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Marlon Pack


TammyAB

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5 minutes ago, TammyAB said:

Seeing a fair few saying he was poor today? I thought he was one of our top performers, did the dirty work and made us tick!

Game of opinions and all that.

Thought he was given a bit of freedom, was decent today.  Rarely dropped in to get the ball from CBs in our own third....might’ve done it on halfway line, but that’s fine.

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3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Thought he was given a bit of freedom, was decent today.  Rarely dropped in to get the ball from CBs in our own third....might’ve done it on halfway line, but that’s fine.

No ones mentioned it Dave - I thought you might have

What did you make of JP dropping into Packs role ? on a number of occasions - bizarre to see him drop in between Kals & Webster !!!!

Clearly a plan or tweak to change something 

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6 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Thought he was given a bit of freedom, was decent today.  Rarely dropped in to get the ball from CBs in our own third....might’ve done it on halfway line, but that’s fine.

I did notice that. Both he and Josh both dropped deep less than usual. Also they seemed to do it between Hunt and Kalas when they did. Almost making a back 3 with Kalas central and Pack right. No need to get the ball off Webster. Was nice to see

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2 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

No ones mentioned it Dave - I thought you might have

What did you make of JP dropping into Packs role ? on a number of occasions - bizarre to see him drop in between Kals & Webster !!!!

Clearly a plan or tweak to change something 

Pack’s heatmap 10-15 yards further forward (guesstimate).

Yes, I did notice.  The only problem was it leaves Diedhiou very isolated in early passage of play, if we want / have to go long.

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1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

Pack’s heatmap 10-15 yards further forward (guesstimate).

Yes, I did notice.  The only problem was it leaves Diedhiou very isolated in early passage of play, if we want / have to go long.

I couldn’t work out what the plan was , there clearly was one - I initially thought to give the hall to JP to travel at them from deep but that wasn’t it .....

Not sure I’ve ever seen him do that before 

Had to double take it was him the first time

(Maybe triple take - I am undecided whether it’s better to watch with or without my glasses so do a 50/50 split ! ? - When the bloke next to me came back after half time he asked us f there were any changes and I said ‘Matty Taylor’s On ‘.    and  pointed to .........JB ??)

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7 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

I couldn’t work out what the plan was , there clearly was one - I initially thought to give the hall to JP to travel at them from deep but that wasn’t it .....

Not sure I’ve ever seen him do that before 

Had to double take it was him the first time

(Maybe triple take - I am undecided whether it’s better to watch with or without my glasses so do a 50/50 split ! ? - When the bloke next to me came back after half time he asked us f there were any changes and I said ‘Matty Taylor’s On ‘.    and  pointed to .........JB ??)

I can only guess that the plan was that to drag the guy designated to mark Pato away from the DM role to create more space for COD and Weimann and possibly Brownhill to operate between their CBs and the rest of their midfield....and also funnel balls into Diedhiou.  In some respects it worked, Diedhiou didn’t have a DM picking up loose touches back towards our midfield.

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32 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

No ones mentioned it Dave - I thought you might have

What did you make of JP dropping into Packs role ? on a number of occasions - bizarre to see him drop in between Kals & Webster !!!!

Clearly a plan or tweak to change something 

I couldn't quite believe it either when Paterson collected the ball between our centre backs. Certainly a different approach from recent games (Pato does roam deep quite often, but up until today not that deep). Made me a bit nervous!

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4 minutes ago, JasonM88 said:

Strange how pack and brownhill both appear to play in diagonals. Pack from the LB area to RW area, and Josh from RB area to LW area. 

The positive thing for Pack is that brighter shaded green blob over the halfway line....we haven’t seen him heat up that area for weeks and weeks.  The lighter green blob in our half is what we e typically seen.

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What @JonDolman said. Pack is getting into the habit now of misplacing relatively simple passes directly to the opposition. Game after game. Without fail. He's not having a good season and at times when you see other players looking more composed you do wonder if Pack's City career is catching up with him as the overall standard of our other players improves.

He is certainly not poor, so what I'm saying is all simply relative, but yesterday to me he was our weakest link and if you want to keep improving you need to upgrade in those areas. It was actually Paterson who  gave the eyes and played a delightful return pass in our best move of the first half (of the type we expect from Pack) whereas Pack's passing range was off.   

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1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

Pack has really struggled this season imo. He does not look in the same class as a number of those players when passing in triangles. I gave him a 5 out of 10 yesterday. I have been very positive about his performances in the past. But I have to say what I'm seeing. Too many misplaced passes and too many bad decisions. He has to turn and go back too often as he hasn't the skill to move it forward. It will be interesting to see what happens if Korey returns the same player. I have read a few comments saying Korey struggled when returning last time from a long injury. Well he didn't at all. He came straight back in and was as good as ever. And with our interest in another defensive midfielder in Williams, will Pack be in our side by Feb. I'm not so sure. LJ has always liked his sharp, mobile midfielders.

 

57 minutes ago, Olé said:

What @JonDolman said. Pack is getting into the habit now of misplacing relatively simple passes directly to the opposition. Game after game. Without fail. He's not having a good season and at times when you see other players looking more composed you do wonder if Pack's City career is catching up with him as the overall standard of our other players improves.

He is certainly not poor, so what I'm saying is all simply relative, but yesterday to me he was our weakest link and if you want to keep improving you need to upgrade in those areas. It was actually Paterson who  gave the eyes and played a delightful return pass in our best move of the first half (of the type we expect from Pack) whereas Pack's passing range was off.   

Both on the money with this for me. In the last 20 minutes, under no pressure, 3 times Pack hit 20 yard forward passes straight to Bolton players allowing them to come at us. Can only surmise that we were looking at Williams as an upgrade on Pack. Then there is Korey to come back and Morell developing nicely. Along with Pato, Pack is our weakest link these days. 

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7 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Pack’s heatmap 10-15 yards further forward (guesstimate).

Yes, I did notice.  The only problem was it leaves Diedhiou very isolated in early passage of play, if we want / have to go long.

And is exactly what happened when it went to 2-1, long balls to Fam on his own, he was being constantly fouled but was getting nothing from the ref and so the ball kept coming back.

I still think for a big lad Fam is easily bullied by a center half who is prepared to take chances with the ref. Wheater being a perfect example of that.

Having said that had Fam won some of these balls there was nobody close to him, found that odd and against a better side we could have been punished.

I thought at 2-1 the game management was not the best.

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1 hour ago, Olé said:

What @JonDolman said. Pack is getting into the habit now of misplacing relatively simple passes directly to the opposition. Game after game. Without fail. He's not having a good season and at times when you see other players looking more composed you do wonder if Pack's City career is catching up with him as the overall standard of our other players improves.

He is certainly not poor, so what I'm saying is all simply relative, but yesterday to me he was our weakest link and if you want to keep improving you need to upgrade in those areas. It was actually Paterson who  gave the eyes and played a delightful return pass in our best move of the first half (of the type we expect from Pack) whereas Pack's passing range was off.   

Starting to come to a similar conclusion Ole.

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8 hours ago, JoeAman08 said:

Thought he was ok. Not as bad as some of his performances this season but nowhere near his best from the start of the season. Good hard work today and part of the winning side. Was 7/10 for me as were most

Both Pack and Webster made too many passes that went straight to opponents.

Unusual for Webster but it's become too often for Pack.

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I agree with @Olé with the exception of the bit about his poor form being the result of improvements around the squad. 

I think he suffers simply because he desperately needs a rest for a couple of weeks. Injuries to Smith and Walsh mean that isn't possible, but perhaps a brave choice against a team that needed unlocking would have been to rest Pack and play Morrell. 

I also don't think it helps him that at times the movement in front of him is desperately poor, although that may be a chicken/egg situation with how slow he is to move the ball on at the moment. 

 

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22 minutes ago, Chris_Brown said:

I agree with @Olé with the exception of the bit about his poor form being the result of improvements around the squad. 

I think he suffers simply because he desperately needs a rest for a couple of weeks. Injuries to Smith and Walsh mean that isn't possible, but perhaps a brave choice against a team that needed unlocking would have been to rest Pack and play Morrell. 

I also don't think it helps him that at times the movement in front of him is desperately poor, although that may be a chicken/egg situation with how slow he is to move the ball on at the moment. 

 

Interesting angle. Maybe it is that simple, but I thought they were very scientific at Failand at measuring fatigue? In a game like this, against weak opposition, with the run we are on, and confidence high, you would have expected Pack to boss it. Maybe LJ wants him on the pitch for his leadership qualities?

 

 

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The problem has been clear to me for a while.  With Korey playing as a ball winning midfielder, Marlon has a bit more time and freedom.  It is no coincidence that his form appears to have dropped off since his injury.  It was also noticeable last season in games when Korey didn't play or had to play at right back.

Hopefully, the problem will be resolved soon, but that will create another, i.e. who to drop when Korey Smith comes back.

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2 hours ago, ScottishRed said:

And is exactly what happened when it went to 2-1, long balls to Fam on his own, he was being constantly fouled but was getting nothing from the ref and so the ball kept coming back.

I still think for a big lad Fam is easily bullied by a center half who is prepared to take chances with the ref. Wheater being a perfect example of that.

Having said that had Fam won some of these balls there was nobody close to him, found that odd and against a better side we could have been punished.

I thought at 2-1 the game management was not the best.

I don’t believe it’s a question of Fam being ‘ bullied ‘ just a difference of culture from the one he grew up playing .

Refs in this country don’t give fouls so easily as in France.

He and Pack  were taking some heavy tackles during the game and just got up and kept at it .

 

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I wonder if Pack was playing higher up because his strength was required against a more physical team - kind of building on the opinion that Patterson was being used to pull their players out of position

I agree there have been a number of misplaced passes, he did set some incredibly high standards last year - if it were anyone else, we’d be suggesting complacency due to the lack of competition. His leadership qualities, as @hoxton casual pointed out must be key.

I’m a huge Pack fan, I do think his ability, when someone takes the pressure off, far outweighs the draw backs of sacrificing another midfielder to have someone in there (ala Smith). In the future, Walsh could however develop into a player who can operate under pressure and do the dirty work; hopefully the Smith/Pack/Borwnhill combo can encourage this development 

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