Robbored Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 No this not another LJ out thread but more of a balanced view of the situation as it stands. Firsty, SL has a project to achieve stability and sustainability at AG and in the past has employed various managers that have been fully aware of that but paid lip service to it and failed to stick to the original strategy. SL then recruits LJ, a former City player who understands SLs project and it’s philosophy and is willing to work within in. He also fully trusts LJ to implement the strategy and has faith in his ability to build a successful squad. Without boring everyone I won’t bother to repeat what SLs strategy is but remind some that it involves developing players and making a profit where possible. So.....LJ has been given full reign of the playing part of the club but working within the confines of said strategy but his options are limited and he’ll be fully aware of that. Thus far LJ has turned a significant profit with the departure of Flint, Bryan and Reid and will have at least some of that to reinvest in the team. Secondly, LJ is quite aware that SL would be very reluctant fund marquee players so is bringing in players who he feels will add more quality but at more sensible price. We’ve seen that over the summer with several new signings. Of course as with any new players it’ll take time for them to settle and become accustomed to not only the area but the style of play. Itll takes several games for the new guys to gel. Patience from us fans is what’s required. Thirdly, we need to remember that City have been cursed by numerous injuries last season which seems to have continued into this season. That can’t be easy for any club with such a long list of missing players. Plus The FA hitting Famara with a six match ban definitely haven’t helped. Finally - the question of whether LJ is the right man or not is neither here nor there but like every manager at every club his signings, selections, tactics, formations are under scrutiny and of course open to criticism - often from wannabe football managers who think they’d do a better job. Questions like why did LJ not sign a powerful striker when he knew Famara was under a lengthy suspension ........... are heard wherever City fans are. That’s one question I’d like to here LJs rationale for. Bottom line. Whilst SL continues at the helm, LJ will be going nowhere - unless he leads City on another sorry run of poor results and City are in or around the DZ. Then and only then will SL possibly wield the axe. Thats why all the negativity around LJ that we see on here is utterly pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Robin Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 6 minutes ago, Robbored said: No this not another LJ out thread but more of a balanced view of the situation as it stands. Firsty, SL has a project to achieve stability and sustainability at AG and in the past has employed various managers that have been fully aware of that but paid lip service to it and failed to stick to the original strategy. SL then recruits LJ, a former City player who understands SLs project and it’s philosophy and is willing to work within in. He also fully trusts LJ to implement the strategy and has faith in his ability to build a successful squad. Without boring everyone I won’t bother to repeat what SLs strategy is but remind some that it involves developing players and making a profit where possible. So.....LJ has been given full reign of the playing part of the club but working within the confines of said strategy but his options are limited and he’ll be fully aware of that. Thus far LJ has turned a significant profit with the departure of Flint, Bryan and Reid and will have at least some of that to reinvest in the team. Secondly, LJ is quite aware that SL would be very reluctant fund marquee players so is bringing in players who he feels will add more quality but at more sensible price. We’ve seen that over the summer with several new signings. Of course as with any new players it’ll take time for them to settle and become accustomed to not only the area but the style of play. Itll takes several games for the new guys to gel. Patience from us fans is what’s required. Thirdly, we need to remember that City have been cursed by numerous injuries last season which seems to have continued into this season. That can’t be easy for any club with such a long list of missing players. Plus The FA hitting Famara with a six match ban definitely haven’t helped. Finally - the question of whether LJ is the right man or not is neither here nor there but like every manager at every club his signings, selections, tactics, formations are under scrutiny and of course open to criticism - often from wannabe football managers who think they’d do a better job. Questions like why did LJ not sign a powerful striker when he knew Famara was under a lengthy suspension ........... are heard wherever City fans are. That’s one question I’d like to here LJs rationale for. Bottom line. Whilst SL continues at the helm, LJ will be going nowhere - unless he leads City on another sorry run of poor results and City are in or around the DZ. Then and only then will SL possibly wield the axe. Thats why all the negativity around LJ that we see on here is utterly pointless. Er...he has....since January Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 Will sustainability continue when the number of bums on seats starts to tail off and next years season ticket sales fall because we have been relegated or just escaped relegation? How much patience does the board think we have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, Top Robin said: Er...he has....since January Are City in the relegation zone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said: Will sustainability continue when the number of bums on seats starts to tail off and next years season ticket sales fall because we have been relegated or just escaped relegation? How much patience does the board think we have? How much patience we have is irrelevant - we aren’t the ones that makes the decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelksRed Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 I fear that supporters will have less patience this time than previously......hiked season ticket prices coincide with a drop in form......what do they expect......paying more for a lesser product.....always going to spark lash back..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Zod Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 The questions should be ‘has LJ got the required ability, tactical know how and experience to work within the remit set by SL and if not does he show signs of learning quick.? Does LJ and MA have the foresight, experience and ability to recruit the right players to fit the model forced on them by SL and if not, are there signs that they will learn quick? Personally I think LJ has shown little sign of ever being a good manager and lacks the ability to learn from his mistakes and develop. Both MA and LJ recruitment is pretty appalling regardless of the ‘remit’ LJ and any SL project are not joined at the hip. SL can still persists with this ‘project’ with a more competent man at the helm. As mentioned before, personally I think SL has lost the love for Bristol City and it’s time for him to see if there’s anyone out there who can relight the fires and has his old level of enthusiasm to move us forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 52 minutes ago, Robbored said: No this not another LJ out thread but more of a balanced view of the situation as it stands. Firsty, SL has a project to achieve stability and sustainability at AG and in the past has employed various managers that have been fully aware of that but paid lip service to it and failed to stick to the original strategy. SL then recruits LJ, a former City player who understands SLs project and it’s philosophy and is willing to work within in. He also fully trusts LJ to implement the strategy and has faith in his ability to build a successful squad. Without boring everyone I won’t bother to repeat what SLs strategy is but remind some that it involves developing players and making a profit where possible. So.....LJ has been given full reign of the playing part of the club but working within the confines of said strategy but his options are limited and he’ll be fully aware of that. Thus far LJ has turned a significant profit with the departure of Flint, Bryan and Reid and will have at least some of that to reinvest in the team. Secondly, LJ is quite aware that SL would be very reluctant fund marquee players so is bringing in players who he feels will add more quality but at more sensible price. We’ve seen that over the summer with several new signings. Of course as with any new players it’ll take time for them to settle and become accustomed to not only the area but the style of play. Itll takes several games for the new guys to gel. Patience from us fans is what’s required. Thirdly, we need to remember that City have been cursed by numerous injuries last season which seems to have continued into this season. That can’t be easy for any club with such a long list of missing players. Plus The FA hitting Famara with a six match ban definitely haven’t helped. Finally - the question of whether LJ is the right man or not is neither here nor there but like every manager at every club his signings, selections, tactics, formations are under scrutiny and of course open to criticism - often from wannabe football managers who think they’d do a better job. Questions like why did LJ not sign a powerful striker when he knew Famara was under a lengthy suspension ........... are heard wherever City fans are. That’s one question I’d like to here LJs rationale for. Bottom line. Whilst SL continues at the helm, LJ will be going nowhere - unless he leads City on another sorry run of poor results and City are in or around the DZ. Then and only then will SL possibly wield the axe. Thats why all the negativity around LJ that we see on here is utterly pointless. It's an interesting point Robbo...as I'm not quiet sure what fans are actually expecting. Do they need patience for promotion? Or patience for making us a sustainable team in the Championship? Big difference imo. If we bob about in this division for the next ten years, neither going up or going down...I'm sure this forum would have imploded in that time :laugh: With the blueprint we have and confines...imo, regardless of what manager/coach was in control, you would need everything to gel and run perfectly for the whole season to even get a sniff of promotion. I honestly believe it's a blueprint that can bring about sustained time in this division...but as for a genuine promotion push, I very much doubt it, unless we had one of those freak seasons where everything just falls into place perfectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 50 minutes ago, Robbored said: How much patience we have is irrelevant - we aren’t the ones that makes the decisions. The thread title is Patience is Required. So perhaps it is relevant how much patience ‘we have’...It will be to SL at least to some extent as LJ has used most of his nine lives...SL has pretty much said that himself in more than one way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brent Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 This talk of SLs strategy of being to sign players, develop and sell for a profit, who is next to go for a big fee? As I’ve said before, we can’t sell Bryan, Reid and Flint every year. And which of LJs signings have seriously developed under him?..Brownhill for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Wood Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Robbored said: Are City in the relegation zone? Got a feeling they may be after Tuesday nights game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, David Brent said: This talk of SLs strategy of being to sign players, develop and sell for a profit, who is next to go for a big fee? As I’ve said before, we can’t sell Bryan, Reid and Flint every year. And which of LJs signings have seriously developed under him?..Brownhill for sure. Could have said that Reid was worth no more than 250k a year ago....This is a question for later in the season, however how many of LJ’s imports will be worth upward of 5M in the next two years will be interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 My guess is that we fans expect to be there or thereabouts every season. Win more games that we lose and in my case playing attractive football and feeling that I’m being entertained. SLs long term project is to reach the PL but not by buying promotion but by having a squad made up of a blend of local players and others that City have brought in. He sees LJ as the man to implement it. All this will take time of course but, quite rightly SL is expecting signs of progress this season and that must mean a higher league finish. I’d be happy with that as I’m sure most fans would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 10 minutes ago, REDOXO said: The thread title is Patience is Required. So perhaps it is relevant how much patience ‘we have’...It will be to SL at least to some extent as LJ has used most of his nine lives...SL has pretty much said that himself in more than one way Fans patience is irrelevant to those who make the decisions. Do you suppose that MA is bothered by how thin the fans patience is? Not in slightest! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 9 minutes ago, Robin Wood said: Got a feeling they may be after Tuesday nights game After four matches? It would mean nothing so early in the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 1 hour ago, General Zod said: The questions should be ‘has LJ got the required ability, tactical know how and experience to work within the remit set by SL and if not does he show signs of learning quick.? Does LJ and MA have the foresight, experience and ability to recruit the right players to fit the model forced on them by SL and if not, are there signs that they will learn quick? Personally I think LJ has shown little sign of ever being a good manager and lacks the ability to learn from his mistakes and develop. Both MA and LJ recruitment is pretty appalling regardless of the ‘remit’ LJ and any SL project are not joined at the hip. SL can still persists with this ‘project’ with a more competent man at the helm. As mentioned before, personally I think SL has lost the love for Bristol City and it’s time for him to see if there’s anyone out there who can relight the fires and has his old level of enthusiasm to move us forward. You don’t seem to understand the gist of my post GZ. Read through it again, slowly and allow it to sink in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slartibartfast Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Robbored said: No this not another LJ out thread but more of a balanced view of the situation as it stands. Firsty, SL has a project to achieve stability and sustainability at AG and in the past has employed various managers that have been fully aware of that but paid lip service to it and failed to stick to the original strategy. SL then recruits LJ, a former City player who understands SLs project and it’s philosophy and is willing to work within in. He also fully trusts LJ to implement the strategy and has faith in his ability to build a successful squad. Without boring everyone I won’t bother to repeat what SLs strategy is but remind some that it involves developing players and making a profit where possible. So.....LJ has been given full reign of the playing part of the club but working within the confines of said strategy but his options are limited and he’ll be fully aware of that. Thus far LJ has turned a significant profit with the departure of Flint, Bryan and Reid and will have at least some of that to reinvest in the team. Secondly, LJ is quite aware that SL would be very reluctant fund marquee players so is bringing in players who he feels will add more quality but at more sensible price. We’ve seen that over the summer with several new signings. Of course as with any new players it’ll take time for them to settle and become accustomed to not only the area but the style of play. Itll takes several games for the new guys to gel. Patience from us fans is what’s required. Thirdly, we need to remember that City have been cursed by numerous injuries last season which seems to have continued into this season. That can’t be easy for any club with such a long list of missing players. Plus The FA hitting Famara with a six match ban definitely haven’t helped. Finally - the question of whether LJ is the right man or not is neither here nor there but like every manager at every club his signings, selections, tactics, formations are under scrutiny and of course open to criticism - often from wannabe football managers who think they’d do a better job. Questions like why did LJ not sign a powerful striker when he knew Famara was under a lengthy suspension ........... are heard wherever City fans are. That’s one question I’d like to here LJs rationale for. Bottom line. Whilst SL continues at the helm, LJ will be going nowhere - unless he leads City on another sorry run of poor results and City are in or around the DZ. Then and only then will SL possibly wield the axe. Thats why all the negativity around LJ that we see on here is utterly pointless. So.................evolution, not revolution ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 Just now, slartibartfast said: So.................evolution, not revolution ! Exactly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mtimmy11 Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 6 minutes ago, Robbored said: After four matches? It would mean nothing so early in the season. So if we need 12points to stay up it means nothing.it's stupid talk like that that is keeping the prat in a job.I travelled 180 miles yesterday to watch that shower of s..t just to have fans like you licking his ass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abraham Romanovich Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 5 minutes ago, Robbored said: After four matches? It would mean nothing so early in the season. True, but exactly when do you envisage this trigger point,you could tell yesterday from the complete lack of atmosphere that people were apathetic ,and resigned to losing , very quickly this will turn to anger if we continue to look so completely lost. Do not even get even me started on Patterson trying to gee up the crowd, what exactly did he expect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slartibartfast Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Robbored said: . Firsty, SL has a project to achieve stability and sustainability at AG and in the past has employed various managers Surely the best way for sustainability is to maximize the money you would get from getting to the Prem (parachute etc.) Trying to get sustainability by just surviving ,or worse is like maxing out your credit card and making minimum payments e.g. take virtually forever ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 6 minutes ago, Mtimmy11 said: So if we need 12points to stay up it means nothing.it's stupid talk like that that is keeping the prat in a job.I travelled 180 miles yesterday to watch that shower of s..t just to have fans like you licking his ass Jeez............. You just don’t understand my thread do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, slartibartfast said: Surely the best way for sustainability is to maximize the money you would get from getting to the Prem (parachute etc.) Trying to get sustainability by just surviving ,or worse is like maxing out your credit card and making minimum payments e.g. take virtually forever ! I’m no financial expert Slart but SL is........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aa_bcfc Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 Patience? 61 years of support surely demonstrates sufficient patience even by your standards. I’ve lost all patience with the dreadful signings of last 2 transfer windows, shocking run of results from January, selling best players, bullshit talk about ‘the project’. it’s very sad if SL cannot see it and take action to address the slide since January. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 To be fair, I think everyone has been patient. I honestly think there are few clubs in the division where either the board or majority of supporters would have given the manager as much time as he has had. And I think this is a really good thing. The problem for me is there comes a point where you want to be reassured as to what you are being patient for. I will be patient if I can see continued learning and correction of mistakes and strategies put in place to build and improve on what has come before. I do not see any evidence of that at the moment and so I don’t really see why more patience is justified. I really want LJ to succeed. But I honestly cannot currently see reasons to think he will eventually do so. And I really want to see them but I feel a time comes when you have to accept a Manager has to go if he is not producing results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivorguy Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Robbored said: How much patience we have is irrelevant - we aren’t the ones that makes the decisions. True, but all the evidence we have from English football is that fans' frustration and worse can influence owners' decisions.n 4 minutes ago, Robbored said: I’m no financial expert Slart but SL is........... Incorrect. His background is not in business and financial planning as evidenced by his over decade failure here and by the nonsense of seeking to make us self financing. Any of us with the right sort of managerial/Board experience could tell you this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 Ps question for other fans as I am struggling to think. When was the last time we had a bad start to the season and turned it round under the same manager? I really am struggling to remember. (GJ joined mid season so does not count). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 1 minute ago, LondonBristolian said: Ps question for other fans as I am struggling to think. When was the last time we had a bad start to the season and turned it round under the same manager? I really am struggling to remember. (GJ joined mid season so does not count). John Ward? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Zod Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 26 minutes ago, Robbored said: Fans patience is irrelevant to those who make the decisions. Do you suppose that MA is bothered by how thin the fans patience is? Not in slightest! If MA and SL really aren’t that bothered about fans patience and feel that it’s their club and they can do what they like regardless I would put that down as a big mistake. SL quite rightly pays his money and makes his decisions but fan power wins out in the end, it may take time for SL to admit he’s got it wrong with LJ and feel that he’s not lost face but he will eventually. We are Bristol City, fans do have a say unless we are totally different to any other football club/ fan base out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo88 Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 31 minutes ago, Robbored said: After four matches? It would mean nothing so early in the season. True, in a way, but also wrong in a way. Four matches is very early, but pressure builds pressure. I’m not convinced that LJ knows his best team, so if he feels City need to get points any way possible he might start tinkering with team selection. Then it’s a viscous spiral of tinkering and more tinkering Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.