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Marcus Rashford.... how calm


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3 minutes ago, Up The City! said:

 

From next season,

Another change to the laws of the game means that if the player's arms extend beyond a "natural silhouette", handball will be given, even if it is perceived as accidental.

That sounds fair enough in the sense of making things more black and white, but I feel like awarding a penalty, an almost certain goal, for cases like tonight seems vastly disproportionate.

A speculative shot not really threatening the goal, and I thought Ferdinand summed it up well when he said, when you're jumping like that, it would be unnatural for your arm to be in any other position. Completely unintentional.

Just doesn't feel like a penalty is a fair reflection of the foul.

 

Hilarious though, nonetheless. Love seeing PSG bottle it again

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25 minutes ago, Up The City! said:

Where United went wrong after SAF left was they appointed people who didn't understand the club. Imo they should have stuck with Giggs.

This. He purposely made himself bigger hence why it's a deliberate hand ball.

He purposely jumped in the air to try and block the shot, the same as thousands of footballers do in every game every week.

The fact he has arms, means his arms have to be somewhere!, this does not mean he is deliberately handling the ball.

The fact that the shot was going about 10 yards over the bar makes it even more farcical, it opens up the scenario where the clever players will no doubt start aiming for detenders arms instead of the goal. 

Anyone who has played the game knows that tonight’s penalty was a complete farce, technology is killing the game I used to love.

 

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11 minutes ago, Portland Bill said:

He purposely jumped in the air to try and block the shot, the same as thousands of footballers do in every game every week.

The fact he has arms, means his arms have to be somewhere!, this does not mean he is deliberately handling the ball.

The fact that the shot was going about 10 yards over the bar makes it even more farcical, it opens up the scenario where the clever players will no doubt start aiming for detenders arms instead of the goal. 

Anyone who has played the game knows that tonight’s penalty was a complete farce, technology is killing the game I used to love.

 

? shut up

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12 minutes ago, Portland Bill said:

He purposely jumped in the air to try and block the shot, the same as thousands of footballers do in every game every week.

The fact he has arms, means his arms have to be somewhere!, this does not mean he is deliberately handling the ball.

The fact that the shot was going about 10 yards over the bar makes it even more farcical, it opens up the scenario where the clever players will no doubt start aiming for detenders arms instead of the goal. 

Anyone who has played the game knows that tonight’s penalty was a complete farce, technology is killing the game I used to love.

 

Long jumpers and high jumpers use their arms to create balance as part of their jumping actions.

Likewise football players arms have to be used to create balance and force - Its Newtons laws of motion. If arm movement is constrained less force is generated meaning players jumping capacity is severely limited. 

There is also a question here about other handballs where the player does not jump. Running technique requires the use of the arms not being constrained. 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Alex_BCFC said:

The problem with slowed down VAR is it doesn't allow for the speed of the ball. There is no way anyone could have moved their hand deliberately towards the ball with that shot - simply not enough time with speed and distance involved. 

I don’t understand this argument. Of course he could move his hand that quickly. Reaction times for humans is tiny. Keepers move that quickly week in week out, having to move much bigger distances, over a shorter amount of time. Of course it’s possible. 

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8 minutes ago, billywedlock said:

For those that don't believe a manger can have impact.. Ole... probably the most impressive turnaround you can think of. Maybe it reflects player power, how they can turn it on and off, like they have done at Chelsea these last years. A sad reflection. OGS has got the job, football is results, and his results with the same material have been extraordinary .  

Whilst I agree on player power, he has earned the job. 

When you listen to his post-match tactical analysis and you can just tell this guy ‘gets it’.

Whether he has surrounded himself with tacticians - which he didn’t have at Cardiff - or has learned, something has clicked and whatever it is it is working and working very well. 

I do not believe it comes down to players playing for him and not Jose. The latter I do, but when he comes out after and the players have executed exactly the tactics he describes instilling in them, it doesn’t suggest it’s all unilateral. 

Be honest, who at 80mins thought Man Utd wouldn’t get that decisive goal? I think we all could see it coming. 

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13 minutes ago, 29AR said:

Whilst I agree on player power, he has earned the job. 

When you listen to his post-match tactical analysis and you can just tell this guy ‘gets it’.

Whether he has surrounded himself with tacticians - which he didn’t have at Cardiff - or has learned, something has clicked and whatever it is it is working and working very well. 

I do not believe it comes down to players playing for him and not Jose. The latter I do, but when he comes out after and the players have executed exactly the tactics he describes instilling in them, it doesn’t suggest it’s all unilateral. 

Be honest, who at 80mins thought Man Utd wouldn’t get that decisive goal? I think we all could see it coming. 

It’s Man Utd, was always going to happen

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19 minutes ago, JasonM88 said:

I don’t understand this argument. Of course he could move his hand that quickly. Reaction times for humans is tiny. Keepers move that quickly week in week out, having to move much bigger distances, over a shorter amount of time. Of course it’s possible. 

No a player cannot move his arm that quickly when jumping because it will significantly affect how the player will jump. 

Reaction times are a complex topic.  For a footballer reactions go beyond having supposedly quick reflexes. A Keeper develops cognitive ability via their specific training for their specific role creating motor programmes. Outfield players have differing abilities and reaction times to different to tasks because they do not practice shot stopping for weeks, months, decades ... 

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10 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

No a player cannot move his arm that quickly when jumping because it will significantly affect how the player will jump. 

Reaction times are a complex topic.  For a footballer reactions go beyond having supposedly quick reflexes. A Keeper develops cognitive ability via their specific training for their specific role creating motor programmes. Outfield players have differing abilities and reaction times to different to tasks because they do not practice shot stopping for weeks, months, decades ... 

The player turned 180 degrees in the time it took for the ball the reach him from when it left his boot. He could move his hand. 

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1 hour ago, Lew-T said:

Surprised by the reaction of the penalty decision on here and social media. Looked pretty clear to me.

Turns his back on the ball and leaves his arm out. 

It's one of those, if it gets given against you you'd be fumming but if it's not given for you then you'd be fumming. 

The rules next season should help to make things much clearer.

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19 minutes ago, JasonM88 said:

The player turned 180 degrees in the time it took for the ball the reach him from when it left his boot. He could move his hand. 

For it to be a penalty his arm has to move to the ball and be deliberate. He has turned his back. It is not arm to ball. That is not deliberate. He has been penalised for having arms. Arms that the ball struck, not the other way round. 

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1 hour ago, JasonM88 said:

It’s Man Utd, was always going to happen

A decade ago; sure, under Moyes, Van Gaal, Mourinho, don’t think so. And that’s the difference, Olé, for whatever reason, has brought the steel back in them where undoubtedly others failed. Yes Jose won honours, but - like them or loathe them - United used to be an edge of your seat watch under Ferguson and they’re becoming that again. 

People love to hate them, but I think that’s down to becoming too popular. The popularity came because they were never beaten until full time. A United, or any team like that, is good for the game. 

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All this talk about whether the player moved his hand deliberately is academic, because Neymar ( that bastion of fair play) says the ball hit the defender in the back.

What's more, the PSG manager said it should not have been a penalty because the shot was going well over the bar, although what that has anything to do with a penalty decision anyone knows.

Good thing those two aren't on a VAR review panel.

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7 hours ago, 29AR said:

Whilst I agree on player power, he has earned the job. 

When you listen to his post-match tactical analysis and you can just tell this guy ‘gets it’.

Whether he has surrounded himself with tacticians - which he didn’t have at Cardiff - or has learned, something has clicked and whatever it is it is working and working very well. 

I do not believe it comes down to players playing for him and not Jose. The latter I do, but when he comes out after and the players have executed exactly the tactics he describes instilling in them, it doesn’t suggest it’s all unilateral. 

Be honest, who at 80mins thought Man Utd wouldn’t get that decisive goal? I think we all could see it coming. 

I wouldn’t discount his decision to bring back Mike Phelan alongside him as a factor.  They both understand the United way. I guess the real test will be when they lose 2-3 on the bounce ?‍♂️

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9 hours ago, Maltshoveller said:

If i was a Man Utd fan i would feel totally cheated 

Their fans turn up every week only for that bunch of W######s to down tools for 18 months

Well maybe the manager was the problem? I mean when you have a guy coming out in press conferences and saying his players are not good enough and he should've been given more money to replace them then maybe you can understand why they downed tools? Mourinho maybe a great tactician but his man management is atrocious.

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9 hours ago, Up The City! said:

Where United went wrong after SAF left was they appointed people who didn't understand the club. Imo they should have stuck with Giggs.

This. He purposely made himself bigger hence why it's a deliberate hand ball.

You have to try and make yourself bigger though. As a defender your not going to make yourself smaller. With the softness that free kicks are given nowadays it makes defending a nightmare as it is.

For me handball should always be intentional movement of the hand or arm at the ball. Ball being smashed at the arm shouldn't be classed as a handball.

If that had happened outside the box there would have been no VAR and nothing would have been given also.

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9 hours ago, RedDave said:

His arm was out. Penalty

Funny how a lot of pundits and fans say no penalty and THREE out of three qualified referees say penalty. Pretty sure if all three say pen then it’s a pen 

Given the bunch of cheats they are/were, I don't trust the views of any present or (recent) past players. Their minds are a fog of conning the ref and bending the rules. 

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