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old_eastender

LJ (and Holden) stick or twist

LJ (and Holden) - stick or twist  

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41 minutes ago, JBFC II said:

I think we can guess what the majority may say... 

...no need to guess why though...the chap's completely out of his depth. I'd take pity on him - and the rest of us - and sack him now.

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In these days of the transfer window, I can't see the point of the wait until Christmas option. We either let Johnson have the next transfer window or bring someone else in now to assess what's needed and hopefully they'll go and get it in January.

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He's had his time, he's had vast amounts of money at his disposal - these are his players, and they aren't performing. For me, he has until December and if no improvement then it's time for a change at the top. 

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Only reason to wait a while is to give themselves time to look for a replacement. I would hope we will look at what some of the foreign managers have achieved in this division. It will need a bit of research to find someone, rather than just go for the obvious names like Mick McCarthy.

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Two ways of looking at it...

Firstly, we are mid table. Exactly the number of points from the play offs as we are the relegation zone. Give LJ until Xmas and see where we are then. Not like anyone coming into the club now will be able to sign players anyway.

or

Secondly, get rid now and give a new manger a good month or so to look at the players that are here so come January he will know exactly what he needs to bring in.

Given we have been through far worse in the previous two seasons in terms of league form I don’t see LJ going anywhere anytime soon.

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Maybe he should take McCallister and Ashton with him too.

As well as experienced manager (UK or foreign) bring in experienced DOF to review recruitment strategy and scouting network too as that clearly needs to improve.

This assumes that SL is willing to review his own strategy of course which may be whistling in the wind.

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8 minutes ago, Warwickshire Red said:

Maybe he should take McCallister and Ashton with him too.

As well as experienced manager (UK or foreign) bring in experienced DOF to review recruitment strategy and scouting network too as that clearly needs to improve.

This assumes that SL is willing to review his own strategy of course which may be whistling in the wind.

Sl likes yes men , part of the reason he fell out with cotts 

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I think now is the right time to part company. We are in no immediate danger, we are still relatively comfortable in the middle of the table, so the new man has time to assess his options and potentially bring in players in January - but more likely next summer.

It’s worth saying that LJ’s appointment has not proven to be the disaster some predicted. He pulled us clear of relegation in his first half-season and has gradually improved the league position since. If he goes now, history will look pretty kindly on him I think. But after an abysmal 2018, I think most are now reaching the conclusion that he is not the right man to take us any further. I think yesterday was nadir for many people like me.

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I know, Glen, and that’s what’s partly holding us back too imo.

If SL’s not willing to come out of his comfort zone, then we need a far more effective and experienced manager who he thinks he can get on with to work within the set parameters.

Surely, it would be preferable if SL appointed the best manager/coach he could get and let him get on with it with less interference? 

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I think he's totally out of his depth so easy for me. Given that, the sooner the better. Harsh as it sounds, a new man needs to be prepared as possible for the January window.

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The squad is far worse now than what he inherited from Cotts. 

As much as I wanted him to succeed, I just can’t see how he will achieve it with the players he has brought in. 

 

Go now as much work work is required before the transfer window. Surely there’s got to be more than Webster, Kelly (Kalas and da Silva) who are worth keeping from the 40 arrivals. 

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2 hours ago, OddBallJim said:

He's had his time, he's had vast amounts of money at his disposal - these are his players, and they aren't performing. For me, he has until December and if no improvement then it's time for a change at the top. 

Same for me. Christmas is too far away. Please don’t give him another transfer window.

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35 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said:

I think now is the right time to part company. We are in no immediate danger, we are still relatively comfortable in the middle of the table, so the new man has time to assess his options and potentially bring in players in January - but more likely next summer.

It’s worth saying that LJ’s appointment has not proven to be the disaster some predicted. He pulled us clear of relegation in his first half-season and has gradually improved the league position since. If he goes now, history will look pretty kindly on him I think. But after an abysmal 2018, I think most are now reaching the conclusion that he is not the right man to take us any further. I think yesterday was nadir for many people like me.

I'd agree with all of that, however the bit in bold means that he won't be going anywhere soon. History has shown us that SL will only dispense with managers when we're deep in trouble and he feels they can't do anything to get us out of it.

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3 hours ago, formerly known as ivan said:

Two ways of looking at it...

Firstly, we are mid table. Exactly the number of points from the play offs as we are the relegation zone. Give LJ until Xmas and see where we are then. Not like anyone coming into the club now will be able to sign players anyway.

or

Secondly, get rid now and give a new manger a good month or so to look at the players that are here so come January he will know exactly what he needs to bring in.

Given we have been through far worse in the previous two seasons in terms of league form I don’t see LJ going anywhere anytime soon.

Second! Get rid now he's had more than enough chances!yesterday was absolutely pathetic!

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Give him the season, this squad won’t be relegated. If we don’t see real signs of improvement, we make a change in the summer and see who we can get. But there’s nothing to stop it ‘clicking’ again, and is going on a great run under LJ. If this happens, keep him. 

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13 minutes ago, BCFCGav said:

Give him the season, this squad won’t be relegated. If we don’t see real signs of improvement, we make a change in the summer and see who we can get. But there’s nothing to stop it ‘clicking’ again, and is going on a great run under LJ. If this happens, keep him. 

Bold statement, seen many fans claim their team is too good to go down, only to be relegated.

Consider the damage to confidence it will do if the performances and results continue as they are.  A side bereft of confidence is only going to go one way.

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He has to go now for me

1. In 3 years and however many windows he still doesn't give any confidence that he can build a side capable of mounting a consistent top 6 challenge. Giving him another 6 or7 weeks or God forbid another window won't change anything.

2. 44 signings.........8 maybe a success. Recruitment ( remember HE has the final say . .  HE said " I'm Head of Talent ID") has been largely crap....£5.3M for Diedhiou - really?

3.Yesterday he got : team selection, formation, shape, tactics, subs, and game management all wrong.........just how inept do you have to be to get fired by Lansdown if your name's Johnson?

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Don't see the point in giving him January for two main reasons:

1) He has had 3 transfer windows already, so the squad should be well shaped to his needs/wants as a manager.

2) If we are to replace him, it's better to give his successor a transfer window in which he can get his own players in.

Edited by Distortia
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19 hours ago, ChippenhamRed said:

I think now is the right time to part company. We are in no immediate danger, we are still relatively comfortable in the middle of the table, so the new man has time to assess his options and potentially bring in players in January - but more likely next summer.

It’s worth saying that LJ’s appointment has not proven to be the disaster some predicted. He pulled us clear of relegation in his first half-season and has gradually improved the league position since. If he goes now, history will look pretty kindly on him I think. But after an abysmal 2018, I think most are now reaching the conclusion that he is not the right man to take us any further. I think yesterday was nadir for many people like me.

 

18 hours ago, Northern Red said:

I'd agree with all of that, however the bit in bold means that he won't be going anywhere soon. History has shown us that SL will only dispense with managers when we're deep in trouble and he feels they can't do anything to get us out of it.

Completely agree with first post above, and sadly, the second too.

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12 minutes ago, Bristolcityyatton said:

Even worse, he's had 5 transfer windows already !

Haha, you know what? I originally thought and typed 5 but then edited it to say 3 because I couldn't remember, and wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt. So you're right, it's even less of an excuse.

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22 minutes ago, Distortia said:

Haha, you know what? I originally thought and typed 5 but then edited it to say 3 because I couldn't remember, and wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt. So you're right, it's even less of an excuse.

I think that three windows was the amount of time he predicted it would take for him to get the squad he wanted?

If I was Lansdown I wouldn't trust him with another window and would give someone else the time between now and January to assess what's needed. That said, it's clear that, barring some unspecified eventuality - which would have to be worse than breaking the club record for consecutive league defeats - the change won't come.

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We are in mid table. At present.  I again invite anyone to recall the SL interview start of the season. He stated openly that last season the second half was not what was expected considering where we were at Xmas new year.  He expects year on year improvement. So, make of that what you will but if he sees us declining I can then only see the inevitable. 

There is so much good  going on at the club. He would not allow us to fall into League one whether that means major changes in new year or before new year.  

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2 minutes ago, MichaelRobartes said:

I think that three windows was the amount of time he predicted it would take for him to get the squad he wanted?

If I was Lansdown I wouldn't trust him with another window and would give someone else the time between now and January to assess what's needed. That said, it's clear that, barring some unspecified eventuality - which would have to be worse than breaking the club record for consecutive league defeats - the change won't come.

I agree.

This is all hot air. Whatever we fans want, it isn't happening.

There's no way Lansdown would even consider it, with the club mid-table. 

If this form continues and we plunge into the drop zone or thereabouts, he might - only might - think about pulling the trigger.

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No agenda - just an observation.

Depsite all the general opinions in all the threads and all the posts since Preston:

This poll - less than 2% of our average attendance have voted.

And only 52% of those voting actually want him out now.

Well you wouldn’t have thought that reading OTIB - proving again it is a small (2%) but vocal cross section of fans and even within that pretty much half are divided still. 

 

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4 minutes ago, Alessandro said:

No agenda - just an observation.

Depsite all the general opinions in all the threads and all the posts since Preston:

This poll - less than 2% of our average attendance have voted.

And only 52% of those voting actually want him out now.

Well you wouldn’t have thought that reading OTIB - proving again it is a small (2%) but vocal cross section of fans and even within that pretty much half are divided still. 

 

I suspect some of the 48% are like me, Alessandro.  I voted "give him until Christmas" but if he was sacked today, I'd be far from unhappy. 

I've lost my faith in him and - I suppose - I'm hoping for a turnabout that I don't think is likely.

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12 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

I suspect some of the 48% are like me, Alessandro.  I voted "give him until Christmas" but if he was sacked today, I'd be far from unhappy. 

I've lost my faith in him and - I suppose - I'm hoping for a turnabout that I don't think is likely.

I’m with you Red-Robbo. If I voted it would be give him to Christmas. 

But to be honest if I was in charge I’d be looking now at potential candidates. It’s more about the downwards trend of the football played than the form or league position. Previously you’ve been able to argue the football was OK, but the results didn’t follow. You can’t even say that now. They’ve looked completely lost the last few games.

Personally my faith has been slowly worked away, I’m more patient maybe than some as we sit midtable, where I expected us to be. If the current performances and results continue there is only one outcome.

Would I surprise you if we beat Leeds and start this circle of LJ in/out all over again?! 

Anyway - the reality is if he goes, depending on which way you ‘want’ to see things - there have been many positives to his time here but they have been also been plenty of negatives. Depending on your need to be right or wrong about him will lead you to focus on one or the other!

 

Edited by Alessandro
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4 hours ago, Alessandro said:

No agenda - just an observation.

Depsite all the general opinions in all the threads and all the posts since Preston:

This poll - less than 2% of our average attendance have voted.

And only 52% of those voting actually want him out now.

Well you wouldn’t have thought that reading OTIB - proving again it is a small (2%) but vocal cross section of fans and even within that pretty much half are divided still. 

 

Interestingly the longer the poll has been open the more people that have opted for the "wait until Xmas" option...

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3 hours ago, old_eastender said:

Interestingly the longer the poll has been open the more people that have opted for the "wait until Xmas" option...

A few have calmed down a bit since Saturday - the figures have got a lot closer since yesterday.

I suspect of the OP had put this up at 7pm on Saturday the totals would be very different and the margin between the latter two options much wider!

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