punting three 50 yard long balls at 5'7" Taylor from the 75th minute. 

It's got to the stage (22 points in 24 games, second half of last season's performances included) where I honestly think a lot of people would be happy to see us go down so long as we did it being nice and playing nice football and indulging all these players as bright young things. It's the O'Dreary 4 pillars era mark II.

I'd rather be knee jerk than sleepwalk through another season like that. And there is nothing knee jerk about reacting to months of the same failed attempts to reproduce training ground football, and employing the same, if not worse (bar Kelly and Weimann) players, like some brute force attempt at up-skilling.

Paterson, Pisano, Brownhill, Smith, O'Dowda, Taylor. Even Pack. All nice people with flashes of talent but soft (physically and mentally) and routinely with their flaws and laboured (at times bewildered) trying to execute the LJ mantra - Man City football at 1mph and with Bristol City players. Add Webster to the list. 

The three players who on their day could boss it for 90 minutes all left. That's the difference. A good player finds ways to affect games regardless and does so relentlessly until opponents capitulate. Flint tried to win everything in both boxes. Reid was constantly getting inside defenders. Bryan could be a total pest.

What we have now is a lot of comfortable ball playing footballers who have little personality or individuality and who are employed to execute LJ's fanciful instructions and will still call it a good effort when the instructions don't work. A team of meaningless platitudes and excuses, not conviction and fight.

There is no question in my mind that Reid got to where he is through his own sheer hard work and determination, not some epiphany with LJ. Otherwise we'd see it with others. Come back to me when Paterson has run a game by making the right attacking decisions 100% of the time, not just one time in ten.

I was worried right from the Forest game and I'm even more worried now the answer to everything is Famara Diedhiou - forgetting the fact that to accommodate him we will lose a body in midfield, an area we surrendered rapidly most of this bad run. It's as if people think we actually get to play an extra player!

We're not "just three games into the season". This manager has (rightly) had years and a lot of fan and media indulgence because of his youth, his "innovation" and his desire to win on his terms and his terms alone. But there is only so long "potential" can be used to excuse a downgrading of players and results.

So no, he is not unfairly treated, and there is not some anti-LJ agenda. What there is, is a very realistic and sadly very flat reaction to our preparedness for his 3rd full season from people who've been force fed the spin for too long (even I was surprised talking to people yesterday I consider the yardstick of optimism). 

"WE GO AGAIN".

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11 minutes ago, Olé said:

Decent post, and the fact it was at 4am is even more impressive.

I never had any issues with LJ as a player and I have no issues with him as a manager - I've always found this "cult of never-liked LJ" nonsense bizarre. I think he is a very likeable manager. He has a massive affinity for the club, he wants to play football the right way and he wants to promote and develop youth.

There is no agenda with LJ. What there is, as you illustrated, is the opposite - a repeated pre-emptive attempt to defend him and gloss over months and months of poor results. From people who then say LJ is treated unfairly! You couldn't make it up.  Either he's a proper manager who is accountable or he's not.

I feel conceited pointing this out as I've done it a number of times on here before and it's not meant to sound smug or intellectual, but as always it's not about the results it's about how we're playing. What are our ideas? How are we going to win matches? Is it something we can build on? How do we adapt?

I have no good answers to these questions. I just see a team shorn of it's talent, which has doubled down on an LJ clone army of slow, methodical, possession footballers. We look very good - that isn't a debate, Weimann is the best player we've acquired at this level. But we're zero threat, 25 yards deep of goal.

There's no pace, there's no change of pace, there's no pattern of play we return to because it causes problems (other than shooting from 20 yards). Bolton were comfortable soaking it up and Boro may as well have had the pipe and slippers out. We look decent in places opponents are happy for us to look decent.

I know less than 1% about football compared to LJ, so I'm not qualified to second guess him, but I just see a nice bloke who wants to be remembered as a bright innovative coach but whose "ideas" are incompatible with the players he signs and his use of them. @Harry's thread is excellent and just one example.

And to cap it all, Plan B, which has always been our achilles heel, and which more than ever feels like an inconvenience to LJ's stubborn determination to prove that he can get a low budget team playing like Man City, involved Webster suddenly punting three 50 yard long balls at 5'7" Taylor from the 75th minute. 

It's got to the stage (22 points in 24 games, second half of last season's performances included) where I honestly think a lot of people would be happy to see us go down so long as we did it being nice and playing nice football and indulging all these players as bright young things. It's the O'Dreary 4 pillars era mark II.

I'd rather be knee jerk than sleepwalk through another season like that. And there is nothing knee jerk about reacting to months of the same failed attempts to reproduce training ground football, and employing the same, if not worse (bar Kelly and Weimann) players, like some brute force attempt at up-skilling.

Paterson, Pisano, Brownhill, Smith, O'Dowda, Taylor. Even Pack. All nice people with flashes of talent but soft (physically and mentally) and routinely with their flaws and laboured (at times bewildered) trying to execute the LJ mantra - Man City football at 1mph and with Bristol City players. Add Webster to the list. 

The three players who on their day could boss it for 90 minutes all left. That's the difference. A good player finds ways to affect games regardless and does so relentlessly until opponents capitulate. Flint tried to win everything in both boxes. Reid was constantly getting inside defenders. Bryan could be a total pest.

What we have now is a lot of comfortable ball playing footballers who have little personality or individuality and who are employed to execute LJ's fanciful instructions and will still call it a good effort when the instructions don't work. A team of meaningless platitudes and excuses, not conviction and fight.

There is no question in my mind that Reid got to where he is through his own sheer hard work and determination, not some epiphany with LJ. Otherwise we'd see it with others. Come back to me when Paterson has run a game by making the right attacking decisions 100% of the time, not just one time in ten.

I was worried right from the Forest game and I'm even more worried now the answer to everything is Famara Diedhiou - forgetting the fact that to accommodate him we will lose a body in midfield, an area we surrendered rapidly most of this bad run. It's as if people think we actually get to play an extra player!

We're not "just three games into the season". This manager has (rightly) had years and a lot of fan and media indulgence because of his youth, his "innovation" and his desire to win on his terms and his terms alone. But there is only so long "potential" can be used to excuse a downgrading of players and results.

So no, he is not unfairly treated, and there is not some anti-LJ agenda. What there is, is a very realistic and sadly very flat reaction to our preparedness for his 3rd full season from people who've been force fed the spin for too long (even I was surprised talking to people yesterday I consider the yardstick of optimism). 

"WE GO AGAIN".

Another on the button post reflecting in words many fans concerns :clap:

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4 hours ago, Fuber said:

However, many (not most, nor all) of you are pretentious self-rightious cock-wombles who have managed to get it into your head the only people wanting LJ out hated him as a player. On here and on Twitter I've noticed it and it's not helping this so-called division.

Maybe you should grow up mate!

 

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4 hours ago, Fuber said:

I've tried being factual. I would appreciate reciprocation.

You tried but failed by throwing in gratuitous abuse that detracts from everything else you have to say.

Still, at least you avoided the stock and equally childish happy clappers/moaners cliches.

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1 hour ago, Olé said:

Decent post, and the fact it was at 4am is even more impressive.

I never had any issues with LJ as a player and I have no issues with him as a manager - I've always found this "cult of never-liked LJ" nonsense bizarre. I think he is a very likeable manager. He has a massive affinity for the club, he wants to play football the right way and he wants to promote and develop youth.

There is no agenda with LJ. What there is, as you illustrated, is the opposite - a repeated pre-emptive attempt to defend him and gloss over months and months of poor results. From people who then say LJ is treated unfairly! You couldn't make it up.  Either he's a proper manager who is accountable or he's not.

I feel conceited pointing this out as I've done it a number of times on here before and it's not meant to sound smug or intellectual, but as always it's not about the results it's about how we're playing. What are our ideas? How are we going to win matches? Is it something we can build on? How do we adapt?

I have no good answers to these questions. I just see a team shorn of it's talent, which has doubled down on an LJ clone army of slow, methodical, possession footballers. We look very good - that isn't a debate, Weimann is the best player we've acquired at this level. But we're zero threat, 25 yards deep of goal.

There's no pace, there's no change of pace, there's no pattern of play we return to because it causes problems (other than shooting from 20 yards). Bolton were comfortable soaking it up and Boro may as well have had the pipe and slippers out. We look decent in places opponents are happy for us to look decent.

I know less than 1% about football compared to LJ, so I'm not qualified to second guess him, but I just see a nice bloke who wants to be remembered as a bright innovative coach but whose "ideas" are incompatible with the players he signs and his use of them. @Harry's thread is excellent and just one example.

And to cap it all, Plan B, which has always been our achilles heel, and which more than ever feels like an inconvenience to LJ's stubborn determination to prove that he can get a low budget team playing like Man City, involved Webster suddenly punting three 50 yard long balls at 5'7" Taylor from the 75th minute. 

It's got to the stage (22 points in 24 games, second half of last season's performances included) where I honestly think a lot of people would be happy to see us go down so long as we did it being nice and playing nice football and indulging all these players as bright young things. It's the O'Dreary 4 pillars era mark II.

I'd rather be knee jerk than sleepwalk through another season like that. And there is nothing knee jerk about reacting to months of the same failed attempts to reproduce training ground football, and employing the same, if not worse (bar Kelly and Weimann) players, like some brute force attempt at up-skilling.

Paterson, Pisano, Brownhill, Smith, O'Dowda, Taylor. Even Pack. All nice people with flashes of talent but soft (physically and mentally) and routinely with their flaws and laboured (at times bewildered) trying to execute the LJ mantra - Man City football at 1mph and with Bristol City players. Add Webster to the list. 

The three players who on their day could boss it for 90 minutes all left. That's the difference. A good player finds ways to affect games regardless and does so relentlessly until opponents capitulate. Flint tried to win everything in both boxes. Reid was constantly getting inside defenders. Bryan could be a total pest.

What we have now is a lot of comfortable ball playing footballers who have little personality or individuality and who are employed to execute LJ's fanciful instructions and will still call it a good effort when the instructions don't work. A team of meaningless platitudes and excuses, not conviction and fight.

There is no question in my mind that Reid got to where he is through his own sheer hard work and determination, not some epiphany with LJ. Otherwise we'd see it with others. Come back to me when Paterson has run a game by making the right attacking decisions 100% of the time, not just one time in ten.

I was worried right from the Forest game and I'm even more worried now the answer to everything is Famara Diedhiou - forgetting the fact that to accommodate him we will lose a body in midfield, an area we surrendered rapidly most of this bad run. It's as if people think we actually get to play an extra player!

We're not "just three games into the season". This manager has (rightly) had years and a lot of fan and media indulgence because of his youth, his "innovation" and his desire to win on his terms and his terms alone. But there is only so long "potential" can be used to excuse a downgrading of players and results.

So no, he is not unfairly treated, and there is not some anti-LJ agenda. What there is, is a very realistic and sadly very flat reaction to our preparedness for his 3rd full season from people who've been force fed the spin for too long (even I was surprised talking to people yesterday I consider the yardstick of optimism). 

"WE GO AGAIN".

Just want to say this is probally one of the best posts I've ever read on here. Brilliant 

Agree with every last bit...and sums up exactly how I feel 

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Very good post @Olé and a much better read than the usual ‘Johnson out midget’ type posts that invariably follow a defeat. 

Agree with much of the sentiment. It really is shit or bust this season for Johnson. IMO if we are flirting with the bottom three towards the end of the year he won’t be seeing in the new one.

SL has made it clear he expects progress this season. Whether or not he’s given his manager sufficient resources to do so is highly questionable but that’s LJs problem to solve. 

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All the self proclaimed ‘Realists’ who want LJ out so we can have the inevitable promotion push maybe should look at the actual reality that we have only done that once in 50+ years and we have spent most of our time in L1. We are a small low spending, selling club in championship terms. That is the reality for all those ‘realists’.

I don’t know if LJ is the right man to lead the club - he’s done some excellent things but also some bone headed things. As I’ve said in other threads, he’s still just about in credit for me but the results up to Xmas will be telling as to his future. I’m pretty sure SL will be thinking similar things

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@Olé brilliant post. Only thing I would disagree on is the shooting from 20 yards. I think we don't shoot enough from the edge of the box and seems to be down to taking an extra touch in trying to find a cute pass. One of many examples yesterday after O'Dowda came on.

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12 minutes ago, BRISTOL86 said:

. It really is shit or bust this season for Johnson. IMO if we are flirting with the bottom three towards the end of the year he won’t be seeing in the new one.

SL has made it clear he expects progress this season. Whether or not he’s given his manager sufficient resources to do so is highly questionable but that’s LJs problem to solve. 

Yep SL does expect progress and has faith in LJ to deliver but within the strategy that SL himself wants. 

An anolgy would be telling a builder to build your house  without vital materials but with not enough money to buy the right ones.

Some fans are anti LJ but I don’t think he’s a poor manager but has to work with one hand tied behind his back . He would have been 100% aware of that when he was appointed and why he he got the job in the first place.

SL has a long term plan and sees LJ as the man to see it through and LJ is almost certainly  the only manager who would work within the strategy that SL has designed. Previous managers paid lip service to it essentially to get appointed...

As I posted on other threads - unless LJ embarks on another dreadful run of results ( hopefully not ) he won’t be going anywhere.

 

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I see the Johnson

hasn’t been backed

One hand tied behind his back

unfair ask

hasn’t been given the tools to do his job Etc 

 

has become the new trend amongst the ones who leap to his defence , whatever he does

Johnson has systematically dismantled the L1 title winning squad , replaced them with ‘his’ players , in amongst the 50 or so he’s gathered in

The wages we pay are at worst mid table 

and

He has spent £37 million pounds in his Five transfer windows here , in less than 3 years

Compare that to the vast majority of Clubs in last 3 years

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SL's plan seems to be to buy young, promising players on the cheap and sell them on at a profit. That profit then subsidising the wages to move towards being self sufficient.

That seems a reasonable idea but is very difficult to actually deliver. I suspect he is quietly satisfied with the way it went this summer.

Looking at the players signed by LJ I struggle to see any evidence that he is delivering against that plan longer term.

None of the players sold for good money were signed by Lee. I struggle to see any of his signings being sold for a big profit. Brownhill maybe if he keeps improving.

Our most likely big sell looks to possibly be Kelly who can't be put down to LJ.

It amazes me the number of signings he has made who have disappeared or added nothing to the first eleven. When Lansdown realises there is no production line of players maturing and ready to have their 'value realised' as he put it at the end of last season, maybe LJ's time will finally be up.

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16 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

I see the Johnson

hasn’t been backed

One hand tied behind his back

unfair ask

hasn’t been given the tools to do his job Etc 

 

has become the new trend amongst the ones who leap to his defence , whatever he does

Johnson has systematically dismantled the L1 title winning squad , replaced them with ‘his’ players , in amongst the 50 or so he’s gathered in

The wages we pay are at worst mid table 

and

He has spent £37 million pounds in his Five transfer windows here , in less than 3 years

Compare that to the vast majority of Clubs in last 3 years

Oh, he's had the "tools" alright.

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5 hours ago, David Brent said:

We’ve played 3 league games. We don’t need anything.

Well actually I disagree . We do need results now, because if we wait to start winning until we NEED to win it will be too late.

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23 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

Well actually I disagree . We do need results now, because if we wait to start winning until we NEED to win it will be too late.

I agree 1960

Some games take on a more than normal importance

We desperately need to break the cycle and scrap a win

 

Lift the mood and install some belief

The longer it goes the harder it’s goin* to be 

 

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29 minutes ago, robin_unreliant said:

SL's plan seems to be to buy young, promising players on the cheap and sell them on at a profit. That profit then subsidising the wages to move towards being self sufficient.

That seems a reasonable idea but is very difficult to actually deliver. I suspect he is quietly satisfied with the way it went this summer.

Looking at the players signed by LJ I struggle to see any evidence that he is delivering against that plan longer term.

None of the players sold for good money were signed by Lee. I struggle to see any of his signings being sold for a big profit. Brownhill maybe if he keeps improving.

Our most likely big sell looks to possibly be Kelly who can't be put down to LJ.

It amazes me the number of signings he has made who have disappeared or added nothing to the first eleven. When Lansdown realises there is no production line of players maturing and ready to have their 'value realised' as he put it at the end of last season, maybe LJ's time will finally be up.

 

Good post RU

Spooky 

Ive just posted this on a different thread 

Posing,  basically , the same question 

 

 

6 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

As always a sensible post M

Having been chewing over our philosophy of buying young , develop, sell at a profit

 

An open question (To all M not just you ;) )

How many players do we have , that we’ve purchased , that would attract a higher fee than we paid  ?

 

As I’ve posed the Q I’ll have a go

Brownhill (Mainly down to signing him with the comp we had to pay - good business but I don’t think because he’s improved massively whilst here - may be controversial view amongst some)

Taylor (Thanks to their pitiful release clause rather than improvement here) (And we wouldn’t make anything overly tasty)

Diedhiou (Possibly) - Goalscorers always liable to attract a inflated bid / fee

COD ( Marginally As it stands IMHO  - potential to extend that potential profit margin ....)

............

the rest ?

( Anyone else I’m overlooking ? )

I think we’d do well to recoup what we paid in the vast majority of cases as it currently stands

 

I havnt included Kelly as we didn’t purchase him but he’s the obvious jewell  value wise in the box right now

 

Worth considering that in Lee’s time here we have brought in £42million of transfer fees

Somewhere around %90 of that figure has come from the sale of Kodjia , Bryan , Reid and Flint -    none of whom he recruited

Credit must go to any help in development and hence value he’s made while they were here  (But Other than Bobby I’m not sure that applies much to the other three) 

 

Is the ethos working , even financially ?

There don’t appear to be many saleable Jewell’s in our squad right now

 

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2 hours ago, Olé said:

I know less than 1% about football compared to LJ, so I'm not qualified to second guess him, but I just see a nice bloke who wants to be remembered as a bright innovative coach but whose "ideas" are incompatible with the players he signs and his use of them. @Harry's thread is excellent and just one example.

Only part of your post I disagree with is the above. You're way too modest, your match reports, analysis and understanding of the game is exceptional. The club could really benefit from your viewpoint on the game, even if they just use your match reports to be used for analysing games from a supporter that not only is clearly passionate about the club (and speaks more sense than 99% of us) but I would also argue is as knowledgeable if not more than some in certain posts at the club.

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Very good post Olé. 

Because I lived in Portugal while LJ was here as a player, I never formed any likes or dislikes about him as a player. (But I did see a minimum of six home games each season) . Except that he did his job to keep the ball moving to a colleague, but that he was not a "game changer". 

Now as HC, he appears, with one or two exceptions, filled his team with identical players like he was. 

His father's biggest failing for me as a manager was his apparent inability to "manage" any player with above average talent and a personality of their own. He also failed miserably with all non UK players. 

LJ appears to have the same faults as a coach. This, together with these extended poor form runs, is why I believe that he is not the one for us. 

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Not sure where anyone gets the idea that LJ's position may be in jeopardy in the near future  - SL was willing to take relegation before rather than sacking him.

LJ is very much SL's manager of choice, the appointment he had planned for years and one that was always going to happen.

It was only a matter of when, and LJ remains intrinsic to SL's vision for the club.

We'd have to be rooted to the bottom of the league before SL considered any change, even then I believe SL would get in an older hand to temporarily help LJ rather than sack him.

This was no ordinary appointment so it would be pointless for fans to judge LJ's performance as we might any other manager. It seems clear to me SL intends LJ to be in situ when he hands over the reins to JL and it would take a truly catastrophic situation to change that.

We're nowhere near that as things stand, and despite SL's previous comments of expecting a higher finish I believe he would accept lower mid table from LJ this season and publicly find reasons to explain and excuse it.

The half a dozen or so regular posters who get stressed and shoot from the hip at the merest criticism of LJ have nothing to worry about, he's not going anywhere.

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9 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Some games take on a more than normal importance

We desperately need to break the cycle and scrap a win

 

Absolutely BBSB , QPR would seem a winnable game on the face. We could really do with a win and for confidence an away win would be very important .  Unfortunately I just expect us to pass the ball around nicely  but ultimately struggle. 
Over the past 6 months or so I have become resigned to dropping points, sad but true. The football of early last season seems a long way away.

 

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For the first time in a while on this forum there’s actually some decent content in this thread, a good read.

I personally really rate Lee Johnson as a manager, I think he’s a young, real up and coming manager, and the most important thing of it all is you feel like he really does just want the best for the club, and you really can’t say that about a lot of mangers that are out there! 

Now don’t get me wrong I can understand why people may want him out, however the only thing I find difficult to understand as the moment is the reasoning of why people want him gone.

1) “He plays shit football”. He doesn’t though does he? Like quoted at the top of the thread he tries to get the players to play football how it should be played, and when it works we are incredible. We are still learning and we are getting there.

2) “Where’s the money gone for transfers SL?!?”.  Football is a business at the end of the day and I thought everyone realised that, pretty sure we have been operating at a loss for the last few seasons. The most important thing in football is stability, we need to become a fully stable championship club before even putting in a serious promotion challenge.

3) “DDLWLLLLDDDLWWDDL” (made that up btw but you know what I’m on about). Don’t know if anyone else agrees but the end of last seasons form isn’t even relevant. Completely different mindset to a restart of the season, in which we are only 3 league games in. Which brings me to my last point,

Johnson out after 3 games?!? Really. Decent point at home to forest first game of the season. Good character shown to come from 2-0 down at Bolton, (yes frustrating we went 2-0 down in the first place but would take a point at that stage). And then yesterday against Boro. Sloppy goals to concede yes, we made chances just like we did against Plymouth. On another day I’m sure we would’ve scored, if we weren’t making chances then it would be seriously worrying, but we are!!

People need to remember we are not a big club at all, we are small. We’ve never even stepped foot in the premier league compared to like 20 other teams in the league this year. Build stability in the championship first, show progression and build from there.

 

Keep the faith. We always believe. 

 

PS. This doesn’t mean I will always be “Johnson In”. However I just think there’s a time and place for these sorts of things and 3 games into the championship campaign is not it. Lansdown has showed previously he’s not afraid to sack a manager and he will still be the same here I’m sure. However he must see something in him that alot of other managers, people and clubs have said about Lee too, that he’s a brilliant young English manager. 

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5 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

How many players do we have , that we’ve purchased , that would attract a higher fee than we paid  ?

Funny I was thinking yesterday, I can see Brownhill being the next off the rank. I really rate him and wouldn't be surprised to see him go . As for the rest, Kelly looks the part , Taylor 🤞(only because he was cheap), and any others would rely on teams taking a punt.  

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9 minutes ago, Head&Shoulders said:

 

3) “DDLWLLLLDDDLWWDDL” (made that up btw but you know what I’m on about). Don’t know if anyone else agrees but the end of last seasons form isn’t even relevant. Completely different mindset to a restart of the season, in which we are only 3 league games in. Which brings me to my last point,

 

Firstly - Fair play to you for a well constructed post with your reasons and explanations 

But As for the above

Sorry I’m firmly sticking my hand up here

I posted in the week and I’ll say again the idea that last season (And the season before) are irrelevant , to be ignored (Whether positive or negative) and no indicator of LJs ability (Positive and negative)  to act as Manager / HC at this Club is IMHO complete nonsense

Every twist and turn , allowing some time to learn , every area , is part of an ongoing evaluation of his abilities 

:comando:

 

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The question I asked as we were leaving yesterday is whether one could imagine any other Championship club employing Lee Johnson as their manager?

This one of the most competitive leagues in the world. It's full, these days, of current international players and, in Bielsa, now attracts managers of global reputation. Lee Johnson has achieved precisely nothing as a manager. I liked him as a player here, but let's face it he was a journeyman pro who mainly played in teams managed by his Dad. That was a subject of comment by his team mates at the time, as I know from overhearing a conversation on a train between two first team regulars in the days after GJ left...they doubted LJ would ever play for the club again (they were wrong as it happens). I agree with @Nogbad the Bad that he has to be judged by different standards to all other men currently managing in England...it's as though the bosses son had the job...which is also the state of play with the running of the club itself. I'm deeply unconvinced by either them. 

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2 hours ago, Murraysrightplum said:

All the self proclaimed ‘Realists’ who want LJ out so we can have the inevitable promotion push maybe should look at the actual reality that we have only done that once in 50+ years and we have spent most of our time in L1. We are a small low spending, selling club in championship terms. That is the reality for all those ‘realists’.

 

Last 50 years:

22 years in Div 3 and 4; 28 years in top two divisions.

In 106 seasons of League football:

47 in Divs 3 and 4; 59 in top two divisions.

 

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6 minutes ago, Head&Shoulders said:

personally really rate Lee Johnson as a manager, I think he’s a young, real up and coming manager, and the most important thing of it all is you feel like he really does just want the best for the club, and you really can’t say that about a lot of mangers that are out there! 

I thought that when he first came in,I saw he went all over studying coaching techniques etc,  and I still think he does care about the club. I have however started to question his ridged 4-4-2 with wingers, and even yesterday he went back to Brownhill wide with 2 of his wide purchases either on the bench or in a different position.  I do agree about the other managers though.

Now don’t get me wrong I can understand why people may want him out, however the only thing I find difficult to understand as the moment is the reasoning of why people want him gone.

1) “He plays shit football”. He doesn’t though does he? Like quoted at the top of the thread he tries to get the players to play football how it should be played, and when it works we are incredible. We are still learning and we are getting there.

Ineffective , but not shite

2) “Where’s the money gone for transfers SL?!?”.  Football is a business at the end of the day and I thought everyone realised that, pretty sure we have been operating at a loss for the last few seasons. The most important thing in football is stability, we need to become a fully stable championship club before even putting in a serious promotion challenge.

I've said elsewhere, after seeing SL back manager after manager, I find it hard to believe that with a dealing profit of about £16m, if LJ really wanted another body in he would have been refused.

3) “DDLWLLLLDDDLWWDDL” (made that up btw but you know what I’m on about). Don’t know if anyone else agrees but the end of last seasons form isn’t even relevant. Completely different mindset to a restart of the season, in which we are only 3 league games in. Which brings me to my last point,

The problem is that it becomes relevant when the form continues this season, I do accept the point though.

Johnson out after 3 games?!? Really. Decent point at home to forest first game of the season. Good character shown to come from 2-0 down at Bolton, (yes frustrating we went 2-0 down in the first place but would take a point at that stage). And then yesterday against Boro. Sloppy goals to concede yes, we made chances just like we did against Plymouth. On another day I’m sure we would’ve scored, if we weren’t making chances then it would be seriously worrying, but we are!!

Forest was an reasonable point, that we limited them to so few real chance was a plus. Bolton, and again yesterday , at 2-0 the game changes and the side winning tend to sit back and hold what they have. Momentum can change and if, like at Bolton , you get a goal back with time left you can force the issue and take advantage of your momentum. If we had scored yesterday with 15 minutes to go we would have had a good chance of a point. Thing is we didn't and we won't more often than not.

People need to remember we are not a big club at all, we are small. We’ve never even stepped foot in the premier league compared to like 20 other teams in the league this year. Build stability in the championship first, show progression and build from there.

Sadly I'm not seeing how this team is progressing. I defended the club over the last transfer window, now with 2 of our better players going (I don't count Flint in this as age was a contributing factor) , the January window looks a real missed opportunity . 

Keep the faith. We always believe. 

It's hard, but as fans what else can you do. Although at £500+ for a season ticket you have to seriously consider your options now.

PS. This doesn’t mean I will always be “Johnson In”. However I just think there’s a time and place for these sorts of things and 3 games into the championship campaign is not it. Lansdown has showed previously he’s not afraid to sack a manager and he will still be the same here I’m sure. However he must see something in him that alot of other managers, people and clubs have said about Lee too, that he’s a brilliant young English manager. 

Funny , I've given up even thinking about the manager leaving. As long as SL's happy Johnson's bullet proof. A lot of what he sees in Johnson is down to towing the company line. If it was the club that stopped him from replacing Djuric, then he's going to have to grow a pair and fight his corner, specially if he has any ambition and hopes to be successful .

 

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