Judge LJ on his two full seasons.

[Red7]

11 hours ago, Moments of Pleasure said:

His own words, quoted on the BBC Sport site, in May '16, were:

"Top get a true reflection of one of my teams it'll probably take three windows but we'll look to fast-track that"

The following November, on the club OS, under a sub heading: 'Lee Johnson has reiterated it could take three windows to get his City team where he wants it to be' he said:

The key words here are "probably" and "could". They weren't exactly outright promises. Although I admit that, in the world of football, making such statements is a bit pointless as there is no way of telling what will happen that far ahead. 

[JBFC II]

13 hours ago, glen humphries said:

Agree mate , we haven’t got any leaders on the pitch , lj said we needed leaders yet still know sign of one, for me we look far to easy to play against, Brentford away we showed a few signs of being a bit more nasty or maybe it was just being more street wise , sadly it seems that was a 1 off.

According to LJ our only leader is Bailey Wright, the sooner he gets back in the side the better

[Major Isewater]

1 hour ago, JBFC II said:

According to LJ our only leader is Bailey Wright, the sooner he gets back in the side the better

Who's fault is it that in the entire squad we only have one ' leader ' ? 

[Bryans Left Peg]

Tomlin was essentially a fan's signing.

I'd never place blame with LJ or the board for that waste of space, that was done to please us fans and we got it horribly wrong.

[Hellfire Corner]

On 05/11/2018 at 00:04, dave36 said:

Thinking back to LJ’s last 2 seasons with us as a player, remember the player who looked to be in space when defending and standing off when attacking. We have one player now who avoids contact just as much, and he gets to play in just about every game! Last season he played our injured captain until he was near crippled and lost his international place. LJ refused to change squad and formations until it was too late to change the game, great for player morale!

 this season we give youth a chance and it pays off, but our game is still ruined by the attacking formation. I hear plenty of comments about  our defence but correct me if I wrong but we are shipping far fewer goals now than in the recent past, we need to take our chances, which means our attack has to improve! Lansdown has to bring in the change, if not getting rid of the Dwarf get him some experienced backup!

Some good points spoilt by the personal insult of LJ in the last sentence.

[Major Isewater]

45 minutes ago, Bryans Left Peg said:

Tomlin was essentially a fan's signing.

I'd never place blame with LJ or the board for that waste of space, that was done to please us fans and we got it horribly wrong.

We wanted him based on what he did when with us on loan . 

Could anyone have guessed what was going to happen subsequently ? 

Perhaps the team of researchers dedicated to establishing the player's DNA ? 

He did have previous.

 

[GoodridgeandGoater]

Thanks for this very enjoyable post. Captures the feast / famine contours of the LJ era very well.

This season seems different as so far in that the ups and downs have been more condensed - couple of wins here, couple of defeats there, a point here, two lost there.  The standard lot of midtable championship outfit. 

City are 12th after about one third of the season, 8 points from the triumph of the top, 7 from the disaster of the relegation. On the evidence so far the best we can hope for is to be tickled with the outside chance of a playoff spot, the worst a dangerous flirtation with relegation. Midtable mediocrity seems the most stolidly likely outcome. 

If the season pans out as more of the same, I think don’t think Johnson is as secure as many seem to assume. Steve Lansdown has said he wants to see progress. He might conclude he’s got what he wants from Johnson - phase 1 of project premier league, a stable, established championship club. LJ would’ve had three full seasons, where after leading us to the heights of promotion contenders and carabao glory, ultimately took us up a cul-de-sac it unfulfilled promise.

For me what Steve does will be how much he feels the years are pressing on him, and how personally attached he is to Lee. The logical next step would be to get a bigger name / more experienced manager in - e.g. David Moyes who pretty much said he’d take the job last week - and allow the signing of a few big fee / big wage players. 

Could be a case of one last roll of the dice vs project status quo. What may be more likely is that Johnson will talk his way into SL’s imagination - we’re not too far away, one or two more windows, a decent striker in, strong Centre mid, a reliable ‘keeper - and he’ll back him to succeed where the father failed.

Whatever happens this season is really pivotal for LJ.  

[RumRed]

1 hour ago, Major Isewater said:

We wanted him based on what he did when with us on loan . 

Could anyone have guessed what was going to happen subsequently ? 

Perhaps the team of researchers dedicated to establishing the player's DNA ? 

He did have previous.

 

His Tweets before signing showed he was an obvious pain in the ass.  It didn’t take a genius to work out he was trouble, let alone a team of researchers.

Not all fans were on bended knee begging him to sign.

[Major Isewater]

22 minutes ago, RumRed said:

His Tweets before signing showed he was an obvious pain in the ass.  It didn’t take a genius to work out he was trouble, let alone a team of researchers.

Not all fans were on bended knee begging him to sign.

So you agree with me then.

There is something array with our recruitment team if they propose paying out a record fee to sign ' an obvious pain in the ass ' .

I never liked his personality but he represented a supposed step up for the club in terms of technical ability and was a marquee signing for us .

It seemed like we had won when we succeeded in getting his signature.

We all saw what followed.

[Mtimmy11]

i know this is off subject but can someone settle a bet.how many players have we signed since lee Johnson took over nearly 3years ago.i thought it was about 30 but my friend thinks it’s higher(including loans)cheers

[Lrrr]

23 minutes ago, Mtimmy11 said:

i know this is off subject but can someone settle a bet.how many players have we signed since lee Johnson took over nearly 3years ago.i thought it was about 30 but my friend thinks it’s higher(including loans)cheers

Are you counting those signed for first team or all who came in under LJ? Players like De Girolamo for example, 23's player or one to be loaned out with hope they'd grow to be a first team player. If you count players like him it'll be over 30.

[Boston Red]

24 minutes ago, Mtimmy11 said:

i know this is off subject but can someone settle a bet.how many players have we signed since lee Johnson took over nearly 3years ago.i thought it was about 30 but my friend thinks it’s higher(including loans)cheers

I need to get out more, but here goes.........................

Giefer, Golbourne, Lucic, J Smith, De Girolamo, Tomlin, Magnússon, O' Neill, O'Dowda, T Moore, Duric, Hegeler, Patterson, Brownhill, Engvall, Wright, M Taylor, A Matthews, Abraham, D Cotterill, Diedhiou, Pisano, Baker, Hinds, Eliasson, Steele, Bakinson, Holden, Semenyo, Walsh, Woodrow, Leko, Kent, Diony, Watkins, Webster, Adelakun, Weimann, Hunt, Eisa, Maenpaa, Da Silva, Kalic.

I make it 43.

This spending like a drunken pirate has only been made possible by selling the family silver (Kodjia, Flint, Bryan, Reid, Ayling, Bolasie sell on clause). We really are not getting a good return on all these signings and all this outlay. It's like a kid always wanting a new toy. 

[Mtimmy11]

9 minutes ago, Boston Red said:

I need to get out more, but here goes.........................

Giefer, Golbourne, Lucic, J Smith, De Girolamo, Tomlin, Magnússon, O' Neill, O'Dowda, T Moore, Duric, Hegeler, Patterson, Brownhill, Engvall, Wright, M Taylor, A Matthews, Abraham, D Cotterill, Diedhiou, Pisano, Baker, Hinds, Eliasson, Steele, Bakinson, Holden, Semenyo, Walsh, Woodrow, Leko, Kent, Diony, Watkins, Webster, Adelakun, Weimann, Hunt, Eisa, Maenpaa, Da Silva, Kalic.

I make it 43.

This spending like a drunken pirate has only been made possible by selling the family silver (Kodjia, Flint, Bryan, Reid, Ayling, Bolasie sell on clause). We really are not getting a good return on all these signings and all this outlay. It's like a kid always wanting a new toy. 

Cheers mate,looks like I forgot a few

[NorfolkInChance]

Well people talk about improvement, and we may improve this season in terms of league position or we may not.

When I think of improvement I look at Norwich, Sheff Utd, Leeds and possibly Brentford over the last couple of seasons - and to a lesser extent the mess QPR were when we beat them and how well Blackburn are doing.

I don't get that feeling with us unfortunately.  It seems like as soon as we build some momentum something happens to destroy it, and generally that is a shocking run of results.

Are we playing the same kind of football as we were this time last season?  Does that mean we will end up any different in terms of league position?

LJ has spent (and possibly wasted) a lot of funds which is why we had to sell like we did in the summer. 

Promotion is not all about finances (it helps) but the idea that we cannot complete due to finances makes my p@ss boil - others have done it....

I probably feel more down about the team than I have for a long time (and yes I've been supporting for 46 years seen all of the crap along the way)..  Unless we get a special coach we cannot get to the Premier League without spending - I think that is obvious.  Is LJ good enough to do it?  Lansdown will not blow a load of money to get us there that is clear - so what happens next?

We've lost approx. £23m just to keep us where we are basically - how can we move forward (genuine question)..

[glen humphries]

4 hours ago, Major Isewater said:

We wanted him based on what he did when with us on loan . 

Could anyone have guessed what was going to happen subsequently ? 

Perhaps the team of researchers dedicated to establishing the player's DNA ? 

He did have previous.

 

The warning signs were there in the video he appeared in with alby pre season, came across as a spiteful sod.

[Robbored]

1 hour ago, Boston Red said:

I need to get out more, but here goes.........................

Giefer, Golbourne, Lucic, J Smith, De Girolamo, Tomlin, Magnússon, O' Neill, O'Dowda, T Moore, Duric, Hegeler, Patterson, Brownhill, Engvall, Wright, M Taylor, A Matthews, Abraham, D Cotterill, Diedhiou, Pisano, Baker, Hinds, Eliasson, Steele, Bakinson, Holden, Semenyo, Walsh, Woodrow, Leko, Kent, Diony, Watkins, Webster, Adelakun, Weimann, Hunt, Eisa, Maenpaa, Da Silva, Kalic.

I make it 43.

This spending like a drunken pirate has only been made possible by selling the family silver (Kodjia, Flint, Bryan, Reid, Ayling, Bolasie sell on clause). We really are not getting a good return on all these signings and all this outlay. It's like a kid always wanting a new toy. 

Why not do a transfer comparison to other Championship clubs? 

That’ll give some idea on where City are in that particular regard.

[glen humphries]

1 hour ago, Boston Red said:

I need to get out more, but here goes.........................

Giefer, Golbourne, Lucic, J Smith, De Girolamo, Tomlin, Magnússon, O' Neill, O'Dowda, T Moore, Duric, Hegeler, Patterson, Brownhill, Engvall, Wright, M Taylor, A Matthews, Abraham, D Cotterill, Diedhiou, Pisano, Baker, Hinds, Eliasson, Steele, Bakinson, Holden, Semenyo, Walsh, Woodrow, Leko, Kent, Diony, Watkins, Webster, Adelakun, Weimann, Hunt, Eisa, Maenpaa, Da Silva, Kalic.

I make it 43.

This spending like a drunken pirate has only been made possible by selling the family silver (Kodjia, Flint, Bryan, Reid, Ayling, Bolasie sell on clause). We really are not getting a good return on all these signings and all this outlay. It's like a kid always wanting a new toy. 

That list is frightening.

[glen humphries]

On the whole our loans have been poor , lj is following in his dads footsteps he used to like signing loads of players , he loved a center forward.

[Robbored]

11 minutes ago, glen humphries said:

That list is frightening.

Compare it to the same period of time to other Championship clubs......you might find that it’s not that unusual.

[Boston Red]

4 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Compare it to the same period of time to other Championship clubs......you might find that it’s not that unusual.

That's 43 players signed from June 2016 to August 2018. 

Most Championship teams do not sign 43 players every two years. 

[glen humphries]

11 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Compare it to the same period of time to other Championship clubs......you might find that it’s not that unusual.

You got any facts to back that up ??

[Dolman Block B]

Lose to Preston saturday and Leeds the following saturday this thread will go into a "Classic" thats a dead cert

[Robbored]

57 minutes ago, glen humphries said:

You got any facts to back that up ??

Just asking the question.

[exAtyeoMax]

2 hours ago, Boston Red said:

I need to get out more, but here goes.........................

Giefer, Golbourne, Lucic, J Smith, De Girolamo, Tomlin, Magnússon, O' Neill, O'Dowda, T Moore, Duric, Hegeler, Patterson, Brownhill, Engvall, Wright, M Taylor, A Matthews, Abraham, D Cotterill, Diedhiou, Pisano, Baker, Hinds, Eliasson, Steele, Bakinson, Holden, Semenyo, Walsh, Woodrow, Leko, Kent, Diony, Watkins, Webster, Adelakun, Weimann, Hunt, Eisa, Maenpaa, Da Silva, Kalic.

I make it 43.

This spending like a drunken pirate has only been made possible by selling the family silver (Kodjia, Flint, Bryan, Reid, Ayling, Bolasie sell on clause). We really are not getting a good return on all these signings and all this outlay. It's like a kid always wanting a new toy. 

Plus Joel Ekstrand. I don't know if he was a freebie or not

[Robbored]

1 hour ago, Boston Red said:

That's 43 players signed from June 2016 to August 2018. 

Most Championship teams do not sign 43 players every two years. 

Got any facts to back that up?         

[CliftonCliff]

1 hour ago, NorfolkInChance said:

 

LJ has spent (and possibly wasted) a lot of funds which is why we had to sell like we did in the summer. 

With respect, that’s a hugely distorted version of events. Flint, Reid & Bryan were offered the opportunity to earn more money elsewhere (and in the cases of the latter two, the chance to play in the PL) and all three made it quite clear that they wanted to go. We couldn’t have kept them if we’d wanted to.

[Robbored]

11 minutes ago, CliftonCliff said:

With respect, that’s a hugely distorted version of events. Flint, Reid & Bryan were offered the opportunity to earn more money elsewhere (and in the cases of the latter two, the chance to play in the PL) and all three made it quite clear that they wanted to go. We couldn’t have kept them if we’d wanted to.

Stop posting facts Cliff......LJs critics can handle them.They don’t fit thier agenda.

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, Robbored said:

Why not do a transfer comparison to other Championship clubs? 

That’ll give some idea on where City are in that particular regard.

Fair response.

2 hours ago, Robbored said:

Compare it to the same period of time to other Championship clubs......you might find that it’s not that unusual.

Have you done some analysis?

 

4 hours ago, Boston Red said:

I need to get out more, but here goes.........................

Giefer, Golbourne, Lucic, J Smith, De Girolamo, Tomlin, Magnússon, O' Neill, O'Dowda, T Moore, Duric, Hegeler, Patterson, Brownhill, Engvall, Wright, M Taylor, A Matthews, Abraham, D Cotterill, Diedhiou, Pisano, Baker, Hinds, Eliasson, Steele, Bakinson, Holden, Semenyo, Walsh, Woodrow, Leko, Kent, Diony, Watkins, Webster, Adelakun, Weimann, Hunt, Eisa, Maenpaa, Da Silva, Kalic.

I make it 43.

This spending like a drunken pirate has only been made possible by selling the family silver (Kodjia, Flint, Bryan, Reid, Ayling, Bolasie sell on clause). We really are not getting a good return on all these signings and all this outlay. It's like a kid always wanting a new toy. 

In a two year period that appears to be a lot of players in, but i’m Gonna break them into categories for a bit of a discussion (bold - success, underline = too early to tell):

Loans with option to buy - Woodrow and Diony (neither option taken because both failed here)

Loans - Giefer, Matthews, Abraham, Cotterill, Leko, Kent, Dasilva and Kalas (Abraham a great success, too early to tell for the latest two)

Free Transfers (genuine) - Lucic, DeGirolamo, O’Neil, Pisano, Semenyo, Steele, Mäenpää (of these I would class Steele and Mäenpää as successes all others failed with exception of Semenyo)

Free Transfers (Tribunal) - J.Smith, Brownhill, Adelakun (Brownhill a success, the other two, yet to be seen, Smithdone well on loan)

Fee paid (For the future - still waiting for the future) - Hinds, Bakinson, Holden (too early to tell)

Fee paid (For the future - the future is here) - O’Dowda, Moore, Engvall, Eliasson, Walsh, Eisa he’s 24!! (not one success at this stage, none are first choice starters.  Apart from Engvall, all could have a future and will ultimately define our recruitment skill or not as the case may be)

Fee paid (experienced) - SUCCESSES - Wright, Weimann and Webster (regular starters and influential performances)

Fee paid (experienced) - DONE OK / FINE - Golbourne (came in and did a job in 15/16), Magnússon (has good and bad moments),    Paterson (only cost £500k, so done ok overall), Taylor (only cost £300k and done ok), Diedhiou (would be a success back in the summer, but worrying trend), Watkins (not easy on the eye, but effective), Hunt (mixed bag, but doing ok)

Fee paid (experienced) - FAILED - Tomlin (lost money on a player in his prime years, paid him a big wage and he upset everyone), Djúric (injury prone since being here, sold at a loss after getting him fit, 6’7” a strange choice for LJ team / style), Baker (Cost the  best part of £4m, and after selling Flint, Magnússon and Wright injured, cannot get a start), Hegeler (didn’t cost much but hasn’t adapted to the Champ).

Of the non-loans the following have come and gone:

Lucic, DeGiralamo, O’Neil, Steele, Engvall, Golbourne, Magnússon, Tomlin, Djúric.

By my reckoning there are 7 successes (1 loan, 6 signings). 4 youngsters too early to judge.  2 players for whom injury makes rating difficult (Adelakun and Eisa).

You can of course debate my view / opinions, but thought it was interesting to break into categories, because you can’t lump straight into success or failure, you have to have some context.  I don’t think the return is good enough for a club said to be ahead of the curve for recruitment.

[Boston Red]

3 hours ago, exAtyeoMax said:

Plus Joel Ekstrand. I don't know if he was a freebie or not

I'll add him to the list.

Giefer, Golbourne, Lucic, J Smith, De Girolamo, Tomlin, Magnússon, O' Neill, O'Dowda, T Moore, Ekstrand, Duric, Hegeler, Patterson, Brownhill, Engvall, Wright, M Taylor, A Matthews, Abraham, D Cotterill, Diedhiou, Pisano, Baker, Hinds, Eliasson, Steele, Bakinson, Holden, Semenyo, Walsh, Woodrow, Leko, Kent, Diony, Watkins, Webster, Adelakun, Weimann, Hunt, Eisa, Maenpaa, Da Silva, Kalic.

That makes 44.

[Mtimmy11]

10 hours ago, Boston Red said:

I'll add him to the list.

Giefer, Golbourne, Lucic, J Smith, De Girolamo, Tomlin, Magnússon, O' Neill, O'Dowda, T Moore, Ekstrand, Duric, Hegeler, Patterson, Brownhill, Engvall, Wright, M Taylor, A Matthews, Abraham, D Cotterill, Diedhiou, Pisano, Baker, Hinds, Eliasson, Steele, Bakinson, Holden, Semenyo, Walsh, Woodrow, Leko, Kent, Diony, Watkins, Webster, Adelakun, Weimann, Hunt, Eisa, Maenpaa, Da Silva, Kalic.

That makes 44.

Thanks again for the answer,I was only 14 out