Could Kasey Palmer be a Striker?

[Denbury Red]

Just got back home to South Devon frustrated at what we have seen tonight  in particular the glaring miss by Fam in the first half - is he really the best we’ve got up front?

Lee changed Bobby Reid into a striker (ok he’s not doing so well this season) but consider Kasey Palmer’s strengths 

Hes strong, quick over 10 yards and a bit more, he has a good shot with his right foot (not seen his left yet), he can turn on a sixpence, he can hold up play, he’s probably as tall as Fam and can head the ball and gets in where it hurts ....

Oh and he’s greedy - which is definitely a trait for a successful striker.

Lee doesn’t seem to know how to get the best out of him (I know,it’s early days) but is it worth playing him higher up, with Fam or even Matty Taylor or Weimann?

just a thought!

 

[leadman]

hope so cuz he aint a midfielder.

[robin_unreliant]

Problem being that LJ only plays with one striker - even at home against teams who aren't in form. So it would mean KP up front alone which I don't think would work.

[RedM]

2 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

He hasn't the movement or work rate to be a striker. And doesn't seem very aggressive either.

I wouldn’t say Fam is overly aggressive either. Granted he has shown a bit more willingness and fight lately but he gets bullied off the ball ( if he does manage to control it) a lot of the time, far too easily for a lone striker for me. I don’t believe playing alone up front comes naturally to him mind, hard work for anyone that role.

I don’t know where Palmer fits in, certainly not as a match starter for me, better as an impact sub. Much like Taylor. (Someone mentions it is early days for him, yes in the scheme of things but not regarding his loan spell, joined in Jan and leaves in May and we are into March when we next play.)If we are consistently going to use these two as such then that’s two of our subs picked out of the three. Great if the come on and influence games, which they have done to be fair, but otherwise only leaves us one sub to use.

I think we have a collection of Strikers who don’t necessarily get the best out of eachother, and probably won’t until another player is added to the squad. Finding this player seems a challenge though as everyone wants players who can make teams tick and purr.

[...]

27 minutes ago, RedM said:

I wouldn’t say Fam is overly aggressive either. Granted he has shown a bit more willingness and fight lately but he gets bullied off the ball ( if he does manage to control it) a lot of the time, far too easily for a lone striker for me. I don’t believe playing alone up front comes naturally to him mind, hard work for anyone that role.

I don’t know where Palmer fits in, certainly not as a match starter for me, better as an impact sub. Much like Taylor. (Someone mentions it is early days for him, yes in the scheme of things but not regarding his loan spell, joined in Jan and leaves in May and we are into March when we next play.)If we are consistently going to use these two as such then that’s two of our subs picked out of the three. Great if the come on and influence games, which they have done to be fair, but otherwise only leaves us one sub to use.

I think we have a collection of Strikers who don’t necessarily get the best out of eachother, and probably won’t until another player is added to the squad. Finding this player seems a challenge though as everyone wants players who can make teams tick and purr.

We get it - you don't fancy Palmer.

LOUD AND CLEAR.

[RedM]

5 minutes ago, ... said:

We get it - you don't fancy Palmer.

LOUD AND CLEAR.

Where exactly do I say this? 

Are you going to make idiotic comments on all my posts today?

[...]

2 minutes ago, RedM said:

Where exactly do I say this? 

Are you going to make idiotic comments on all my posts today?

1) Read between the lines of your post, and its quite obvious.

2) I have not decided on todays target yet.

[Baldyman]

Palmer has looked great in a couple of his Cameos but tries to do too much . One word is ringing alarm bells in my head where he’s concerned ..... JET ! 

[BessexRED]

Didn't Johnson say he could play the Bobby Reid role when he signed? Whether you classify that as a striker or not I don't know but I think I agree, not as an out and out number 9 though.

Paterson should've started last night.

[Olé]

1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

He hasn't the movement or work rate to be a striker. And doesn't seem very aggressive either.

And he's not particularly fast either!

Given the offer of so many peoples wives, he seems to have morphed into the second coming of Lois Diony. 

There's a good player in there somewhere, but he needs to pass the ball and do the basics right to start with. 

[TonyTonyTony]

9 minutes ago, Olé said:

There's a good player in there somewhere, but he needs to pass the ball and do the basics right to start with. 

Agree 100% with this. He is too complacent and needs this knocked out of him. You can’t showboat and not put in a shift in the championship. 

[Robbored]

3 minutes ago, BessexRED said:

Paterson should've started last night.

Yep - hindsight is a wonderful thing....

Pato has taken regular critism on here and from fans in general but last night I and the guys around me were wanting to replace Palmer with him. 

Its odd that when he’s not actually playing how much you realise what he actually brings. Palmer wasn’t a patch on Pato in the first half and LJ was 100% right in replacing him.

On last night first 45 I’d be surprised if Palmer gets another start any time soon.

Just highlights how ridiculous the £4m Sun story was yesterday.

[reddogkev]

2 hours ago, RedM said:

I wouldn’t say Fam is overly aggressive either. Granted he has shown a bit more willingness and fight lately but he gets bullied off the ball ( if he does manage to control it) a lot of the time, far too easily for a lone striker for me. I don’t believe playing alone up front comes naturally to him mind, hard work for anyone that role.

I don’t know where Palmer fits in, certainly not as a match starter for me, better as an impact sub. Much like Taylor. (Someone mentions it is early days for him, yes in the scheme of things but not regarding his loan spell, joined in Jan and leaves in May and we are into March when we next play.)If we are consistently going to use these two as such then that’s two of our subs picked out of the three. Great if the come on and influence games, which they have done to be fair, but otherwise only leaves us one sub to use.

I think we have a collection of Strikers who don’t necessarily get the best out of eachother, and probably won’t until another player is added to the squad. Finding this player seems a challenge though as everyone wants players who can make teams tick and purr.

Good post, and the details you write about Palmer is why I felt yesterday £4milliion would be too high a price.  I don't rate Palmer as highly as some others do on here, but accept it is very early days.

I do like the OP's suggestion that he could be transformed into a striker, ala Bobby Reid before him, as I have seen some traits in Kasey that remind a little of Bobby before last season.

The answer might be to sign Palmer in the summer under the proviso that he seeks additional training at the fitness group who did wonders with Bobby Reid's conditioning.

[TonyTonyTony]

1 hour ago, Robbored said:

Yep - hindsight is a wonderful thing....

Pato has taken regular critism on here and from fans in general but last night I and the guys around me were wanting to replace Palmer with him. 

Its odd that when he’s not actually playing how much you realise what he actually brings. Palmer wasn’t a patch on Pato in the first half and LJ was 100% right in replacing him.

On last night first 45 I’d be surprised if Palmer gets another start any time soon.

Just highlights how ridiculous the £4m Sun story was yesterday.

Agree with all of this. The guy behind me who has been quiet in our recent run of good form normally moans non stop about Pato. This is the same guy who shouts out that Johnson is a useless midget every time a player misses a pass.

Well guess what, the same fella started moaning that LJ was a useless midget last night for not playing Pato. You couldn’t make it up

[42nite]

13 minutes ago, TonyTonyTony said:

Agree with all of this. The guy behind me who has been quiet in our recent run of good form normally moans non stop about Pato. This is the same guy who shouts out that Johnson is a useless midget every time a player misses a pass.

Well guess what, the same fella started moaning that LJ was a useless midget last night for not playing Pato. You couldn’t make it up

 

Do you sit just in front of the Directors box?

 

[Dr Balls]

24 minutes ago, reddogkev said:

Good post, and the details you write about Palmer is why I felt yesterday £4milliion would be too high a price.  I don't rate Palmer as highly as some others do on here, but accept it is very early days.

I do like the OP's suggestion that he could be transformed into a striker, ala Bobby Reid before him, as I have seen some traits in Kasey that remind a little of Bobby before last season.

The answer might be to sign Palmer in the summer under the proviso that he seeks additional training at the fitness group who did wonders with Bobby Reid's conditioning.

The difference between Reid and Palmer is not just speed and fitness, but attitude. Bobby rarely gave up chasing, even a hopeless cause, when all the odds were against him. Do I think Kasey Palmer has that in him? Not that I have seen so far, given that he doesn't chase back and provide similar cover to Paterson, which would seem to be standard for any midfielder. 

 

1 hour ago, Baldyman said:

Palmer has looked great in a couple of his Cameos but tries to do too much . One word is ringing alarm bells in my head where he’s concerned ..... JET ! 

I have seen the analogy to JET before in the past week or so. The only difference is that I don't think Palmer is anywhere as talented as JET, who could take a game away from the opposition all on his own, even at this level. Such a waste of talent!

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Olé said:

And he's not particularly fast either!

Given the offer of so many peoples wives, he seems to have morphed into the second coming of Lois Diony. 

There's a good player in there somewhere, but he needs to pass the ball and do the basics right to start with. 

This 

He seems a bit of a flat track bully to me. When going well and in front against poor opposition the showboating, skill and flare will shine, but when struggling or losing it's a different story. Obviously he has ability but defo needs to sort his decision making out

[Major Isewater]

31 minutes ago, TonyTonyTony said:

Agree with all of this. The guy behind me who has been quiet in our recent run of good form normally moans non stop about Pato. This is the same guy who shouts out that Johnson is a useless midget every time a player misses a pass.

Well guess what, the same fella started moaning that LJ was a useless midget last night for not playing Pato. You couldn’t make it up

We are sooooo lucky to have supporters like that ! 

[cidered abroad]

For a Chelsea loan, I don't rate Palmer too highly. Not enough awareness of others.

I think that when Semenyo is considered ready by LJ, we will see a very good team player.

[Spike]

Palmer is a luxury roaming attacking midfielder, the talent and skill is there but he simply doesn't suit our system. 

Much like Kent I can see him going to another team and shining but we need two box to box, hard working midfielders and a defensive midfielder in the current system and Palmer isn't box to box, he needs that freedom to roam and we can't afford to give it to him. 

The thing I don't understand is the striker situation, it was clear that we needed to bring in a striker with quality and I can understand that isn't easy to get in January but what I don't understand is bringing Semenyo back if we never intended to use him and I don't understand Mo Eisa not getting a look in. 

Come the end of the season this great chance for promotion may be hard to come by again if we fail to make it. Kalas is likely to leave, O'Dowda also looks likely to sign for another club and if Leeds go up they've shown interest. With those two leaving we'll be missing a vital part of our solid defensive pairing and we'll have lost one of our best natural wide players with Eliasson arguably being our best naturally wide playing asset. 

I think come the end of the season we may lose more than Kalas and O'Dowda. With the great run we had and again more exposure of our better players we could certainly be fending off interest for Brownhill, Webster maybe even Kelly if he finds his feet again. 

My concern right now isn't so much top 6, it's more who we're going to lose before next season starts if we don't at the very least get into the play offs. 

[TonyTonyTony]

57 minutes ago, 42nite said:

Do you sit just in front of the Directors box?

I prefer the cramped seats in the Dolman thanks 

[DingleRed]

8 hours ago, Spike said:

Palmer is a luxury roaming attacking midfielder, the talent and skill is there but he simply doesn't suit our system. 

Much like Kent I can see him going to another team and shining but we need two box to box, hard working midfielders and a defensive midfielder in the current system and Palmer isn't box to box, he needs that freedom to roam and we can't afford to give it to him. 

The thing I don't understand is the striker situation, it was clear that we needed to bring in a striker with quality and I can understand that isn't easy to get in January but what I don't understand is bringing Semenyo back if we never intended to use him and I don't understand Mo Eisa not getting a look in. 

Come the end of the season this great chance for promotion may be hard to come by again if we fail to make it. Kalas is likely to leave, O'Dowda also looks likely to sign for another club and if Leeds go up they've shown interest. With those two leaving we'll be missing a vital part of our solid defensive pairing and we'll have lost one of our best natural wide players with Eliasson arguably being our best naturally wide playing asset. 

I think come the end of the season we may lose more than Kalas and O'Dowda. With the great run we had and again more exposure of our better players we could certainly be fending off interest for Brownhill, Webster maybe even Kelly if he finds his feet again. 

My concern right now isn't so much top 6, it's more who we're going to lose before next season starts if we don't at the very least get into the play offs. 

This is why Semenyo was brought back

"Having discussed it with Steve and Mark Ashton we thought it was right as a group to bring him back and have a good look at him for six months," explained Johnson.

There is work to do to polish the diamond.

"He's excellent outside the box but he needs to work inside the box and on getting across players, on that instinct to score goals," said Johnson.

"But we believe we have a raw talent there who can be brilliant for Bristol City."

[Davefevs]

I don’t agree with the comments that he doesn’t work hard enough or lacks aggression.  Yeah, totally accept he lost the ball in bad positions last night....that’ll need to improve unquestionably.  But he worked hard enough, won back to goal challenges.  I don’t think people are watching the whole performance, but basing it on his errors....and forgetting any positives.

If you look, it wasn’t as bad as most of us recall, although I think there is the one lost possession missing from the data.

Some comparisons.

And.....interestingly Pato in the away game at Brum.

[Davefevs]

6 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Im not sure if player stats show who was statistically our best player last night. Would be interesting to see who that is. Not sure if you know a bit about how stats work Dave, if so wonder if you could help answer this.

Let's take Pack as an example. He miscontrols ball very badly in the box and then player runs past him and scores like he is not there. Would this make his score of his stats decrease significantly, or would the same mistake much higher up the pitch be statistically the same?

I don’t have that kinda data.  They are all 1s and 0s in my Stats Zone app.  Pack wasn’t at his best last night, had good and bad moments, but was massively at fault for their first....and did a turtle’s head jump for their second.

No idea how Whoscored work out their ratings.

https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1288946/Live/England-Championship-2018-2019-Bristol-City-Birmingham

 

[Frenchay Red]

57 minutes ago, DingleRed said:

This is why Semenyo was brought back

"he needs to work inside the box and on getting across players, on that instinct to score goals," said Johnson.

While they're working on Semenyo they ought to include FD in the sessions.

[Spike]

15 hours ago, DingleRed said:

This is why Semenyo was brought back

"Having discussed it with Steve and Mark Ashton we thought it was right as a group to bring him back and have a good look at him for six months," explained Johnson.

There is work to do to polish the diamond.

"He's excellent outside the box but he needs to work inside the box and on getting across players, on that instinct to score goals," said Johnson.

"But we believe we have a raw talent there who can be brilliant for Bristol City."

So we brought back another striker who isn't up to the level we need him to be. 

At what point is Eisa going to get a look in, Semenyo doesn't sound like the answer to our issues and Eisa cost us a decent fee and isn't even being considered. 

At this point I don't think we have a single striker up to the level needed to play in this system. 

[Ashton98]

I think it’s hard to judge him after joining us halfway through the season barely playing for Blackburn. I think a whole pre season with us learning our system and getting match fit we will see a completely different player 

[bengalcub]

Lj give Eisa a shot , 

You signed him from daddy with uncles blessing , now give him a chance ,fammy was awful on tuesday and we have no other options ( taylor) cant hold a strikers position....

[Mr Popodopolous]

Eisa isn't ready IMO. Should have been loaned to a midtable or higher end League One club in January, instead we haven't really played him and nor have we loaned hm- it's a complete waste of development potential.

[Robbored]

4 minutes ago, bengalcub said:

Lj give Eisa a shot , 

You signed him from daddy with uncles blessing , now give him a chance ,fammy was awful on tuesday and we have no other options ( taylor) cant hold a strikers position....

Jeeez.........

Don’t you realise just how vast the gulf in quality is between the Championship and L1 or L2?

Neither Elisa or Semenyo have reached the required standard as yet but given time and taking part in first team training they’ll both develop better skills. They’ll be up against Championship defenders in training and how they do against that type of quality is a significant factor when LJ and assistants make judgements on whether ready to make the step up.