Marlon Pack

[Jack Bailey]

Captain, midfield leader, has that magical pass in his locker and all round nice guy etc BUT he looks knackered. He is losing the ball cheaply and in bad positions, less aggressive in the tackle, sluggish in possession and passing is sideways and backwards. I cannot remember his last decent game. Marlon needs a rest to re-charge the batteries. Views?

[Shuffle]

Big fan of Pack but agree that he’s dreadfully out of form. I genuinely believe that he is only playing as decent in the air as whilst he’s probably one of the fittest at club, he’s also the slowest. He looks like he’s pulling a parachute at moment but on his day is class. Just hasn’t been his day for a long time!

Would be happy to go with Brownhill/Walsh but no way will he be dropped 

[ExiledAjax]

I said it on another thread but my theory is that he's basically a bit sad, a bit lonely, and perhaps struggling with the extra pressure.

His best mates have all either moved away (and in the process trebled their wages) or been side-lined for months with injuries and illness. He's suddenly gone from being part of a close-knit group of mates who have won, lost, and holidayed together to being one of the leaders of a group of guys who, in the main, I imagine he had never met before pre-season.  He's lost guys he has been best man for or have been his best man (IIRC), blokes he has won trophies with and just really good mates.

Bryan, Reid and Flint have all got their moves...but Pack didn't get his.  There was talk of a Wolves move wasn't there? Whether there was any truth to that I don't know but I know it would affect me if I worked in a tight team for four years and then all my mates got a lucrative move to a bigger company whilst I had to try and cobble together a bunch of new lads into some sort of team.

I get that this is part and parcel with being a pro footballer but that doesn't prevent it from affecting him.

[The Fat Controller]

7 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

I said it on another thread but my theory is that he's basically a bit sad, a bit lonely, and perhaps struggling with the extra pressure.

His best mates have all either moved away (and in the process trebled their wages) or been side-lined for months with injuries and illness. He's suddenly gone from being part of a close-knit group of mates who have won, lost, and holidayed together to being one of the leaders of a group of guys who, in the main, I imagine he had never met before pre-season.  He's lost guys he has been best man for or have been his best man (IIRC), blokes he has won trophies with and just really good mates.

Bryan, Reid and Flint have all got their moves...but Pack didn't get his.  There was talk of a Wolves move wasn't there? Whether there was any truth to that I don't know but I know it would affect me if I worked in a tight team for four years and then all my mates got a lucrative move to a bigger company whilst I had to try and cobble together a bunch of new lads into some sort of team.

I get that this is part and parcel with being a pro footballer but that doesn't prevent it from affecting him.

All points to him needing a rest though, doesn't it. Even if it's just for a game or two, which would hopefully bring him back refreshed as we approach a busy period for fixtures.

I'd hate to see a Fontaine situation where a player so bereft of form is not taken out of the firing line. It will destroy his confidence in the end. 

[And Its Smith]

10 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

I said it on another thread but my theory is that he's basically a bit sad, a bit lonely, and perhaps struggling with the extra pressure.

His best mates have all either moved away (and in the process trebled their wages) or been side-lined for months with injuries and illness. He's suddenly gone from being part of a close-knit group of mates who have won, lost, and holidayed together to being one of the leaders of a group of guys who, in the main, I imagine he had never met before pre-season.  He's lost guys he has been best man for or have been his best man (IIRC), blokes he has won trophies with and just really good mates.

Bryan, Reid and Flint have all got their moves...but Pack didn't get his.  There was talk of a Wolves move wasn't there? Whether there was any truth to that I don't know but I know it would affect me if I worked in a tight team for four years and then all my mates got a lucrative move to a bigger company whilst I had to try and cobble together a bunch of new lads into some sort of team.

I get that this is part and parcel with being a pro footballer but that doesn't prevent it from affecting him.

Blimey.  Someone pass me a tissue, I am welling up at his plight.  Poor guy.

[ExiledAjax]

Just now, Chris_Brown said:

All points to him needing a rest though, doesn't it. Even if it's just for a game or two, which would hopefully bring him back refreshed as we approach a busy period for fixtures.

I'd hate to see a Fontaine situation where a player so bereft of form is not taken out of the firing line. It will destroy his confidence in the end. 

I'm not sure. Maybe a rest is what he needs, maybe a chance to go and see some of the aforementioned mates.  But then I also wonder if he's the kind of guy who has a proud streak and wants to play through it?

Just now, RedDave said:

Blimey.  Someone pass me a tissue, I am welling up at his plight.  Poor guy.

I know, I've concocted a real sob story. But honestly he strikes me as the kind of bloke who is quite emotional, and for whom family and friends are really important. 

I could be making it all up of course as I don't know the guy...maybe he's just out of form or just really really hates Kalas?

[CyderInACan]

Bear in mind he (I think) signed a new contract here in the summer, he knew full well his bestie Flinty was going as well as JB so I don’t think it’s him missing his mates at play. Everyone suffers from a drop in form now and again. Maybe he needs to be dropped to give him a reboot. 

[Davefevs]

48 minutes ago, Shuffle said:

Big fan of Pack but agree that he’s dreadfully out of form. I genuinely believe that he is only playing as decent in the air as whilst he’s probably one of the fittest at club, he’s also the slowest. He looks like he’s pulling a parachute at moment but on his day is class. Just hasn’t been his day for a long time!

Would be happy to go with Brownhill/Walsh but no way will he be dropped 

....and my only reservation about leaving him out on Sunday.

Last season’s home game v Millwall was a boring affair, but Marlon’s screen in front of Baker / Wright was very effective in stopping them getting easy balls into Morison, and also he was snapping around Gregory for balls that dropped into the gaps.  Cue, LJ subbing Pack on the hour, and Millwall ending the game creating good chances....one point blank save from Frankie from Elliott (from memory).

25 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

I said it on another thread but my theory is that he's basically a bit sad, a bit lonely, and perhaps struggling with the extra pressure.

His best mates have all either moved away (and in the process trebled their wages) or been side-lined for months with injuries and illness. He's suddenly gone from being part of a close-knit group of mates who have won, lost, and holidayed together to being one of the leaders of a group of guys who, in the main, I imagine he had never met before pre-season.  He's lost guys he has been best man for or have been his best man (IIRC), blokes he has won trophies with and just really good mates.

Bryan, Reid and Flint have all got their moves...but Pack didn't get his.  There was talk of a Wolves move wasn't there? Whether there was any truth to that I don't know but I know it would affect me if I worked in a tight team for four years and then all my mates got a lucrative move to a bigger company whilst I had to try and cobble together a bunch of new lads into some sort of team.

I get that this is part and parcel with being a pro footballer but that doesn't prevent it from affecting him.

Interesting angle, and easy to poo-poo, but it does make you wonder.  I would give him a rest, irrespective of my reply to Shuffle above.

I also wonder whether other teams know that everything goes through Marlon, and have countered this, 1) stopping City playing and 2) making Marlon look bad by stifling him?

[JoeAman08]

LJ hasn’t dropped Paterson he won’t be dropping Pack. Even though we have enough options to do so in a one off match. It all comes back to LJ though. He doesn’t use all the tools at his disposal

[Super]

2 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

LJ hasn’t dropped Paterson he won’t be dropping Pack. Even though we have enough options to do so in a one off match. It all comes back to LJ though. He doesn’t use all the tools at his disposal

Really?

[JoeAman08]

1 minute ago, Super said:

Really?

He hasn’t and it has taken 11 months for Paterson to play to at a 6/10 level for a couple matches. If half our central midfield is out of form for 11 months we will find ourselves bottom half of L1 in a years time. Point is if someone is out of form and looks like could use a break, give it to him. End of last season we had Eliasson ready to help out but continued out of form Paterson. 

[ExiledAjax]

15 minutes ago, CyderInACan said:

Bear in mind he (I think) signed a new contract here in the summer, he knew full well his bestie Flinty was going as well as JB so I don’t think it’s him missing his mates at play. Everyone suffers from a drop in form now and again. Maybe he needs to be dropped to give him a reboot. 

A fair point and I accept it may be as simple as a drop in form.

I was just hypothesising as to why he's had a drop in form.

[Super]

2 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

He hasn’t and it has taken 11 months for Paterson to play to at a 6/10 level for a couple matches. If half our central midfield is out of form for 11 months we will find ourselves bottom half of L1 in a years time. Point is if someone is out of form and looks like could use a break, give it to him. End of last season we had Eliasson ready to help out but continued out of form Paterson. 

Paterson has only started half the league games this season

[ExiledAjax]

Checked the stats, Pack has played every minute of every league game. The only other player to do this is Webster.

[phantom]

1 hour ago, Jack Bailey said:

Captain, midfield leader, has that magical pass in his locker and all round nice guy etc BUT he looks knackered. He is losing the ball cheaply and in bad positions, less aggressive in the tackle, sluggish in possession and passing is sideways and backwards. I cannot remember his last decent game. Marlon needs a rest to re-charge the batteries. Views?

I think I am to blame!

I was never overly impressed with Pack, but a few weeks ago I was saying to friends how much better he looked at the start of the season. . .BOOM "kiss of death"

Ever since then he seems to have retracted back to the player he was the end of last season

I think too much is put on him carrying the midfield fight, and Korey missing is a big part of this, if he looks shattered now just after an international break we are going to have problems. But then he traveled to Dubai and then having late night outs on return, that is going to tire anybody out

[wendyredredrobin]

New contract signed, so doesn't have to make so much effort until it is up for renewal or he fancies a move, perhaps?

His poor passing might be due to a lack of movement around and ahead of him though.

Of course, he could be carrying an injury for all we know.

My view is that he is missing Korey in the middle of the park and that is what is affecting his game.

[Major Isewater]

35 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

....and my only reservation about leaving him out on Sunday.

Last season’s home game v Millwall was a boring affair, but Marlon’s screen in front of Baker / Wright was very effective in stopping them getting easy balls into Morison, and also he was snapping around Gregory for balls that dropped into the gaps.  Cue, LJ subbing Pack on the hour, and Millwall ending the game creating good chances....one point blank save from Frankie from Elliott (from memory).

Interesting angle, and easy to poo-poo, but it does make you wonder.  I would give him a rest, irrespective of my reply to Shuffle above.

I also wonder whether other teams know that everything goes through Marlon, and have countered this, 1) stopping City playing and 2) making Marlon look bad by stifling him?

I would pick Hegeler in place of Pack with the latter being on the bench in case of urgency.

I've always considered JH to be a similar style of player to Pack but technically better . He needs games to show his stuff and Packy needs time out or competition for his place.

[Bar BS3]

2 hours ago, Jack Bailey said:

Captain, midfield leader, has that magical pass in his locker and all round nice guy etc BUT he looks knackered. He is losing the ball cheaply and in bad positions, less aggressive in the tackle, sluggish in possession and passing is sideways and backwards. I cannot remember his last decent game. Marlon needs a rest to re-charge the batteries. Views?

I agree he looks burned out. The biggest problem to have arisen from Smith being out long term. 

Walsh has only just stepped up to first team contention, then Brownhill gets suspended. 

Maybe now with Brownhill back, Walsh looking ok & Morrell being a viable option, Pack can get a little bit of respite, even if it’s just coming off early now and then. 

It’s certainly difficult to take Pack out of the team, with the cover available, but I agree that he really needs a break. 

[Fuber]

I fancy Hegeler behind Walsh and Brownhill in a 3.

Just for a bit of height - plus despite nothing else Hegeler can read the game well.

[Super]

I blame a baby shark.

[robin_unreliant]

I reckon Hegeler will be gone in January.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Pack in a 3 would improve him I think, would help the team too.

Or as @Fuber said Hegeler behind Walsh and Brownhill in a 3- that could work too, were we to take Pack out the firing line for a bit. Think he could screen, he's sound technically but is like a lot of our more experienced players let's say, perhaps a lot of our players, ill suited to a 2.

[redcherryberry]

27 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Pack in a 3 would improve him I think, would help the team too.

Or as @Fuber said Hegeler behind Walsh and Brownhill in a 3- that could work too, were we to take Pack out the firing line for a bit. Think he could screen, he's sound technically but is like a lot of our more experienced players let's say, perhaps a lot of our players, ill suited to a 2.

Mr Pop, Are you seriously considering Hegeler as an option? He hasn’t played any Chanpionship minutes since god knows when & barely plays for the U23’s. Fitness wise he would be miles behind the rest. I’m also led to believe he does more ‘coaching’ than ‘training’ during the week. He was available for transfer in the last window but their were no takers. If he isn’t gone in Jan then no doubt he’ll be released at the end of the season?!? 

A player like Hegeler would work in you’re 3 in CM but no chance it will be the man himself. 

[eardun]

I don’t think Pack has been on form since August. I recall that even in the win v Blackburn at start of Sept he wasn’t up to his usual standard, despite his goal. It’s a big worry as it’s the main reason for our patchy form in my view. Need to somehow find the solution. Is it a rest he needs, is the responsibility of captaincy wearing him down, or something else?

[marcofisher]

53 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Pack in a 3 would improve him I think, would help the team too.

Or as @Fuber said Hegeler behind Walsh and Brownhill in a 3- that could work too, were we to take Pack out the firing line for a bit. Think he could screen, he's sound technically but is like a lot of our more experienced players let's say, perhaps a lot of our players, ill suited to a 2.

Having two busy midfielders around him would improve him greatly I feel, would love to see Walsh and Brownhill either side of him with Eliasson and Weimann interchanging either side of Dedhiou. 

[Alessandro]

5 hours ago, ExiledAjax said:

A fair point and I accept it may be as simple as a drop in form.

I was just hypothesising as to why he's had a drop in form.

I think you my well be on to something, but surely he would have had time to adjust by now? I'm sure he has other mates in and around the club.

That reason might excuse a poor start, not a flying start and a dip. Eitherway, if it were me and I was disappointed by the move, I'd double my efforts and make sure I got it next summer....

I think Pack's dip in form has had a massive baring on the team. He was our quarterback and leader. Maybe the pressure is too much and maybe he has been 'found out' by the opposition?

It's up to him to work to adapt his game and step up again.

I often think he looks off the pace when he gets caught positionally? Not sure his defensive discipline and positioning is always as it should be. He was caught in no man's land for one Sears shot and was ambling around for their first goal, Walsh was doing a better job at tracking despite starting further up the field. With their second goal he'd made himself a third CB and then was slow to push up meaning Sears had way too much time and space to shoot when the ball fell to him.

[Davefevs]

21 minutes ago, redcherryberry said:

Mr Pop, Are you seriously considering Hegeler as an option? He hasn’t played any Chanpionship minutes since god knows when & barely plays for the U23’s. Fitness wise he would be miles behind the rest. I’m also led to believe he does more ‘coaching’ than ‘training’ during the week. He was available for transfer in the last window but their were no takers. If he isn’t gone in Jan then no doubt he’ll be released at the end of the season?!? 

A player like Hegeler would work in you’re 3 in CM but no chance it will be the man himself. 

I think he’s saying If was fully fit.  You couldn’t bring him in Sunday per se.

[Mr Popodopolous]

47 minutes ago, redcherryberry said:

Mr Pop, Are you seriously considering Hegeler as an option? He hasn’t played any Chanpionship minutes since god knows when & barely plays for the U23’s. Fitness wise he would be miles behind the rest. I’m also led to believe he does more ‘coaching’ than ‘training’ during the week. He was available for transfer in the last window but their were no takers. If he isn’t gone in Jan then no doubt he’ll be released at the end of the season?!? 

A player like Hegeler would work in you’re 3 in CM but no chance it will be the man himself. 

I should have been a tad clearer- maybe not Sunday then, was thinking ahead again. Maybe it's too late now for it to work for him here given the age, all the injuries and the lack of faith LJ has shown in him and his contract being up in the summer. Think he could have worked in a 3 or between the defence and midfield in a 4-1-4-1 but there we go.

[Major Isewater]

32 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I think he’s saying If was fully fit.  You couldn’t bring him in Sunday per se.

How's he going to get fully fit if he doesn't play ?

I'd stick him in with , as I previously wrote, Pack on the bench if needed .

He has the height, passes the ball well and is a good reader of the game , all qualities attributed to Pack .

 

[O'Garlandinho]

7 hours ago, Jack Bailey said:

Captain, midfield leader, has that magical pass in his locker and all round nice guy etc BUT he looks knackered. He is losing the ball cheaply and in bad positions, less aggressive in the tackle, sluggish in possession and passing is sideways and backwards. I cannot remember his last decent game. Marlon needs a rest to re-charge the batteries. Views?

Surely the above is how he's always been? Except he does have the odd good game.