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Leeds Emergency Press Conference 5pm


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38 minutes ago, Septic Peg said:

 

Who's our spy then? Everyone saying it goes on everywhere and at every club. I reckon ours is this dodgy fella. No idea who he is... 

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Don't recognise the fella but seem to recall he used to win the football pools a lot...

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Would everyone feel the same if this Leeds employee was caught spying in the game leading up to our game v them? Highly doubtful.

Yes clubs do allow people to watch PARTS of a training session, when doing tactical, set pieces, or when the starting 11 is clearly being shown, only club officials are allowed on site. So when this person did get caught it was a ‘closed’ training session, gaining an unfair advantage? Most certainly.

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12 minutes ago, BCFC11 said:

Would everyone feel the same if this Leeds employee was caught spying in the game leading up to our game v them? Highly doubtful.

Yes clubs do allow people to watch PARTS of a training session, when doing tactical, set pieces, or when the starting 11 is clearly being shown, only club officials are allowed on site. So when this person did get caught it was a ‘closed’ training session, gaining an unfair advantage? Most certainly.

Spot on.

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26 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

He quoted a number of Derby games this season and provided examples too though.

Gave analysis on Man Utd v Derby, Derby v us and Chelsea v Derby. Think he's pretty big on this side of the game etc.

Oh I'd expect it this season, absolutely, and that intricately. If he wants to tell me 23 clubsx 51 games last year x4hours plus the games this year, I'm saying 'bullshit'. If that's true, basically he's admitting he has f all impact because you can look at Leeds last year to counter them. 

This is nothing more than a PR exercise imho. Totally staged. Impressive none the less. But look even Man Utd showed you don't have to be sooo intricate; on the weekend they basically gave away we saw wide strikers against attacking fullbacks was there kryptonite and from there containment. That doesn't require the analysis Bielsa is blagging they pull out. 

And then, all this data Bielsa is looking at, absorbing it for not only his next game but what the next 3 because he needs to pick with the short term future in mind... he is 100% chatting bollox to my mind. He's basically trying to minimise the impact of the spying because look at all this data I have anyway even putting that aside. 

Like I said, if he could do that on Bristol City, Rotherham, Ipswich, Reading tomorrow I'll accept I'm wrong. He won't, I'm sure because he can't, and only doing so would convince me this hasn't been prepared for the presser. 

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1 minute ago, 29AR said:

Oh I'd expect it this season, absolutely, and that intricately. If he wants to tell me 23 clubsx 51 games last year x4hours plus the games this year, I'm saying 'bullshit'. If that's true, basically he's admitting he has f all impact because you can look at Leeds last year to counter them. 

This is nothing more than a PR exercise imho. Totally staged. Impressive none the less. But look even Man Utd showed you don't have to be sooo intricate; on the weekend they basically gave away we saw wide strikers against attacking fullbacks was there kryptonite and from there containment. That doesn't require the analysis Bielsa is blagging they pull out. 

And then, all this data Bielsa is looking at, absorbing it for not only his next game but what the next 3 because he needs to pick with the short term future in mind... he is 100% chatting bollox to my mind. He's basically trying to minimise the impact of the spying because look at all this data I have anyway even putting that aside. 

Like I said, if he could do that on Bristol City, Rotherham, Ipswich, Reading tomorrow I'll accept I'm wrong. He won't, I'm sure because he can't, and only doing so would convince me this hasn't been prepared for the presser. 

I'm on the fence about the depth of his research. He has form for it elsewhere- I think it possible it happened, maybe it partly depends on how big their scouting and analysis department is too.

Wouldn't agree- Leeds last year were vastly different to Leeds under Bielsa. He has quite significantly improved a number of players- I reckon he's a bit of an obsessive though, not all managers are to that extent. He condenses it into about 10-15 mins per opponent as players as I guess we all do waver after a long time watching.

.https://www.foxsportsasia.com/football/1021321/you-know-more-than-me-bielsas-barcelona-research-surprised-guardiola/

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4 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I'm on the fence about the depth of his research. He has form for it elsewhere- I think it possible it happened, maybe it partly depends on how big their scouting and analysis department is too.

Wouldn't agree- Leeds last year were vastly different to Leeds under Bielsa. He has quite significantly improved a number of players- I reckon he's a bit of an obsessive though, not all managers are to that extent. He condenses it into about 10-15 mins per opponent as players as I guess we all do waver after a long time watching.

.https://www.foxsportsasia.com/football/1021321/you-know-more-than-me-bielsas-barcelona-research-surprised-guardiola/

For me it comes to simple maths. Every champ team played at least 48 games last year (46 league, 2 cups). Multiple that by 23, multiple that by 4 hours a game. Talking 4,500 hours. Times that by 1.5 as we are hald way through a season and he's looking this year too, perhaps more closely this year as it's of relevance. Most people., including (relatively) poorly paid analysts will do a 35 hour week. Even if he had 10 analysts, we are talking 6 months of work before it even starts getting compounded. It just doesn't seem remotely plausible... to me. 

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41 minutes ago, spudski said:

We are...just as much, if not more.

Of course - all clubs do it.

LJ and his coaching staff know all there is to know about every regular Championship player they face. It’s in every clubs interest to do their necessary homework on opposition players. All their strengths and weaknesses along with the favoured formation and tactics of the manager.

All of Citys regular first teamers will be known to every other club  It’s common practice.

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Was it morally okay to do? Probably not. Did he break any rules in doing it? Definitely not. (As far as I can tell anyway). 

In which case I can't see that the EFL/FA can do FA about it. If the 'spy' trespassed (sp) then the police could have done something but seems they ain't so just a moral issue. Let's be honest, morals went out of football a long time ago.

 

 

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1 minute ago, arrytheb said:

Was it morally okay to do? Probably not. Did he break any rules in doing it? Definitely not. (As far as I can tell anyway). 

In which case I can't see that the EFL/FA can do FA about it. If the 'spy' trespassed (sp) then the police could have done something but seems they ain't so just a moral issue. Let's be honest, morals went out of football a long time ago.

  

 

You're not wrong there.

What made me laugh was Jenas going on about a points deduction on the Saturday and then talking about how Bournemouth should have got in the refs face Sunday evening on MOTD2. 

Interesting (football) moral compass he has.

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7 minutes ago, arrytheb said:

Was it morally okay to do? Probably not. Did he break any rules in doing it? Definitely not. (As far as I can tell anyway). 

In which case I can't see that the EFL/FA can do FA about it. If the 'spy' trespassed (sp) then the police could have done something but seems they ain't so just a moral issue. Let's be honest, morals went out of football a long time ago.

 

 

Just to be facetious, trespass is a civil wrong not a crime. 'Trespassers will be prosecuted' as misleading a sign as that brexit bus. 

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10 minutes ago, 29AR said:

For me it comes to simple maths. Every champ team played at least 48 games last year (46 league, 2 cups). Multiple that by 23, multiple that by 4 hours a game. Talking 4,500 hours. Times that by 1.5 as we are hald way through a season and he's looking this year too, perhaps more closely this year as it's of relevance. Most people., including (relatively) poorly paid analysts will do a 35 hour week. Even if he had 10 analysts, we are talking 6 months of work before it even starts getting compounded. It just doesn't seem remotely plausible... to me. 

Ha

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24 minutes ago, 29AR said:

For me it comes to simple maths. Every champ team played at least 48 games last year (46 league, 2 cups). Multiple that by 23, multiple that by 4 hours a game. Talking 4,500 hours. Times that by 1.5 as we are hald way through a season and he's looking this year too, perhaps more closely this year as it's of relevance. Most people., including (relatively) poorly paid analysts will do a 35 hour week. Even if he had 10 analysts, we are talking 6 months of work before it even starts getting compounded. It just doesn't seem remotely plausible... to me. 

10 - they've got hundreds!

 

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8 minutes ago, downendcity said:

10 - they've got hundreds!

 

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Well, then there is that. One man's qualitative interpretation v another's, then there is absorbing that data, selecting your team, imparting that knowledge in your players in enough time for them to leave training at midday to get a round of golf in or media or or or community visits whilst also working on fitness and their own plays to counter the opposition... in this presser, in my opinion, less would have been more Mr Bielsa, in that it would have been believable. 

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17 minutes ago, 29AR said:

Well, then there is that. One man's qualitative interpretation v another's, then there is absorbing that data, selecting your team, imparting that knowledge in your players in enough time for them to leave training at midday to get a round of golf in or media or or or community visits whilst also working on fitness and their own plays to counter the opposition... in this presser, in my opinion, less would have been more Mr Bielsa, in that it would have been believable. 

Gives them 10-15 mins on the opponent.

Split partly between their attacking strengths and weaknesses and the same with defence apparently.

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2 hours ago, 29AR said:

For me it comes to simple maths. Every champ team played at least 48 games last year (46 league, 2 cups). Multiple that by 23, multiple that by 4 hours a game. Talking 4,500 hours. Times that by 1.5 as we are hald way through a season and he's looking this year too, perhaps more closely this year as it's of relevance. Most people., including (relatively) poorly paid analysts will do a 35 hour week. Even if he had 10 analysts, we are talking 6 months of work before it even starts getting compounded. It just doesn't seem remotely plausible... to me. 

 

So those 10 analysts they employ are at home awaiting their next job from Leeds, how many Championship games were played this week....  24 games, so each analysts has been assigned 2.4 games to look at, each taking 4 hours to compile so just over 8 hours to compile, and file with the club to add to their dossier on those clubs for the week. You wouldn't need 10 analysts either,  96 hours of work, with your suggestion that they are doing 35 hours a week they would need 2.7 analysts full time, if you had 4-5 a 19-24 hour working week. 

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6 hours ago, Fiale said:

 

So those 10 analysts they employ are at home awaiting their next job from Leeds, how many Championship games were played this week....  24 games, so each analysts has been assigned 2.4 games to look at, each taking 4 hours to compile so just over 8 hours to compile, and file with the club to add to their dossier on those clubs for the week. You wouldn't need 10 analysts either,  96 hours of work, with your suggestion that they are doing 35 hours a week they would need 2.7 analysts full time, if you had 4-5 a 19-24 hour working week. 

Except you're missing  they were compiling for last season also, Bielsa's grandioise claim of 51 derby games from last year plus this season also, on every championship team, that's where it becomes thousands of man hours and lacking credibility. You're right for a given game week of course. 

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If they did it all in a week, but I didn't see where he said it was all done in that time frame. If this is a ongoing thing at the club (and others have indicated all clubs are doing it to some degree bar the actual spying part) then this would just be part of the clubs weekly activity, adding to their dossiers on other clubs in a ongoing basis. The only difference for the last week would be people pulling the files out and summarising key points from all the reports for the team. I maybe wrong, but that would be the only way this kind of thing could work, and as mentioned by others Leeds are alone in this approach.... maybe a poster who is more into the footballing world will be able to shed some light on this, would be interesting to know.

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12 hours ago, 29AR said:

For me it comes to simple maths. Every champ team played at least 48 games last year (46 league, 2 cups). Multiple that by 23, multiple that by 4 hours a game. Talking 4,500 hours. Times that by 1.5 as we are hald way through a season and he's looking this year too, perhaps more closely this year as it's of relevance. Most people., including (relatively) poorly paid analysts will do a 35 hour week. Even if he had 10 analysts, we are talking 6 months of work before it even starts getting compounded. It just doesn't seem remotely plausible... to me. 

It does not work that way. There are services to use and software like 3D tactico coach that does that task. Ten, twenty, thirty etc matches can be studied and the information turned into dossiers and video footage. All done by a couple of individuals in days.

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4 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

It does not work that way. There are services to use and software like 3D tactico coach that does that task. Ten, twenty, thirty etc matches can be studied and the information turned into dossiers and video footage. All done by a couple of individuals in days.

I'm glad this has become news worthy as I don't think the average football fan realises actually how much technology is used in football/sport these days.

Info from players wearing gadgets in there vests all being tracked via satellite and gathered by analysts using software.

Individual Apps that players have...and software tracking sleep patterns, rest, diet etc.

It really is mind blowing how much is used these days, and it's not really spoken about or shown via the national media.

I've used layman's terms here.

 

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40 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

It does not work that way. There are services to use and software like 3D tactico coach that does that task. Ten, twenty, thirty etc matches can be studied and the information turned into dossiers and video footage. All done by a couple of individuals in days.

That's how he explained it worked, which is why I'm a non-believer. He said his staff spent the time analysing the games and invested on average 4 hours a game. That's what tipped me to 'this has been prepared for the presser and he's blagging this for PR' and now everyone is not talking about sneaky, sneaky Bielsa, but what a magnificent manager he is. It's had exactly the desired effect. In my opinion, maybe I am wrong. 

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57 minutes ago, spudski said:

I'm glad this has become news worthy as I don't think the average football fan realises actually how much technology is used in football/sport these days.

Info from players wearing gadgets in there vests all being tracked via satellite and gathered by analysts using software.

Individual Apps that players have...and software tracking sleep patterns, rest, diet etc.

It really is mind blowing how much is used these days, and it's not really spoken about or shown via the national media.

I've used layman's terms here.

 

I don't know why the manager (head coach tsk) doesn't just get in his car, drive up the motorway for 2 hours, and sit in his sheepskin coat, with a hot bovril in one hand and a greasy bacon sarnie in the other, and watch the opposition.

Analytics! I ask you!!

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