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Gazza


myol'man

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1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

Gazza clearly done some terrible things in the past, and maybe still doing them, who knows. 

As a footballer he is probably the most overrated player of all time.

I'm not saying he didn't have some tremendous natural attributes, certainly in those first couple of years with the pace too.

But how many good seasons did he have?

 

Ha ha ha ha ha

‘ probably the most overrated player of all time.’

 

You watched him how many times live ?

certainly before his injury the best player we produced for decades and the best player at the 90 World Cup

 

’most overrated player of all time’

 

Priceless

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1 hour ago, phantom said:

Not sure if it was clever or sick that they used footage of him with Princess Diana 

Just throwing this out there, and I am not condoning what he did. But is it a crime to kiss someone without their consent? How many times must this happen in bars and clubs up and down the country on a weekend 

Yes, the moral compass of lawyers is also questionable! I’m sure Gazza has smarter and more expensive lawyers then the defendants who know how to manipulate a jury - a jury probably was not appropriate in this case.

is it a crime? If the person on the receiving end did not want the attention, then yes it is. Same as someone taking something away from you without consent is stealing.. just because you didn’t verbally confirm you didn’t want them to take it off you doesn’t mean it’s not theft.

if the person decides they didn’t want that attention that is harrasment/assault, simple as really. Someone might not be bothered but someone else might be, neither are more valid in their feelings. The real problem is the fact that woman are not empowered to feel like they can speak out against such behaviours as they have been conditioned to accept that this is the way things are and to get on with it.

often men feel entitled to do whatever they want, and it’s wrong.

*edit - conditioned is the wrong word, forced is probably more appropriate

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53 minutes ago, reddoh said:

Please don't forget American Judges decided a "Blow Job" was not a sexual act.

(I had a witty comment to type here but thought you probably wouldn't swallow it).

That's not true. Clinton claimed he was referring to intercourse only when he denied under oath having 'sexual relations' with Lewinski- a claim somewhat undermined laterly by his jizz all over her dress (and let's not mention the cigar).

He was impeached by the house of representatives anyway, but the Democrat majority Senate just about refused to remove him from office.

With respect, your interpretation is somewhat exaggerated, but credit for the gag (see what I did there?!).

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19 minutes ago, Fjmcity said:

Yes, the moral compass of lawyers is also questionable! I’m sure Gazza has smarter and more expensive lawyers then the defendants who know how to manipulate a jury - a jury probably was not appropriate in this case.

is it a crime? If the person on the receiving end did not want the attention, then yes it is. Same as someone taking something away from you without consent is stealing.. just because you didn’t verbally confirm you didn’t want them to take it off you doesn’t mean it’s not theft.

if the person decides they didn’t want that attention that is harrasment/assault, simple as really. Someone might not be bothered but someone else might be, neither are more valid in their feelings. The real problem is the fact that woman are not empowered to feel like they can speak out against such behaviours as they have been conditioned to accept that this is the way things are and to get on with it.

often men feel entitled to do whatever they want, and it’s wrong.

*edit - conditioned is the wrong word, forced is probably more appropriate

I'm only going to comment on the first part of your statement... But how can you question the morale compass of solicitors? Every man and woman in this country, regardless of the crime they've allegedly committed, has the right to seek legal advice when charged. 

Their job, is to either defend, or prosecute. They're not there to be the judge or jury. Sure, there are some crimes where solicitors will refuse to represent someone. But the trial doesn't go ahead without fair representation. And as much as I think some of our laws are so bloody soft, where the punishment doesn't fit the crime, I'm glad we live in a country where you hear both sides of the argument. All the evidence, and a jury decides the verdict. 

It's certainly not for us to question the solicitors, who are only doing their job. 

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46 minutes ago, Akira said:

I'm only going to comment on the first part of your statement... But how can you question the morale compass of solicitors? Every man and woman in this country, regardless of the crime they've allegedly committed, has the right to seek legal advice when charged. 

Their job, is to either defend, or prosecute. They're not there to be the judge or jury. Sure, there are some crimes where solicitors will refuse to represent someone. But the trial doesn't go ahead without fair representation. And as much as I think some of our laws are so bloody soft, where the punishment doesn't fit the crime, I'm glad we live in a country where you hear both sides of the argument. All the evidence, and a jury decides the verdict. 

It's certainly not for us to question the solicitors, who are only doing their job. 

I agree, everyone deserves the right to representation, it’s what makes a democracy. But as to the statement I was answering to, they pandered to the celebrity status of the client to get him off, which to me is questionable. If I were accused of what Gazza was and pictures of me were shown to the jury of me kissing and embracing people from old Facebook photos it would mean jackshite. 
 

I question the moral compass of people who are comfortable with facilitating this slight of hand and technicalities to mitigate a crime - but that’s the line of business I guess andit’s an imperfect system, imperfect as well in the fact that the most expensive lawyer normally wins

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10 minutes ago, Fjmcity said:

I agree, everyone deserves the right to representation, it’s what makes a democracy. But as to the statement I was answering to, they pandered to the celebrity status of the client to get him off, which to me is questionable. If I were accused of what Gazza was and pictures of me were shown to the jury of me kissing and embracing people from old Facebook photos it would mean jackshite. 
 

I question the moral compass of people who are comfortable with facilitating this slight of hand and technicalities to mitigate a crime - but that’s the line of business I guess andit’s an imperfect system, imperfect as well in the fact that the most expensive lawyer normally wins

Like many on here, I am sure, I saw pictures of 'an incident' in 2017 involving Ben Stokes and Alex Hales.

Ben Stokes was charged with affray, whilst Alex Hales was not even charged: Ben Stokes was acquitted.

I am sure the jury had their reasons, but....

 

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1 hour ago, Stortz said:

That's not true. Clinton claimed he was referring to intercourse only when he denied under oath having 'sexual relations' with Lewinski- a claim somewhat undermined laterly by his jizz all over her dress (and let's not mention the cigar).

He was impeached by the house of representatives anyway, but the Democrat majority Senate just about refused to remove him from office.

With respect, your interpretation is somewhat exaggerated, but credit for the gag (see what I did there?!).

sorry my version of history differs with yours but if you have a problem with me just spit it out:icecream:

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On 15/10/2019 at 10:29, Dollymarie said:

Well maybe until the jury has decided, then it’s best to stop making any comments. 
 

I hope no one you care about is ever on the end of any unwanted advances. 

It's a Forum, folk surely can speculate/ discuss, it will have no bearing on the trial.

Can we comment now he has been cleared? ?

 

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4 hours ago, JonDolman said:

Gazza clearly done some terrible things in the past, and maybe still doing them, who knows. 

As a footballer he is probably the most overrated player of all time.

I'm not saying he didn't have some tremendous natural attributes, certainly in those first couple of years with the pace too.

But how many good seasons did he have?

Blinking blimey .... you’ve had a “Weston Super” with that comment ...

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On 14/10/2019 at 17:03, Loon plage said:

Man shouldn't be given a pass because he was formerly a good footballer.

Absolute pest and before the fans come out of the woodwork, that could have been your mum, daughter wife sister etc.

No one should have to put up with that.

 

On 15/10/2019 at 09:45, marcofisher said:

Ah yes, so the woman should just attribute Sexual Assault as 'misguided warmth' and leave it there?

Absolute nonsense, his status as a footballer has nowt to do with it. 

I would hate to think what else you would describe as 'misguided warmth'.

You both shouldn't really comment on a active trial. 

7 hours ago, Fjmcity said:

To be cleared completely seems a little bizarre when he admitted to unwanted physical contact.

I’m not saying he should be locked up with the key thrown away but this type of behaviour needs some retribution.

if it’s not consensual, then it’s not ok.

*edit - also feel for this woman having the phrase ‘fat lass’ banded about about 50 times in various press releases

What sort of behaviour? He was found not guilty and therfore you can't go saying those things. 

I've not followed this case one little bit, but what I do know is he has been found not guilty and therfore you can't be saying stuff like that at all. 

 

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If i came on here at half time saying such and such is a world beater, then hes gone out in the 2nd half scored a own goal got sent off.

Would i expect stick on a large scale, yes i would.

Court cases are a lot like football matches,anything can happen in a minute.

I can only hope and pray some members here dont get picked for jury service.

 

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Totally correct he should be found not guilty.

Convict him of a lesser crime, because trying to merely kiss someone, is not sexual assault.

Pretty sure he would go on the sex offenders register. But that should be for people who actually touch people up or rape them. Kissing is not on that level.

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8 hours ago, Up The City! said:

 

You both shouldn't really comment on a active trial. 

What sort of behaviour? He was found not guilty and therfore you can't go saying those things. 

I've not followed this case one little bit, but what I do know is he has been found not guilty and therfore you can't be saying stuff like that at all. 

 

This goes beyond whatever the legal verdict was and guilty or not there are societal questions here about the conduct of men in general.

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7 hours ago, Oh Louie louie said:

Some people here over 40 bought this story! Talk about backing the wrong horse.

Marco fisher how does it feel to accuse a innocent man of grabbing a women and sticking his tounge down her throat.

You must feel a right ****, i would.

Thank god for british justice.

 

 

7 hours ago, Oh Louie louie said:

If i came on here at half time saying such and such is a world beater, then hes gone out in the 2nd half scored a own goal got sent off.

Would i expect stick on a large scale, yes i would.

Court cases are a lot like football matches,anything can happen in a minute.

I can only hope and pray some members here dont get picked for jury service.

 

Hi Mate,

Cheers for the lovely comments. 

If you actually read what I put you would notice I put a quote of one of the witnesses and not a personal accusation by myself. 

If he is not guilty of Sexual Assault, which is what he was in court for, then fair enough, but he still has openly admitted to kissing this woman against her will. Nobody even has given a shred of respect for this woman throughout this trial who has been openly labelled as "fat lass" throughout the whole trial.

Quote

The prosecution tried unsuccessfully to have Gascoigne’s past crimes read to the jury, arguing his convictions for offences including battery, criminal damage, drink-driving and religiously aggravated harassment “brought some balance” to a character reference by Gascoigne’s longtime friend and former counsellor Paul Spanjar, who described him as “one of the most generous people I’ve ever met … a natural carer and a very honest and straight guy”.

In the end, the jury of eight men and four women were not told about Gascoigne’s previous convictions and they decided they could not find him guilty of sexual assault or assault by beating

Seems like one of those where if it were joe public the courtroom would not have treated them so kindly. 

 

Oh and by the way mate I don't feel like a ****, I would feel like a **** if I said things like this:

On 15/10/2019 at 11:16, Oh Louie louie said:

Dolly im hetrosexual but if gazza kissed me id never wash again.

 

8 minutes ago, Fjmcity said:

This goes beyond whatever the legal verdict was and guilty or not there are societal questions here about the conduct of men in general.

100% spot on, the man has forcibly kissed a stranger, on the lips with no consent, with witnesses, even his barrister admitted he did. And yet, after bringing the woman's weight into the equation he still gets away not guilty purely because the jury couldn't rule on whether the kiss was 'sexual' or not. Like I said, if sexual assault wasn't the correct charge, then fair enough, but he definitely should have been convicted for something. 

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9 minutes ago, marcofisher said:

 

100% spot on, the man has forcibly kissed a stranger, on the lips with no consent, with witnesses, even his barrister admitted he did. And yet, after bringing the woman's weight into the equation he still gets away not guilty purely because the jury couldn't rule on whether the kiss was 'sexual' or not. Like I said, if sexual assault wasn't the correct charge, then fair enough, but he definitely should have been convicted for something. 

Yes bang on - often these things are not sexual - power, control and entitlement are often the main drivers. The horrendous 'fat lass' narrative seems to have been surreptitiously used to convey the message that "how could it be sexual, shes a fat lass"

whole thing wreaks of an old fashioned system that badly needs an update, peoples mind-sets also need an update as far to many people do not have the first idea about the meaning and importance of consent. Some scary viewpoints on here

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5 minutes ago, Fjmcity said:

Yes bang on - often these things are not sexual - power, control and entitlement are often the main drivers. The horrendous 'fat lass' narrative seems to have been superstitiously used to convey the message that "how could it be sexual, shes a fat lass"

whole thing wreaks of an old fashioned system that badly needs an update, peoples mind-sets also need an update as far to many people do not have the first idea about the meaning and importance of consent. Some scary viewpoints on here

I realise Gazza was a drunken mess in this situation and should be convicted of some minor crime.

But a man should be able to approach a woman without getting "consent"

I've never got a woman to actually say the word "yes" before i kiss her (or any other intimacy) - it just does not happen like that.

What should be a crime is when a woman says no and a man ignores her.

I fear for my son growing up - cos how do you approach a woman nowadays???? if the woman isnt interested, you arent just knocked back anymore, your made out to be a pervert and a weirdo!

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6 minutes ago, Riaz said:

I realise Gazza was a drunken mess in this situation and should be convicted of some minor crime.

But a man should be able to approach a woman without getting "consent"

I've never got a woman to actually say the word "yes" before i kiss her (or any other intimacy) - it just does not happen like that.

What should be a crime is when a woman says no and a man ignores her.

I fear for my son growing up - cos how do you approach a woman nowadays???? if the woman isnt interested, you arent just knocked back anymore, your made out to be a pervert and a weirdo!

Spot on

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5 minutes ago, Riaz said:

I realise Gazza was a drunken mess in this situation and should be convicted of some minor crime.

But a man should be able to approach a woman without getting "consent"

I've never got a woman to actually say the word "yes" before i kiss her (or any other intimacy) - it just does not happen like that.

What should be a crime is when a woman says no and a man ignores her.

I fear for my son growing up - cos how do you approach a woman nowadays???? if the woman isnt interested, you arent just knocked back anymore, your made out to be a pervert and a weirdo!

Consent does not have to be verbal, As long as you raise you son (as I am sure you will) to be respectful and aware then he will have no trouble

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42 minutes ago, Fjmcity said:

This goes beyond whatever the legal verdict was and guilty or not there are societal questions here about the conduct of men in general.

That conversation is perfectly valid.

However what you can't do is comment on Gazzas conduct as whatever he did or didn't do, the court found it lawful.

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1 minute ago, phantom said:

* certainly not just men

absolutely right Phantom, a couple of years ago I had the sad misfortune to take a minibus hen party from Bristol to Butlins Minehead. I  ( as a 69 year old guy ) have never heard such atrocious language in my life and sexual descriptions from not only the younger element but also the older and it takes a lot to shock me ( ex RAF with 2 daughters). We nearly cancelled their return journey as the other 2 minibus drivers experienced the same. We got our own back on the return however as they were very badly hung-over so found every pothole between Minehead and Bristol.

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