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Our "play-style"


Spike

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3 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Forty - tell me the difference between Juniors drab play and his fathers drab play?  :dunno:

Personally I can’t see any difference which is why I ask if it’s a family trait......

and please - put me on ignore.

Your rather sad obsession with GJ does you no credit. I have pointed out to you before that in the play off final season we actually got plenty of praise from the media for our football but that doesn't suit your personal agenda.

So be it, you are entitled to your view but please do us the courtesy of not constantly repeating it. I was not much enamoured of our football under Pulis or SO'D but I don't feel the need to endlessly tell the world about it.

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15 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Forty - tell me the difference between Juniors drab play and his fathers drab play?  :dunno:

Personally I can’t see any difference which is why I ask if it’s a family trait......

and please - put me on ignore.

Number of days in a year Robbored thinks about GJ:  365 (unless it's a leap year)

Number of days in a year GJ thinks about Robbored: 0

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4 minutes ago, chinapig said:

Your rather sad obsession with GJ does you no credit. 

Not obsession chinapig.

I feel a little aggrieved that some posters are whinging about LJs style of play but when I whinged about GJ playing exactly the same way I received fearful dogs abuse........it’s not bloody fair..........:sad26:

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5 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Not obsession chinapig.

I feel a little aggrieved that some posters are whinging about LJs style of play but when I whinged about GJ playing exactly the same way I received fearful dogs abuse........it’s not bloody fair..........:sad26:

You have entirely missed my point but let's just regard this correspondence as closed and leave it at that.

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2 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Not obsession chinapig.

I feel a little aggrieved that some posters are whinging about LJs style of play but when I whinged about GJ playing exactly the same way I received fearful dogs abuse........it’s not bloody fair..........:sad26:

With the greatest respect, this thread is not about you. It is about the current manager and the style of football we play. The fact you have changed the subject to a man who has not managed the club for almost a decade and is not currently involved with the club seems purely to be to give you a window to air the fact you feel aggrieved about something that happened many years ago and is in no way relevant to this thread.

If you want to start a thread about yourself and how you are treated on these boards then I am sure you are welcome to do so on the non-football page but it strikes me as a bit rude to hijack someone else’s thread purely so you can discuss yourself.

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22 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Forty - tell me the difference between Juniors drab play and his fathers drab play?  :dunno:

Personally I can’t see any difference which is why I ask if it’s a family trait......

and please - put me on ignore.

Is it your aim to have everyone put you on ignore? maybe then your work will be done.

Fair play, will be great though when no one comments on any of your wind ups.

I'll start the ball rolling.

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18 minutes ago, OddBallJim said:

A few thoughts on today's viewing:

We are a very predictable side. I think we have enough quality about us to avoid a relegation dogfight, since we look fairly assured at the back. However, we lack the creativity or cutting-edge up front that top 10 teams possess, and for that reason I think we will languish in the mid-table. 

Dhiedhou struck a very frustrating figure with me today. His touch is clearly sharpening up, and he proved a handful for the Rotherham CBs, but he also spurned three guilt-edged chances in the second half that really, a championship quality striker should be burying. 

I was impressed with both Da Silva and Adelekun and was disappointed to see the latter of those substituted, though I warmly welcomed Taylor onto the field as it was clear we needed his industry and creativity in the final third to kick start something for us. Within seconds of being on, he played Dhiedhou into acres of space on the left flank with a first time pass. THAT is the creativity and imagination that we need in the team. I don't for one minute think Matty Taylor offers direct solutions to our lack of goals, but what he does do is create space for other players exceptionally well and moves the ball intelligently, whilst taking appropriate risks at the same time. 

Webster and Kalas looked more assured at the back, and the wide-open spaces that were exploited in our 18-yard area by Brentford didn't seem to be there today, which was reassuring - though I didn't feel that Rotherham possessed the same level of threat as Brentford and were largely uninspiring. That being said, I was very surprised by their second half showing and the robust challenges they threw in. I've never considered Rotherham a particularly dirty side, but I have no arguments over either sending off today. Whether the second one was a direct red is irrelevant - the ref warned them as a team about their challenges, and they paid no notice. 

Pack, Brownhill and Paterson isn't doing it for me in midfield. All three are clearly gifted footballers, but I'm not convinced that playing together in a central midfield three is working. Pack was exposed as lacking pace a few times today, and it feels to me as though Brownhill and Paterson try to occupy the same role/spaces, which results in neither of them being their very most effective. 

Nicki was solid in goal, as per usual. Not much more to report on that.

In summary, I can't bemoan a win too much, though I would stress that 1 goal against 9-men for me represents a very unconvincing performance and had the red cards not come, I am not convinced we would have got ourselves over the line to win that game. Our style of play is far too predictable, and we lack imagination going forward. We don't give the ball away too cheaply, though we also don't take any risks, which largely results in a dour and uninspiring brand of football on offer. 

I have honestly had it with Paterson. He is a fantastic talent who can be anything he wants to be but the issue seems to be that, for whatever reason, he does not want to push himself to meet his potential.    His presence in the team stifles other players and appears to be purely on the forlorn basis he will have his one good game in ten.

I think Johnson is right that there is a £20 million player in there but only Paterson can choose to unlock it and either does not want or is not able to do so. Even his rare good games do little more than highlight the player he could be. I honestly think we need him out to progress.

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3 hours ago, Nibor said:

Two full backs overlapping, two wide players (on their wrong feet) and one forward who's mostly defending corners or running down the wing.   What is the point in making a low percentage strategy (crossing) even worse by not having anybody in the box when we do get the ball in?  Why play Patterson instead of a second forward?

  

Because we're playing a questionable formation.

Need '3' in CM really to make the wingers and Diedhiou both effective and secure IMO.

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2 hours ago, pongo88 said:

Yes with did, but it was against 9 men after countless crosses, which had achieved nothing. As a percentage, the goals we score balanced against the number of crosses going into the box must be very small.   I’ve got to agree with @Spike ‘s comments. City’s play is so unbelievably predictable which makes the job of the opposition’s team manager’s pre-match team talk easy. All he’s got to say is “ they will play it wide then bang in a hopeful cross. Just stay in position in the box and it will be easy to head the ball away.”

Rotherham is a team in the relegation zone, with a minuscule budget, yet until the sendings off they played the best football on the ground and (IMO) looked like the likely winners 

I’m sorry, but if the opposition team talk is so darn easy why are we unbeaten in 7?

We don’t have the quality going forward. Blame LJ if you like (and perhaps the buck does lie with him) but you have to say he’s made us tough to beat. 

Good teams start with great defences. Great defences sometimes mean sacrificing forward play. 

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1 hour ago, Major Isewater said:

Yes but how many times were our crosses just swiped away by their big central defenders ?

 

Yeah I know - just being facetious.

I think we probably have a larger than average cross per game rate and I agree with others it’s not playing to our strengths right now.

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4 hours ago, JoeAman08 said:

Yes and weren’t having much luck breaking them fown through the middle either. We did try and mix it up but crosses were inevitable. Don’t mind crosses either but we didn’t vary they type enough for me. 

Thought last season we did not cross enough but do remember some goals from different types of crosses. Just a shame we got rid of Djuric and started crossing more lofted type crosses. 

Idk I don’t mind it. You can score lots of goals from crosses. Liverpool score lots from those waist high with power from Robertson, Mane or Salah. Man city scores many low on the floor ones. These are extreme examples but point for me stands. Crossing is fine but need to try to be a bit more creative in them. For example Dasilva had many chances to cross today but always opted to loft it even though he had many different crossing positions. 

You just need a striker, or someone on the move to get across the near post.  Look at Salah’s flick goal v Wolves.  Was t the greatest cross / pull-back, But Salah was on the move, and a,ways towards the near post.  Mane dies the same.  Just ping it across the box....own goals are fine (Millwall) too.

1 hour ago, chinapig said:

This is England, the belief that the way to play is to sling hopeful high balls into the box still clings on by its fingernails.

What comes to mind is Moyes, when his Man Utd side drew a game at home (to Fulham I think), bragging that they had got a record number of crosses in, as though that was an end in itself.

It seems that LJ, despite all the analysis at his disposal, has turned into a bit of a tactical dinosaur.

I was at Old Trafford for that game.  Dan Burn gobbled them up all afternoon.  And then Darren Bent headed the equaliser.  My sin neck muscles were straining in amongst the home fans! ?

1 hour ago, chinapig said:

LJ did tell us he was going to go more direct but did not explain why so I'm baffled too as it seems out of character.

As @BobBobSuperBob said, to make the best out of £5.3m spent.  I think he’s desperate to either prove he was right if give him opportunity to be saleable....to someone like Derby....and recoup as much as possible without egg on his face.  I think there is a forward in there, but not playing the way we do.

1 hour ago, OddBallJim said:

I don't for one minute think Matty Taylor offers direct solutions to our lack of goals, but what he does do is create space for other players exceptionally well and moves the ball intelligently, whilst taking appropriate risks at the same time. 

I’ve never been a great fan of MT, but as someone else said elsewhere, he cane on and first touch, made space for himself and chipped a lovely pass with his left leg into the channel for Diedhiou.

If LJ is going to persist with 4141, could MT be a reverse-Reid....a striker converted into a midfielder.  His workrate, tenacity and knowledge of where a striker wants the ball, might just work as a midfielder who can also name intelligent runs...perhaps without the pressure of everyone expecting goals from him.  I think Pato has been better of late, but he’d (MT) really “pest” the opposition midfield, there’d be no free ride in there like the some opposition get.

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12 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

You just need a striker, or someone on the move to get across the near post.  Look at Salah’s flick goal v Wolves.  Was t the greatest cross / pull-back, But Salah was on the move, and a,ways towards the near post.  Mane dies the same.  Just ping it across the box....own goals are fine (Millwall) too.

I was at Old Trafford for that game.  Dan Burn gobbled them up all afternoon.  And then Darren Bent headed the equaliser.  My sin neck muscles were straining in amongst the home fans! ?

As @BobBobSuperBob said, to make the best out of £5.3m spent.  I think he’s desperate to either prove he was right if give him opportunity to be saleable....to someone like Derby....and recoup as much as possible without egg on his face.  I think there is a forward in there, but not playing the way we do.

I’ve never been a great fan of MT, but as someone else said elsewhere, he cane on and first touch, made space for himself and chipped a lovely pass with his left leg into the channel for Diedhiou.

If LJ is going to persist with 4141, could MT be a reverse-Reid....a striker converted into a midfielder.  His workrate, tenacity and knowledge of where a striker wants the ball, might just work as a midfielder who can also name intelligent runs...perhaps without the pressure of everyone expecting goals from him.  I think Pato has been better of late, but he’d (MT) really “pest” the opposition midfield, there’d be no free ride in there like the some opposition get.

True about the striker. Fam does not have natural movement in the box. Maupay good example of good movement. Think you can find one in any window as loads of strikers out there looking to prove themselves but scouting has to be there

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Just now, JoeAman08 said:

True about the striker. Fam does not have natural movement in the box. Maupay good example of good movement. Think you can find one in any window as loads of strikers out there looking to prove themselves but scouting has to be there

That is it in a nutshell.  Ask Bob about Marriott at Luton!

There’s possibly an argument that Eisa has it, but we don’t know if the Cheltenham-Eisa morphs into a Championship-Eisa.  I would be tempted to try him on his own v Huddersfield....play the same system, with my other experiment, Taylor in CM but licence to join up (not in the same way as Pato does).

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7 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

True about the striker. Fam does not have natural movement in the box. Maupay good example of good movement. Think you can find one in any window as loads of strikers out there looking to prove themselves but scouting has to be there

Pukki (Free Transfer btw).  another - Not sure Ive seen many strikers with less movement than FD tbh

He ain’t for me

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1 hour ago, Robin101 said:

I’m sorry, but if the opposition team talk is so darn easy why are we unbeaten in 7?

We don’t have the quality going forward. Blame LJ if you like (and perhaps the buck does lie with him) but you have to say he’s made us tough to beat. 

Good teams start with great defences. Great defences sometimes mean sacrificing forward play. 

Unbeaten in 7 sounds ok until you look at the stats. City has only scored 14 goals at home in 13 matches this season, with a goal difference of +1. The recent performances against three relegation threatened teams have been dire, with City looking unlikely to win until Rotherham were reduced to 9 men. City drew against Millwall thanks to an own goal. The same against Brentford, though it was credited to Pisano. Against Rotherham it took until the 86th minute to get a goal when Rotherham had only 9 men on the pitch 

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We are slow, predictable, lack a cutting edge and as far as supporters are concerned "boring". We are trying to play a lone striker as a target man, which firstly makes no sense, plus doesn't suit Diedhiou anyway. I feel for him because he's being given a near impossible task. We put in crosses when it is just him up against 4 defenders, and no other City players in the penalty area. 

If LJ wants to ensure that we are "solid", he's going the wrong way about it, going for the equivalent of the guy who is 5ft 9in and 15 stone, slow but difficult to get around, rather than than the athletic 6ft 3in blok of the same weight, who offers more than being difficult to get past!

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2 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Pukki (Free Transfer btw).  another - Not sure Ive seen many strikers with less movement than FD tbh

He ain’t for me

I did like him because thought he had a good finish on him. That came with a bit of space and time. Think defenses have wised up to that now. He has talent so will still probably net 10-12 goals but they will come with just playing. I am with you though, seems a luxury player to me. One that would maybe do better in a better side and be a good bench option(in England could maybe do better abroad). For us however he doesn’t bring anything to the table. Doesn’t hold it up, doesn’t get in behind, isn’t particularly good in the air, doesn’t find little spaces in the box and does not really link up play. I wanted for him to push on after a slow start but seems like he will just be an average type striker who happens to be our record signing

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6 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

I did like him because thought he had a good finish on him. That came with a bit of space and time. Think defenses have wised up to that now. He has talent so will still probably net 10-12 goals but they will come with just playing. I am with you though, seems a luxury player to me. One that would maybe do better in a better side and be a good bench option(in England could maybe do better abroad). For us however he doesn’t bring anything to the table. Doesn’t hold it up, doesn’t get in behind, isn’t particularly good in the air, doesn’t find little spaces in the box and does not really link up play. I wanted for him to push on after a slow start but seems like he will just be an average type striker who happens to be our record signing

Really not sure how you get the best out of him Joe, that’s what would concern me

We are very reliant on him having a decent game if we want a decent team performance 

 

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3 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Really not sure how you get the best out of him Joe, that’s what would concern me

We are very reliant on him having a decent game if we want a decent team performance 

 

From what I have seen of him in person and in highlights is he is more of a counter attack player. That might not be the best description but he needed more space. He likes running off defenders initially and when they catch him up he takes them 1v1. So in a quicker paced team but perhaps not a possesion one.

Especially now that we have become more respected, think lots of teams gameplan to sit back on us a bit more. So he struggles. Whereas he looked good against Derby, WBA and Norwich because we had less of the ball but they left spaces in defense in their pursuit of goals. 

Not sure if we can get more out of him in games like today. Just not his natural game but will be 70% of our games. We need a striker in Jan. Not a complimentary one either. If not, we will be ok but bo chance at pushing up the table

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8 hours ago, Alessandro said:

Did we just score from a cross?

So do you legitimaly think we're scoring more goals using a crossing style over say last season where we were less predictable? 

Honestly, I would love to see how many crosses we put in today and then compare that to the single goal it provided. We had 13 corners and I'd hazard a guess of 15-25 crosses in open play, even taking the lowest estimate that's one goal from 28 crosses 38 at worst end of that estimate. Do you really think that's a viable goal to cross ratio who are focusing their whole game around crossing?! 

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8 hours ago, KeepUpLino said:

LJ hasn’t got a clue what’s he’s doing, boring shithouse football that’s sucking every last ounce of Enjoyment out of the match day experience... Not for me thanks!!

When the goal went in ive never seen so many people still sat in their seats and not cheering!! Says it all.

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11 hours ago, Robbored said:

Senior won lots more games Tone but it was still like watching paint dry.............:sleeping:

Take your point Robbo but sometimes results need to be ground out. It would be nice to win pretty but Liverpool, Spurs or Man City we ain't.

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