Irony

[reddoh]

18 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

Don’t remember Joe saying that....

Sorry forgot to use the Scottish accent.

[Bazooka Joe]

Calling people "morons" (from the safety of your keyboard) ain't gonna win you any friends.

These people are fellow-Reds whose opinions simply differ to yours.

I presume those with "reasonable views" are enlightened posters that agree with you.

This would be a bloody boring forum if we all thought and said the same.

[Bazooka Joe]

ForeverRes if I were you, I'd stop posting on this topic.

The hole you've dug is getting ever deeper.

Move on.

[IAmNick]

2 hours ago, ForeverRes said:

People keep replying with "but the football is really poor blah blah blah". 

I'm not arguing that the football is good. 

I'm saying people last season were saying they'd take Warnock over Johnson, despite poor football.

The same ones are now whining because of the poor football. Which is fair enough. But I just find it ironic.

Anyone want to challenge me on what I'm actually saying? Rather than twisting it into their favour 

I think you have a bit of a misunderstanding over what people mean - and I'm not someone who particularly wanted Warnock last year, although I am not a Johnson fan either. In my view, there are two major differences with the "poor" football comment you're talking about.

Firstly when you hire Warnock, you know what you're getting... it's not pretty, but it works. Maybe that's what you call "poor" football, as it's undeniably not for the purists - free flowing busy bees through the thirds (someone get the vomit bag), but that also doesn't mean it can't be very entertaining and exciting - and talking to Cardiff fans I know, they were very entertained last year. It's quick, it's aggressive, it scores goals, and their players end up at 90m blowing out their arses for the team. There is a large difference there with what we're currently getting... ours is also not free flowing for the purists, but it's also not quick, or aggressive, and it's not entertaining in the slightest. Both "poor" football - yes, maybe. But still very different.

Secondly, as far as I'm aware, Warnock was made manager of Cardiff at the start of the 2016-2017 season, and at the end of the 2017-2018 season they were automatically promoted to the premier league. Lee was made our manager getting on for three years ago now, and around eight months before Warnock arrived at Cardiff. That's fine - and we were sold a grand vision so we all knew it would take time. Well it has been a fair bit of time, and I'm not really seeing this vision coming to fruition. I understood the football may not be great at the start as Lee had his windows and coached his team, and brought in our young exciting academy players - that's perfectly fine, and even laudable. However three years later there is now scant reflection of this grand vision on the pitch. I would expect that after this time with the squad, we would at LEAST be starting to see the vision of Lee Johnson's Bristol City appearing, which we thought we had this time last year. But, instead, all we have is "poor" football, and nothing more.

Yesterday, our young, academy prospect stuffed group of busy bees had an average age of 25.18 years - by the way, I believe our youngest player is also a loan so we don't even own him. Boring old Rotherham's average age was 25.45 years, so less than 0.3 more than us. Rotherham were more energetic, had a better game plan which they executed more competently, and in my opinion looked more likely until having two players sent off.

It all comes down to expectation and execution, with Warnock you get "poor" but exciting, aggressive, attacking football that gets results - he knows that, and he wont tell you anything else. With Lee, you get sold the world, but you end up with "poor" but boring, pedestrian football which isn't really getting results - I believe our last 10 games (including our entire "run") is W3, D4, L3. I believe that's around 60 points over a season, or mid table. Wow.

There is a difference in "poor" football, it's far too broad to use in the way you have - and calling people morons at the same time when you don't understand this is just bizarre. For the record as I said, I am not a big fan of either Warnock, or Johnson. 

 

 

 

[Red-Robbo]

Although the football wasn't wonderful, I did quite enjoy yesterday. There were moments of class - from both sides to be fair - and who doesn't enjoy seeing a dirty opponent get a red? 

For a lot of the match, there was an ebb and flow to the game, and I felt - unlike on Boxing Day - the players were all trying - and it was entertaining.

I've got to be honest, I don't go to AG to see 100% silky skills and the best players in the world. You can watch all that on telly. There's something more visceral to watching your team play live. Frustration, nagging fear, anger, elation - they are all part of the mix that makes football what it is.

[Leveller]

4 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

I’m waiting for @Leveller to comment on this thread

 Morons........

Interested in your views  Leveller......you’re not keen on insults ........are you..........

 

No, I’m not. Though he didn’t name any individuals, just a generalised rant.

[BobBobSuperBob]

17 minutes ago, Leveller said:

No, I’m not. Though he didn’t name any individuals, just a generalised rant.

Shall I point out a few more personalised ones you appear to have missed ?

[Davefevs]

5 hours ago, Olé said:

A couple of chances? Are you aware the final shot tally was 22-18 in our favour, yet at least half of ours came in the final ten minutes after they were down to nine men.

Not just my memory, you can go and check the text commentary sites and see the list of shots we had at the very end, which made the statistics much more flattering.

But this means for the majority of the game Rotherham created more chances than us, exactly as I saw it. Also note nearly half our shots were from outside the box too.

Again, exactly as I saw it, and as it always is - where Rotherham (yes Rotherham) carved through us, we were reduced to pot shots. In the circumstances, yes outplayed.

This helps prove your point;

I’m guessing the big vertical on 90 minutes is Weimann’s chance (which might’ve been offside????).

5 hours ago, cidered abroad said:

I can assure you that Rotherham did not "Sit Back".

After the two red cards, yes. But before that, I thought they looked a well organized side, similar to Brentford a few days earlier. One part of their game stood out for me. Their throw ins went to their players and they the kept ball much longer than we do from throws with our standard one of  "throw it up the line to Diedhiou", marked by two defenders and the ball immediately ends up with the other team.

We can't right even get basic things like that.

It is a big bug-bear of mine.  Even at the levels I played, we knew how to block runners to create the throw to the free-man.  In fact Pato is about the only one who looks like he knows how to do it.  Against Cardiff last season...a team you expect to bombard you with long throws...it amazed me hiw many times they were able to get a short throw into feet, and either play back to the thrower or filter the ball inside.  It ain’t that difficult....least of all for pro’s who can practice pretty much every scenario.

[Leveller]

1 hour ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Shall I point out a few more personalised ones you appear to have missed ?

Feel free. I don’t live on here. I probably only look at 25% of the threads on OTIB and 5% of all the posts.

[Mr Popodopolous]

On 29/12/2018 at 23:25, paul_fox said:

And he only needed 2-3 transfer windows to get "his" team up. Something Lee was happy blab on about when joining, he still hasn't managed to put together a team 

He also had parachute payments- Year 3 and Year 4 of them...that helped.

I'm not discrediting him at all, think he did very well there and is still over and above expectations there now, most definitely- but cannot deny parachute payments would have helped IMO.

[Mr Popodopolous]

On 30/12/2018 at 00:58, Up The City! said:

I went to the game expecting at least a 3 nil win so I'm disappointed especially after they only had 9 players.

HOWEVER,

Considering our home form has been shite and it's been god knows how long since a home win I will take that win just to get that monkey off of our backs.

Really? Rotherham don't get turned over and haven't been turned over often on the road often this year.

Better sides than us haven't thrashed them on their travels- that was a tad optimistic wasn't it?? Think they lost 5-1 at Brentford on the opening day (when Brentford were good) but beyond that...

[Up The City!]

2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Really? Rotherham don't get turned over and haven't been turned over often on the road often this year.

Better sides than us haven't thrashed them on their travels- that was a tad optimistic wasn't it?? Think they lost 5-1 at Brentford on the opening day (when Brentford were good) but beyond that...

To be brutally honest I've not followed the fortunes of Rotherham, all I know is they are at the bottom and we should be beating teams of Rotherhams status and position comfortably.

But this is Bristol City, we always seem to perform well against the bigger sides but struggle in the games we should win comfortably.

[Mr Popodopolous]

10 minutes ago, Up The City! said:

To be brutally honest I've not followed the fortunes of Rotherham, all I know is they are at the bottom and we should be beating teams of Rotherhams status and position comfortably.

But this is Bristol City, we always seem to perform well against the bigger sides but struggle in the games we should win comfortably.

I do look at the opposition often before a game- that's part of the reason I had us down as a draw v Brentford for example- noted number of home draws for us, away draws for them? About 40%, perhaps a bit more probability I estimated.

hat's not how it tends to work in this League. I had a feeling 2 goal win tops for us.

Taking a look at their (Rotherham's) results in more detail. Putting aside their thrashing at Brentford, they conceded 25% of their away goals (4 out of 16- excluding yesterday too) in the last 10 mins. In hindsight, a game of patience makes a bit more sense when looked at in that context.

[Fpcity]

7 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

He also had parachute payments- Year 3 and Year 4 of them...that helped.

I'm not discrediting him at all, think he did very well there and is still over and above expectations there now, most definitely- but cannot deny parachute payments would have helped IMO.

Yes but I don't think they spent more than us on fees? Maybe a few earn more but that would be the free transfers like Bamba and Hoilett? 

[Judda]

On 29/12/2018 at 23:40, AppyDAZE said:

2-3?  it's you, he meant 23

The worry is he may actually get 23!

[BS4 on Tour...]

2 hours ago, Judda said:

The worry is he may actually get 23!

He probably will....I’ve never known so many fellow season ticket holders seriously thinking of not renewing next season...it should be a big worry to those in power at our club...it’s just not a very enjoyable day out at the moment...back in the day there was little else to do but now there are a zillion other alternatives to football...better things to do which are more fun....and I fear our ST sales in the new year will not be very buoyant as there is definitely an air of apathy that can be detected amongst the crowd...a real lack of interest and enthusiasm. 

The rhetoric coming from the club isn’t helping, it’s almost as though they don’t credit us with any real understanding or intelligence as supporters...this ‘strategy’ they wang on about, and the laughable terms thrown around during interviews, it’s just wearing people down, including some of the players evidently...other clubs don’t pussyfoot around and take tiny tentative steps to move forward at a snail’s pace, they make bold decisions and move on much more quickly than we do....and some reap the rewards....we haven’t competed at the top level of English football for nearly 40 years...and the patience amongst many long-standing supporters is wearing very thin....

[1bristolcity]

On 30/12/2018 at 08:57, ForeverRes said:

@Olé

You seem to have a lot of respect on this forum, not sure why. 

You change your mind and opinions every week.

Its embarrassing to read at times

He very much instigates negativity towards the team on here, which satisfies all the the other miserable sods on here that  have an agenda to oust LJ. He and his mates are very much a minority, but they shout down others so it really becomes a bit skewed toward them I am afraid, anyone like your goodself comes under scrutiny, like how often you post and any lay off's you might have had, etc , in fact he called it spooky that you didn't post for some time.

I was celebrating a win on Saturday, he was replying with negative reactions, which need I say more? 

Happy New To You and all City fans. 

 

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 hours ago, paul_fox said:

Yes but I don't think they spent more than us on fees? Maybe a few earn more but that would be the free transfers like Bamba and Hoilett? 

Without the parachute payments, they would have had to have slashed the wage bill I'd have thought. Anyway, agree to disagree.

[Bob Turnip]

On 29/12/2018 at 22:49, ForeverRes said:

I find it amusing how the same fans on here were saying last season they'd take Warnock and his awful football over Johnson.

Yet they are on here saying "I don't care about the win or the 7 game unbeaten streak, the football is awful". 

Prove that the same people said both. 

[Davefevs]

36 minutes ago, 1bristolcity said:

He very much instigates negativity towards the team on here, which satisfies all the the other miserable sods on here that  have an agenda to oust LJ. He and his mates are very much a minority, but they shout down others so it really becomes a bit skewed toward them I am afraid, anyone like your goodself comes under scrutiny, like how often you post and any lay off's you might have had, etc , in fact he called it spooky that you didn't post for some time.

I was celebrating a win on Saturday, he was replying with negative reactions, which need I say more? 

Happy New To You and all City fans. 

 

 

Ole pretty much does match reviews (fine ones too), so I would take it as a compliment that his view changes every week....our performances aren’t the same....it shows a lack of pre-conceived bias....and his ability to review each game in isolation.

Did you see ALL positives v Rotherham?

[NickJ]

On 30/12/2018 at 10:28, ForeverRes said:

It's subjective. 

Objective is the use of numbers 

Subjective is ones opinion 

You are wrong. Nothing to do with numbers:

objective

/əbˈdʒɛktɪv/

adjective

1.

(of a person or their judgement) not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts.

"historians try to be objective and impartial"

synonyms:

impartial, unbiased, unprejudiced, non-partisan, disinterested, non-discriminatory, neutral, uninvolved, even-handed, equitable, fair, fair-minded, just, open-minded, dispassionate, detached, impersonal, unemotional, clinical "an interviewer must try to be objective"

antonyms:

biased, partial, prejudiced

• not dependent on the mind for existence; actual.

  "a matter of objective fact"

  synonyms:

  factual, actual, real, empirical, verifiable, existing, manifest "the world of objective knowledge"

  antonyms:

  subjective

[Olé]

3 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

I’ve never known so many fellow season ticket holders seriously thinking of not renewing next season...it should be a big worry to those in power at our club...

I must admit I've heard this from quite a few too - I tend to take it with a pinch of salt as you get these threats every season, but two things stand out for me, a) I know of several people saying it who have already started to miss games in favour of doing other things, and b) this is coming right after the hassle before this season when prices went up after a poor finish and people were made to feel unwelcome in certain parts of the ground, and were displaced to elsewhere. So it's perfectly possible people renewed at a premium, or in a new location, but were less than happy with the situation, and this quality of football at home will make their minds up for next season.

2 hours ago, 1bristolcity said:

He very much instigates negativity towards the team on here

Think you've got the wrong person boss. Nothing in your post corresponds to anything I've said and I rarely if ever come on OTIB on a Saturday when we play at home. But using your post as an example, I am struck by the poor reputation OTIB has ("everyone moans") which is worth a comment as I think it's sad if people have that view, although I've never held it myself. To me OTIB is just a more developed discussion than any other medium offers, which inevitably means greater weight of comment on bad things. Like most things nuance is required and the reality is usually somewhere in the middle, the problem being that positive comment generates very little debate.

[BobBobSuperBob]

3 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Ole pretty much does match reviews (fine ones too), so I would take it as a compliment that his view changes every week....our performances aren’t the same....it shows a lack of pre-conceived bias....and his ability to review each game in isolation.

Did you see ALL positives v Rotherham?

He didn’t see ANYTHING  

 

He never gets within 30 miles of AG

 

[Natchfever]

On 29/12/2018 at 22:49, ForeverRes said:

I find it amusing how the same fans on here were saying last season they'd take Warnock and his awful football over Johnson.

Yet they are on here saying "I don't care about the win or the 7 game unbeaten streak, the football is awful". 

I know what you lot are gunna say "but Cardiff actually got promoted". Yeh you're right, and I don't think City will this year, but it's just rather ironic.

You lot really are a bunch of morons.

Ive never seen a set of fans so negative about a team 7 unbeaten. The football isn't great, but I find that quite funny how we're not playing great and getting results! I've seen many years where we played good football and lost every week (Johnsons first full year comes to mind). 

To those with reasonable views, happy with the win today and good to continue the unbeaten run. Bring on 2019, I'm confident the football will improve! Don't think it will bring promotion this year, but what a league to be involved with! 

Up the City

Please feel free to **** off you trolling ***.

Happy new year.

[1bristolcity]

On 30/12/2018 at 08:57, ForeverRes said:

@Olé

You seem to have a lot of respect on this forum, not sure why. 

You change your mind and opinions every week.

Its embarrassing to read at times

 

4 hours ago, Olé said:

I must admit I've heard this from quite a few too - I tend to take it with a pinch of salt as you get these threats every season, but two things stand out for me, a) I know of several people saying it who have already started to miss games in favour of doing other things, and b) this is coming right after the hassle before this season when prices went up after a poor finish and people were made to feel unwelcome in certain parts of the ground, and were displaced to elsewhere. So it's perfectly possible people renewed at a premium, or in a new location, but were less than happy with the situation, and this quality of football at home will make their minds up for next season.

Think you've got the wrong person boss. Nothing in your post corresponds to anything I've said and I rarely if ever come on OTIB on a Saturday when we play at home. But using your post as an example, I am struck by the poor reputation OTIB has ("everyone moans") which is worth a comment as I think it's sad if people have that view, although I've never held it myself. To me OTIB is just a more developed discussion than any other medium offers, which inevitably means greater weight of comment on bad things. Like most things nuance is required and the reality is usually somewhere in the middle, the problem being that positive comment generates very little debate.

I did Ole, I somehow got you mixed up wit the one that goes by the name of a true City Legend....that is true irony.

Apologies.

[1bristolcity]

3 hours ago, Loon plage said:

Please feel free to **** off you trolling ***.

Happy new year.

Perfectly good sensible post,  why the aggression?  

[1bristolcity]

3 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

He didn’t see ANYTHING  

 

He never gets within 30 miles of AG

 

Again you make wild assumptions about people or detail you know nothing about, LJ had a heart to heart with you, apparently, and you couldn't wait to stab him in the back on here,  that takes

some two faced balls, even for you. FWIW I was at AG before you were born, even moved back to Bristol when they were promoted to Div 1, went to every match I could home and away for many years, and all through that good and bad times I NEVER turned in on the manager(s) or players, because it was loyalty, just blind loyalty, but you are a rabble rouser, a trouble maker with a capital T, and yet you bring into doubt on here that somehow I and others that call you out are less of a supporter than you.

That's Irony.... HAPPY NEW YEAR !!!

 

[downendcity]

3 hours ago, Loon plage said:

Please feel free to **** off you trolling ***.

Happy new year.

A different slant on the normal seasonal greeting!