Diedhiou

[TheCulturalBomb]

We need a proven goalscorer, as a target man he's fairly average, whereas get a good size striker with height and he'll give you most of what Diedhou does.

[Spike]

11 minutes ago, petehinton said:

So...they aren’t impressive because our defence is better...?

If he didn’t score them those games would’ve ended 0-0, same principle. 

Bare in mind he missed the first 6(?) games of the season too. 

22 goals in 48 starts is half decent in my book. 

I've lost count of how many times I've said in this thread that his goals are "decent", but decent is not the level you're looking for when you're chasing promotion. 

Also this whole "had he not scored those goals" the game would have ended 0-0 debate is theoretical and pointless. By the same logic I could say had Weimann played those games as striker instead of him he may have 15 goals... it's theoretical and considering Weimann has had far less games as a striker and still has 6 goals speaks volumes considering no-one rates him as a striker.

What is fact is that our defensive record is what's outstanding, not our scoring record so winning those games was more about the fact we defended well, not that Fammy is doing a great job and scoring a lot. 

Our team's clearly strongest in defence, then the midfield and our lead striker is not even top 10 in the league and we lack quality in depth to put his position under any threat. 

[TonyTonyTony]

7 minutes ago, Spike said:

it still doesn't change the fact that Diedhiou is not good enough for a promotion pushing team.. 

Fact ? Your opinion maybe but not a fact at all. In actual fact he is the first choice striker for us - a promotion chasing team, so he clearly is good enough.

[Spike]

8 minutes ago, Alex_BCFC said:

Not a fact. 

A fact is that we made the top 5, until other teams played a game more, with him as a sole striker for us. 

Wherher it stays like that who knows? Personally I’d love to see him have support as he must be knackered playing that lonely role game in game out but clearly LJ couldn’t get the right deal done. 

I do agree with that and have said he is inconsistent. Sometimes it sticks and other times it bounces off him. 

If LJ had done any deal I doubt very much need be getting a partner, he'd be getting replaced. 

[Cowshed]

4 minutes ago, Spike said:

How do we know LJ has faith in him? 

 

He clearly cannot think he is shit ..

 

4 minutes ago, Spike said:

 

Obviously he values Fammy because that's who he has and there is nothing he can do about that right now. 

 

You answered your own question. Lee Johnson clearly persists with the player over seasons.. Other players he does not and has not in previous seasons..

6 minutes ago, Spike said:

 

It's easy to say WWWWWWW etc but the last result was an L and that's been the first task stand out challenge we've had in a long time. Our next game is away to Norwich who are top of the league with the top goalscorer. We also have some big matches coming up, we'll see how we do against those teams but it still doesn't change the fact that Diedhiou is not good enough for a promotion pushing team.

 

Yes it is easy. Its the reality. Diedhiou is a significant part of the team being a possible promotion team.  

10 minutes ago, Spike said:

Should we get promoted I am very confident in saying we would bring in a striker who would be on the team sheet in front of him. I don't think the same could be said about the other top 5 teams leading strikers, I think they'd still be their starting strikers. 

 Its a out there hypothetical. But I would expect the same would apply to numerous members of the starting XI.  

[Alex_BCFC]

2 minutes ago, Spike said:

If LJ had done any deal I doubt very much need be getting a partner, he'd be getting replaced. 

Rotated I expect. 

[TV Tom]

1 minute ago, Between heaven and hell said:

I've never criticised his goal scoring record but Jesus Christ you have to agree some times his ball control if absolutely chomical 

I have not taken the time to read any of the comments but what I would say is that I would like to know who made the decision he was worth 5 million? Who made the decision not to take action during the January transfer window knowing full well that Fammy  just isn’t good enough to be our only out and out centre forward, to be honest I feel sorry for the guy

[petehinton]

5 minutes ago, Spike said:

I've lost count of how many times I've said in this thread that his goals are "decent", but decent is not the level you're looking for when you're chasing promotion. 

Also this whole "had he not scored those goals" the game would have ended 0-0 debate is theoretical and pointless. By the same logic I could say had Weimann played those games as striker instead of him he may have 15 goals... it's theoretical and considering Weimann has had far less games as a striker and still has 6 goals speaks volumes considering no-one rates him as a striker.

What is fact is that our defensive record is what's outstanding, not our scoring record so winning those games was more about the fact we defended well, not that Fammy is doing a great job and scoring a lot. 

Our team's clearly strongest in defence, then the midfield and our lead striker is not even top 10 in the league and we lack quality in depth to put his position under any threat. 

I would say scoring the highest amount of game winning goals in the division, whilst being out for the first four, is doing a great job. Seems we will just agree to disagree. 

Head and shoulders above Taylor. Gets absolutely battered by two CBs for 93 mins a game. Wins us games. Good enough for me. 

[Spike]

2 minutes ago, TonyTonyTony said:

Fact ? Your opinion maybe but not a fact at all. In actual fact he is the first choice striker for us - a promotion chasing team, so he clearly is good enough.

OK I keep getting called out for saying fact, let me accept its not fact but let's be honest, if we got promoted would you still have him as your only striker in the Premier League? Anyone who says yes either is too loyal for football or just can't see he'd be way out of his depth. 

I have said in this thread we still could get promoted but if we do it won't be bernadotte Diedhiou's performances, it'll be down to the rest of the team having stepped up their quality. 

This squad /team has some real stand out players, Fammy is not one of them. 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, glen humphries said:

I’m being harsh on his goal record but the rest I stand by , do you think his ball control, movement, holding the ball up is good ?

As I’ve said many times, he’s being asked to play a certain way.  Ideally he’d play alongside a true target man and be running into flick-ons, or having a Bradley Dack sliding balls down the side for him to run onto.  Look at his YouTube clips from Angers.  We don’t play that way.  Read my stuff on the Matt Smith thread.  Fam doesn’t even have a runner to flick long balls too (like Smith does with Wells).  If he did, you’d see him challenge for headers very different to what he does currently.  There is no point him winning a flick on, so he tries his hardest to back-in and get it down...which is incredibly tough against Champ CBs.

1 hour ago, South Somerset Red said:

Everybody likes a stat these days. I've defended him in the past but when you actually watch his overall game its pretty poor. His movement is poor, his aerial threat for his size is poor and his first touch is poor. I feel with the crosses we put in in games with a clinical finisher we would be wiping teams away. 

His natural game is constrained.  That’s a recruitment issue...and overall Fam has done ok imho.  

1 hour ago, lenred said:

According to the stats on BBC he scores a goal every 210 minutes. For comparison Pukki is every 116 mins, Sharp every 104 mins, Tammy every 117 mins Adams every 133 mins and Maupay every 138.  All have assists to their name as well to varying degrees which Fammy doesn’t. 

Pukki - an on the shoulder player who Farke has recruited to fit the way they pass.  Jordan Rhodes doesn’t fit it, has to sit on the bench.  Having a great season.  Will be really interesting to see him v Kalas.

Sharp - Having a phenomenal season, but last season scored at the same rate as Fam.  They are set up for him to poach, with McGoldrick the workhorse (also having one of his best seasons, but scoring at a similar rate to Fam) and Duffy and Norwood the suppliers.  They rely on their goals, they don’t spread the rest around any better than us.

Tammy - we know all about....but his goals aren’t making much of a difference, because they concede so many at the other end.  Perhaps if they played differently to stop conceding so many, they might not create as many chances for him.

Adams - massively helped by Jutkiewicz, but would we swap positions with them?

Maupay - would we swap positions with Brentford.

I’m sure if you played Fam with a strike partner he would score more goals....but I don’t think it would help the team.  What would you prefer.

[Mr Popodopolous]

3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

As I’ve said many times, he’s being asked to play a certain way.  Ideally he’d play alongside a true target man and be running into flick-ons, or having a Bradley Dack sliding balls down the side for him to run onto.  Look at his YouTube clips from Angers.  We don’t play that way.  Read my stuff on the Matt Smith thread.  Fam doesn’t even have a runner to flick long balls too (like Smith does with Wells).  If he did, you’d see him challenge for headers very different to what he does currently.  There is no point him winning a flick on, so he tries his hardest to back-in and get it down...which is incredibly tough against Champ CBs.

 His natural game is constrained.  That’s a recruitment issue...and overall Fam has done ok imho.  

Pukki - an on the shoulder player who Farke has recruited to fit the way they pass.  Jordan Rhodes doesn’t fit it, has to sit on the bench.  Having a great season.  Will be really interesting to see him v Kalas.

Sharp - Having a phenomenal season, but last season scored at the same rate as Fam.  They are set up for him to poach, with McGoldrick the workhorse (also having one of his best seasons, but scoring at a similar rate to Fam) and Duffy and Norwood the suppliers.  They rely on their goals, they don’t spread the rest around any better than us.

Tammy - we know all about....but his goals aren’t making much of a difference, because they concede so many at the other end.  Perhaps if they played differently to stop conceding so many, they might not create as many chances for him.

Adams - massively helped by Jutkiewicz, but would we swap positions with them?

Maupay - would we swap positions with Brentford.

I’m sure if you played Fam with a strike partner he would score more goals....but I don’t think it would help the team.  What would you prefer.

Pukki instead of Diedhiou in this team- another level perhaps in terms of goals and all round play.

Thinking on paper with the likes of Paterson, Weimann, Palmer, O'Dowda and Eliasson all in and around as supporting cast...him or even Assombalonga though different types of players, could have been very interesting.

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, Spike said:

OK I keep getting called out for saying fact, let me accept its not fact but let's be honest, if we got promoted would you still have him as your only striker in the Premier League? Anyone who says yes either is too loyal for football or just can't see he'd be way out of his depth. 

I have said in this thread we still could get promoted but if we do it won't be bernadotte Diedhiou's performances, it'll be down to the rest of the team having stepped up their quality. 

This squad /team has some real stand out players, Fammy is not one of them. 

Someone is always the 11th best player in any team.

We have a budget, we can’t spend willy-nilly, we cut our cloth.  We are 6th (with game / games in hand over teams), on a fantastic run.  Failure in whatever shape or form if it happens won’t be down to Famara alone.

[Dr Balls]

Fam is a decent striker at this level, but in our usual formation he has a thankless task of playing a lone striker against 2 or sometimes 3 central defenders. The situation seems to be that he is better away from home, probably because the opposition feel that they need to come on to us, and he has more one against one chances. However at home, the 4-1-4-1 formation feels quite negative, just as it did first half today. When we switch to bring Taylor on and go to a diamond in midfield, things start to happen. And that usually gives Fam more of a chance.

The reality of our situation is that in the summer we sold 2 strikers in the window (Reid, Djuric) and replaced them with Weimann, who is a class player but was out injured today, or players who aren't even on the bench. On that basis, we are dependent on the rest of the team chipping in, but we have also lost Flint's 10+ goals per season. Brownhill is scoring a few more, but it's the lack of options that is really the problem.

So the options are continue as we are or do we try Eisa or Semenyo? As for a target man up front, or only other option is Marley Watkins, who is not a central forward, but a midfielder who is large and get forward, which is not the same thing at all!

Play like we did today in the second half against most if not all Championship teams and we would win. However it's clear we don't have a cutting edge like some other teams into the Championship, but we do have a better midfield and defence.

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Pukki instead of Diedhiou in this team- another level perhaps in terms of goals and all round play.

Thinking on paper with the likes of Paterson, Weimann, Palmer, O'Dowda and Eliasson all in and around as supporting cast...him or even Assombalonga though different types of players, could have been very interesting.

I’m not against an on-the-shoulder striker, would like to see a Hogan-type to see how it would work out.

I haven’t seen enough of Norwich or Pukki to really know how they cope when they have to go a bit longer / direct, like we do sometimes (less so of late)

[Spike]

3 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

He clearly cannot think he is shit ..

Because he's the only player who suits the system that we have... 

3 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

You answered your own question. Lee Johnson clearly persists with the player over seasons.. Other players he does not and has not in previous seasons..

Over seasons? This is his second season and as mentioned before he was a support striker as he was at the beginning of the season until LJ found the replacements didn't suit that style of play.

3 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

Yes it is easy. Its the reality. Diedhiou is a significant part of the team being a possible promotion team.  

He is a significant part of the team but he's not a key player in our promotion push that's the defence. If Diedhiou got injured tomorrow and couldn't play again this season we could still get promoted, the same can't be said if you removed Kalas or Webster for the rest of the season as they are the real quality pushing us towards promotion. In fact of all the starting 11 I think Fammy is the one main players we could do without and still push for promotion. 

3 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

 Its a out there hypothetical. But I would expect the same would apply to numerous members of the starting XI.  

Agreed, however if we were told we could only make one key signing it's fair to say Fammy would be the one replaced. Most of our team showed they were capable of competing against Wolves today, same can't be said for Fammy. 

[Spike]

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Someone is always the 11th best player in any team.

We have a budget, we can’t spend willy-nilly, we cut our cloth.  We are 6th (with game / games in hand over teams), on a fantastic run.  Failure in whatever shape or form if it happens won’t be down to Famara alone.

Name a team who has been promoted from the Championship with their lead striker being the worst player in the starting 11...

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I’m not against an on-the-shoulder striker, would like to see a Hogan-type to see how it would work out.

I haven’t seen enough of Norwich or Pukki to really know how they cope when they have to go a bit longer / direct, like we do sometimes (less so of late)

Pukki reminds me of Reid a bit, not entirely though- don't know if he works as hard. Part striker, part attacking midfielder- goals, assists, good technically. As you say though, when they need to go longer perhaps not so much in his case.

[Dr Balls]

10 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

As I’ve said many times, he’s being asked to play a certain way.  Ideally he’d play alongside a true target man and be running into flick-ons, or having a Bradley Dack sliding balls down the side for him to run onto.  Look at his YouTube clips from Angers.  We don’t play that way.  Read my stuff on the Matt Smith thread.  Fam doesn’t even have a runner to flick long balls too (like Smith does with Wells).  If he did, you’d see him challenge for headers very different to what he does currently.  There is no point him winning a flick on, so he tries his hardest to back-in and get it down...which is incredibly tough against Champ CBs.

His natural game is constrained.  That’s a recruitment issue...and overall Fam has done ok imho.  

Pukki - an on the shoulder player who Farke has recruited to fit the way they pass.  Jordan Rhodes doesn’t fit it, has to sit on the bench.  Having a great season.  Will be really interesting to see him v Kalas.

Sharp - Having a phenomenal season, but last season scored at the same rate as Fam.  They are set up for him to poach, with McGoldrick the workhorse (also having one of his best seasons, but scoring at a similar rate to Fam) and Duffy and Norwood the suppliers.  They rely on their goals, they don’t spread the rest around any better than us.

Tammy - we know all about....but his goals aren’t making much of a difference, because they concede so many at the other end.  Perhaps if they played differently to stop conceding so many, they might not create as many chances for him.

Adams - massively helped by Jutkiewicz, but would we swap positions with them?

Maupay - would we swap positions with Brentford.

I’m sure if you played Fam with a strike partner he would score more goals....but I don’t think it would help the team.  What would you prefer.

Much as Maupay is an unpleasant individual (at least on the pitch), add him to the rest of our team, and I honestly think we would make the automatic places.

[lenred]

6 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

As I’ve said many times, he’s being asked to play a certain way.  Ideally he’d play alongside a true target man and be running into flick-ons, or having a Bradley Dack sliding balls down the side for him to run onto.  Look at his YouTube clips from Angers.  We don’t play that way.  Read my stuff on the Matt Smith thread.  Fam doesn’t even have a runner to flick long balls too (like Smith does with Wells).  If he did, you’d see him challenge for headers very different to what he does currently.  There is no point him winning a flick on, so he tries his hardest to back-in and get it down...which is incredibly tough against Champ CBs.

His natural game is constrained.  That’s a recruitment issue...and overall Fam has done ok imho.  

Pukki - an on the shoulder player who Farke has recruited to fit the way they pass.  Jordan Rhodes doesn’t fit it, has to sit on the bench.  Having a great season.  Will be really interesting to see him v Kalas. 

Sharp - Having a phenomenal season, but last season scored at the same rate as Fam.   They are set up for him to poach, with McGoldrick the workhorse (also having one of his best seasons, but scoring at a similar rate to Fam) and Duffy and Norwood the suppliers.  They rely on their goals, they don’t spread the rest around any better than us.

Tammy - we know all about....but his goals aren’t making much of a difference, because they concede so many at the other end.  Perhaps if they played differently to stop conceding so many, they might not create as many chances for him.

Adams - massively helped by Jutkiewicz, but would we swap positions with them?

Maupay - would we swap positions with Brentford.

I’m sure if you played Fam with a strike partner he would score more goals....but I don’t think it would help the team.  What would you prefer.

Not sure why you've quoted me Dave as I was merely replying to a post requesting stats which I gave.  However with regards your post I wouldn't swap positions with Birmingham or Brentford no, but I'd 100% swap their strike force for ours and we'd only be in a better place for it. Sheffield U also have McGoldrick as you say, who has scored 2 more and also has 3 more assists than Fammy and so to say they aren't sharing the goals around could be debated.   None of these players cost more than Fam either and a majority of the top 20 Champoionship scorers didn't either.  Completely apppreciate we are playing a different game this year and Fammy is decent enough. But it's a shame we don't have more. 

[Marlborough Red]

Nobody has mentioned Mo Eisa or Semenyo as alternatives a up front..

Surely worth a try if we need to change it with 30 minutes to go.

If not , why did we buy them , bring them, back fro loa loan?

Fam is so frustrating and looks knackered by 60 minutes.

 

 

[glen humphries]

25 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

As I’ve said many times, he’s being asked to play a certain way.  Ideally he’d play alongside a true target man and be running into flick-ons, or having a Bradley Dack sliding balls down the side for him to run onto.  Look at his YouTube clips from Angers.  We don’t play that way.  Read my stuff on the Matt Smith thread.  Fam doesn’t even have a runner to flick long balls too (like Smith does with Wells).  If he did, you’d see him challenge for headers very different to what he does currently.  There is no point him winning a flick on, so he tries his hardest to back-in and get it down...which is incredibly tough against Champ CBs.

His natural game is constrained.  That’s a recruitment issue...and overall Fam has done ok imho.  

Pukki - an on the shoulder player who Farke has recruited to fit the way they pass.  Jordan Rhodes doesn’t fit it, has to sit on the bench.  Having a great season.  Will be really interesting to see him v Kalas.

Sharp - Having a phenomenal season, but last season scored at the same rate as Fam.  They are set up for him to poach, with McGoldrick the workhorse (also having one of his best seasons, but scoring at a similar rate to Fam) and Duffy and Norwood the suppliers.  They rely on their goals, they don’t spread the rest around any better than us.

Tammy - we know all about....but his goals aren’t making much of a difference, because they concede so many at the other end.  Perhaps if they played differently to stop conceding so many, they might not create as many chances for him.

Adams - massively helped by Jutkiewicz, but would we swap positions with them?

Maupay - would we swap positions with Brentford.

I’m sure if you played Fam with a strike partner he would score more goals....but I don’t think it would help the team.  What would you prefer.

He still can’t trap a ball , his movement is non existent, never gets across his marker, I understand what you’re saying Dave , but movement and ball control are basic things for a professional and he’s poor at both.

[bcfc01]

56 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

The reality is the team was not with more mobile players at the Managers disposal. How more successful can the team be than WWWWWWWW..! 

The reality could be that we are not hanging on to a 1-0 or 2-1 lead.

[Between heaven and hell]

33 minutes ago, harrys said:

I have not taken the time to read any of the comments but what I would say is that I would like to know who made the decision he was worth 5 million? Who made the decision not to take action during the January transfer window knowing full well that Fammy  just isn’t good enough to be our only dout and out centre forward, to be honest I feel sorry for the guy

Some good points made there sir 

[Pippintogg]

I agree with many others that it is tough for Fam as a lone striker and it's not his game. However the stats show what he is. An average player. 22 goals in 58 league games, 2 assists and an average rating of about 6.5. He is not the player we needed. You can't fault his effort but we need quality. Other posters are correct in saying that he wouldn't get in to any of the other top 6 sides. We needed another Wilbraham and a mobile striker. We will struggle to stay in the playoffs with the lack of fire power. 

[WolfOfWestStreet]

Players that are better than Fam cost more money that we are obviously willing to spend. 

He's our level, which is basically alright/half decent. 

[lenred]

8 minutes ago, WolfOfWestStreet said:

Players that are better than Fam cost more money that we are obviously willing to spend. 

He's our level, which is basically alright/half decent. 

Maupay was £1.7m. Sharp was £700k. Pukki was free. Che Adams was £2.2m. 4 of the top 5 scorers in the division cost less combined than Fams fee. They are out there it’s just a case of finding them! 

[Mr Popodopolous]

30 minutes ago, glen humphries said:

He still can’t trap a ball , his movement is non existent, never gets across his marker, I understand what you’re saying Dave , but movement and ball control are basic things for a professional and he’s poor at both.

Would say his control his hit and miss, sometimes he can take down a pass and play a great cross-field ball have seen one or two of those but certainly not consistently enough, his movement over the ground is slow for a start, let alone complex.

[bcfc01]

2 minutes ago, lenred said:

Maupay was £1.7m. Sharp was £700k. Pukki was free. Che Adams was £2.2m. 4 of the top 5 scorers in the division cost less combined than Fams fee. They are out there it’s just a case of finding them! 

Agreed - we paid way over the odds for Diedhiou.

[Spike]

15 minutes ago, Pippintogg said:

I agree with many others that it is tough for Fam as a lone striker and it's not his game. However the stats show what he is. An average player. 22 goals in 58 league games, 2 assists and an average rating of about 6.5. He is not the player we needed. You can't fault his effort but we need quality. Other posters are correct in saying that he wouldn't get in to any of the other top 6 sides. We needed another Wilbraham and a mobile striker. We will struggle to stay in the playoffs with the lack of fire power. 

3

I think that's the thing going on here with this thread, everyone thinks I hate Fammy when that's not the case, I just think he's not up to the level we need to progress further with this current tactical plan.

I really like Fammy, I know he gives his all but sometimes that just isn't enough, certainly when you're looking to make it to the Premier League. I don't think there is one player in the squad who lacks passion or determination, that's my biggest love of our squad at the moment, they have heart and they do their best. Unfortunately, football isn't always about trying and passion, sometimes you need that extra bit of natural ability to take that next big step and Diedhiou is not a Premier League striker, not even in a supporting role IMO.

[lenred]

2 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Agreed - we paid way over the odds for Diedhiou.

I don’t necessarily agree paid way over the odds, my point is just that the value can be found. Finding it is the tricky part though it seems! Maybe it’s an anomaly that this seasons top strikers were so cheap I don’t know but there is quality obviously out there where you don’t have to spend 10/15 million to compete.