City don’t want to go up.....

[The Constant Rabbit]

2 oh-so-nearly made it seasons do make the Bristol Sport Franchise more appealing to new owners though doesn't it.........

It's almost like Lansdown Inc don't want to go up and lose the Premier league carrot....

[TonyTonyTony]

19 hours ago, Banjo Island said:

Its quite obvious we dont have enough to get over the line most games i sit and hope rather than expect so much is missing from our game we rareley lòok like scoring from a freekick or conrner and when was the lst time we saw a piledriver from outside the box fizz into the top corner i beleive a quality miffielder and a get in behind pacy striker added to what we have would have made the diffrence having got ourselfs in a great postion two seasons in a row and do nothing is baffling can we really expect to be there a third year highly unlikely

Fullstops. Commas

They are your friends

[The Hustler]

5 minutes ago, TonyTonyTony said:

Fullstops. Commas

They are your friends

The irony in this post.

[Riaz]

Does make me laugh people saying we dont want to go up.

For the owner, it will be finally quids after about 20 years of putting in massive lumps of investment. Including transforming the ground.

For players , its the absolute pinnacle and the chance to see their wages double or triple.

We all dream of being in the premier league. Anyone who thinks players/managers/chairman arent trying are ******* clueless. IMO

[Kid in the Riot]

The players have written into their contracts that they double their wages if we win promotion to the Prem, so they are motivated alright. 

[Redmycolour]

22 hours ago, tin said:

Lansdown wants promotion but isn’t willing to pay for it, either on a proven manager or top players. That’s the issue and until it changes we can’t hope for anything more.

Yes agree, Landsdowns not willing to pay top wages for top players, to get us there, yes LJ got us in playoffs positions like last season, but it's happening again, we drop away. 

[Numero Uno]

Devils Advocate here but when we get a crowd of circa 18-19k (make that 15-16k in reality with absent season ticket holders) tomorrow evening with the club in 7th place with 10 games to go I am imagining the “Investor” will be questioning how much the fans want it too!!!

[HitchinRed]

22 hours ago, tin said:

Lansdown wants promotion but isn’t willing to pay for it, either on a proven manager or top players. That’s the issue and until it changes we can’t hope for anything more.

I suspect that SL would be willing to pay quite a lot for promotion. The problem is that he is not prepared to gamble the tens of millions you are suggesting on getting promoted.

You've got to remember that he's done that before and got his fingers burnt.

I for one am not blaming him for this approach.

[Suffolkcity]

I don't think it's a case we don't want to go up, but the club can't afford to take the risk of spending big and not going up, as the long term effects of that could be disastrous. 

[Tin Soldier]

On 09/03/2019 at 23:27, Ivorguy said:

This has always been said for the nearly 70 years I have followed City

The reason is not far to seek.  We have always, with very few exceptions, been happy as a club to be satisfied with just jogging along.  That isn't to say the club haven't wanted more but that they are always ok with it as it is.  We lack that belief and full on commitment other clubs have

You could well say this is typical of Bristol as a whole. For all my 70 + years we have talked about a modern transport system but are now worse off than we were pre war when we had trams and a more comprehensive suburban railway system in addition to buses

If you support City then you just have to accept that the killer instinct is almost always lacking.  Players often refer to us as a nice club in a nice city.  Don't think that is a view held by Leeds players for example.  Leeds always look and sound like they mean business

Unfortunately spot on! Ambition is quite often the difference between good players and bloody good players.

Unfortunately I believe this will be a determining factor come end of season positions. Kind of got used to it now.

[Shtanley]

23 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

The players have written into their contracts that they double their wages if we win promotion to the Prem, so they are motivated alright. 

Double?! Didn’t realise it would be that high.

Presumably then half if they get relegated?

[Redmycolour]

On 11/03/2019 at 09:41, Kid in the Riot said:

The players have written into their contracts that they double their wages if we win promotion to the Prem, so they are motivated alright. 

And how do you know that? 

[BCFCinNW6]

From what I've heard the club doesnt want promotion this year because it isnt ready for a push and the club's infrastructure isn't quite ready - eg the new training facilities at Failand. 

I understand the plan is to go up and stay up so best to do this once the club is in better shape from an organisational perspective. 

 

 

[CotswoldRed]

37 minutes ago, BCFCinNW6 said:

From what I've heard the club doesnt want promotion this year because it isnt ready for a push and the club's infrastructure isn't quite ready - eg the new training facilities at Failand. 

I understand the plan is to go up and stay up so best to do this once the club is in better shape from an organisational perspective. 

 

 

I reckon if Man City trained at Failand they'd be just as good. 

What could our players possibly be lacking at Failand that would have a material effect on their performance?

[BCFCinNW6]

14 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said:

I reckon if Man City trained at Failand they'd be just as good. 

What could our players possibly be lacking at Failand that would have a material effect on their performance?

It’s more about attracting the best players with world class facilities if / when we go up rather than the current set up. 

And besides everything’s got QEH all over it hasn’t it? Pretty sure Man city aren’t renting facilities from a school. 

 

 

 

[CotswoldRed]

1 minute ago, BCFCinNW6 said:

It’s more about attracting the best players with world class facilities if / when we go up rather than the current set up. 

And besides everything’s got QEH all over it hasn’t it? Pretty sure Man city aren’t renting facilities from a school. 

 

 

 

I see the point you were making now. Cheers. 

[Undy English]

5 minutes ago, BCFCinNW6 said:

It’s more about attracting the best players with world class facilities if / when we go up rather than the current set up. 

And besides everything’s got QEH all over it hasn’t it? Pretty sure Man city aren’t renting facilities from a school. 

 

 

 

Well said. We've had some big names reject us over the years.

[Loco Rojo]

On 09/03/2019 at 23:36, sh1t_ref_again said:

I think the question when levelled at players can be a difficult one, with certain players knowing if they assist the club to get promoted they are unlikely to be a part of the team playing in the premiership, so it's like the old analogy of Turkeys voting for Christmas!!

This does not apply to the club or management, although as a fan and longtime season ticket holder I have mixed views about being promoted this year, if we went up I would want to be competitive and not just completing for the lowest ever points record, I think held by FLDC. Conversely the money you make from just getting promoted could help to sustain and raise the level of players higher if invested wisely and not doing a Fulham. It would also be great to see us at that level.

I read something similar to you first paragraph somewhere - might have been The Secret Footballer or something. But the concept is that as you say, when the team is in the lower Division, players and their families are settled and earning a salary and playing regularly. To then go up, your point kicks in and there's a risk the player may not get in the team or be sold - thus disrupting them and their families settled life (I'm sure that was one of the key points - no footballer wants an unhappy wife/girlfriend to have to deal with). So why rock the boat. 

So if this is true in any way, I can see the point of it and might go some way to explain the argument in the OP.

[Mtimmy11]

Every players contract is different.they would all be on a good bonus but at least 5/6 I would say would be told to find a new club.

[Natchfever]

50 minutes ago, BCFCinNW6 said:

It’s more about attracting the best players with world class facilities if / when we go up rather than the current set up. 

And besides everything’s got QEH all over it hasn’t it? Pretty sure Man city aren’t renting facilities from a school. 

 

 

 

Pay and they will come.

[Mr Popodopolous]

On 10/03/2019 at 14:13, tin said:

Lansdown wants promotion but isn’t willing to pay for it, either on a proven manager or top players. That’s the issue and until it changes we can’t hope for anything more.

We can lose £13m per season plus allowable costs.

We exceeded this by £8m last season.

Hence within the limits of what is possible and the regulations, I'd say we were pushing it. Now maybe we can spend a bit this summer but could it have been spent better in January, i.e. the mooted loan for Assombalonga? Would that have hindered us moving forward if we didn't go up -.e.g. retention of Kalas? He incidentally, last 4 seasons contained 2 promotions and 2 playoffs- I'd say that is quite a coup, before we even get onto the revelation that was Webster but in terms of top players yes Kalas is a top CB at this level on track record.

On balance then, I wouldn't agree fully, but there has to be an aspect of gamble at times...but it has to be at the right moment. Last season we were close to our limits, this season we have rebalanced it somewhat but it leaves us in a decent position in the summer from that POV.

[sh1t_ref_again]

9 minutes ago, Loco Rojo said:

I read something similar to you first paragraph somewhere - might have been The Secret Footballer or something. But the concept is that as you say, when the team is in the lower Division, players and their families are settled and earning a salary and playing regularly. To then go up, your point kicks in and there's a risk the player may not get in the team or be sold - thus disrupting them and their families settled life (I'm sure that was one of the key points - no footballer wants an unhappy wife/girlfriend to have to deal with). So why rock the boat. 

So if this is true in any way, I can see the point of it and might go some way to explain the argument in the OP.

Agree this can all be part of it, its easy as fans to forget that footballers have a life outside the game with all the same pressures (maybe not money), but kids in schools, family location etc etc,

We also have a perception that footballers and professional athletes are going to be very ambitious and want to play for their country and in the Prem, which to a degree I am sure they are, as they have already got a long way up the pyramid, but they also see what they do as a job and means to make a living, so maybe also very realistic in how far they can or want to go. 

Its been seen before about signing journey men on big money and watch as they bleed you dry and go thru the motions. It's why I believe are current strategy of up and coming players is the right way, when you end up with a team that is good enough to go up and be the mainstay when you are up.

[Natchfever]

52 minutes ago, BCFCinNW6 said:

It’s more about attracting the best players with world class facilities if / when we go up rather than the current set up. 

And besides everything’s got QEH all over it hasn’t it? Pretty sure Man city aren’t renting facilities from a school. 

 

 

 

Do all Premier League clubs have their own training grounds ? I'm pretty sure that  Burnley train at a National Trust location. 

Genuine question by the way.

[cidered abroad]

3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

We can lose £13m oer season plus allowable costs.

We exceeded this by £8m last season.

Hence within the limits of what is possible and the regulations, I'd say we are pushing it. Now maybe we can spend a bit this summer but could it have been spent better in January, i.e. the mooted loan for Assombalonga? Would that have hindered us moving forward if we didn't go up -.e.g. retention of Kalas? He incidentally, last 4 seasons contained 2 promotions and 2 playoffs- I'd say that is quite a coup, before we even get onto the revelation that was Webster but in terms of top players yes Kalas is a top CB at this level on track record.

On balance then, I wouldn't agree fully, but there has to be an aspect of gamble at times...but it has to be at the right moment. Last season we were close to our limits, this season we have rebalanced it somewhat but it leaves us in a decent position in the summer from that POV.

An old saying in business is never to put an accountant in the number one job. (Was SL the accountant and Hargreaves the investor? Someone tell me if I'm wrong.)

Why is this so?

Because the accountant is simply a historian who records where money came from and where it went. They rarely if ever gamble.

Whereas the Investor is always taking risks on investments within the range of nil risk (National Savings) to 100% risk (a 100/1 outsider in the Grand National)

Thus SL has invested and will continue to invest heavily in the bricks and mortar but appears reticent to now gamble even relatively small amounts on a player that could be the one that triggers a big leap toward the Premier League.

[BCFCinNW6]

7 minutes ago, Loon plage said:

Do all Premier League clubs have their own training grounds ? I'm pretty sure that  Burnley train at a National Trust location. 

Genuine question by the way.

I don’t know tbh but given that Bristol is considered a footballing backwater I think the plan is to get all of our ducks in a row to mitigate the risk of failure if SL is going to sink serious money into a premier league-ready squad. 

Best to get our house in order first before he takes a massive financial gamble I guess. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

8 minutes ago, cidered abroad said:

An old saying in business is never to put an accountant in the number one job. (Was SL the accountant and Hargreaves the investor? Someone tell me if I'm wrong.)

Why is this so?

Because the accountant is simply a historian who records where money came from and where it went. They rarely if ever gamble.

Whereas the Investor is always taking risks on investments within the range of nil risk (National Savings) to 100% risk (a 100/1 outsider in the Grand National)

Thus SL has invested and will continue to invest heavily in the bricks and mortar but appears reticent to now gamble even relatively small amounts on a player that could be the one that triggers a big leap toward the Premier League.

Going against my natural football finance instincts, but I'd have considered making a serious play of offering that loan fee and wages- came to £3.5m once the 2 combined according to @Kid in the Riot - for Assombalonga in January.

On a permanent may have been more of a problem for us financially but I'd genuinely have been delighted with that. If it hadn't come off, his wages would have been off the books and with some out of contract players, maybe the odd sale or fringe players we could have readjusted possibly.

[cidered abroad]

12 minutes ago, sh1t_ref_again said:

Agree this can all be part of it, its easy as fans to forget that footballers have a life outside the game with all the same pressures (maybe not money), but kids in schools, family location etc etc,

We also have a perception that footballers and professional athletes are going to be very ambitious and want to play for their country and in the Prem, which to a degree I am sure they are, as they have already got a long way up the pyramid, but they also see what they do as a job and means to make a living, so maybe also very realistic in how far they can or want to go. 

Its been seen before about signing journey men on big money and watch as they bleed you dry and go thru the motions. It's why I believe are current strategy of up and coming players is the right way, when you end up with a team that is good enough to go up and be the mainstay when you are up.

Agree with everything you say. But the big problem with the way we are doing it, is that it is probable or possible that we will always miss out to the so called big clubs who are more determined than us.

If we never make the play off's and stumble along in mid table, maybe flirting with the top edge of the "bottom six", we will see a drop in Season Tickets and attendance's. And from then, as Ipswich are finding after years of security, the only way is down.

[sh1t_ref_again]

4 minutes ago, cidered abroad said:

Agree with everything you say. But the big problem with the way we are doing it, is that it is probable or possible that we will always miss out to the so called big clubs who are more determined than us.

If we never make the play off's and stumble along in mid table, maybe flirting with the top edge of the "bottom six", we will see a drop in Season Tickets and attendance's. And from then, as Ipswich are finding after years of security, the only way is down.

But that's where you look to improve year on year with the blend of players you have, you need to build that squad which is capable of being competitive also at the level above so they will take you there. The danger is you will always have bigger clubs trying to take your best players, but if you are making good profit on them and reinvesting, overall you should continue to improve. 

Its very difficult for clubs such as ours to mix it up with the big clubs due to parachute payments and FFP, so you need to invest in good young players on long contracts and develop a team.

[Major Isewater]

1 hour ago, Loon plage said:

Pay and they will come.

Absolutely this and if we can’t sustain Prem or upper Championship wages why not just  be honest about our ambitions and save us all a lot of heartbreak.